Is housing value disparity between Blacks and Whites racist?

[Chernoslavia]

I did not mean to draw out legitimate racists that are saying legit racist things.

That invariably happens when you start saying that black people being worse off isn't because of racism. Racists love that. Their trick is to not state openly that they believe that black people are just genetically inferior, but also they rule out anything else that could possibly account for blacks being worse off and leave it to their audience to employ the process of elimination.

[Ifreann]

I know that you didn't say that. I didn't say that you said that. But that is, in effect, what you are doing. You're criticising people, themselves children if I understand correctly, for seeming to despair and give up on having a better life. But that's just people having emotions. They aren't bad and lazy because of that. They're worn down by generations of racism, and you're here telling them to just work their way out of it. You're like the person who tells people to just stop being depressed.

Yeah, but you said, and let me put this in quotations for you so you can understand better,

for me

I didn't say they should do it

for me

I meant they should do it

for themselves.

Saying that I even remotely meant that they should do it for me is false. And yes, they are a bit down on their luck because of racism, but guess what. Racism isn't an excuse anymore. from what I know, many of the jobs in my town fire people on the spot for racism. many of the colleges in my county kick students out for racism. I live in the south and racial bias has dropped dramatically in the years even before I was born. You can't use the far past to justify the present, at least not here.

When I say "perform a dedicated work ethic", I don't mean "do hard work" I mean "do a performance that creates the image of having a dedicated work ethic".

[Mardla]

I don't want to live in a "black neighborhood", honestly, and would pay a lot less for such housing. If you think that's racist, then so are blacks who work very hard to escape black neighborhoods.

[Ifreann]

I don't want to live in a "black neighborhood", honestly, and would pay a lot less for such housing. If you think that's racist, then so are blacks who work very hard to escape black neighborhoods.

Yeah, people who recognise that centuries of racism have created black neighbourhoods that aren't desirable to live in are the real racists. Got 'em. Left DESTROYED.

[Petrolheadia]

See: Asians.

A very fair comparison, because Asians and blacks have basically the same history in the US. I mean, there's the slight difference that whereas blacks were brought to America in chains, Asians were banned from immigrating to the United States until relatively recently. And I guess you can kinda see how that means that most of the Asians in America are, by definition, well off enough to be able to afford to move to America.

Well-off people don't have a reason to immigrate.

Those who do are those who barely have the money to emigrate, sell everything to do so and end off without anything. Migrant labourers, boat people, etc.

[Ifreann]

A very fair comparison, because Asians and blacks have basically the same history in the US. I mean, there's the slight difference that whereas blacks were brought to America in chains, Asians were banned from immigrating to the United States until relatively recently. And I guess you can kinda see how that means that most of the Asians in America are, by definition, well off enough to be able to afford to move to America.

Well-off people don't have a reason to immigrate.

Those who do are those who barely have the money to emigrate, sell everything to do so and end off without anything. Migrant labourers, boat people, etc.

Yes, nobody has a reason to leave China except the poor.

[Chernoslavia]

I don't want to live in a "black neighborhood", honestly, and would pay a lot less for such housing. If you think that's racist, then so are blacks who work very hard to escape black neighborhoods.

Yeah, people who recognise that centuries of racism have created black neighbourhoods that aren't desirable to live in are the real racists. Got 'em. Left DESTROYED.

Whitey's fault!

- Ifreann, 2018

[Saiwania]

I do think to myself that investing in Black neighborhoods isn't such a bad idea. I don't want to live where Black people live not because there is anything wrong with them, but simply because I'm White and would be too different. I do want to own such property though, to rent it out and hopefully get profit. I want to be a slum lord just like Sean Hannity. The real estate holdings he's built up is admirable.

I believe in racial realism and a harmony is to be found if you live where your race is the majority. You fit right into that community. If you're the only White though, and everyone's Black, you don't. Same situation happens with every racial group. It is what nature intends, for people to associate with their own kind.

[Petrolheadia]

Well-off people don't have a reason to immigrate.

Those who do are those who barely have the money to emigrate, sell everything to do so and end off without anything. Migrant labourers, boat people, etc.

Yes, nobody has a reason to leave China except the poor.

The people who haven't made it in their home country are more likely to emigrate.

Also, it doesn't account for that much Asian superiority. First you've got the yellow peril stuff, and then you have Asians being statistically richer than whites.

[Mardla]

I don't want to live in a "black neighborhood", honestly, and would pay a lot less for such housing. If you think that's racist, then so are blacks who work very hard to escape black neighborhoods.

Yeah, people who recognise that centuries of racism have created black neighbourhoods that aren't desirable to live in are the real racists. Got 'em. Left DESTROYED.

That's true, but the people in the neighborhoods are the main contributors to the neighborhoods being undesirable.

[Ifreann]

Yes, nobody has a reason to leave China except the poor.

The people who haven't made it in their home country are more likely to emigrate.

Across the Pacific ocean, somehow.

Also, it doesn't account for that much Asian superiority. First you've got the yellow peril stuff, and then you have Asians being statistically richer than whites.

Well obviously what happened is that there were no Asians, and then a load of dirt poor Asians showed up on homemade rafts, then they used their inherent racial superiority to get mega-rich.

Or, you know, only rich Asians could afford to migrate to the US and they used their existing wealth to accumulate more wealth and pass it on to their children and so on.

[Ifreann]

Yeah, people who recognise that centuries of racism have created black neighbourhoods that aren't desirable to live in are the real racists. Got 'em. Left DESTROYED.

