BART cop who shot man is released after 1 year sentence

[Nuvalia]

Im in San Francisco for summer vacation. I NEED HELP!!

[Galla-]

A justification exists in the mind of the actor. All action has a justification, or else it wouldn't be done. Saying that a justification has to agree with facts the situation is ignorant, it merely has to agree with the individual who carries out the action, regardless of outside variables.

Sorry, but the justification 'he was running at me' doesn't work when footage shows that he was lying on the ground, regardless of what you say.

It worked for him at the time.

Thus, the justification works.

The excuse didn't.

[The Anti-Cosmic Gods]

Possibly not, was their mens rea and mens actus there? Did he intend to kill?

Having said that, one could say that for many people in jail for killing, people who were not trained to properly assess a situation - should we provide them the same leniency.

No.


But you seem to forget that this is a mansaughter charge and not a murder charge.

And who else gets one year in prison for manslaughter? Cops should be held to the same standard as everyone else, if not a higher one.

[Asamark]

Very hard to sprint anywhere when two officers have you pinned to the ground.

Not at all. His legs were pumping just as hard.

[Ifreann]

Very hard to sprint anywhere when two officers have you pinned to the ground.

Not at all. His legs were pumping just as hard.

Allegedly. We can't really ask him, given his current health problems.

[Kobeanare]

current health problems.

I feel you might be understating things just a tad.

[Barringtonia]

No.


But you seem to forget that this is a mansaughter charge and not a murder charge.

If I wasn't a police officer, despite their training, if my colleagues were holding someone to the ground and I shot him, even if I claimed he was reaching for some imaginary gun, I'd be done for murder.

The charge is irrelevant.

[Natapoc]

Im in San Francisco for summer vacation. I NEED HELP!!

My advice is to stay away from the cops. Especially if you are not white. They could mistake you breathing for a threat and "ACCIDENTALLY" shoot you.

Then people on NSG will spend hours trying to defend the cop who murdered you (OH SORRY I mean manslaughtered you)

Saying how cops just are not trained and until you are in the situation where you see a breathing person you just don't know how to act!

Besides, if the cop thought you were a threat for breathing then you were a threat! End of story. Prove to me that the cop did not think you were a threat!

Besides prove that the cop was not just trying to tase you for breathing instead of shooting you!

[Boatail hollowpoints]

REally... the dude WAS on the ground. Several cops around, obviously outnumbered. The cop stands up and shoots him point blank... aaahhh. I saw the video too.

I'm thinking if that had been me without the blue suit & badge... 15 to life... no chance of parole. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander....

and he still got paid while in jail? WTF. This place is broken.

[Kobeanare]

Also, even assuming his story is true and the legal proceedings were reasonable, why are we allowing someone this incompetent back on the force?

[Demen]

No.


But you seem to forget that this is a mansaughter charge and not a murder charge.

And who else gets one year in prison for manslaughter? Cops should be held to the same standard as everyone else, if not a higher one.

That's exactly what I said.


Look at my 2nd post.

[Rokartian States]

Im in San Francisco for summer vacation. I NEED HELP!!

My advice is to stay away from the cops. Especially if you are not white. They could mistake you breathing for a threat and "ACCIDENTALLY" shoot you.

Then people on NSG will spend hours trying to defend the cop who murdered you (OH SORRY I mean manslaughtered you)

Blatant mockery and refusal to debate like a grown adult? Oh no, my arguments are defeated!

Also, even assuming his story is true and the legal proceedings were reasonable, why are we allowing someone this incompetent back on the force?

That's what I'm trying to figure out. If you know somebody screwed up that bad in the first place, why would you even want him working for you again?

[Ifreann]

current health problems.

I feel you might be understating things just a tad.

Patient is exhibiting symptoms consistent with a minor case of death.

[Brandenburg-Altmark]

Obviously every police officer on earth is a racist just waiting to pop one of those jiggaboo spook nigger monkeys. That's why the Swastika armband is standard issue. His reaction to the shooting, falling to his knees and shouting "Oh god" repeatedly, was just an act for sympathy. Yup.

[Demen]

Obviously every police officer on earth is a racist just waiting to pop one of those jiggaboo spook nigger monkeys. That's why the Swastika armband is standard issue. His reaction to the shooting, falling to his knees and shouting "Oh god" repeatedly, was just an act for sympathy. Yup.

[Flameswroth]

What they neglect to mention is that Oscar Grant was actually Oz'kahrg Rahnt, a demonic entity from the fifth dimension. What started as a routine arrest for believed drug use became something far more dangerous when Rahnt revealed his sinister reptillian form and began to chant a spell that would end the world. Mehserle, keeper of the holy way of D'knak-thur, recognized it and stepped in swiftly to end Rahnt's incantation with a quick bullet to the back, dispersing the evil Rahnt's spirit back to the fifth dimension, and leaving behind the body of the man he had possessed.

The video tape is pretty blurry, which is why you can't really tell that's what's happening.

I'm actually quite appalled that people are siding with the members of Rahnt's cult on this. They want the policeman punished for dispersing their daemon-lord back to the fifth dimension, postponing their unholy redemption for another millenia.

[Natapoc]

Why? What reason do you have for doubting him?

When a person kills another person I have a tendency to not believe the rational of the shooter without more evidence. The evidence produced by the killer was not very believable.

Do you normally believe killers stories unless pressing evidence to the contrary is presented?

You realize you are asking me to judge what the cop was thinking at the time right? What was going on in his mind?

