Abortion Consequences of illegal vs legal

[UCUMAY]

I wanted to discuss this in a logical way.

Pros Legalized abortion

Safer environment
No legal action will be taken on the mothers attempting to abort
Can force medical mal-pratice in the event an abortion is badly performed
Reduce the number of people in the foster care system by reducing the number of unwanted children.
Reduces medical expense due to carrying and deliverying a child (abortion is cheaper than having a baby in a legal system)

Pros Criminalized abortion

More Tax payers
Follows morals
Maybe will make the parents mature?

That's all I can come up with for a first go at it. But as far as I can see there is no logical reason to criminalize abortion unless you need to increase your population.

Your opinions NSG?

[Gauthier]

Another plus for Legalized abortion?

Organized crime won't stand to make money off of it.

[UCUMAY]

Another plus for Legalized abortion?

Organized crime won't stand to make money off of it.

That's a very good reason in my opinion.

[Georgism]

Women won't stick rusty coathangers up their vaginas because they're so desperate to get rid of the foetus if abortion is legal.

Or is that what you meant by 'safer environment'?

[UCUMAY]

Women won't stick rusty coathangers up their vaginas because they're so desperate to get rid of the foetus if abortion is legal.

Or is that what you meant by 'safer environment'?

That is what I meant...

[Georgism]

Women won't stick rusty coathangers up their vaginas because they're so desperate to get rid of the foetus if abortion is legal.

Or is that what you meant by 'safer environment'?

That is what I meant...

Oh. I've got nothing then.

Although I must say that I think legalised abortion 'follows morals' much better than criminalised abortion does.

[UCUMAY]

That is what I meant...

Oh. I've got nothing then.

Although I must say that I think legalised abortion 'follows morals' much better than criminalised abortion does.

I put that in for the religious... But how does legalized abortion follow the morals better? *curious*

[Gaiso]

That is what I meant...

Oh. I've got nothing then.

Although I must say that I think legalised abortion 'follows morals' much better than criminalised abortion does.

Legalized abortion is certainly more "Small Government" than making it illegal.

[UCUMAY]

Oh. I've got nothing then.

Although I must say that I think legalised abortion 'follows morals' much better than criminalised abortion does.

Legalized abortion is certainly more "Small Government" than making it illegal.

I do like a smaller government.

[Augarundus]

Abortion is a moral right; the fetus lacks any rights until it develops rational.

The individual's rights are derived from their rational; at his core, man is a supremely rational being (it is the only means we have of accurately interpreting the universe, our single means of survival, and our key to dominance). To exist as a rational, sovereign self, man must exist independent of coercion (simplified explanation of Objectivism).

A fetus lacks rational, thus has no right to exist.

(I'm debating as to whether or not abortion should be legal at ANY STAGE; an individual has no right save by permission to impose his will over another... thus a child has no right to exist in its mother's womb... but the coercion is not intentional, so it's a difficult debate...)

[UCUMAY]

Abortion is a moral right; the fetus lacks any rights until it develops rational.

The individual's rights are derived from their rational; at his core, man is a supremely rational being (it is the only means we have of accurately interpreting the universe, our single means of survival, and our key to dominance). To exist as a rational, sovereign self, man must exist independent of coercion (simplified explanation of Objectivism).

A fetus lacks rational, thus has no right to exist.

(I'm debating as to whether or not abortion should be legal at ANY STAGE; an individual has no right save by permission to impose his will over another... thus a child has no right to exist in its mother's womb... but the coercion is not intentional, so it's a difficult debate...)

This is off topic....

[Georgism]

Oh. I've got nothing then.

Although I must say that I think legalised abortion 'follows morals' much better than criminalised abortion does.

I put that in for the religious... But how does legalized abortion follow the morals better? *curious*

> Puts the individual in control of her own body
> Prevents the aforementioned rusty coathanger scenario.

Also IIRC it was actually a religious man who led the calls for legal abortion in the UK. I'm not sure where I heard that though so it could be total bullshit.

[UCUMAY]

I put that in for the religious... But how does legalized abortion follow the morals better? *curious*

> Puts the individual in control of her own body
> Prevents the aforementioned rusty coathanger scenario.

Also IIRC it was actually a religious man who led the calls for legal abortion in the UK. I'm not sure where I heard that though so it could be total bullshit.

Protect the sinner so that they can redeem themselves? That's an interesting arguement.

[Roman Templars]

Legalized Abortion: stem cell research (unless its for the facial cream then that is just wrong. Cause it is like rubbing a dead baby on your face)

Criminalized Abortion: Knowing good life is safe
protecting their rights as human beings while in the womb( I don't want to hear about it)
and MORE PEOPLE!

[Augarundus]

Abortion is a moral right; the fetus lacks any rights until it develops rational.

