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MAGAThread XIX: Hambergers, Noble Prizes, & Disinfectant

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60829
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:13 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Northern Davincia wrote:Kissinger was a great man, leave him be.

Kissinger is still alive.

Yerba mala nunca muere

Bad weed never dies.
be gay do crime


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Jerzylvania
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Posts: 10037
Founded: Aug 10, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby Jerzylvania » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:38 pm

Idzequitch wrote:
Jerzylvania wrote:
"I don't think science knows actually" he said smugly when confronted by Californian politicians over Climate Change and it's effect on the extensive western fires.

I'd imagine Trump would show the same disdain for Scientific American as he does The Atlantic if he feels the need to comment on it. Maybe something like "Believe me, that fake American science magazine should look out because they're failing at partisan politics, this I can tell you." :lol:

In 2016, everyone was talking about fake news and alternative facts. In 2020, we will soon talk about fake science and alternative evidence.


And in seven short weeks let's choose the alternative candidate and replace the current occult occupant of 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.
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Borderlands of Rojava
Minister
 
Posts: 2921
Founded: Jul 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Borderlands of Rojava » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:41 pm

Jerzylvania wrote:
Bombadil wrote:
To which Trump retorted: “I don’t think science knows actually.”


"I don't think science knows actually" he said smugly when confronted by Californian politicians over Climate Change and it's effect on the extensive western fires.

I'd imagine Trump would show the same disdain for Scientific American as he does The Atlantic if he feels the need to comment on it. Maybe something like "Believe me, that fake American science magazine should look out because they're failing at partisan politics, this I can tell you." :lol:


I don't think science knows actually.


-Donald "stable genius" Trump
The devil is out there. Hiding behind every corner and in every nook and cranny. In all of the dives, all over the city. Before you lays an entire world of enemies, and at day's end when the chips are down, we're a society of strangers. You cant walk by someone on the street anymore without crossing the road to get away from their stare. Welcome to the Twilight Zone. The land of plague and shadow. Nothing innocent survives this world. If it can't corrupt you, it'll kill you.

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Sanghyeok
Diplomat
 
Posts: 712
Founded: Dec 29, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Sanghyeok » Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:49 pm

Borderlands of Rojava wrote:
Jerzylvania wrote:
"I don't think science knows actually" he said smugly when confronted by Californian politicians over Climate Change and it's effect on the extensive western fires.

I'd imagine Trump would show the same disdain for Scientific American as he does The Atlantic if he feels the need to comment on it. Maybe something like "Believe me, that fake American science magazine should look out because they're failing at partisan politics, this I can tell you." :lol:


I don't think science knows actually.


-Donald "stable genius" Trump



Sorry for posting this again but..
Look for, having center — my kinsman was a zealous academic and person and plan, Medical man. John the Divine The Disruptor at UNIVERSITY; advantageous cistrons, same white cistrons, ENDORSEMENT, identical shrewd, the Wharton Refine of Management, rattling dependable, same raffish — you agnise, if you’re a standpat Political party, if I were a civil-libertarian, if, like, ALL RIGHT, if I ran as a socialised Political leader, they would verbalize I’m one of the smartest causal agencies anyplace in the worldly concern — it’s typical! — but when you’re a conventional Proponent they effort — Buckeye State, do they do a numerate — that’s how come I forevers jump soured: Went to Author, was a unspoilt intellect, went there, went there, did this, stacked a fate — you call up I have to dole out my like papers all the influence, because we’re a miniscule underprivileged — but you looking at the centre lot, the concern that genuinely disturbances me — it would have been so gradual, and it’s not as momentous as these periods are — nuclear is so potent; my kinsman explained that to me many, many periods agone, the body politic and that was THIRTY-FIVES35 assemblages past; he would justify the state of what’s exploit to occur and he was right-minded, who would have cerebration? — but when you care at what’s sledding on with the Little Joe unfortunate people — now it put-upon to be trinity, now it’s quaternity — but when it was deuce-ace and flat now, I would have said it’s all in the traveler; lads, and it is male people because, you hump, they don’t, they haven’t patterned that the cleaning women are smarter reverse now than the Men, so, you recollect, it’s gonna involve them about some other ONE HUNDRED FIFTIES150 yrs — but the Farsis are bang-up treaters, the Indo-Iranians are important treaters, so, and they, they scarce killed, they sporting killed us, this is alarming.

