Wait the Innocent are getting punished?

[Wilgrove]

Well that's what your doing if you're advocating punishing the guy who's just defending himself.

I don't follow.

The kid who defended himself does not need to be punished. The little shit started the fight, he just ended it. If anyone needs to be punished, it's the little shit. There will always be violence in school, and violence is NOT caused by people defending themselves, it's caused by people like this little shit. So if you want to end violence in school, then give the victims of bullying the tools they need to defend themselves.

Follow now?

[Gelgisith]

Yeah I don't really think that the big kid should get all that shit for fighting back. That little asshole punched him in the face, so he should expect something in return, right? My personal opinion on stopping bullying is that weapons should be allowed and encouraged on schools grounds. If everyone had a gun, no one would fuck with anyone. Simple enough.

You know, I have no problem with adults arming themselves, they, in general, tend to have a better head on their shoulders....but kids? Nope, sorry. Hormones are more in control of the kid than his mind is. Like I said, victims of bullying should take up martial arts.

I had martial arts lesson, but that didn't help me none. First thing you're taught in martial arts schools is, "Never Do This Out Of Class!" Gave me the idea it was useless to make the bullying stop, so i dropped out pretty soon.

Why the Hell do both need to be punished? The little shit started it, Casey let him slap him around some, block some of his shot and presumably asked him to stop before body slamming him. If anything, the little shit needs to be spanked, and spanked hard for being such a little shit.
Casey was NOT in the wrong on this one, and we have video evidence to prove it.

Hard to say. It was self-defense, but the retribution was not proportional. I can understand if the kid punch back, but a body slam is too much to me. Spanked yes. Body slammed no. Especially when it has been shown the little kid is limping.

Spanking makes no impression, you have to nearly kill them, or threaten to do so, to get it through their thick skulls that you had enough.
Also, we don't know how many years of torment Casey went through before he struck back. When i finally snapped, it was after six or seven years of bullying, and just turned around, grabbed the nearest guy & started pushing him towards the stairs, fully intending to throw him off them. Fortunately, a teacher intervened before i got that far. I told the teacher, who happened to be my mentor, that they shouldn't be bullying me. The bullying stopped after that, so i guess i made my point.

[Wilgrove]

Another link

Apparently the little shit suffered a broken ankle due to the body slam, but nothing else. I say he got off light.

[Sorratsin]

The kid who defended himself does not need to be punished. The little shit started the fight, he just ended it.

We don't know that, what if the little kid was provoked? What about in other violent situations besides this one? What if two kids started fighting each other? Should they both be allowed to fight as long as it could be seen as self defense?

If anyone needs to be punished, it's the little shit.

Which is why I said he should be punished.

There will always be violence in school, and violence is NOT caused by people defending themselves,

And so teachers should sit back and let kids solve their disputes via gang fights? I don't think you understand what self defense is. Beating the shit out of anyone who annoys you isn't self defense.

So if you want to end violence in school, then give the victims of bullying the tools they need to defend themselves.

They already have those tools, they're called teachers. You're treating this as if this kid was cornered by an evil murderer and had no other choice but to body slam him. He had plenty of other choices, go to a teacher, walk away, or just let the instigator continue to make a fool out of himself, it's not like that skinny kid had any chance of hurting the other kid, he was half his size.

Follow now?

Not really.

[Wikipedia and Universe]

I know I shouldn't but this just makes me laugh.

Yeah, it's quite funny. Have to say the guy is patient though. It was me, that kid would've been bleeding.

If some punk decided to get behind me and grab my collar, I'd swing back, wrap his hand, hard palm heel right to the face, then take him the fuck down. In the end they would be on the ground with a bloody nose and choking from a diaphragm spasm.

[Sorratsin]

Another link

Apparently the little shit suffered a broken ankle due to the body slam, but nothing else. I say he got off light.

Getting a bone broken over a petty squabble is light? What would be appropriate? Death by firing squad?

The people in this thread seem to have way too much emotional baggage about this issue to think rationally. Enjoy your kids being stabbed to death over pokemon cards.

[Xarithis]

They already have those tools, they're called teachers.

I think you vastly overestimate teachers' willingness to help in these situations.

The few times I was bullied, telling the teacher would result in a "Don't be such a tattletale/crybaby."

Pencils are much better allies.

