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by Major-Tom » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:20 pm
by Estanglia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:21 pm
La xinga wrote:Godular wrote:
Specifically? A belief held on the basis of faith, which by definition involves a distinct lack of evidence.
Atheism is not predicated on faith. It specifically relies on logical reasoning that states that if there is no tangible and verifiable evidence supporting the proposition that a thing is true (e.g. 'God Exists'), one must logically default to the negation of that proposition (e.g. 'God Does Not Exist').
As Atheism specifically denies the utility of faith as evidence, it cannot be a religion.
The thing is that no one would accept something like this if they didn't see SOMETHING.
I know, I know, you don't see it as a proof, but somehow, I do.
Torrocca wrote:"Your honor, it was not mein fault! I didn't order the systematic genocide of millions of people, it was the twenty kilograms of pure-cut Bavarian cocaine that did it!"
by Neutraligon » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:25 pm
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:25 pm
La xinga wrote:Godular wrote:
What is it that causes you to hold their position as untrue, but you hold a story vastly more fantastical in higher regard? What makes your story any better than... say... the Norse Pantheon? You claim that people wouldn't follow it if they didn't see something? But back in the day, a simple thunderstorm was evidence for the existence of Thor and his apparently frequent bouts of indigestion.
Because no one would believe my religion or even want to be part of it, considering how hard it is, how expensive too.
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:26 pm
by Estanglia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:28 pm
Torrocca wrote:"Your honor, it was not mein fault! I didn't order the systematic genocide of millions of people, it was the twenty kilograms of pure-cut Bavarian cocaine that did it!"
by La Xinga » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:28 pm
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:29 pm
Estanglia wrote:La xinga wrote:Example?
Say, someone decides to belive in a religion because they were predicted to die from an illness but somehow survived.
To them, that might be a reason to believe in that religion because they prayed to that religion's god/gods and got better. I'd call that one giant coincidence and no evidence that praying to that god/gods helped at all.
by La Xinga » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:29 pm
Estanglia wrote:La xinga wrote:Example?
Say, someone decides to belive in a religion because they were predicted to die from an illness but somehow survived.
To them, that might be a reason to believe in that religion because they prayed to that religion's god/gods and got better. I'd call that one giant coincidence and no evidence that praying to that god/gods helped at all.
by Estanglia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:30 pm
La xinga wrote:Estanglia wrote:
Say, someone decides to belive in a religion because they were predicted to die from an illness but somehow survived.
To them, that might be a reason to believe in that religion because they prayed to that religion's god/gods and got better. I'd call that one giant coincidence and no evidence that praying to that god/gods helped at all.
That's before a religion happened, the stuff in Tanach are unnatural occurrences.
Torrocca wrote:"Your honor, it was not mein fault! I didn't order the systematic genocide of millions of people, it was the twenty kilograms of pure-cut Bavarian cocaine that did it!"
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:30 pm
by Neutraligon » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:31 pm
Godular wrote:La xinga wrote:So the splitting of the sea, a hallucination for about 3 million people? Same for giving of the Torah, Korach and his men getting swallowed by the ground, the walls around Yericho, the burning of Sancheriv's army, all hallucinations?!
That or lies... or significant amounts of exaggeration for dramatic effect.
by La Xinga » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:31 pm
Godular wrote:La xinga wrote:So the splitting of the sea, a hallucination for about 3 million people? Same for giving of the Torah, Korach and his men getting swallowed by the ground, the walls around Yericho, the burning of Sancheriv's army, all hallucinations?!
That or lies... or significant amounts of exaggeration for dramatic effect.
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:32 pm
2. in Tanach, these are unnatural occurrences.
by Neutraligon » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:33 pm
by Estanglia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:33 pm
La xinga wrote:That's before a religion happened, the stuff in Tanach are unnatural occurrences.
Torrocca wrote:"Your honor, it was not mein fault! I didn't order the systematic genocide of millions of people, it was the twenty kilograms of pure-cut Bavarian cocaine that did it!"
by Neutraligon » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:33 pm
by La Xinga » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:34 pm
by Godular » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:37 pm
by La Xinga » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:38 pm
Godular wrote:La xinga wrote:there must be a reason the Jews accepted such a hard thing.
They didn't, at first. The religion developed over time, as all religions do. It could just as easily started as a group of philosophical writings or folk tales that folks then started to actually believe in because everybody else did.
Shit, one need only look at the Greek pantheon for that. If nothing else, those stories are even more widely understood at outright fairy tales explaining this thing or that, but people made offerings and worship to them all the same.
by Estanglia » Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:39 pm
Torrocca wrote:"Your honor, it was not mein fault! I didn't order the systematic genocide of millions of people, it was the twenty kilograms of pure-cut Bavarian cocaine that did it!"
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