I prefer the facts of the case: "The cop shot and killed a person who was restrained and posed no harm to anyone".

These are the facts. Anything else requires mind reading abilities and is also not relevant.

[The Parkus Empire]

I remember this shit.

You can train on cardboard for years, but you'll never know the feeling of catching a dangerous criminal

Looks to me like the guy wasn't at all "dangerous" (and even if he were, cops are trained to react properly to dangerous people, not react like you or I, that's part of their job)--the cop, on the other hand, was evidently a sadistic fuck who enjoyed torturing arrestees, yet accidentally (provided his story is to be believed) went too far, so I think "dangerous" in regards to the cop would be slight understatement here.

Despite all this, I feel pretty sorry for the cop, and I should want total leniency, just permanent separation from the police force and any other occupation that requires one to carry a gun. However, there is something immensely satisfying about seeing a cop suffer from the law he lives to shove down everyone's throat--and yet, he only gos one year for this shit and is now supposedly (dunno if it's true, I just saw it posted here) back on the force --this guy should clearly not be a cop.

[Kalysk]

By no means am I condoning the officers shooting of the victim, however, there is no logic/goal in shooting him. It's not like he decided, "Oh, I'm gonna shoot me a nigger and get off free!" If he knowingly pulled out his gun and shot a man, I honestly can't believe he thought he would not go to jail, or at least face some sort of punishment. I like to believe that it was indeed just a horrible accident, and do feel that 1 year is indeed a bit..lenient..for manslaughter.

[Brandenburg-Altmark]

I remember this shit.

You can train on cardboard for years, but you'll never know the feeling of catching a dangerous criminal

Looks to me like the guy wasn't at all "dangerous" (and even if he were, cops are trained to react properly to dangerous people, not react like you or I, that's part of their job)--the cop, on the other hand, was evidently a sadistic fuck who enjoyed torturing arrestees, yet accidentally (provided his story is to be believed) went too far, so I think "dangerous" in regards to the cop would be slight understatement here.

Despite all this, I feel pretty sorry for the cop, and I should want total leniency, just permanent separation from the police force and any other occupation that requires one to carry a gun. However, there is something immensely satisfying about seeing a cop suffer from the law he enforces--and yet, he only gos one year for this shit and is now supposedly (dunno if it's true, I just saw it posted here) back on the force --this guy should clearly not be a cop.

Really? People take G&D's throwaways seriously still? I'd be a bit puzzled if I wasn't giggling.

[The Anti-Cosmic Gods]

What they neglect to mention is that Oscar Grant was actually Oz'kahrg Rahnt, a demonic entity from the fifth dimension. What started as a routine arrest for believed drug use became something far more dangerous when Rahnt revealed his sinister reptillian form and began to chant a spell that would end the world. Mehserle, keeper of the holy way of D'knak-thur, recognized it and stepped in swiftly to end Rahnt's incantation with a quick bullet to the back, dispersing the evil Rahnt's spirit back to the fifth dimension, and leaving behind the body of the man he had possessed.

The video tape is pretty blurry, which is why you can't really tell that's what's happening.

I'm actually quite appalled that people are siding with the members of Rahnt's cult on this. They want the policeman punished for dispersing their daemon-lord back to the fifth dimension, postponing their unholy redemption for another millenia.

Iä! Iä! Rahnt F'tang!!

[Kobeanare]

I feel you might be understating things just a tad.

Patient is exhibiting symptoms consistent with a minor case of death.

What exactly is a major case of death?

[Rokartian States]

Why? What reason do you have for doubting him?

When a person kills another person I have a tendency to not believe the rational of the shooter without more evidence. The evidence produced by the killer was not very believable.

He dropped his gun, grabbed his head, and said, "Oh god." That's not what racist murderers do.

Do you normally believe killers stories unless pressing evidence to the contrary is presented?

I don't believe either side until evidence is presented.

You realize you are asking me to judge what the cop was thinking at the time right? What was going on in his mind?

Judging intent based on actions is not a terribly hard task.

I prefer the facts of the case: "The cop shot and killed a person who was restrained and posed no harm to anyone".

I'm well aware that you prefer to tilt stories against state officials.

These are the facts. Anything else requires mind reading abilities and is also not relevant.

The fact that he immediately showed shock and remorse is irrelevant? The fact that an independent witness heard him say he was about to tase Grant is irrelevant?

[Flameswroth]

Do you normally believe killers stories unless pressing evidence to the contrary is presented?

Of course. That's the premise the whole legal system takes, is it not? We require that guilt be proven before condemnation. We don't assume based on appearances and circumstances and punish accordingly. We assume his innocence, by his testimony or otherwise, until actual guilt can be ascribed.

In this case he was found to be guilty of a crime, just not the one you feel he committed. And I've no doubt that to some degree this was due to not having the appropriate evidence to show what he did was malicious or intentional. So to me, that's the system working as intended.

[Natapoc]

Do you normally believe killers stories unless pressing evidence to the contrary is presented?

Of course. That's the premise the whole legal system takes, is it not? We require that guilt be proven before condemnation. We don't assume based on appearances and circumstances and punish accordingly. We assume his innocence, by his testimony or otherwise, until actual guilt can be ascribed.

In this case he was found to be guilty of a crime, just not the one you feel he committed. And I've no doubt that to some degree this was due to not having the appropriate evidence to show what he did was malicious or intentional. So to me, that's the system working as intended.

Not at all. The premise of the legal system has nothing to do with believing a murders stories about their motives,ect.

It has to do with innocent until proven guilty. This person was proven guilty.