by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:19 am
by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:25 am
by Destyntine » Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:35 am
by An Alan Smithee Nation » Sat Dec 26, 2020 7:52 am
by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Sun Dec 27, 2020 1:02 am
Destyntine wrote:The cliché that I always find to be the biggest turnoff in writing is the flawless hero/Mary Sue cliché. In writing, this is the character that is written to be absolutely perfect in everything they do, everything they say, and you know they will have a happy ending. A Mary Sue character is very easy to spot due to their center of attention and absolute perfectionist qualities.
I also cannot stand the throwaway side-character cliché. I have often noticed in stories where death is common there are always those side characters who are thrown in just be killed off in order to reveal a threat or show the threat in action. These characters are usually weaker or are a lower rank compared to main characters. Ever notice how a group of soldiers goes into a fight and everyone in that team dies except for the main characters? How about when a bunch of knights are defending a castle and only the main characters manage to escape the attack alive. These kinds of things are subtle but they get to me.
by Haremm » Sun Dec 27, 2020 11:58 pm
Destyntine wrote:
I also cannot stand the throwaway side-character cliché. I have often noticed in stories where death is common there are always those side characters who are thrown in just be killed off in order to reveal a threat or show the threat in action. These characters are usually weaker or are a lower rank compared to main characters. Ever notice how a group of soldiers goes into a fight and everyone in that team dies except for the main characters? How about when a bunch of knights are defending a castle and only the main characters manage to escape the attack alive. These kinds of things are subtle but they get to me.
by Western Fardelshufflestein » Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:04 am
Haremm wrote:Destyntine wrote:
I also cannot stand the throwaway side-character cliché. I have often noticed in stories where death is common there are always those side characters who are thrown in just be killed off in order to reveal a threat or show the threat in action. These characters are usually weaker or are a lower rank compared to main characters. Ever notice how a group of soldiers goes into a fight and everyone in that team dies except for the main characters? How about when a bunch of knights are defending a castle and only the main characters manage to escape the attack alive. These kinds of things are subtle but they get to me.
So cannon fodders?
I don't know what do you to call it, but it's when the main character/s is about to die/lose but then his allies suddenly arrive in an extremely dramatic fashion (don't get me wrong, they sure do make one hell of an entrance) and save him from the brink of death. It's just bothering why they didn't come with the MC in the first place or that why the MC has to face his enemy/ies all alone.
The Western Fardelshufflestein Sentinel | 27 November 2022 bUt wHy iS tHE rUm gOnE!?
by Nuroblav » Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:49 am
Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:Why must there be romance in every single story ever? Why must there ALWAYS be a love triangle? Love triangles are so overdone, and it can be more interesting to have a love hexagon or a love dodecahedron if it is portrayed well.
SNOW ON CHRISTMAS. NOT EVERYONE LIVES IN THE SUPER COLD REGIONS OF THE WORLD. NO. JUST NO.
by Western Fardelshufflestein » Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:57 pm
Nuroblav wrote:I'll second the deux ex machina mentioned above, given that usually I can sense from way too far off that it'll end well.
Dunno if there's a technical term for this either, but part of me is tired of 'other important character almost dies near the end but we find out afterwards they they don't actually'.Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:Why must there be romance in every single story ever? Why must there ALWAYS be a love triangle? Love triangles are so overdone, and it can be more interesting to have a love hexagon or a love dodecahedron if it is portrayed well.
SNOW ON CHRISTMAS. NOT EVERYONE LIVES IN THE SUPER COLD REGIONS OF THE WORLD. NO. JUST NO.
Love's Labours Lost: hold my love octagon
The snow on Christmas one is rather annoying though, I'll agree.
The Western Fardelshufflestein Sentinel | 27 November 2022 bUt wHy iS tHE rUm gOnE!?
by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:03 am
by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:38 am
by Chan Island » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:41 am
Anollasia wrote:"Honey, I can explain."
She doesn't listen to him and runs away
(It would be a much shorter story if she would listen, but that doesn't mean it's not cliché).
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.
by Anollasia » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:20 pm
Chan Island wrote:Anollasia wrote:"Honey, I can explain."
She doesn't listen to him and runs away
(It would be a much shorter story if she would listen, but that doesn't mean it's not cliché).