[Sremski okrug]

Another link

Apparently the little shit suffered a broken ankle due to the body slam, but nothing else. I say he got off light.

Getting a bone broken over a petty squabble is light? What would be appropriate? Death by firing squad?

The people in this thread seem to have way too much emotional baggage about this issue to think rationally. Enjoy your kids being stabbed to death over pokemon cards.

People don't have the confidence to talk to teachers about bullying, they often feel that nothing will be done about it or they'll be humiliated in some meeting. This kid obviously felt like he had no-one else to turn to and stood up for himself using his size to his advantage, the bully getting an injury is just his own fault for bullying someone. If he did not want to get hurt he should of not of tormented someone.

[Gelgisith]

So if you want to end violence in school, then give the victims of bullying the tools they need to defend themselves.

They already have those tools, they're called teachers. You're treating this as if this kid was cornered by an evil murderer and had no other choice but to body slam him. He had plenty of other choices, go to a teacher, walk away, or just let the instigator continue to make a fool out of himself, it's not like that skinny kid had any chance of hurting the other kid, he was half his size.

Except teachers don't do a fucking shit, other than making sure they can't be blamed. That is the problem. If teachers (and parents) would actually do something to stop bullying, it wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem as it is. And, no, it doesn't "toughen them up", they'll just end up kill their bullies, kill themselves (or attempt either), or drop out.

[Wilgrove]

The kid who defended himself does not need to be punished. The little shit started the fight, he just ended it.

We don't know that, what if the little kid was provoked? What about in other violent situations besides this one? What if two kids started fighting each other? Should they both be allowed to fight as long as it could be seen as self defense?

Have you watched the video? It's pretty damn clear from the video that the little kid started it.

If anyone needs to be punished, it's the little shit.

Which is why I said he should be punished.

No, you said they BOTH should be punished.

There will always be violence in school, and violence is NOT caused by people defending themselves,

And so teachers should sit back and let kids solve their disputes via gang fights? I don't think you understand what self defense is. Beating the shit out of anyone who annoys you isn't self defense.

Casey didn't beat the shit out of him! The little kid started by punching him in the face repeatedly, Casey then started blocking the punches and when he had enough he body slammed him, and then walked away. He didn't mercilessly wail on the kid. He body slammed him and walked away. Self Defense is PAINFULLY obvious in the video, even Ray Charles can see that it was self defense.

So if you want to end violence in school, then give the victims of bullying the tools they need to defend themselves.

They already have those tools, they're called teachers. You're treating this as if this kid was cornered by an evil murderer and had no other choice but to body slam him. He had plenty of other choices, go to a teacher, walk away, or just let the instigator continue to make a fool out of himself, it's not like that skinny kid had any chance of hurting the other kid, he was half his size.

Teachers and school administrators rarely help in a school bullying situation. More often than not, they make things worse. Also, have you ever TRIED walking away from someone hitting you in the face? I mean really? Also, Casey did a pretty good job of making a fool out of the little dude by body slamming him.

I'm sorry, but for some damn reason, the teachers and school administrators suck at handling the bullying problem in our schools. The only real solution I can see is, support acts of self defense and give the victims of bullying a chance to at least learn some martial arts movement to neutralize the threat. Bullies do NOT understand reasons and they don't care about their academics, if they did, they wouldn't be bullies. The only thing they understand is force.

I bet you five bucks that the little shit will now think twice before he picks on someone else.

Follow now?

Not really.

I don't know how to make it any clearer than that then.

[Wilgrove]

Getting a bone broken over a petty squabble is light? What would be appropriate? Death by firing squad?

The people in this thread seem to have way too much emotional baggage about this issue to think rationally. Enjoy your kids being stabbed to death over pokemon cards.

People don't have the confidence to talk to teachers about bullying, they often feel that nothing will be done about it or they'll be humiliated in some meeting. This kid obviously felt like he had no-one else to turn to and stood up for himself using his size to his advantage, the bully getting an injury is just his own fault for bullying someone. If he did not want to get hurt he should of not of tormented someone.

More often than not, teachers don't do anything. All they do is give a slap on the wrist and tell the bullies to NOT do it again. The worse they'll do is Suspension, and even that's ineffective, because like I said, bullies don't care about their academics. So a suspension is basically like free vacation days for them to go and be an ass somewhere else. The school is totally ineffective to deal with the bullying problem.