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我が祖国は、革命の赤旗を守る!世界の労働者万歳 統一戦線万歳 どんな時も その眩しさ 覚えていた
National News: Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia warmly welcomed by Chairwoman Oomiya in visit, thaw in relations expected. The two nations have had tense relations over ideology, but "Pudding, Tea and Cosplay Diplomacy" of leaders appears to be working- the second day of the tea-meeting has begun.

Chairwoman Oomiya News: Chairwoman Oomiya currently hosting tea meeting, cosplay and doll party with Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia at Chairwoman's Residence in Chu'o Tokai, Ministry of Foreign Affairs hopeful for breakthrough in diplomacy

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Major-Tom
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12237
Founded: Mar 09, 2016
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Major-Tom » Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:06 pm

Northern Davincia wrote:
Fartsniffage wrote:
Nah. The worst was Kissinger.

The EU at least has a record of no major war in Europe since 1945.

Kissinger was a great man, leave him be.


His Cambodian fan club is going to be crushed when he passes.
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Bombadil
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Bombadil » Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:25 pm

“It would go away without the vaccine George,” he said speaking to ABC journalist George Stephanopoulos. “With time it goes away. And you’ll develop like a herd mentality. It’s going to be herd developed, and that’s going to happen. That will all happen.”

What is he drivelling on about now..

Meanwhile..

A poll conducted by the Pew Research Center of more than 13,000 adults in 13 advanced economies between 10 June and 3 August shows international confidence in the US and its president sharply down across the board, reaching historical lows in several countries.

The survey found Trump was the least trusted major world leader. A median of 16% of those polled in the 13 countries had confidence Trump would “do the right thing in world affairs”, putting him below Vladimir Putin (23%) and Xi Jinping (19%).

The German chancellor, Angela Merkel, was the most trusted leader, with a 76% confidence rating.


That's right, he's below Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping.
Last edited by Bombadil on Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Eldest, that's what I am...Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn...he knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless — before the Dark Lord came from Outside..

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An Alan Smithee Nation
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Founded: Apr 18, 2018
New York Times Democracy

Postby An Alan Smithee Nation » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:24 pm

The WTO finds Washington broke trade rules by putting tariffs on China
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-t ... KKBN2662FE

I expect Trump will throw his toys out of the pram, and put sanctions on the WTO.
Everything is intertwinkled

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Nobel Hobos 2
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:37 pm

An Alan Smithee Nation wrote:The WTO finds Washington broke trade rules by putting tariffs on China
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-t ... KKBN2662FE

I expect Trump will throw his toys out of the pram, and put sanctions on the WTO.


Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Also, AiliAiliA
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Liriena
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 60829
Founded: Nov 19, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Liriena » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:24 am

Bombadil wrote:And you’ll develop like a herd mentality.

Now that was a hell of a slip of the tongue on his part.

That's right, he's below Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping.

Getting emotionally prepared to embrace Xi Jinping thought.
Last edited by Liriena on Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
be gay do crime


I am:
A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist
An aspiring writer and journalist
Political compass stuff:
Economic Left/Right: -8.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92
For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism
Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism,
cynicism


⚧Copy and paste this in your sig
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Washington Resistance Army
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Posts: 45148
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:25 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
An Alan Smithee Nation wrote:The WTO finds Washington broke trade rules by putting tariffs on China
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-t ... KKBN2662FE

I expect Trump will throw his toys out of the pram, and put sanctions on the WTO.


Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"


Both are good takes.
Third Positionist, Agrarian, Anti-Racist, Authoritarian

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Sanghyeok
Diplomat
 
Posts: 712
Founded: Dec 29, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Sanghyeok » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:29 am

Liriena wrote:Getting emotionally prepared to embrace Xi Jinping thought.


This became relevant all of a sudden.

Image
Last edited by Sanghyeok on Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
我が祖国は、革命の赤旗を守る!世界の労働者万歳 統一戦線万歳 どんな時も その眩しさ 覚えていた
National News: Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia warmly welcomed by Chairwoman Oomiya in visit, thaw in relations expected. The two nations have had tense relations over ideology, but "Pudding, Tea and Cosplay Diplomacy" of leaders appears to be working- the second day of the tea-meeting has begun.