That's true, but the people in the neighborhoods are the main contributors to the neighborhoods being undesirable.

To you?

[Mardla]

That's true, but the people in the neighborhoods are the main contributors to the neighborhoods being undesirable.

To you?

Yes, as well as the people trying to escape.

[Ifreann]

To you?

Yes, as well as the people trying to escape.

If you say so, chief.

[South Ccanda]

Yeah, people who recognise that centuries of racism have created black neighbourhoods that aren't desirable to live in are the real racists. Got 'em. Left DESTROYED.

Whitey's fault!

- Ifreann, 2018

well, actually, I think Ifreann has a point on this one. I'm not stating that Mardla's statement is inherently racist, but the point where they tried to prove they weren't racist just doesn't have any standing. Again, I believe Mardla's first statement is somewhat reasonable.

[US-SSR]

From what I see, it is not that black people exist in a community that reduces the value, but the quality of the area. In general, black residents make far less than their white neighbors in other communities.

People you address will just retort back that this is because of racism. Because God forbid there are other possible reasons for a community to be poorer relative to other communities!

In a racist society, no, there are not.

[Klorgia1]

So basically, the disparity is a chain effect of the past, not current racism (in OP's opinion).

[Sovaal]

In part sure, but that's hardly the whole image. Some areas are simply less valuable, be they white, black, purple, green, etc. be they for economic of legal reasons.

[Chernoslavia]

People you address will just retort back that this is because of racism. Because God forbid there are other possible reasons for a community to be poorer relative to other communities!

In a racist society, no, there are not.

What racist society?

[The Snazzylands]

In part sure, but that's hardly the whole image. Some areas are simply less valuable, be they white, black, purple, green, etc. be they for economic of legal reasons.

But the economic and legal institutions aren't immune to the biases and prejudices of the culture they inhabit. For example, before the civil rights movement, just being Black was a legitimate reason to be denied a home loan. I'm not saying discrimination nowadays is anywhere near that blatant, but you have to admit that it stood in the way of African-Americans being able to accumulate the kind of generational wealth that a proportionally much larger group of White people are able to benefit from today. So yes, you absolutely need to consider the big picture but you can't consider institutionalized racism out of the question when trying to understand why Black communities are disproportionally poor and crime-ridden compared to White communities.

People you address will just retort back that this is because of racism. Because God forbid there are other possible reasons for a community to be poorer relative to other communities!

In a racist society, no, there are not.

There are, but the racism can't really be separated from the economic reasons.

[Thuzbekistan]

I do think to myself that investing in Black neighborhoods isn't such a bad idea. I don't want to live where Black people live not because there is anything wrong with them, but simply because I'm White and would be too different. I do want to own such property though, to rent it out and hopefully get profit. I want to be a slum lord just like Sean Hannity. The real estate holdings he's built up is admirable.

I believe in racial realism and a harmony is to be found if you live where your race is the majority. You fit right into that community. If you're the only White though, and everyone's Black, you don't. Same situation happens with every racial group. It is what nature intends, for people to associate with their own kind.

I'm the only white guy in my neighborhood. Neighbor is Mexican and most of the rest are black. I dont think I've ever had nicer neighbors. Despite a language barrier, the Mexican still chats with me and on the multitude of times the idiots at ups deliver a package to the wrong address, they have gotten in their cars and delivered it to me (they being the black people in my neighborhood).

Racial realism is another abhorrent ideology to justify defacto segregation.

[Thuzbekistan]

Yes, as well as the people trying to escape.

If you say so, chief.

Have you ever been to a really bad part of town? Theres trash all over the sides if the roads, guns sticking out of peoples pants, boarded up homes. These parts of town are dangerous just driving through if you're a white guy and God help you if you are a Mexican driving through. The people in these communities absolutely are the reason those communities dont see development. If the cops cant go there in fear of being shot, you wont see construction work either.

[Ifreann]

If you say so, chief.

Have you ever been to a really bad part of town? Theres trash all over the sides if the roads, guns sticking out of peoples pants, boarded up homes. These parts of town are dangerous just driving through if you're a white guy and God help you if you are a Mexican driving through.

You know my favourite part of this post? "[G]uns sticking out of peoples[sic] pants". This is America we're talking about. What's the problem with black men exercising their right to bear arms?

Did you hear about that shooting at a mall in Alabama on Black Friday? Police announced pretty quickly that they'd shot the perpetrator. Only it turned out that the man they shot and killed was not the perpetrator. Emantic Bradford Jr. was a legally armed US Army veteran who happened to be in the mall. He drew his handgun when he heard gunfire, as did many other people, and he was helping direct other shoppers to safety when he was shot three times in the back of the head and neck.

The people in these communities absolutely are the reason those communities dont see development. If the cops cant go there in fear of being shot, you wont see construction work either.

If cops are afraid of black people, that's not the fault of black people, that's racism.

[HC Eredivisie]

The people who haven't made it in their home country are more likely to emigrate.

Across the Pacific ocean, somehow.

In contrast to the Irish who went across the Atlantic Ocean, somehow.

[Liriena]

If you say so, chief.

Have you ever been to a really bad part of town? Theres trash all over the sides if the roads, guns sticking out of peoples pants, boarded up homes. These parts of town are dangerous just driving through if you're a white guy and God help you if you are a Mexican driving through. The people in these communities absolutely are the reason those communities dont see development. If the cops cant go there in fear of being shot, you wont see construction work either.

So what are your thoughts on the history of redlining?