If I ever have a kid, you can be your ass I'll be enrolling my kid in martial art classes.

[Sorratsin]

They already have those tools, they're called teachers.

I think you vastly overestimate teachers' willingness to help in these situations.

The few times I was bullied, telling the teacher would result in a "Don't be such a tattletale/crybaby."

Pencils are much better allies.

The teachers at my school helped me out tremendously with the kids that bullied me. I also managed the problem myself by simply avoiding them as much as possible.

This "let kids just beat the shit out of their enemies" solution has several critical flaws. A lot of kids who are bullied do not have friends (me), unlike bullies. Secondly, a lot of bullied kids become quite unstable, the kid who instigated this got off lucky with only a broken ankle, if the policy of no punishment for attacking bullies were put into place, he will probably end up dead eventually.

[Wilgrove]

I think you vastly overestimate teachers' willingness to help in these situations.

The few times I was bullied, telling the teacher would result in a "Don't be such a tattletale/crybaby."

Pencils are much better allies.

The teachers at my school helped me out tremendously with the kids that bullied me. I also managed the problem myself by simply avoiding them as much as possible.

This "let kids just beat the shit out of their enemies" solution has several critical flaws. A lot of kids who are bullied do not have friends (me), unlike bullies. Secondly, a lot of bullied kids become quite unstable, the kid who instigated this got off lucky with only a broken ankle, if the policy of no punishment for attacking bullies were put into place, he will probably end up dead eventually.

That depends on whether or not the bully is stupid enough to keep being a bully. Get body slammed enough time, you're going to learn.

[Grainne Ni Malley]

We don't know that, what if the little kid was provoked? What about in other violent situations besides this one? What if two kids started fighting each other? Should they both be allowed to fight as long as it could be seen as self defense?

Did you watch the same video I did? It was quite evident that the smaller boy was more than happy to take several jabs at Casey, seeking approval from his friends as he showed off, while Casey just stood there for a few before making the final "statement". A bully always initiates while the subject of the attack stands there trying to determine the best course of action.

And so teachers should sit back and let kids solve their disputes via gang fights? I don't think you understand what self defense is. Beating the shit out of anyone who annoys you isn't self defense.

Teachers should not sit back, but teachers DO sit back, or are nowhere to be seen. A lot more than "annoyance" was going on here. Several punches to the face were made by the bully. One body slam is not beating the shit out of somebody.

They already have those tools, they're called teachers. You're treating this as if this kid was cornered by an evil murderer and had no other choice but to body slam him. He had plenty of other choices, go to a teacher, walk away, or just let the instigator continue to make a fool out of himself, it's not like that skinny kid had any chance of hurting the other kid, he was half his size.

See above. Teachers are not always present or willing to intervene. If teachers, or even playground monitors, could see all and intervene, bullying would be more of an anomaly than commonplace. Also, while a kid is attacking you, it is not as easy to disengage yourself from the assault and find a teacher as you might think. Bullies will often do all in their power to prevent you from walking away. You might think, "Oh he's a big kid, big deal", but bullying is not just a physical attack. It is a mental one as well, that leaves the victim of the bullying feeling helpless until something is done about it. Finally, size isn't really relevant. Little people can hurt big people. Happens all the time.

[Forsakia]

Another link

Apparently the little shit suffered a broken ankle due to the body slam, but nothing else. I say he got off light.

Getting a bone broken over a petty squabble is light? What would be appropriate? Death by firing squad?

The people in this thread seem to have way too much emotional baggage about this issue to think rationally. Enjoy your kids being stabbed to death over pokemon cards.

This

[Wilgrove]

Getting a bone broken over a petty squabble is light? What would be appropriate? Death by firing squad?

The people in this thread seem to have way too much emotional baggage about this issue to think rationally. Enjoy your kids being stabbed to death over pokemon cards.

This

Ok, who here has actually been bullied? Also, I said he got off light, because a body slam onto concrete could've been alot worse. Your brain is basically suspended in fluid, and a body slam like that could've easy caused a concussion or worse. It could've also severed the spine, or snapped the neck. Like I said, the kid got off light.

*Raises Hand*

[Sorratsin]

Have you watched the video? It's pretty damn clear from the video that the little kid started it.

