global collapse?

[Mahdah]

Not if we remained a neutral country, Hitler had nothing against Americans as a neutral country. And whoever said the British would step in, the British army at the time was not very big but their navy on the other hand was the largest.

You forget that Nazi Germany declared war on the US after Pearl Harbor, on December 11th, because of their treaty obligations with Japan. So unless Hitler could have talked the Japanese out of that attack, there was no way the US could stay neutral with respect to the war in Europe.

Hitler could of suceeded if Japan hadent attacked Pearl harbor..

[Espaa]

Not if we remained a neutral country, Hitler had nothing against Americans as a neutral country. And whoever said the British would step in, the British army at the time was not very big but their navy on the other hand was the largest.

That's the most idiotic thing I've heard all day! Hitler only wished to stray away from having the Americans join the war after what had happened in World War I. He knew his forces wouldn't be able to handle fighting them with another enemy so close (USSR), and didn't want to declare war on America until they had enough power to do so (e.g. using conquered European troops). He wanted "world domination" and the rise of the "Aryan race" etc. etc., he would of eventually attacked the Americas there is absolutely no doubt in it.

The USSR was Hitlers ally inthe beginning of the war if he really wanted he could have easily invaded America with the help of the USSR but instead he got greedy and turned against his own ally and that in turn caused the downfall of Nazi Germany. If America remained neutral there would be probably three super powers, Nazi Germany, USSR, and USA.

[Farnhamia]

You forget that Nazi Germany declared war on the US after Pearl Harbor, on December 11th, because of their treaty obligations with Japan. So unless Hitler could have talked the Japanese out of that attack, there was no way the US could stay neutral with respect to the war in Europe.

Hitler could of suceeded if Japan hadent attacked Pearl harbor..

But they did, so your point is pointless.

[Munathanura]

Hitler's attempted empire would have collapsed, even without the Americans, and France would have regained her freedom. Of course, a few tens of millions of people would have died as well as those who died in our timeline, but the Nazis would have fallen. If anything, the French would have ended up speaking Russian, although I suspect that the British might have stepped in and helped France out at this point.

Well if america remained neutarl before hitler could declare war agaisnt America, They have to deal with Russia..

A Russia who had fought so long and hard against Nazi Germany, without any supplies from America? They would have been even worse off than they were IRL. Sure, they would have had more land, but it would have been difficult land to control. America, on the other hand, would have had a large, stable economy, a large industrial base and would have been more than a match for the Russians, who couldn't have even begun to consider attacking America after taking out the Nazis.

[Mahdah]

Hitler could of suceeded if Japan hadent attacked Pearl harbor..

But they did, so your point is pointless.

No you dont understand..When japan attacked Pearl harbor America enterd and then on to that Germany attacks russia, There expansion was then doubted once america entered the war because of the number of nations now agaisnt them on the western front

[Munathanura]

That's the most idiotic thing I've heard all day! Hitler only wished to stray away from having the Americans join the war after what had happened in World War I. He knew his forces wouldn't be able to handle fighting them with another enemy so close (USSR), and didn't want to declare war on America until they had enough power to do so (e.g. using conquered European troops). He wanted "world domination" and the rise of the "Aryan race" etc. etc., he would of eventually attacked the Americas there is absolutely no doubt in it.

The USSR was Hitlers ally inthe beginning of the war if he really wanted he could have easily invaded America with the help of the USSR but instead he got greedy and turned against his own ally and that in turn caused the downfall of Nazi Germany. If America remained neutral there would be probably three super powers, Nazi Germany, USSR, and USA.

No, no they couldn't. Germany and the USSR combined, even with all the manufacturing power of Europe at their disposal, could only equal the manufacturing power of the US, and that's at best. They'd have longer supply lines, loose more men and would also be dealing with massive internal problems that would be tearing their countries apart. If anything like that had been attempted, there would be only one super power left, America, with Canada and Britain probably being the next two largest powers (assuming that Japan entered the war as well and was destroyed along with Germany and the USSR).

Anywho, back on topic, I don't see anything short of total thermonuclear war bringing about the entire collapse of civilisation as we know it.

[Fson]

France being a much smaller country, with a smaller military budget and probably alongside Britain the only European country that can even come close to the US in terms of military might. It was a legit example, no need for the same old jokes..

xD France is full of a bunch of stuck up snobs. They hate Americans when if it wasn't for us French wouldn't be a language anymore and they would all be talking German and saluting Hitler.

And if it wasn't for them you would still be a British colony, not that any of that is relevant since I was merley stating that the US deployment in Africa is negliable.

[Risottia]

how many countries how need to fail before it would start a domino effect? cause all civilization to collapse ?I think two. america and china?

If America and China would collapse, Europe, Russia, South America, India and the Near/Middle East would continue to work. Through major problems, yea, but they wouldn't collapse.

[Farnhamia]

Well if america remained neutarl before hitler could declare war agaisnt America, They have to deal with Russia..

A Russia who had fought so long and hard against Nazi Germany, without any supplies from America? They would have been even worse off than they were IRL. Sure, they would have had more land, but it would have been difficult land to control. America, on the other hand, would have had a large, stable economy, a large industrial base and would have been more than a match for the Russians, who couldn't have even begun to consider attacking America after taking out the Nazis.

I think that if Germany and America had somehow avoided war, and if Germany had either invaded and conquered Britain or forced them to a separate peace ... I don't know. This brings in too many variables. Would there be a British government-in-exile in Canada? If so, what would be our relationship with it? Would German control of the Middle East - I think this an inevitable result of a Nazi victory in Europe - allow them to use economic warfare against the US? Would we come to some kind of agreement with Germany? And there were a number of Nazi sympathizers in the US. They vanished when war came, but without war, might they not have come to the fore in an electoral reaction against Roosevelt's now-failed policy of supporting Britain in Europe?