The individual's rights are derived from their rational; at his core, man is a supremely rational being (it is the only means we have of accurately interpreting the universe, our single means of survival, and our key to dominance). To exist as a rational, sovereign self, man must exist independent of coercion (simplified explanation of Objectivism).

A fetus lacks rational, thus has no right to exist.

(I'm debating as to whether or not abortion should be legal at ANY STAGE; an individual has no right save by permission to impose his will over another... thus a child has no right to exist in its mother's womb... but the coercion is not intentional, so it's a difficult debate...)

This is off topic....

This is a pro of legalized abortion. It respects individual sovereignty.

Deontology is a legitimate part of a policy discussion; melikes kritiks.

[Davids Conglomerates]

Pros Criminalized abortion

Maybe will make the parents mature?

I wouldn't class that as a pro. Humans who are immature won't be made any more mature by having abortion available.

There are plenty of people in Ireland who can't handle having the responsibility of a child and we have no shortage of teenagers getting pregnant. Keeping abortion illegal has done nothing to make people more mature. People will still find a way to make an utter balls of their job, no matter the circumstances.

[UCUMAY]

Legalized Abortion: stem cell research (unless its for the facial cream then that is just wrong. Cause it is like rubbing a dead baby on your face)

Criminalized Abortion: Knowing good life is safe
protecting their rights as human beings while in the womb( I don't want to hear about it)
and MORE PEOPLE!

Thank you for adding something constructive.

I strongly believe stem cells need to be researched further. On the other hand I don't necessarily believe in letting a festus potential be wasted. But I still strongly support legal abortion if that makes any sense.

[Georgism]

> Puts the individual in control of her own body
> Prevents the aforementioned rusty coathanger scenario.

Also IIRC it was actually a religious man who led the calls for legal abortion in the UK. I'm not sure where I heard that though so it could be total bullshit.

Protect the sinner so that they can redeem themselves? That's an interesting arguement.

Dunno if that was the actual argument put forward but it sounds nice

[UCUMAY]

Pros Criminalized abortion

Maybe will make the parents mature?

I wouldn't class that as a pro. Humans who are immature won't be made any more mature by having abortion available.

There are plenty of people in Ireland who can't handle having the responsibility of a child and we have no shortage of teenagers getting pregnant. Keeping abortion illegal has done nothing to make people more mature. People will still find a way to make an utter balls of their job, no matter the circumstances.

Nvm...

[UCUMAY]

Protect the sinner so that they can redeem themselves? That's an interesting arguement.

Dunno if that was the actual argument put forward but it sounds nice

It makes more sense than some of the other arguements.

[Roman Templars]

Legalized Abortion: stem cell research (unless its for the facial cream then that is just wrong. Cause it is like rubbing a dead baby on your face)

Criminalized Abortion: Knowing good life is safe
protecting their rights as human beings while in the womb( I don't want to hear about it)
and MORE PEOPLE!

Thank you for adding something constructive.

I strongly believe stem cells need to be researched further. On the other hand I don't necessarily believe in letting a festus potential be wasted. But I still strongly support legal abortion if that makes any sense.

I am a pro life person and against abortion. Call me a hipacrite if you want (isn't the first time) but i believe it stem cells is a form of Taking a life to Save a life.

[Georgism]

Dunno if that was the actual argument put forward but it sounds nice

It makes more sense than some of the other arguements.

Agreed. It makes religious people sound nice, which is a change for these forums.

[UCUMAY]

Thank you for adding something constructive.

I strongly believe stem cells need to be researched further. On the other hand I don't necessarily believe in letting a festus potential be wasted. But I still strongly support legal abortion if that makes any sense.

I am a pro life person and against abortion. Call me a hipacrite if you want (isn't the first time) but i believe it stem cells is a form of Taking a life to Save a life.

Stem cells can also come from cord blood. I believe your facts are out of date rather than right/wrong.

[Norstal]

Legalized Abortion: stem cell research (unless its for the facial cream then that is just wrong. Cause it is like rubbing a dead baby on your face)

Criminalized Abortion: Knowing good life is safe
protecting their rights as human beings while in the womb( I don't want to hear about it)
and MORE PEOPLE!

Thank you for adding something constructive.

I strongly believe stem cells need to be researched further. On the other hand I don't necessarily believe in letting a festus potential be wasted. But I still strongly support legal abortion if that makes any sense.

We don't use fetus for stem cells anymore, I think.

[Roman Templars]

Thank you for adding something constructive.

I strongly believe stem cells need to be researched further. On the other hand I don't necessarily believe in letting a festus potential be wasted. But I still strongly support legal abortion if that makes any sense.

We don't use fetus for stem cells anymore, I think.

Ya know, I am only going off what I was taught in biology class, and we skimmed through stem cells and DNA fingerprinting, etc.