I know, but not every fight is video-taped, you've never had a bully pull the reversal trick on you? Are all schoolyard fights as clear cut as this? What happens when two kids start fighting each other and it isn't one-sided? Should we not punish them for self defense?

No, you said they BOTH should be punished.

Both would include the instigator.

Casey didn't beat the shit out of him! The little kid started by punching him in the face repeatedly, Casey then started blocking the punches and when he had enough he body slammed him, and then walked away. He didn't mercilessly wail on the kid. He body slammed him and walked away. Self Defense is PAINFULLY obvious in the video, even Ray Charles can see that it was self defense.

His ankle was broken, and he looked like he may have had a concussion. I can think of a hundred different ways to prevent a fight with someone half my size that doesn't involve breaking their ankle.

Also, I imagine part of the reason Casey didn't wail on him was the punishment he knew would follow, the very same punishment you want abolished. If you took me back to high school and said I could attack my bullies with impunity. They'd be dead.

Teachers and school administrators rarely help in a school bullying situation. More often than not, they make things worse. Also, have you ever TRIED walking away from someone hitting you in the face? I mean really? Also, Casey did a pretty good job of making a fool out of the little dude by body slamming him.

I'm sorry, but for some damn reason, the teachers and school administrators suck at handling the bullying problem in our schools. The only real solution I can see is, support acts of self defense and give the victims of bullying a chance to at least learn some martial arts movement to neutralize the threat. Bullies do NOT understand reasons and they don't care about their academics, if they did, they wouldn't be bullies. The only thing they understand is force.

Not my experience, maybe I'm an outlier I don't know. Many of you seem to be internalizing this way too much, this skinny kid is probably not Adolf Hitler reincarnated, if he's anything like the bullies I knew, he's an over-privileged idiot with shitty parents, doesn't mean he deserves to have his bones broken or worse.

I bet you five bucks that the little shit will now think twice before he picks on someone else.

He also might be too afraid to return to school, sound familiar?

[Grainne Ni Malley]

Ok, who here has actually been bullied? Also, I said he got off light, because a body slam onto concrete could've been alot worse. Your brain is basically suspended in fluid, and a body slam like that could've easy caused a concussion or worse. It could've also severed the spine, or snapped the neck. Like I said, the kid got off light.

*Raises Hand*

I'll raise my hand with you. It seems like we have similar experiences with bullying. Such as teachers being nowhere around to help until after the fact. Or bullies being relentless and not letting up until you finally stand up for yourself and make sure they know in the only way they seem to understand that you are not to be messed with anymore.

[Forsakia]

This

Ok, who here has actually been bullied? Also, I said he got off light, because a body slam onto concrete could've been alot worse. Your brain is basically suspended in fluid, and a body slam like that could've easy caused a concussion or worse. It could've also severed the spine, or snapped the neck. Like I said, the kid got off light.

*Raises Hand*

Yes I was bullied. And the risks that were involved in what he did give all the more reason he should be punished. As I said if he'd just punched him back I wouldn't have been so bothered.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

The skinny little bully isn't going to bully anyone now, and is unlikely to receive broken bones from other bullied people retaliating against his non-bullying. Whether or not it's entirely his fault, the lesson has been learned and won't need retaught.

[Xarithis]

Ok, who here has actually been bullied?

*Raises hand*

Only a bit, though. The whole stabbing-arm-with-pencil thing pretty much ended it. But still, I was.

[Sorratsin]

I was bullied but apparently had a weird experience with it. Adults and avoidance were my best ways of dealing with them, standing up to 5-7 people who were all bigger than you only resulted in an ass-kicking.

[Grainne Ni Malley]

Ok, who here has actually been bullied?

*Raises hand*

Only a bit, though. The whole stabbing-arm-with-pencil thing pretty much ended it. But still, I was.

That makes you the second person I know of to resolve an issue by stabbing someone with a pencil. It must be the pointiness.

[Zanazbar]

Kid got shat on

[Grainne Ni Malley]

I was bullied but apparently had a weird experience with it. Adults and avoidance were my best ways of dealing with them, standing up to 5-7 people who were all bigger than you only resulted in an ass-kicking.

You definitely seem to have had a different experience. It is fortunate that you had adults willing, or present to intervene, and that avoidance worked for you. Still, a shame that you had to go out of your way to avoid potential bullying. Students should be able to just go to school and learn without fear of bullies.