[Munathanura]

I think that if Germany and America had somehow avoided war, and if Germany had either invaded and conquered Britain or forced them to a separate peace ... I don't know. This brings in too many variables. Would there be a British government-in-exile in Canada? If so, what would be our relationship with it? Would German control of the Middle East - I think this an inevitable result of a Nazi victory in Europe - allow them to use economic warfare against the US? Would we come to some kind of agreement with Germany? And there were a number of Nazi sympathizers in the US. They vanished when war came, but without war, might they not have come to the fore in an electoral reaction against Roosevelt's now-failed policy of supporting Britain in Europe?

I don't see the Germans being able to invade England, not with England's strong navy and the German's lack of deep water surface vessels. If Germany had managed to carve out the little kingdom that Hitler wanted, then Britain might have been at risk of invasion, but even then the German empire would have been torn apart, given Hitler's ideas on who should be free and who should be a slave race. The Soviets would also have done very well against Germany, likely still being able to take Berlin, albeit at a much higher cost.

Now, if Germany had managed to survive the USSR and the internal struggles that would have arisen from Hitler's policies, it probably would have dominated the Middle East and North Africa, at least for a time. America would probably have responded by using oil from what is now Indonesia, as well as its own domestic supply, and probably oil from China once it was discovered there. Germany could have waged economic warfare against the US, but not to all that great an extent.

In regards to the Nazi sympathisers in the US, I can't really say much because I don't know anything. I imagine that they would be sidelined after Germany's eventual collapse, though.

[Newly created nation63]

What does this have to do with Liechtenstein?

[Munathanura]

What does this have to do with Liechtenstein?

Liechtenstein owns the world. Hence, if it collapses, the entire world will collapse.

That may or may not be sarcasm. If in doubt, read the other posts in this thread.

[Grindcore and Beer]

Global collapse will happen economically and it will happen because the middle class vanishes. Once the middle class is gone the economy will slowly phase out since the majority of the population buying their wares is now gone.

[Farnhamia]

Global collapse will happen economically and it will happen because the middle class vanishes. Once the middle class is gone the economy will slowly phase out since the majority of the population buying their wares is now gone.

Do you expect those people to disappear? Even if what we now call the middle class falls into poverty, they'll still exist as people and will still need those wares.

[SpectacularSpectacular]

You forget that Nazi Germany declared war on the US after Pearl Harbor, on December 11th, because of their treaty obligations with Japan. So unless Hitler could have talked the Japanese out of that attack, there was no way the US could stay neutral with respect to the war in Europe.

Hitler could of suceeded if Japan hadent attacked Pearl harbor..

Guess we will never know since we don't live in the world of 'could of'.

I could have been black if only one of my parents were.

[Snoopin Around]

I agree with the first post. If the U.S. falls, and China falls. Global Collapse.

[SpectacularSpectacular]

Global collapse will happen economically and it will happen because the middle class vanishes. Once the middle class is gone the economy will slowly phase out since the majority of the population buying their wares is now gone.

Do you expect those people to disappear? Even if what we now call the middle class falls into poverty, they'll still exist as people and will still need those wares.

Only the middle class apparently go in the rapture

[Grindcore and Beer]

Global collapse will happen economically and it will happen because the middle class vanishes. Once the middle class is gone the economy will slowly phase out since the majority of the population buying their wares is now gone.

Do you expect those people to disappear? Even if what we now call the middle class falls into poverty, they'll still exist as people and will still need those wares.

They will still exist, and yes they will still need those wears. But they may not be able to afford them. You will see more people sacrificing more than they have been already to the point where survival will become futile. I am just putting in my 2 cents.

[Newly created nation63]

I could have been black if only one of my parents were.

We don't have genetic therapies for that yet?

[Farnhamia]

Do you expect those people to disappear? Even if what we now call the middle class falls into poverty, they'll still exist as people and will still need those wares.

They will still exist, and yes they will still need those wears. But they may not be able to afford them. You will see more people sacrificing more than they have been already to the point where survival will become futile. I am just putting in my 2 cents.

You're allowed to put in as many cents as you like, but you have to expect people to respond, and ask you to explain what you say.

And what happens at the point where survival becomes futile? Everyone dies? Mass hysteria? What?

[Grindcore and Beer]

They will still exist, and yes they will still need those wears. But they may not be able to afford them. You will see more people sacrificing more than they have been already to the point where survival will become futile. I am just putting in my 2 cents.

You're allowed to put in as many cents as you like, but you have to expect people to respond, and ask you to explain what you say.

And what happens at the point where survival becomes futile? Everyone dies? Mass hysteria? What?

A serfdom where the richest of the rich keep all power and 75-80% of wealth. Hire own protections. Or there will be bloody revolutions worldwide. I wouldn't put that past the brink of possibility. America will eventually have to wake up if it wants to continue to exist.

[Farnhamia]

You're allowed to put in as many cents as you like, but you have to expect people to respond, and ask you to explain what you say.

And what happens at the point where survival becomes futile? Everyone dies? Mass hysteria? What?

A serfdom where the richest of the rich keep all power and 75-80% of wealth. Hire own protections. Or there will be bloody revolutions worldwide. I wouldn't put that past the brink of possibility. America will eventually have to wake up if it wants to continue to exist.

Wake up and do what?

[Galla-]

Only the USA would need to fall for the world to collapse.

[Sibirsky]

Liechtenstein is the keystone to the whole global economy. If that collapses, we're all doomed.

Kiribati