Chairwoman Oomiya News: Chairwoman Oomiya currently hosting tea meeting, cosplay and doll party with Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia at Chairwoman's Residence in Chu'o Tokai, Ministry of Foreign Affairs hopeful for breakthrough in diplomacy

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Sanghyeok
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Posts: 712
Founded: Dec 29, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Sanghyeok » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:31 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"


China shouldn't be in WTO: Broke
US shouldn't be in WTO: Broke
Nobody should be in WTO: BASED

#Juchegang #Autarky
Last edited by Sanghyeok on Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
我が祖国は、革命の赤旗を守る!世界の労働者万歳 統一戦線万歳 どんな時も その眩しさ 覚えていた
National News: Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia warmly welcomed by Chairwoman Oomiya in visit, thaw in relations expected. The two nations have had tense relations over ideology, but "Pudding, Tea and Cosplay Diplomacy" of leaders appears to be working- the second day of the tea-meeting has begun.

Chairwoman Oomiya News: Chairwoman Oomiya currently hosting tea meeting, cosplay and doll party with Azur Deutschland Leaders Julienne and Sylvia at Chairwoman's Residence in Chu'o Tokai, Ministry of Foreign Affairs hopeful for breakthrough in diplomacy

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Dumb Ideologies
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Posts: 43386
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:47 am

Sanghyeok wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"


China shouldn't be in WTO: Broke
US shouldn't be in WTO: Broke
Nobody should be in WTO: BASED

#Juchegang #Autarky


This but unironically.
Tʜᴇ Mᴏsᴛʟʏ Pᴇᴀᴄᴇғᴜʟ Rɪᴏᴛɪɴɢ ᴏғ Dᴜᴍʙ Iᴅᴇᴏʟᴏɢɪᴇs
¸„¤*˜*¤„¸„¤*˜*¤„¸ To culture war! The cause of and solution to all of life's problems ¸„¤*˜*¤„¸„¤*˜*¤„¸
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane ~ Marcus Aurelius
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Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:57 am

People seem to forget what the world looked like before the WTO. It wasn't all "now we can specialise and make rules that are just perfect for our economy!"

It was a racist mess of economical warfare that would often spiral into actual warfare as regional powers had to establish their economic dominance regionally and by force. There is actually nothing wrong with WTO rules on most favoured nation treatment, since the only reason for putting higher taxes on similar goods from different nations is economic warfare.

The WTO and its predecessors is partially responsible for peaceful relations after WW2.
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Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 52840
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:38 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
An Alan Smithee Nation wrote:The WTO finds Washington broke trade rules by putting tariffs on China
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-t ... KKBN2662FE

I expect Trump will throw his toys out of the pram, and put sanctions on the WTO.


Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"


Making it impossible for your country to conduct global trade to own the Chinese.
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Loben III
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Loben III » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:41 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:People seem to forget what the world looked like before the WTO. It wasn't all "now we can specialise and make rules that are just perfect for our economy!"

It was a racist mess of economical warfare that would often spiral into actual warfare as regional powers had to establish their economic dominance regionally and by force. There is actually nothing wrong with WTO rules on most favoured nation treatment, since the only reason for putting higher taxes on similar goods from different nations is economic warfare.

The WTO and its predecessors is partially responsible for peaceful relations after WW2.


Uh oh, the R word was said. Better not leave the WTO.
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Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19360
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:11 am

Loben III wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:People seem to forget what the world looked like before the WTO. It wasn't all "now we can specialise and make rules that are just perfect for our economy!"

It was a racist mess of economical warfare that would often spiral into actual warfare as regional powers had to establish their economic dominance regionally and by force. There is actually nothing wrong with WTO rules on most favoured nation treatment, since the only reason for putting higher taxes on similar goods from different nations is economic warfare.

The WTO and its predecessors is partially responsible for peaceful relations after WW2.


Uh oh, the R word was said. Better not leave the WTO.

We could have a discussion on the merits or all the other points I mentioned. Dismissing it because racism was mentioned seems intellectually dishonest.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

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An Alan Smithee Nation
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Founded: Apr 18, 2018
New York Times Democracy

Postby An Alan Smithee Nation » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:15 am

Would Apple be able to survive financially if it had to make its products in the US? Doubling the already expensive unit price, would price a lot of people out of the market.
Everything is intertwinkled

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Loben III
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Loben III » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:19 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Loben III wrote:
Uh oh, the R word was said. Better not leave the WTO.

We could have a discussion on the merits or all the other points I mentioned. Dismissing it because racism was mentioned seems intellectually dishonest.

