Should religion have a place in Schools

[Dyakovo]

Religion has no place in school or anywhere else in civilized society for that matter

:rofl: It shoud not have a place.

Why?

[Malgrave]

School Children should learn about differing types of religion to expand their cultural beliefs and fight against extremism in the population, however Religion should be kept out of other educational subjects like Science and Maths.

The European approach works best, students learn about other cultures whilst learning about sexual health and evolution.

[Wiztopia]

In Public Schools: No.

In Private Schools: If it is a religious school.

well argued...

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

There's an argument for that? The only school that should have religion in it are religious schools. That's it. Public school is where it especially doesn't belong though.

[Free Soviets]

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

Because private schools, if retaining the knowledge the State tells them to inculcate to the students (after all they must be allowed by the State), are free to teach whatever they wish (again, following the state guidelines). That's why you have religious/military schools. After all, there's freedom of religion. What SHOULD NOT be done is to make the state teach religion as part of its official knowledge.

are is not should be. and preventing them from including religious indoctrination in their schools in no way undermines freedom of religion. they are still free to have whatever the fuck they want for their religious beliefs and practices (within reason, of course). but running a school is not a religious undertaking, and i see no reason to let them pollute education with their nonsense.

[Dyakovo]

running a school is not a religious undertaking.

It is if it is a religious institution running the school...

[Free Soviets]

well argued...

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

There's an argument for that? The only school that should have religion in it are religious schools. That's it.

the second sentence is precisely what i am looking for an argument to support - why should we let 'religious schools' exist? if religious organizations want to run a school, go for it (provided they meet standards, etc). but why should they be allowed to mix education and religious indoctrination?

Public school is where it especially doesn't belong though.

sure. though your argument against teaching about religions remains ridiculous.

[Wiztopia]

There's an argument for that? The only school that should have religion in it are religious schools. That's it.

the second sentence is precisely what i am looking for an argument to support - why should we let 'religious schools' exist? if religious organizations want to run a school, go for it (provided they meet standards, etc). but why should they be allowed to mix education and religious indoctrination?

Public school is where it especially doesn't belong though.

sure. though your argument against teaching about religions remains ridiculous.

They probably shouldn't when you think about it. Especially when some of the students don't agree with the religion. Like if parents force them to go there.

I still maintain that no religious book belongs in a public school.

[Free Soviets]

running a school is not a religious undertaking.

It is if it is a religious institution running the school...

nah. the closest you'd get would be to find/found a religion that held 'teaching the government required curriculum' to be a sacred act. no religion that i am aware of holds such a thing. but even then, the actual business of running a school would be only incidentally religious. schooling itself is a non-religious thing.

[Samuraikoku]

are is not should be. and preventing them from including religious indoctrination in their schools in no way undermines freedom of religion. they are still free to have whatever the fuck they want for their religious beliefs and practices (within reason, of course). but running a school is not a religious undertaking, and i see no reason to let them pollute education with their nonsense.

Freedom of religion implies that religious organizations can teach their beliefs, and that includes having religious schools. But, if regulated by the State, the "religious indoctrinement" wouldn't happen. Just like religious school students where I live pay no mind. One thing is to keep religion away from education (that's why the official state education must be secular), another is intolerance.

[Free Soviets]

are is not should be. and preventing them from including religious indoctrination in their schools in no way undermines freedom of religion. they are still free to have whatever the fuck they want for their religious beliefs and practices (within reason, of course). but running a school is not a religious undertaking, and i see no reason to let them pollute education with their nonsense.

Freedom of religion implies that religious organizations can teach their beliefs, and that includes having religious schools.

no, it doesn't. at least not if we are using 'schools' to mean the equivalent of the compulsory public school system. now, it may be the case that if we prevent them from integrating indoctrination into their curriculum, religions will stop running private schools. and, well, good. but they clearly could run a school without the religion and have their indoctrination classes after school or on weekends or whatever. like they do anyways for their adherents who go to real schools...

[Samuraikoku]

no, it doesn't. at least not if we are using 'schools' to mean the equivalent of the compulsory public school system. now, it may be the case that if we prevent them from integrating indoctrination into their curriculum, religions will stop running private schools. and, well, good. but they clearly could run a school without the religion and have their indoctrination classes after school or on weekends or whatever. like they do anyways for their adherents who go to real schools...

That would be pointless, wouldn't it? And yes, unfortunately, freedom of religion implies freedom to teach it at their schools, providing that they attone to the official curriculum. If the law says so, so it is. The decision of which school to attend, however, it's upon the parents.

[JuNii]

And if it does how should it be taught;
Extra curricular subject,
Voluntary subject,
Creationism, should it be allowed,
not at all,
blanket teach multiple religions alongside each other,
just the "main" ones,

Thoughts...?

it does have a place in school. it's called Religious studies or Theology. normally I believe it's a Voluntary subject and it should be all encompassing, including all the major religions.

