Taxes on Churches?

[Genivar]

I don't know how taxing a church is considered unconstitutional, but I think any church that supports a political candidate should lose their tax exemption status.

[Minotzia]

Now, the Constitution clearly dictates a separation of church and state. I think that this is a violation of the Constitution. Its only generating a few thousand dollars a year, so all it does is discourage church attendance and violate people's rights. I have a few questions for NS:

Is it Constitutionally acceptable for the city of Mission, Kansas to tax churches?
Is it morally acceptable for the city of Mission, Kansas to tax churches?
Should the federal or state government do something about this?
AND Why?

1. Definitely not, it is clear that the separation of Church and State was intended to not only prevent Church influence the State, but the other way around. The fact that the Founders never engaged or supported this action is evident that their intent included a prohibition on taxing religious establishments.

2. No, we open the door to further taxation/control of private organizations. It's unacceptable to allow the government to control any aspect of religious practice. It discourages religious organization and as a result must be condemned.

3. I imagine that the municipal government will see an uproar of dissent if they continue to support this measure, but in the event that they aren't stopped by the people it is necessary that the state intervene. Don't see any reason that the federal government need involve itself.

[Wikkiwallana]

This nation was founded on christian values. We can't just drop the Christian element of society altogether, and it would be foolish to try.

1. No it wasn't.
2. Who said anything about dropping the Christian element of society? Taxing churches won't make them all suddenly vanish. Further, in general conversation "churches" can refer to places of worship for any and all religions.

[Gauthier]

Any religious group that takes active political direction ought to have the tax exemption revoked.

*coughcoughMormonscoughcoughProp8coughcough*

[Lackadaisical2]

Thats not how the Supreme Court views it, and they're the ones who decide that.

Out of curiosity, what's the ruling?

Something about having the ability to tax something implies the ability to destroy it, but I'm having a hard time finding where I'd read that...

[Republicke]

Out of curiosity, what's the ruling?

Something about having the ability to tax something implies the ability to destroy it, but I'm having a hard time finding where I'd read that...

That's a rather scary ruling vis-a-vis income tax.

[Iron Chariots]

Source?

I seem to remember it being a product of Enlightenment Values, myself.

Honestly, Enlightenment values and Christian values overlapped a lot, especially at that time.

Well that depends on the Christians in question.

Either way, I think claiming a nation was founded upon the values of a certain religion is to claim philosophical inspiration from said religion (or really any idea)-- and the American Founders were clearly inspired first and foremost by Enlightenment philosophers. The fact that some sects of Christianity had similar ideals doesn't make the US a Christian nation.

[Umbra Ac Silentium]

Out of curiosity, what's the ruling?

Something about having the ability to tax something implies the ability to destroy it, but I'm having a hard time finding where I'd read that...

During James Monroe’s presidency, Maryland tried to tax a branch of the national bank out of existence by attempting to tax the federal government. McCulloch, the cashier at the branch of the national bank in Maryland, refused to pay this tax. The Supreme Court, headed by John Marshall, continued to strengthen the national government by ruling that the power to tax is the power to destroy. The ruling in the case of McCulloch v. Maryland in 1819 was that states could not tax the national government.

[Vragovia]

Presumably having In God We Trust on your currency, and having One Nation under God in the pledge recited in schools are equally unconstitutional and you would support them being removed as well?

Indeed it should. But that's not going to happen, right? Separation of church and state, my ass! Where I'm at it's even worse, but hey that's why we have NS.

[Nightkill the Emperor]

Presumably having In God We Trust on your currency, and having One Nation under God in the pledge recited in schools are equally unconstitutional and you would support them being removed as well?

They added One Nation Under God during Cold War, because they thought communists couldn't say God.

[Rolamec]

If it's a non-profit organization, no, it shouldn't be taxed. And that doesn't apply merely to churches. Guys, we have enough taxes as it is, let's try and not expand them.

[Rolamec]

I don't know how taxing a church is considered unconstitutional, but I think any church that supports a political candidate should lose their tax exemption status.

Churches that do support a political candidate or campaign are taxed. But for churches which do, it is [unconstitutional].

[Genivar]

If it's a non-profit organization, no, it shouldn't be taxed. And that doesn't apply merely to churches. Guys, we have enough taxes as it is, let's try and not expand them.

Wrong! Tax Churchs and the Rich! MUAHAhAHAHAHA!

[Fartsniffage]

If it's a non-profit organization, no, it shouldn't be taxed. And that doesn't apply merely to churches. Guys, we have enough taxes as it is, let's try and not expand them.

Wrong! Tax Churchs and the Rich! MUAHAhAHAHAHA!

Tax rich churches?

[Rolamec]

If it's a non-profit organization, no, it shouldn't be taxed. And that doesn't apply merely to churches. Guys, we have enough taxes as it is, let's try and not expand them.

Wrong! Tax Churchs and the Rich! MUAHAhAHAHAHA!

[Occupied Deutschland]

If it's a non-profit organization, no, it shouldn't be taxed. And that doesn't apply merely to churches. Guys, we have enough taxes as it is, let's try and not expand them.

Wrong! Tax Churchs and the Rich! MUAHAhAHAHAHA!

I KNEW he was evil, but the mad scientist laugh is too much

[Genivar]

Wrong! Tax Churchs and the Rich! MUAHAhAHAHAHA!

Tax rich churches?

That would be the catholic cathedrals.

[Hevistica]

The Hevistic Honey Badger says churches, along with all religious buildings, are bad and they must be burned.

[Northwest Slobovia]

I don't know how taxing a church is considered unconstitutional, but I think any church that supports a political candidate should lose their tax exemption status.

Yup. I could see a tax that was so high as to put religious organizations out of business would be found unconstitutional, but asking them to pay what every other property owner pays seems fair.

[Blahem]

This nation was founded on christian values. We can't just drop the Christian element of society altogether, and it would be foolish to try.

According to the Treaty of Tripoli:

" Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries." (1796)

So, apparently the Founding Fathers disagree with you.

[Minotzia]

I don't know how taxing a church is considered unconstitutional, but I think any church that supports a political candidate should lose their tax exemption status.

Yup. I could see a tax that was so high as to put religious organizations out of business would be found unconstitutional, but asking them to pay what every other property owner pays seems fair.

Because, as I've said, the government is meant not to interfere with church. The people who wrote the damn thing didn't tax churches, now did they? So how could you possibly interpret the Constitution as allowing the tax of religious organizations if the people who wrote the clause would have never considered such a proposal?

[Roman Cilicia]

They were saying that so as to not antagonize the Berber (Muslim) pirates of the Barbary coast.

[Occupied Deutschland]

This nation was founded on christian values. We can't just drop the Christian element of society altogether, and it would be foolish to try.

According to the Treaty of Tripoli:

" Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries." (1796)

So, apparently the Founding Fathers disagree with you.

To be fair, "founded on the Christian Religion" and "founded on Christian values" is not the same thing.

[Blahem]

According to the Treaty of Tripoli:

" Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries." (1796)

So, apparently the Founding Fathers disagree with you.

To be fair, "founded on the Christian Religion" and "founded on Christian values" is not the same thing.

Tell me, what is the difference between "Christian religion" and "Christian values"?

[Buffett and Colbert]

Whether it results in the taxation of churches or not (which I don't think should be allowed), this "driveway tax" is absurd, if it's like how Fox is reporting it.