Rape Thread [SAFE SPACE - Mod Enforced]

[Person012345]

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

Wellllll, the way I see it when someone violates certain right of another human being they lose those rights themselves.

I view all sorts of life-destroying things as a justified punishment for rape and the like, I just don't advocate it because there is too high a chance of false convictions (that is to say, a higher than 0 chance). But ethically, I would really have no qualms with doing all sorts of horrible things to a rapist.

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

Wellllll, the way I see it when someone violates certain right of another human being they lose those rights themselves.

I view all sorts of life-destroying things as a justified punishment for rape and the like, I just don't advocate it because there is too high a chance of false convictions (that is to say, a higher than 0 chance). But ethically, I would really have no qualms with doing all sorts of horrible things to a rapist.

Then I see no reason why you are not a bigger monster than the rapist.

I know you've stolen something at some point in your life. Perhaps as a child you stole some candy or somesuch from a sibling. Does this mean you have no right to posses anything anymore? Should you die for that? No? Then why does rape, as horrible as it is, justify these things?

And even with that aside, those types of punishments lead to worse crimes. What does the rapist have to lose if he kills his victim? Nothing. And I'll not point out the chance of false conviction, as you already have shown you understand.

[Tlaceceyaya]

Wellllll, the way I see it when someone violates certain right of another human being they lose those rights themselves.

I view all sorts of life-destroying things as a justified punishment for rape and the like, I just don't advocate it because there is too high a chance of false convictions (that is to say, a higher than 0 chance). But ethically, I would really have no qualms with doing all sorts of horrible things to a rapist.

Then I see no reason why you are not a bigger monster than the rapist.

I know you've stolen something at some point in your life. Perhaps as a child you stole some candy or somesuch from a sibling. Does this mean you have no right to posses anything anymore? Should you die for that? No? Then why does rape, as horrible as it is, justify these things?

And even with that aside, those types of punishments lead to worse crimes. What does the rapist have to lose if he kills his victim? Nothing. And I'll not point out the chance of false conviction, as you already have shown you understand.

Actually, if anything, killing their victim would be better for the rapist if rape meant the death penalty. A dead victim can't testify against them.

[JuNii]

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

My justification? they hurt someone I consider a friend. do I need any other reason?

[Nahgallay]

I'm sorry for what happened to you. I am a survivor as well. I have been raped multiple times in my life. It is not spoken about enough. There are too many rapists out there! I never learned in school about rape, how wrong it is, or anything about the subject. We need to educate young men how wrong raping someone is and how damaging it is to that person! Not just physically, but all of the severe emotional trauma that develops afterwards. A lot of rapes are classified as "date rape". Fathers or a strong male role model in a boys life needs to sit down with them and teach them that when they are with a someone, whether it be a boy or a girl. That if they want to be intimate, if that individual says "no", it means exactly that! Do not hold them down and have sex with them.

Women rape people too.

Yes, but not nearly as much as men raping women, come on! Did I really need to say that? We need to educate every child that rape is wrong, no matter who does it

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

Then I see no reason why you are not a bigger monster than the rapist.

I know you've stolen something at some point in your life. Perhaps as a child you stole some candy or somesuch from a sibling. Does this mean you have no right to posses anything anymore? Should you die for that? No? Then why does rape, as horrible as it is, justify these things?

And even with that aside, those types of punishments lead to worse crimes. What does the rapist have to lose if he kills his victim? Nothing. And I'll not point out the chance of false conviction, as you already have shown you understand.

Actually, if anything, killing their victim would be better for the rapist if rape meant the death penalty. A dead victim can't testify against them.

Exactly.

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

My justification? they hurt someone I consider a friend. do I need any other reason?

I have a friend who thinks your flag is offensive. Can I kill you now? Yes of COURSE you need another, actually sound reason.

[Person012345]

Then I see no reason why you are not a bigger monster than the rapist.

I know you've stolen something at some point in your life. Perhaps as a child you stole some candy or somesuch from a sibling. Does this mean you have no right to posses anything anymore? Should you die for that? No? Then why does rape, as horrible as it is, justify these things?

Firstly, one can easily make amends for taking some candy. Secondly, I did not say that any violation negates all rights. If I stole candy from my brother, then I would indeed, morally, lose my right to a similar piece of candy should I become in possession of one in the future, or otherwise a monetary sum equal to the candy, or at least would morally be forced to contribute some form of actual reasonable reparation for it. I don't put a lot of value on a piece of candy. I put a vast amount of value on the thing that a rapists takes (I'm not sure there's any way of explaining just what I think that is briefly, and if there is - it's half 3 am and I can't think of how to do it). Someone who rapes goes way beyond taking candy they're not entitled to and giving up an equal bit of candy. To my mind, when someone rapes or murders, they relinquish their humanity and the rights that go with it. I'm not particularly bothered if you think that makes me as bad as a rapist, as I find that point of view patantly absurd. I'm not going around carrying out bad punishments, I'm simply saying I don't view the perp as having the rights that he so clearly demonstrated that he's willing to violate. And thus have no moral basis on which to object to any sort of nasty punishment on an actual known (as in 100%, but I wouldn't be that certain unless it happened to me, thus see below why I don't advocate such this as par for the course).

