Thread for Gamers IX: God Howard Starfield Edition

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Its an excuse to complain about something.

Now if the game was set in Scotland in say 900 AD having random black guys running around wouldnt make sense, but when you have all of this stuff from almost 1000 years all crammed in together in battles in random generic medieval locations its a poor argument imo.

Same with the immersion argument, you have fuckers running around the like the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Santa Claus, fucking Hitler and Stalin duking it out on the eastern front, Gordon Ramsey, Beric Dondarion and Geralt of Rivia and many more. You can kill a dude in full plate armour with a frying pan for petes sake, and that is actually kind of more realistic than some of the other weapons you can use to kill people in armour.

Also this... amazing voice

Those are absolutely fantastic.

The only historical realism complaint that I could somewhat understand was the CoD WWII one, where half the uniforms and weapon skins look like they were ripped from Fortnite alongside the historical ones. Like one or the other 0lease, because it's incredibly jarring and unappealing when they're together in the same game. If anything it's more an art design and aesthetic complaint than realism.

Plus I absolutely hated that you couldnt customize for when you played axis and there were no uniforms. So basically half the time your customization is rendered moot. To be honest I really liked the concept of collecting various historical uniforms for both sides but the completely fucked it up.

That and Loot boxes magicly landing on the beach.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Its an excuse to complain about something.

Now if the game was set in Scotland in say 900 AD having random black guys running around wouldnt make sense, but when you have all of this stuff from almost 1000 years all crammed in together in battles in random generic medieval locations its a poor argument imo.

Same with the immersion argument, you have fuckers running around the like the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Santa Claus, fucking Hitler and Stalin duking it out on the eastern front, Gordon Ramsey, Beric Dondarion and Geralt of Rivia and many more. You can kill a dude in full plate armour with a frying pan for petes sake, and that is actually kind of more realistic than some of the other weapons you can use to kill people in armour.

Also this... amazing voice

Those are absolutely fantastic.

The only historical realism complaint that I could somewhat understand was the CoD WWII one, where half the uniforms and weapon skins look like they were ripped from Fortnite alongside the historical ones. Like one or the other 0lease, because it's incredibly jarring and unappealing when they're together in the same game. If anything it's more an art design and aesthetic complaint than realism.

Plus I absolutely hated that you couldnt customize for when you played axis and there were no uniforms. So basically half the time your customization is rendered moot. To be honest I really liked the concept of collecting various historical uniforms for both sides to use as skins but they completely fucked it up.

Were there really no uniform options for the axis side? Wow that sucks wtf

[Earthbound Immortal Squad]

Like some people do do shit that is obviously just so they can hit a check box to pat themselves on the back or wank themselves off about how progressive they are, but at the end of the day a lot of the complaining about "historical accuracy" "realism" "immersion" and other things like such as that, is a very thin facade put up by people just wanting to complain and often focuses on absolute stupid fucking shit in games that do no set out to be incredibly realistic or historically accurate anyway, that people really need to get over themselves about.


See if you are going to complain about something in mordhau, maybe focus on an actual problem, such as the bullshit balance on some of the maps (average blue team experience on crossroads by the way which is basically fuck you stay in your spawn or die by red cav) or weapons being overpowered and not having animations sync up properly, re balancing the perks, more game modes etc. All of these should take precedence if you are going to complain about something or ask for something to be fixed, not crying if they might add some women or blacks into the game some point way down the line

Gaming immersion is definitely a type of game some players like to play, I get bored very quickly if the game doesn't have serious depth to it, though I admit players like that are rare and I do agree there are those who will just say that to be trendy but that seems to be the way of culture right now very few will stand true to their beliefs, but to assume all are just saying it to be trendy is extremely naive. For example take some of the nationstates role play threads the detail that goes into them is remarkable that would be considered immersive if it was in the form of a video game.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Like some people do do shit that is obviously just so they can hit a check box to pat themselves on the back or wank themselves off about how progressive they are, but at the end of the day a lot of the complaining about "historical accuracy" "realism" "immersion" and other things like such as that, is a very thin facade put up by people just wanting to complain and often focuses on absolute stupid fucking shit in games that do no set out to be incredibly realistic or historically accurate anyway, that people really need to get over themselves about.


