Libya megathread: Gaddafi dead

[Alien Space Bats]

OK, quick question: How many of you anti-interventionists would be in favor of helping the rebels if they announced that they wanted to establish a Marxist regime in Libya?

[Sibirsky]

OK, quick question: How many of you anti-interventionists would be in favor of helping the rebels if they announced that they wanted to establish a Marxist regime in Libya?

[Parti Ouvrier]

Obama has given an ultimatum to Gaddafi, which is getting us ever closer to war.

Thank you Charlotte. Of course I don't agree with everything you say but I believe the words 'military action' give us an idea of what is in store for the Libyan people.*

*Keep in mind the rebels will be submerged with Colonel Gadhaffi's supporters. It's an illusion to think that Gadhaffi's forces can just be targeted neatly.

[Laerod]

Considering that the people in question have been requesting exactly the intervention they're now getting for about a week, I think you've some explaining to do concerning how exactly listening to, and granting their request is denying democratic rights.

It's rather like saying that the western personnel presently involved in Japan is denying Japan's democratic right to deal with the earthquake-aftermath.

... Actually, not rather, but exactly like saying this.

This is Middle East Megathread, onward...The democratic initiative has been taken away and the people calling for western intervention are very small and usually the people who were formally part of the Gadhaffi regime, that is to say they are opportunists hoping to curry favour with the west.

Have people forgotten this infamous banner already. viewtopic.php?f=20&t=95787&start=1050
It reads 'No foreign intervention; Libyan people can manage it alone.' How soon people forget.
Meanwhile the mainstream media wants everyone to forget what happened in Iraq. They want to just sweep it aside and support a friendly no kill zone. Its just a no fly zone they will tell you, nothing bad will happen because everything the government says including the shrill voices of the illiberal, priggish mainstream media that demands we 'do something' in Libya.

Oh, right, sweep it aside. Because letting Gaddafi crush the rebels and letting the disasters in Japan hog the media were clearly not options.

[Parti Ouvrier]

This is Middle East Megathread, onward...The democratic initiative has been taken away and the people calling for western intervention are very small and usually the people who were formally part of the Gadhaffi regime, that is to say they are opportunists hoping to curry favour with the west.

Have people forgotten this infamous banner already. viewtopic.php?f=20&t=95787&start=1050
It reads 'No foreign intervention; Libyan people can manage it alone.' How soon people forget.
Meanwhile the mainstream media wants everyone to forget what happened in Iraq. They want to just sweep it aside and support a friendly no kill zone. Its just a no fly zone they will tell you, nothing bad will happen because everything the government says including the shrill voices of the illiberal, priggish mainstream media that demands we 'do something' in Libya.

Oh, right, sweep it aside. Because letting Gaddafi crush the rebels and letting the disasters in Japan hog the media were clearly not options.

Oh, let's talk about Japan in the Middle East Mega thread. I give up.

[Ceannairceach]

Perhaps this was already mentioned, but...

It appears Obama has finally moved. I for one will be watching intently for any American intervention in the area.

[Lacadaemon]

I don't think brutally gunning down protesters actually makes your regime look stronger and impervious to breakdown. I think you've got causality in reverse, Gaddafi couldn't do something like that immediately because there is seemingly such an overwhelming segment against him in the country that an attack like wouldn't scare them into submission but enrage them more so. So the west are happy to intervene since this would seem to have popular support, and as such Gaddafi's regime is clearly illegitimate. I don't think the perception of Gaddafi's regime being unstable was caused by him not immediately and brutally gunning down protesters (how many regimes actually unambiguously do this any more anyway?), that's just a tangential event related to the general clear instability of the regime, and is as such a non sequitur.

Gun them down straight away=stability.

My point is he wasn't tyrannical enough to hold a firm grip on the country, and that is now why the west is eager to drop bombs.

And lets face it, this is all going through because people shot their mouths off and the result - if Gaddaiffi survives- will be another round of nationalization. Hence the bombs.

[Cerralvo Island]

The US hasnt declared war since 1943.

[Sierra Lobo]

Me too. I just want all US forces to withdraw. We have no business with any nations at all. We need to scale down/ close bases in Japan, Germany and in all ME nations.

Withdraw from all foreign bases.

I wont be that drastic scaling down with eventual withdrawal as the goal, is more realistic. The ultimate goal is complete withdrawal from all bases.

[Mosasauria]

No.
This is their revolution. Unless the anti-Gadhaffi revolters ask for help, we should not, under any circumstances, intervene.

[South Norwega]

No.
This is their revolution. Unless the anti-Gadhaffi revolters ask for help, we should not, under any circumstances, intervene.

They've asked for the imposition of a No-Fly Zone, IIRC>

[Caninope]

No. This does not cut it on an international forum, especially if Sky News has a website.

Wait...why does it cut it LESS if Sky News has a website? Wouldn't that make it more...uh...however you modify "cut it" for this context, because other people can see it?

I'm looking at their site, I guess I'm not familiar enough with the UK's culture/news to be able to tell if this is nutty or not.

Because he told us to watch the TV channel, not available to most here in the States, when he could have just grabbed the article off the website, if there is indeed one.

[Caninope]

NO!

Foreign powers must not invade Libya. That'll just screw up the situation even more. Civilians would just be dying even more quickly, thanks to the 'mistakes' of the foreign soldiers. And once Gaddafi is gone, the foreigners will have to set up a government, most likely a weak or corrupt one.

No foreign intervention!

*cough*

Foreign Intervention =/= Invasion

[Mosasauria]

No.
This is their revolution. Unless the anti-Gadhaffi revolters ask for help, we should not, under any circumstances, intervene.

They've asked for the imposition of a No-Fly Zone, IIRC>

Then that's about all we should do, and nothing else.

[Caninope]

The US hasnt declared war since 1943.

December 8, 1941, IIRC.

[Farnhamia]

No.
This is their revolution. Unless the anti-Gadhaffi revolters ask for help, we should not, under any circumstances, intervene.

They've asked for the imposition of a No-Fly Zone, IIRC>

They have, and the UN has authorized one.

[South Norwega]

The US hasnt declared war since 1943.

December 8, 1941, IIRC.

June '42, it seems

[Scientific socks]

December 8, 1941, IIRC.

June '42, it seems

Depending the definition of war. There have been plenty of military engagements. The world just assumes that the US should solve international issues such as Libya. Most other powerful countries could not care less. I noted that Russia and China didnt even bother having an opinion on what should be done in Libya.

[Rolamec]

Who declares war nowadays?

And yes, declare war, and take over it. Split it up between the three powers.

[Israeon]

Iraq
Afghanistan

Now... Libya?

HELL NAW!

[Potarius]

Why doesn't the US just declare war on the rest of the African nations that are involved in this kind of shit, too?

Hmm...

[Vitaphone Racing]

I was told that I had to say what my opinions are

Also, whilst your at it, perhaps clean it up, because most users on this site wont bother reading that

it is what we internet folk call a TEXT WALL

Are you serious? Its about 500 words.

[Potarius]

Also, whilst your at it, perhaps clean it up, because most users on this site wont bother reading that

it is what we internet folk call a TEXT WALL

Are you serious? Its about 500 words.

A rather poorly-formatted wall of fucking text with facts and opinions interspliced with reckless abandon that happens to be about 500 words, yeah.

[Rolamec]

Why doesn't the US just declare war on the rest of the African nations that are involved in this kind of shit, too?

Hmm...

Do they have oil?

[Aryas regime]

Dude think we helped Alkida before they came alkida against the russians in the cold war there president is bad enough if we helped the rebels we would just have more alkida type groups in libya!