And even with that aside, those types of punishments lead to worse crimes. What does the rapist have to lose if he kills his victim? Nothing. And I'll not point out the chance of false conviction, as you already have shown you understand.

Those are some of the many reasons I wouldn't advocate it (although prehaps the biggest one is that I don't think the justice system should be used as a punishment anyway. I view it partially as a deterrent, partially a way of keeping dangerous people away from those they would harm. This doesn't preclude the death penalty, I am generally against that for the false conviction reason though).

[Scomagia]

Women rape people too.

Yes, but not nearly as much as men raping women, come on! Did I really need to say that? We need to educate every child that rape is wrong, no matter who does it

You spoke specifically of educating young men, which shows a certain disregard to the fact that women DO rape men and other women. It's not reported as much, sure, but it happens more than you think. Educate young men and young women.

[Person012345]

Did I really need to say that?

Yes, you do. Every time you use phrasing like you did, it creates an atmosphere that it only happens to women. People who don't realise that male-rape is a problem, or generally shrug it off, don't have that assumption challenged. Think about what you're saying, and when talking about rape, do not speak as if it's just a female problem because it isn't.

[JuNii]

My justification? they hurt someone I consider a friend. do I need any other reason?

I have a friend who thinks your flag is offensive. Can I kill you now? Yes of COURSE you need another, actually sound reason.

are you trying to equate an opinion on a picture with a physical attack on a person? I hope not.

also, I am not on the jury for this... [censored]'s trial if and when it gets to trial and I'm pretty damned sure I won't be. so my opinions and thoughts are perfectly safe for me to have concerning any 'punishments' meted out.

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

I have a friend who thinks your flag is offensive. Can I kill you now? Yes of COURSE you need another, actually sound reason.

are you trying to equate an opinion on a picture with a physical attack on a person? I hope not.

also, I am not on the jury for this... [censored]'s trial if and when it gets to trial and I'm pretty damned sure I won't be. so my opinions and thoughts are perfectly safe for me to have concerning any 'punishments' meted out.

I'm not denying you can have opinions. What I'm saying is, your opinions are pretty wrong.

Someone hurting your friend is absolutely no justification for hurting them. Without proper context, evidence, logic, and lack of emotional lashing out, it could very well be your friend deserving to get hurt. Obviously, it's not, as we have hypothetically said it is a rape, and someone did rape them, wiping out context and evidence. But there is still a lack of logic and overwhelming emotional responses.

[JuNii]

are you trying to equate an opinion on a picture with a physical attack on a person? I hope not.

also, I am not on the jury for this... [censored]'s trial if and when it gets to trial and I'm pretty damned sure I won't be. so my opinions and thoughts are perfectly safe for me to have concerning any 'punishments' meted out.

I'm not denying you can have opinions. What I'm saying is, your opinions are pretty wrong.

Someone hurting your friend is absolutely no justification for hurting them. Without proper context, evidence, logic, and lack of emotional lashing out, it could very well be your friend deserving to get hurt. Obviously, it's not, as we have hypothetically said it is a rape, and someone did rape them, wiping out context and evidence. But there is still a lack of logic and overwhelming emotional responses.

really? please point out how my opinion was wrong.

and my opinion was just that, an opinion. not subject to influencing any jury that would have a say on the verdict as well as punishment meted out should he/she be found guilty. As I said, the chances of me being selected for jury on that particular trial would be nil at best.

[Person012345]

Also, to clarify, I don't necessarily think they lose said rights -forever-. There can be mitigating factors (not about the rape itself, nothing can excuse that at all short of prehaps some convoluted situation in which they would both die if it was not committed or something, idk, but about conduct afterwards), but these tend also to be uncertain (pertaining to things such as remorse and so on, which only the perp can know whether they truly feel).

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

I'm not denying you can have opinions. What I'm saying is, your opinions are pretty wrong.

Someone hurting your friend is absolutely no justification for hurting them. Without proper context, evidence, logic, and lack of emotional lashing out, it could very well be your friend deserving to get hurt. Obviously, it's not, as we have hypothetically said it is a rape, and someone did rape them, wiping out context and evidence. But there is still a lack of logic and overwhelming emotional responses.

really? please point out how my opinion was wrong.