See if you are going to complain about something in mordhau, maybe focus on an actual problem, such as the bullshit balance on some of the maps (average blue team experience on crossroads by the way which is basically fuck you stay in your spawn or die by red cav) or weapons being overpowered and not having animations sync up properly, re balancing the perks, more game modes etc. All of these should take precedence if you are going to complain about something or ask for something to be fixed, not crying if they might add some women or blacks into the game some point way down the line

Gaming immersion is definitely a type of game some players like to play, I get bored very quickly if the game doesn't have serious depth to it, though I admit players like that are rare and I do agree there are those who will just say that to be trendy but that seems to be the way of culture right now very few will stand true to their beliefs, but to assume all are just saying it to be trendy is extremely naive. For example take some of the nationstates role play threads the detail that goes into them is remarkable that would be considered immersive if it was in the form of a video game.

Oh i get that i do, i like to be immersed in games as well, but i think that complaining (in mordhaus case and some others) that women will ruin your immersion, but none of that stuff which is already in the game doesnt, and stuff like this which i forgot to mention doesnt (granted this one is more of a bug but still), is in my opinion stupid and with little basis and seems more and more like an excuse to just complain.

[Ism]

Anyway, I've gotten back to playing Baldur's Gate 2 recently. Still in Athkatla, but I've gotta say, it's fun. Bit frustrating how poorly put together my party is though. 3 mages and I don't have my magic license yet. Ugh.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Anyway, I've gotten back to playing Baldur's Gate 2 recently. Still in Athkatla, but I've gotta say, it's fun. Bit frustrating how poorly put together my party is though. 3 mages and I don't have my magic license yet. Ugh.

Ive not played those games in ages, my brother got me into them for a while, but they couldnt hold my interest. Shame, seems like they would have been up my alley.

[Earthbound Immortal Squad]

Gaming immersion is definitely a type of game some players like to play, I get bored very quickly if the game doesn't have serious depth to it, though I admit players like that are rare and I do agree there are those who will just say that to be trendy but that seems to be the way of culture right now very few will stand true to their beliefs, but to assume all are just saying it to be trendy is extremely naive. For example take some of the nationstates role play threads the detail that goes into them is remarkable that would be considered immersive if it was in the form of a video game.

Oh i get that i do, i like to be immersed in games as well, but i think that complaining (in mordhaus case and some others) that women will ruin your immersion, but none of that stuff which is already in the game doesnt, and stuff like this which i forgot to mention doesnt (granted this one is more of a bug but still), is in my opinion stupid and with little basis and seems more and more like an excuse to just complain.

For me it depends on the game and how historically accurate it should be for example in BF5 I have no objection to a woman being there but they need to make it fit with the timeline e.g something simple like making them French resistance would have solved that problem, as for this Mordhaus game I hadn't heard of it until today so I have no clue on that front.

[The Huskar Social Union]

Oh i get that i do, i like to be immersed in games as well, but i think that complaining (in mordhaus case and some others) that women will ruin your immersion, but none of that stuff which is already in the game doesnt, and stuff like this which i forgot to mention doesnt (granted this one is more of a bug but still), is in my opinion stupid and with little basis and seems more and more like an excuse to just complain.

For me it depends on the game and how historically accurate it should be for example in BF5 I have no objection to a woman being there but they need to make it fit with the timeline e.g something simple like making them French resistance would have solved that problem, as for this Mordhaus game I hadn't heard of it until today so I have no clue on that front.

Its just an arcadey multiplayer medieval fighting game, no campaign or anything. Its pretty fun.

BF5 yes is more of a valid case to complain about some of the decisions on the dev side, especially after their response and comments. Personally i was not into the game from the get go because it just looked like a major downgrade from BF1 which i fucking loved.

[Ism]

Anyway, I've gotten back to playing Baldur's Gate 2 recently. Still in Athkatla, but I've gotta say, it's fun. Bit frustrating how poorly put together my party is though. 3 mages and I don't have my magic license yet. Ugh.

Ive not played those games in ages, my brother got me into them for a while, but they couldnt hold my interest. Shame, seems like they would have been up my alley.