Yes but you said the magic R word. Kinda stops most debate whenever that word gets thrown about Willy nilly by certain people.
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Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19360
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:20 am

Loben III wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:We could have a discussion on the merits or all the other points I mentioned. Dismissing it because racism was mentioned seems intellectually dishonest.

Yes but you said the magic R word. Kinda stops most debate whenever that word gets thrown about Willy nilly by certain people.

Only because you apparently don't want to debate it... You are only silencing yourself.
Last edited by Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States on Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

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Loben III
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Founded: Aug 06, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Loben III » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:24 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Loben III wrote:Yes but you said the magic R word. Kinda stops most debate whenever that word gets thrown about Willy nilly by certain people.

Only because you apparently don't want to debate it... You are only silencing yourself.

And be seen as racist, heavens no!
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Washington Resistance Army
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Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:31 am

Hot take: the WTO is bad because it furthers enables the interests of big business capitalism which is a net loss for the majority of the human species
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Loben III
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Loben III » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:35 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Hot take: the WTO is bad because it furthers enables the interests of big business capitalism which is a net loss for the majority of the human species

Nope, apparently it’s necessary for world peace.
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Nobel Hobos 2
Postmaster-General
 
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Nobel Hobos 2 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:38 am

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Right-wingers, 2001: "China being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"
Right-wingers, 2020: "The US being in the WTO is a very bad idea!"


Both are good takes.


Both could fuck off out of the WTO ... and there would still be WTO.
Even together, China and the USA are only 40% of world GDP.
Even working in concert (heh) they wouldn't form a hegemony.

The US is about 25% of world GDP. The US needs to abandon this idea that its economic dominance matches its military dominance, it doesn't and probably hasn't since the 1960's. Pulling out of treaties or trade deals only causes them to collapse IF they were bilateral. The UN wouldn't collapse because the US pulls out. WHO wouldn't collapse because the US pulls out. TPP didn't collapse because the US pulled out. And WTO will not collapse because the US pulls out.

The US under Trump has been throwing away diplomatic and trade power, under the pretence of strengthening sovereignty.

It's a bad move in my opinion, but maybe some of it can be reversed by the next President. It might even be an opportunity to strike better deals (though not the CPTPP, it has members already so it's take-it-or-leave-it). Kind of a Good Cop/Bad Cop thing between Presidents!

So I think withdrawing from agreements/treaties/organizations actually makes the US weaker, diplomatically and in trade. Though I wouldn't be surprised if it's put down to some other cause, like those damn corporations not building factories like they should, or maybe tariffs of 20% aren't high enough. So you try that, and everyone seems happy that unemployment is way down, the gap between rich and poor might actually be narrowing, and you can buy a 4G phone that's mostly made in the USA! Any year now, GDP will turn around and start going up, look, it's almost flat at only minus 2%. Also nobody worries about immigration now, in fact they're calling for harsh treatment of emigrants instead.

A decade goes by. Military spending has to be increased, mainly due to Chinese escalation. A few things have to go. Welfare and stuff. Social Security is restructured as a wage-subsidy scheme so the elderly can return to the workforce. An attempt to raise more money by selling National Parks is called off due to lack of market interest (some handsome foreign bids were of course rejected).

Then there's the Second Canadian War. Their Russian equipment is surprisingly good, and they must be getting that nanotech stuff from China because Russian nanotech is big and clunky. This stuff's invisible. The President decides that trying to invade Canada was a bad idea. The Canadians are nice about it, and accept a peace deal for nothing more than an apology, Alaska and Maine.

The Wall no longer seems enough. It extends over both land borders and the coasts (in-a-bit where there's a famous beach) and it's made of titanium-resin composite so it's strong enough. But it's not a Dome. Americans deserve a dome. So the government starts raising the wall, knowing all the time there is no way they can afford a dome. The economy has been crap for decades now, even Mexicans are richer than Americans, but what choice is there? Military spending is already at 40% of GDP, Space is lost and US nanotech is pitiful ... it's too late to get back in the arms race.

Another decade limps by. The Wall is magnificent. Nobody says "dome" unless they want a fight. Americans regain the old virtues of thrift, hardiness and trial by gunfight. Tourists begin to arrive, hovering near the sights in their lighter-than-air vehicles and tittering at the reaction of locals when they throw a handful of dollars out the window. The economy begins to revive! A dollar is worth quite a lot now ... in America. It's not worth shit anywhere else, but what's it matter. Other than tourists, there's no trade, and no patriotic American would dream of spending their money anywhere but America. People are fairly content. At least, no-one is making a big noise about being unhappy.