I just did. Please read my post before you go off with your smilie banter and bad typing.

It lacks any form of logic. It's just "He hurt friend. Me smash!"

[JuNii]

really? please point out how my opinion was wrong.

I just did. Please read my post before you go off with your smilie banter and bad typing.

It lacks any form of logic. It's just "He hurt friend. Me smash!"

In other words, you don't know what my opinion was in regard to...

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

and you are just assuming that my opinion fell into that catagory...

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

I just did. Please read my post before you go off with your smilie banter and bad typing.

It lacks any form of logic. It's just "He hurt friend. Me smash!"

In other words, you don't know what my opinion was in regard to...

Jeez, I have a fever and leave for ten minutes, and emotionally charged jerky illogical punishments fly everywhere. Is there any actual justification for any of this?

and you are just assuming that my opinion fell into that catagory...

You're either backpedalling off the face of the planet, or incomprehensible and didn't say what you meant.

I was under the impression that your opinion had to do with torturing rapists, because you responded to my remark upon that behavior. And I explained why it is emotionally charged, jerky, and illogical. Why it makes you a monster, is not morally correct, and escalates crimes, making it COMPLETELY useless, other than satisfying some sadistic needs of monsters.

[Pottslande]

@katganistan:

That's not what i meant at all. To you and all who accuse me of siding with rapists or something, let's make it clear that I'm not.

However, I sometimes do feel sorry for them - they're sick, wretched human beings with almost no hope of a better future. To get into the mindset that allows them to comit a rape, something must have happened to them. Perhaps they, too, were raped at an impresionable age, maybe there was a faulty gene in their code, maybe they were brought up in such a way as to encourage a mindset of control. The point is, these things happened, and these issues werent resolved before they comitted the horific act. If we could just pinpoint these issues before they snowballed, the rapes wouldn't happen and you'd have another productive member of society.

I'm not saying its not the rapist's fault - people need to control their actions and act morally. But something happened in the rapists mind to make them them think rape is somehow ok.

Understanding is not empathising (I really feel more sorry for the lost potential in a rapist, the loss of humanity to base, monstorous urges). You need to understand the darkness if you want to conquer it.

[Tothia]

Even if we do spread the word about males raping other males, I doubt much people would care. Even the FBI say that men can't be victims of rape. There are so many things I want to change in America.

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

Even if we do spread the word about males raping other males, I doubt much people would care. Even the FBI say that men can't be victims of rape. There are so many things I want to change in America.

Also, of females raping males. Which is considered impossible by most jerks people.

[Nahgallay]

Did I really need to say that?

Yes, you do. Every time you use phrasing like you did, it creates an atmosphere that it only happens to women. People who don't realise that male-rape is a problem, or generally shrug it off, don't have that assumption challenged. Think about what you're saying, and when talking about rape, do not speak as if it's just a female problem because it isn't.

I didn't say it was only a female problem. In my first post I spoke about educating children specifically boys not to rape girls or boys. I know male-rape is an issue, that's why I addressed it. But it is very rare that women rape, especially compared to male rapists.

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

Yes, you do. Every time you use phrasing like you did, it creates an atmosphere that it only happens to women. People who don't realise that male-rape is a problem, or generally shrug it off, don't have that assumption challenged. Think about what you're saying, and when talking about rape, do not speak as if it's just a female problem because it isn't.

I didn't say it was only a female problem. In my first post I spoke about educating children specifically boys not to rape girls or boys. I know male-rape is an issue, that's why I addressed it. But it is very rare that women rape, especially compared to male rapists.

It doesn't matter. It happens. Also, when females rape, it's not always raping males! Sheesh, you're not really getting this.

[JuNii]

In other words, you don't know what my opinion was in regard to...

and you are just assuming that my opinion fell into that catagory...

You're either backpedalling off the face of the planet, or incomprehensible and didn't say what you meant.

I was under the impression that your opinion had to do with torturing rapists, because you responded to my remark upon that behavior. And I explained why it is emotionally charged, jerky, and illogical. Why it makes you a monster, is not morally correct, and escalates crimes, making it COMPLETELY useless, other than satisfying some sadistic needs of monsters.

And I never argued that my opinion wasn't emotionally charged, jerky nor illogical (except on why I suggested what I did.) I also stated that as My opinion, that has no bearing on the fate of the rapist, doesn't matter if it's Emotionally charged, jerky nor illogical since it has no bearing on the fate of the individual. thus it's safe for me to hold such an opinion. now if I was a member of the jury where this 'person' was on trial, then yes, You would be correct in stating that my opinion was wrong. but I'm not, so it isn't.

