Hey, politicians! Want to create jobs!

[Volnotova]

Though the German education system is highly discriminating (like the Japanese one).

A German friend explained it to me.

Basically, in primary, you are in the same class as everybody else. You all study together. Then, when you're graduating from primary school, your teacher decides which secondary school you go to.

Gymnasium's for the intelligent. Here, they are taught specialised work. Potential engineers, potential doctors, etc are formed here.

Realschule is for the moderately intelligent. Here, they're taught office work, and also some work associated with advanced science.

Hauptschule is for the stupid. Here, they're taught artisinal work.

Are you insinuating that is bad?

Each according to their ability ladies and gentlemen...

[Keronians]

Trade duties, basically.

Yeah, this won't work either. It was one of the reasons why the Great Depression hit the US so badly.

America needs to get over itself, and needs to achieve German style growth.

There were other factors in the Great Depression, and I don't think such a system has ever been done before, and certainly not in a country with the dominance America has in the Consumer market.

Not to mention, I think a few 'ups and downs' are good for a healthy economy. We keep bailing ours out(rather than say, bailing the workers out like in the Depression) and I believe its a factor in our stagnation. Sometimes you need to bottom out so you can continue building back up.

Europe put up its own trade barriers in response. Your international trade went down to $3 billion in the 1929. America used to make up with exports when its domestic demand slowed, but here, it couldn't because:

a) Its goods were more expensive
b) People couldn't afford them, even though they were cheap, because they didn't have money (post-war Europe)

[Greater Cabinda]

There were other factors in the Great Depression, and I don't think such a system has ever been done before, and certainly not in a country with the dominance America has in the Consumer market.

Not to mention, I think a few 'ups and downs' are good for a healthy economy. We keep bailing ours out(rather than say, bailing the workers out like in the Depression) and I believe its a factor in our stagnation. Sometimes you need to bottom out so you can continue building back up.

Europe put up its own trade barriers in response. Your international trade went down to $3 billion in the 1929. America used to make up with exports when its domestic demand slowed, but here, it couldn't because:

a) Its goods were more expensive
b) People couldn't afford them, even though they were cheap, because they didn't have money (post-war Europe)

A) Those were MASSIVE tariffs that no one in their right mind would propose at this point and time.
B) European goods are not the target of most tariffs. Asian goods are. It's not like China really imports anything from us anyway.

[Robert Magoo]

I don't think you're right about that. That's not a bad thing though, because the value of the currency also increases.

How so?

It's a matter of logical. Right now the vast majority of Americans earn far above the minimum wage. If that is understood then it must hold true that lowering the minimum wage for those people would not effect them at all. If you are working for a bank for $18/h then minimum wage being lowered from (a hypothetical) $7/h wouldn't lower your wage in kind. You've already signed a contract to work for $18/h and if we understand the relationship between an employer and employee as one were both sides seek maximum utility for minimum price, then we must conclude that the banker was hired because he was worth $18/h and that no one else applied who would provide comparable service and could be employed for less.

If that is true than the reduction of minimum wage will not have effect on the banker's wage. This process may repeated for anyone currently employed at above minimum wage. The only people who would be effected are the people currently kept out of the market by the minimum wage.

Apply this to another commodity other than labour and you'll see how this is the same, if Gold were to have a price floor of $7 that would not mean that lowering the price floor would lower the price of gold. The price of gold like the price of (skilled) labour is already well above the minimum and an elimination of the price floor will not have any effect in lowering it.

It doesn't directly lower your wage, but it lowers the wage for somebody else, which lowers the wage for people in similar industries earning a similar wage, which lowers wages for those around them, etc etc until all wages are lowered. You may have a contract for a particular wage, but that doesn't mean that somebody else can't come in who will work for less, and contracts aren't generally permanent anyway. The person worth $18 in your example may well be worth $18 given a set value for the currency, but when the value of that currency increases, that person may no longer be worth that wage.

It won't directly reduce wages in all industries, but the economy is totally interconnected. Lowering wages in one industry will eventually catch up to other industries.

[The Black Forrest]

So no government = no public sector?

Er yeah, the government is the public sector.

Tell that to TA.

Only if unemployed people take the jobs. If workers are 'diverted' from more valuable tasks, that would harm the economy, as a bathroom attendant doesn't really add much value...

Isn't that the choice of the business if they want to do that?

Besides they do offer value; those that have them are rather clean.

[Norstal]

Though the German education system is highly discriminating (like the Japanese one).