And another decade. There's actually some modest economic growth. Perhaps because governments in the over-developed world, who have been offering aid for decades, have taken a lead from the tourists and now dump billions of dollars on the US from space. The government may be too proud to accept aid, but the people aren't.

So it's not a bright future, but it's not complete disaster either. It's now 2100, and that was the Second American Century.
Also, AiliAiliA
No footwear industry: citizens cannot afford new shoes.
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Bombadil
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13888
Founded: Oct 13, 2011
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Bombadil » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:43 am

Nobel Hobos 2 wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Both are good takes.


Both could fuck off out of the WTO ... and there would still be WTO.
Even together, China and the USA are only 40% of world GDP.
Even working in concert (heh) they wouldn't form a hegemony.

The US is about 25% of world GDP. The US needs to abandon this idea that its economic dominance matches its military dominance, it doesn't and probably hasn't since the 1960's. Pulling out of treaties or trade deals only causes them to collapse IF they were bilateral. The UN wouldn't collapse because the US pulls out. WHO wouldn't collapse because the US pulls out. TPP didn't collapse because the US pulled out. And WTO will not collapse because the US pulls out.

The US under Trump has been throwing away diplomatic and trade power, under the pretence of strengthening sovereignty.

It's a bad move in my opinion, but maybe some of it can be reversed by the next President. It might even be an opportunity to strike better deals (though not the CPTPP, it has members already so it's take-it-or-leave-it). Kind of a Good Cop/Bad Cop thing between Presidents!

So I think withdrawing from agreements/treaties/organizations actually makes the US weaker, diplomatically and in trade. Though I wouldn't be surprised if it's put down to some other cause, like those damn corporations not building factories like they should, or maybe tariffs of 20% aren't high enough. So you try that, and everyone seems happy that unemployment is way down, the gap between rich and poor might actually be narrowing, and you can buy a 4G phone that's mostly made in the USA! Any year now, GDP will turn around and start going up, look, it's almost flat at only minus 2%. Also nobody worries about immigration now, in fact they're calling for harsh treatment of emigrants instead.

A decade goes by. Military spending has to be increased, mainly due to Chinese escalation. A few things have to go. Welfare and stuff. Social Security is restructured as a wage-subsidy scheme so the elderly can return to the workforce. An attempt to raise more money by selling National Parks is called off due to lack of market interest (some handsome foreign bids were of course rejected).

Then there's the Second Canadian War. Their Russian equipment is surprisingly good, and they must be getting that nanotech stuff from China because Russian nanotech is big and clunky. This stuff's invisible. The President decides that trying to invade Canada was a bad idea. The Canadians are nice about it, and accept a peace deal for nothing more than an apology, Alaska and Maine.

The Wall no longer seems enough. It extends over both land borders and the coasts (in-a-bit where there's a famous beach) and it's made of titanium-resin composite so it's strong enough. But it's not a Dome. Americans deserve a dome. So the government starts raising the wall, knowing all the time there is no way they can afford a dome. The economy has been crap for decades now, even Mexicans are richer than Americans, but what choice is there? Military spending is already at 40% of GDP, Space is lost and US nanotech is pitiful ... it's too late to get back in the arms race.

Another decade limps by. The Wall is magnificent. Nobody says "dome" unless they want a fight. Americans regain the old virtues of thrift, hardiness and trial by gunfight. Tourists begin to arrive, hovering near the sights in their lighter-than-air vehicles and tittering at the reaction of locals when they throw a handful of dollars out the window. The economy begins to revive! A dollar is worth quite a lot now ... in America. It's not worth shit anywhere else, but what's it matter. Other than tourists, there's no trade, and no patriotic American would dream of spending their money anywhere but America. People are fairly content. At least, no-one is making a big noise about being unhappy.

And another decade. There's actually some modest economic growth. Perhaps because governments in the over-developed world, who have been offering aid for decades, have taken a lead from the tourists and now dump billions of dollars on the US from space. The government may be too proud to accept aid, but the people aren't.

So it's not a bright future, but it's not complete disaster either. It's now 2100, and that was the Second American Century.


..and everyone's drinking Brawndo.
Eldest, that's what I am...Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn...he knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless — before the Dark Lord came from Outside..

十年

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