My opinion, if you didn't know... was to use crabs instead of wolves that someone else suggested. I reasoned that they have smaller mouths and thus would not readily kill the person (logically thought out... rather silly, but still logically thought out.). I also stated that I would buy the gasoline because that same person suggested setting him on fire.

yes, it does satisfy some sadistic need... in my case, someone was hurt and thus the need satisfied would be revenge. and there is a chance that the person who did the hurting would not see trial.
the morally right response would be to tell the victim to go to the police (she did) file a report (She did) and let them do the investigating (they are). to this point, I have no reason to doubt the poster thus can act like an ITG in meting out punishment because I know the results of telling a victim a sensible, reasoned, and morally correct response would do about as much good for her as shouting would stop a thunder-storm.

Am I putting the Victim's feelings before the rights of the person who caused the crime? yes. Am I putting the emotional turmoil that the victim is going through before being 'morally superior' in regards to handling the person who did this? again yes. do I want my opinions to actually be enacted on the person should he/she be found guilty?

...

[Nahgallay]

I didn't say it was only a female problem. In my first post I spoke about educating children specifically boys not to rape girls or boys. I know male-rape is an issue, that's why I addressed it. But it is very rare that women rape, especially compared to male rapists.

It doesn't matter. It happens. Also, when females rape, it's not always raping males! Sheesh, you're not really getting this.

Um... Clearly you're not getting something.. I Never said anything about females only raping males, so what are you talking about??

[The Daktanese Technocracy]

It doesn't matter. It happens. Also, when females rape, it's not always raping males! Sheesh, you're not really getting this.

Um... Clearly you're not getting something.. I Never said anything about females only raping males, so what are you talking about??

Let me show you what you said.

I know male-rape is an issue, that's why I addressed it. But it is very rare that women rape,

Heavily implying that when women rape, it's always raping men. You're not getting it. You keep implying stereotypes that are completely false, even if you don't mean it.

You're either backpedalling off the face of the planet, or incomprehensible and didn't say what you meant.

I was under the impression that your opinion had to do with torturing rapists, because you responded to my remark upon that behavior. And I explained why it is emotionally charged, jerky, and illogical. Why it makes you a monster, is not morally correct, and escalates crimes, making it COMPLETELY useless, other than satisfying some sadistic needs of monsters.

And I never argued that my opinion wasn't emotionally charged, jerky nor illogical (except on why I suggested what I did.) I also stated that as My opinion, that has no bearing on the fate of the rapist, doesn't matter if it's Emotionally charged, jerky nor illogical since it has no bearing on the fate of the individual. thus it's safe for me to hold such an opinion. now if I was a member of the jury where this 'person' was on trial, then yes, You would be correct in stating that my opinion was wrong. but I'm not, so it isn't.

My opinion, if you didn't know... was to use crabs instead of wolves that someone else suggested. I reasoned that they have smaller mouths and thus would not readily kill the person (logically thought out... rather silly, but still logically thought out.). I also stated that I would buy the gasoline because that same person suggested setting him on fire.

yes, it does satisfy some sadistic need... in my case, someone was hurt and thus the need satisfied would be revenge. and there is a chance that the person who did the hurting would not see trial.
the morally right response would be to tell the victim to go to the police (she did) file a report (She did) and let them do the investigating (they are). to this point, I have no reason to doubt the poster thus can act like an ITG in meting out punishment because I know the results of telling a victim a sensible, reasoned, and morally correct response would do about as much good for her as shouting would stop a thunder-storm.

Am I putting the Victim's feelings before the rights of the person who caused the crime? yes. Am I putting the emotional turmoil that the victim is going through before being 'morally superior' in regards to handling the person who did this? again yes. do I want my opinions to actually be enacted on the person should he/she be found guilty?

...

You do not live in a vacuum, your opinion is still wrong, and your lust for revenge still hurts YOU, by making YOU more angry. This is all I am saying. I do not really CARE if you aren't on the jury, it's still a bad position.

And I do hope that last part was a joke. You would do some sick, sick demented shit, otherwise. Hell, at that point, I'd probably put you down for the rapist's safety, if I was there. People have a right to not be burned and fed to other animals, and I'll gladly fight for that. The Rapist DOES need to be punished. They did a horrible thing. But people who would gladly do what you describe are much, much worse.

[Scomagia]

It doesn't matter. It happens. Also, when females rape, it's not always raping males! Sheesh, you're not really getting this.

Um... Clearly you're not getting something.. I Never said anything about females only raping males, so what are you talking about??

I am going to say this very clearly. It is not "rare" that women rape, it is rarely REPORTED. It does not take that much effort to address female rapists in addition to male rapists. Mmk? Your posts do not say what you think they say. A little sensitivity to the issue would be appreciated. You are unintentionally reinforcing stereotypes.