A German friend explained it to me.

Basically, in primary, you are in the same class as everybody else. You all study together. Then, when you're graduating from primary school, your teacher decides which secondary school you go to.

Gymnasium's for the intelligent. Here, they are taught specialised work. Potential engineers, potential doctors, etc are formed here.

Realschule is for the moderately intelligent. Here, they're taught office work, and also some work associated with advanced science.

Hauptschule is for the stupid. Here, they're taught artisinal work.

I'll say that it isn't a "nice" system, but it did keep the German economy afloat. Or at least, they're doing something right. They still maintain their manufacturing sector; maybe this kind of education system can work in the U.S.

[Mediterreania]

I partially agree with you, but we should also replace welfare with jobfare... instead of the unemployed relying on some government beauracrat for their livelyhood, they can get a job and WORK FOR A LIVING!

Except that large corporations drive small businesses out of business, meaning that people can't WORK FOR A LIVING.

[Terra Agora]

So without a public sector = no government?

So no government = no public sector?

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

[Greater Cabinda]

So no government = no public sector?

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Government positions are public sector...

[The Black Forrest]

I partially agree with you, but we should also replace welfare with jobfare... instead of the unemployed relying on some government beauracrat for their livelyhood, they can get a job and WORK FOR A LIVING!

Except that large corporations drive small businesses out of business, meaning that people can't WORK FOR A LIVING.

That's the problem with all this completely "free market" gibberish.

It will never take hold because those at the top will stop it out.

The concept sounds nice; just not implementable......

[The Black Forrest]

So no government = no public sector?

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Err then what do you call government positions?

[Hydesland]

The government cant create jobs.

The government can create jobs.

[Terra Agora]

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Government positions are public sector...

Im talking about non DC type jobs. Yes technically sure. But broken window fallacy either way so its quite irrelevant.

[Keronians]

So no government = no public sector?

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Not really...

Not having a public sector would in essence mean that there is no government.

[Norstal]

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Err then what do you call government positions?

Thief raping warmongering genocidal satanic devil worshipers who are moronic stupid idiotic poopy heads.

At least, that's what I would say if I were an anarchist.

[Escchelary]

Aww, screw the old system. Let's go Communist!

[Terra Agora]

Yes but you can have a government without a public sector...

Err then what do you call government positions?

Im talking about contractors,police, etc the bulk of the public sector. Not the people in DC.

[Norstal]

Aww, screw the old system. Let's go Communist!

Let's not.

[Terra Agora]

Err then what do you call government positions?

Thief raping warmongering genocidal satanic devil worshipers who are moronic stupid idiotic poopy heads.

At least, that's what I would say if I were an anarchist.

This has nothing to do with anarchism...

[Mediterreania]

Err then what do you call government positions?

Thief raping warmongering genocidal satanic devil worshipers who are moronic stupid idiotic poopy heads.

At least, that's what I would say if I were an anarchist.

I prefer "petty oligarchs of the state."

[Libertarian Mesa]

If I were a business owner and I could hire people for a dollar a day, I would like to hire more produce more and sell for less, I would like to dominate the market and everything will take to compete with me. Not only regulations, but the spirit of business owners.

[Norstal]

Thief raping warmongering genocidal satanic devil worshipers who are moronic stupid idiotic poopy heads.

At least, that's what I would say if I were an anarchist.

This has nothing to do with anarchism...

When you make extravagant claims, I think I'm entitled to using my own strawmen.

[Wolfmanne]

We need more people qualified and starting up their own small businesses, I don't care if they're builders or run a paki shop. David Cameron is doing it with University technical colleges and the 'Big Society', plus the public sector cuts and the Universal Credit which will eliminate a benefits culture. I do agree we need less regulation and more privatization but we shouldn't lower minimum wage.

Btw I speak for Britain not America.

[Greater Cabinda]

If I were a business owner and I could hire people for a dollar a day, I would like to hire more produce more and sell for less, I would like to dominate the market and everything will take to compete with me. Not only regulations, but the spirit of business owners.

So, you admit that you would pay people absolutely shit?

[Greater Cabinda]

We need more people qualified and starting up their own small businesses, I don't care if they're builders or run a paki shop. David Cameron is doing it with University technical colleges and the 'Big Society', plus the public sector cuts and the Universal Credit which will eliminate a benefits culture. I do agree we need less regulation and more privatization but we shouldn't lower minimum wage.

Btw I speak for Britain not America.

In America they're making it significantly harder for small businesses to enter the market.