It also can make for a more interesting story too, that's the thing! She can straight up disbelieve what he's saying, they can argue, shout at each other, plunge into the emotional depth of their 2 stories, right there in the moment.
But no, have them run away and then they make up for it later because you can't actually write human interaction. Gets me every time.
---------------------
For me, I generally dislike the Worff effect. This is more of a TV and comic book sin, but the end result is that you just feel sorry for the resident punching bag. Like the Avatar of Khaine in Warhammer, who is beaten by everyone and their grandma because hey, look how badass they are. At least let Worff win a few battles here and there, and even beat named characters from time to time, to remind us that he's actually bad-ass and not a mere punching bag.
Another I dislike is how everything is a love story. Yeah, I get it, people like to have naughties in bed, but in every damn story? I'd pay to watch a movie where there just isn't a romantic relationship in it.
by Heloin » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:34 pm
Chan Island wrote:For me, I generally dislike the Worff effect. This is more of a TV and comic book sin, but the end result is that you just feel sorry for the resident punching bag. Like the Avatar of Khaine in Warhammer, who is beaten by everyone and their grandma because hey, look how badass they are. At least let Worff win a few battles here and there, and even beat named characters from time to time, to remind us that he's actually bad-ass and not a mere punching bag.
Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts wrote:I hate it when writers feel the need to pander to SJWs and moral guardians who complain incessantly about anything or anyone they don't like.
Just make a good story, goddammit.
Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts wrote:Thin skinned authors who can't take criticism.
by Australian rePublic » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:38 pm
by Jabberwocky » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:41 pm
by Western Fardelshufflestein » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:42 pm
Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts wrote:I hate it when writers feel the need to pander to SJWs and moral guardians who complain incessantly about anything or anyone they don't like.
Just make a good story, goddammit.
Anollasia wrote:"Honey, I can explain."
She doesn't listen to him and runs away
(It would be a much shorter story if she would listen, but that doesn't mean it's not cliché).
Australian rePublic wrote:Shoving a love story where it doesn't belong for the sake of unnecessarily including a love story. This happens all the time in American cinema. The best example I can think of RN is the movie "Speed"
The Western Fardelshufflestein Sentinel | 27 November 2022 bUt wHy iS tHE rUm gOnE!?
by Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:01 pm
by Cannot think of a name » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:48 pm
Western Fardelshufflestein wrote:Why must there be romance in every single story ever? Why must there ALWAYS be a love triangle? Love triangles are so overdone, and it can be more interesting to have a love hexagon or a love dodecahedron if it is portrayed well.
Fictional characters looooooove having [REDACTED] out of wedlock. Why can't there be at least one person who chooses to wait after marriage?
SNOW ON CHRISTMAS. NOT EVERYONE LIVES IN THE SUPER COLD REGIONS OF THE WORLD. NO. JUST NO.Haremm wrote:
So cannon fodders?
I don't know what do you to call it, but it's when the main character/s is about to die/lose but then his allies suddenly arrive in an extremely dramatic fashion (don't get me wrong, they sure do make one hell of an entrance) and save him from the brink of death. It's just bothering why they didn't come with the MC in the first place or that why the MC has to face his enemy/ies all alone.
The fancy literary term is deus ex machina. This can get cheesy really quickly unless it is delivered unexpectedly and well.
by Chan Island » Tue Jan 05, 2021 3:39 pm
Amorosa-Coonarra Coasts wrote:Movies and books that fall into the genre of 'Grimdark': stories that are dark, edgy and gritty for the sheer hell of it with no other reason than following trends.
Symptoms that your narrative is a casualty of Grimdark include:
- A washed-out, dark colour palette of dirty greys and blacks
- Gruff heroes with no moral compass
- Killing off characters every five minutes.
- Drowning the audience in so much depressing schlock that they don't care anymore.
Anollasia wrote:
Also, have you ever watched Big Hero 6? That's one movie where there isn't a romantic story, just brotherly/friendly love.
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.
by Crysuko » Thu Jan 07, 2021 7:20 am
by Polska Rzeczpospolita Robotnicza » Thu Jan 07, 2021 7:28 am
by Burpolis Dna » Fri Jan 08, 2021 11:09 am
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