Pretty cheap during Steam sales if you've any interest. I do get where you're coming from though, took me ages to get into the first one, spent most of my first few hours just toying around in the character creator, and then just leaving it untouched in my library. If you can stick with it for a little while though, round out your party it picks up. Nashkel is really where that shows best, because once you reach it the main plot begins in earnest and the world really opens up. And you can get Minsc, of course.

[Highever]

Those are absolutely fantastic.

The only historical realism complaint that I could somewhat understand was the CoD WWII one, where half the uniforms and weapon skins look like they were ripped from Fortnite alongside the historical ones. Like one or the other 0lease, because it's incredibly jarring and unappealing when they're together in the same game. If anything it's more an art design and aesthetic complaint than realism.

Plus I absolutely hated that you couldnt customize for when you played axis and there were no uniforms. So basically half the time your customization is rendered moot. To be honest I really liked the concept of collecting various historical uniforms for both sides to use as skins but they completely fucked it up.

Were there really no uniform options for the axis side? Wow that sucks wtf

Nope. Literally nothing. Like how can you introduce customization into CoD when 50% of the time players cant have customization? So fucking stupid. They also had a Destiny style hub where your character ran around.

I think I read somewhere the original plan was to have players be able to choose who their main side was, Allies or Axis and that there would be two hubs one for each faction and both sides were fully customizable with tons of options. But apprently there was outrage that you could "be a nazi" or something so what it is now is what we got.

[Earthbound Immortal Squad]

For me it depends on the game and how historically accurate it should be for example in BF5 I have no objection to a woman being there but they need to make it fit with the timeline e.g something simple like making them French resistance would have solved that problem, as for this Mordhaus game I hadn't heard of it until today so I have no clue on that front.

Its just an arcadey multiplayer medieval fighting game, no campaign or anything. Its pretty fun.

BF5 yes is more of a valid case to complain about some of the decisions on the dev side, especially after their response and comments. Personally i was not into the game from the get go because it just looked like a major downgrade from BF1 which i fucking loved.

A good campaign was always a big seller for me possibly because I could play offline and I used to have terrible internet. MY favourites were halo 3 and reach, Skyrim and GTA 5 and probably my favourite thing and I know I will sound cynical now but I rejoiced being able to play a game without having to watch out for someone else who couldn't play. I don't have a prejudice to newbies I just think games should have a system which allows new players to train properly before going fully online otherwise it often ruins my enjoyment.

[Purpelia]

I never got the "Not realistic enough" argument. Considering one generation ago the stores where swamped with boring realistic shooters. Then Doom and Overwatch came in and reminded the videogame industry that shooters can be fun.

Anyway, looking back at BF3, BF4 and, BF Hardline, and all the crazy shit that goes on in the plots and game play of those stories (BF3 nukes Paris then never talks about it again, BF4 had hovertanks, BF Hardline was an 80's cop show) really saying that some woman and a metal arm where unrealistic is rather tame.

It's a matter of advertising and expectations. Nobody complains about Wolfenstein having Nazi zombies and death robots and robot-death-zombies because that is what is established for the franchise and thus what you expect when buying it. But battlefield is a franchise that is grounded in basically historical settings and thus the fans expected the same. At least those of us who were fans of the original battlefields (42, Vietnam) and skipped over the modern stuff entirely because it's dumb.

Hell even BF1 had people running around with a bunch of prototype weapons that rarely if ever saw actual use in WW1. So saying some woman with a metal arm ruined the game from the very first trailer was a poor criticism.

Personally for me BF1 was a catastrophic disappointment. I did not buy the game explicitly because it's not a WW1 game but a Wolfenstien in WW1 game. Not that I am not a fan of Wolf, I am. But I like my battlefields to be battlefields and my Wolfs to be Wolfs.

It wasn't political, it was just a virtual woman with a virtual prosthetic arm that made the anti SJW crowd yell "FoRcEd DiVerSITy!!111". Everything afterwards was a shit show.

Honestly I think it was more the fact that when people started complaining about anything at all the devs immediately started using the bigot card to make them self look like victims as opposed to addressing criticism. That is the sort of behavior that is just insufferable.