[New Alaxia]

And if it does how should it be taught;
Extra curricular subject,
Voluntary subject,
Creationism, should it be allowed,
not at all,
blanket teach multiple religions alongside each other,
just the "main" ones,

Thoughts...?

it does have a place in school. it's called Religious studies or Theology. normally I believe it's a Voluntary subject and it should be all encompassing, including all the major religions.

It's fine to have a class to learn about it, but not to teach it as fact with the rest of the curriculum. I definitely agree we should learn about religions, but not as part of any core classes like science.

[Free Soviets]

no, it doesn't. at least not if we are using 'schools' to mean the equivalent of the compulsory public school system. now, it may be the case that if we prevent them from integrating indoctrination into their curriculum, religions will stop running private schools. and, well, good. but they clearly could run a school without the religion and have their indoctrination classes after school or on weekends or whatever. like they do anyways for their adherents who go to real schools...

That would be pointless, wouldn't it?

perhaps some religious groups would want to run a school because they think education is important rather than as merely an excuse for indoctrination?

And yes, unfortunately, freedom of religion implies freedom to teach it at their schools, providing that they attone to the official curriculum. If the law says so, so it is.

um, the question i am posing is "why shouldn't we change the law?"

[Vecherd]

In Public Schools: No.

In Private Schools: If it is a religious school.

well argued...

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

No reason for the government to shove its big nose in private school so long hatred is not teached.

[Samuraikoku]

perhaps some religious groups would want to run a school because they think education is important rather than as merely an excuse for indoctrination?

It's inconceivable to think a religious group would run a secular school making their own religious education optional. It doesn't make any sense.

um, the question i am posing is "why shouldn't we change the law?"

If the majority of people (or at least their representatives in Congress) are fine with religious education taught in religious private schools and keeping it away from public secular schools, then why do you need to change it?

[Norstal]

well argued...

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

No reason for the government to shove its big nose in private school so long hatred is not teached.

What if they teach creationism and screw up the next generation?

[Ifreann]

well argued...

btw, i'm still waiting to hear a reasonable argument for why we shouldn't require even private schools to be secular in their educational operations. save the religious indoctrination for, well, never. but at least keep it outside of education.

No reason for the government to shove its big nose in private school so long hatred is not teached.

So, I could establish a private school and teach children that 1 + 1 = purple monkey dishwasher, and there's nothing wrong with that?

[Rentusera]

No reason for the government to shove its big nose in private school so long hatred is not teached.

So, I could establish a private school and teach children that 1 + 1 = purple monkey dishwasher, and there's nothing wrong with that?

Yes. That is free speech.

Case in point, I don't believe in truly free speech.

a = world
b = physics
c = matter-energy
x = god

b+c+x = a
b+c = a
b+c = b+c+x = a but b+x ≠ and c+x ≠ a
∴ x = 0
Q.E.D.

Do I get a Nobel Prize yet?

I think there's a spare Chemistry one lying around here somewhere, if that'll do.

It'll do.

Does it come with the cash, though?

I read your post, read your signature, read your post again, and...

Too young, call me in four years. >_>

[Maroza]

Maybe in history class that someone who is worshiped was crucified and that we use the year of his death to tell the date.

[Make up your own mind]

I read your post, read your signature, read your post again, and...

Too young, call me in four years. >_>[/quote]

Understood. <_<

[Flameswroth]

are is not should be. and preventing them from including religious indoctrination in their schools in no way undermines freedom of religion. they are still free to have whatever the fuck they want for their religious beliefs and practices (within reason, of course). but running a school is not a religious undertaking, and i see no reason to let them pollute education with their nonsense.

Perhaps it would be edifying for you to observe some science, math or history classes at a religious institution, then? It strikes me that perhaps you have this vision in your mind that religion suffuses and warps every topic at a private, religious institution to the point where the education is compromised. However, given that a school must be accredited in order to have its degrees/diplomas/etc recognized in any official capacity, I do not think the problem of religion in a private school compromises the education to the degree you feel it does.

I think that's the important thing to remember - that there are guidelines in becoming an accredited institution, and they can ensure that educational standards are met.

[Johz]

Why of course. Considering the vast majority of people in the world have some form of religion, it should form part of the physical/social/health aspect of the curriculum, alongside being gay, and the fact that people of differing skin colours exist. No one religion should be pushed down everyone's throats, but it's a necessary life skill...

[Bottle]

Why of course. Considering the vast majority of people in the world have some form of religion, it should form part of the physical/social/health aspect of the curriculum, alongside being gay, and the fact that people of differing skin colours exist. No one religion should be pushed down everyone's throats, but it's a necessary life skill...

Teaching that religion exists is quite different from teaching religion. For instance, we teach children that the KKK exists, but we don't teach the precepts of the KKK as if they were fact, or as if they were good rules for living. The people who want Christianity taught in American schools want to see Christian principles presented as fact, as moral directives, and as the cultural heritage of America...none of which are any more true of Christian principles than of the KKK's principles.

[Demarlandia]

Considering the prevalence of theists, I'd suggest that religious education is very important to understand views of individuals, promote social cohesion and, most importantly,Creacionusm is Bull Shit.That way in the Great Nation of Demarlandia the people is learning the History of lost Humanities