If i say your product sucks and why I expect one of the these:
- To be ignored.
- To be politely told my criticism is invalid because I am not your target audience (polite way of saying "if you don't like it don't buy it")
- A polite response accepting my criticism and how you plan to address it.
- A polite response accepting my criticism and why you disagree with it.

If you insult me instead than you can expect only the same in return. And god knows once you insult the internet it will strike back.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

I never got the "Not realistic enough" argument. Considering one generation ago the stores where swamped with boring realistic shooters. Then Doom and Overwatch came in and reminded the videogame industry that shooters can be fun.

Anyway, looking back at BF3, BF4 and, BF Hardline, and all the crazy shit that goes on in the plots and game play of those stories (BF3 nukes Paris then never talks about it again, BF4 had hovertanks, BF Hardline was an 80's cop show) really saying that some woman and a metal arm where unrealistic is rather tame.

It's a matter of advertising and expectations. Nobody complains about Wolfenstein having Nazi zombies and death robots and robot-death-zombies because that is what is established for the franchise and thus what you expect when buying it. But battlefield is a franchise that is grounded in basically historical settings and thus the fans expected the same. At least those of us who were fans of the original battlefields (42, Vietnam) and skipped over the modern stuff entirely because it's dumb.

I mean, I wasn't really saying the inaccuracies and the new BF's wheren't fun, I like playing 3 and 4.

And hover tanks where fun to use in the last BF4 dlc while being a nice nod to BF 2142.

[Purpelia]

If I wanted hovertanks I'd be playing MWLL. Awesome game that by the way.

[The first Galactic Republic]

Those are absolutely fantastic.

The only historical realism complaint that I could somewhat understand was the CoD WWII one, where half the uniforms and weapon skins look like they were ripped from Fortnite alongside the historical ones. Like one or the other 0lease, because it's incredibly jarring and unappealing when they're together in the same game. If anything it's more an art design and aesthetic complaint than realism.

Plus I absolutely hated that you couldnt customize for when you played axis and there were no uniforms. So basically half the time your customization is rendered moot. To be honest I really liked the concept of collecting various historical uniforms for both sides to use as skins but they completely fucked it up.

Were there really no uniform options for the axis side? Wow that sucks wtf

They did add them later.

[Highever]

Were there really no uniform options for the axis side? Wow that sucks wtf

They did add them later.

Not really. Basically all the did was add a few different color schemes to the default german uniforms. Hardly the same as the varied and interesting uniforms for the allies that also includes different helmets and such.

[Rostavykhan]

Hell even BF1 had people running around with a bunch of prototype weapons that rarely if ever saw actual use in WW1. So saying some woman with a metal arm ruined the game from the very first trailer was a poor criticism.

It wasn't political, it was just a virtual woman with a virtual prosthetic arm that made the anti SJW crowd yell "FoRcEd DiVerSITy!!111". Everything afterwards was a shit show.

Nah, DICE kinda made it political real quick, even if the cyborg girl wasn't inherently political.

Though, besides that, immersive =/= realistic. If BFV was a totally realistic MilSim, I'd still hate it.

Despite having a lot of machineguns and tanks and obscure weapons, BF1 still had the aesthetic down. The gear was all at least made or used in some way around the 1910's, soldiers still resembled soldiers from the time period, and most maps had that greyed-out, gloomy vibe to it. Sure, a German medic might not be wearing an accurate uniform, but they looked German. Huge tank battles might not have been the norm until late into the war, but it still had that WWI vibe going down whenever you climbed out of a trench and followed a landship around a bombed out church.

With BFV, everything looked a little too vibrant, and a robo-woman and katana-wielding commando? Sure, BF1 having supports wearing experimental knight helms was weird, but at least you could wave that off as "well, at least I can see that being in the game because it's WWI", but katanas and prosthetic arms on the western from in WWII is a little too far out there. Even beyond the trailer, the actual game just looks off. Half the time, you can't even tell who's Axis and who's Allies because everyone is wearing the same jumble of overcoats and arm warmers and goggles, sometimes in the same colours. Also, for some reason, some of the British skins use modern Chinese gas masks, which is, uh...strange.

I hardly take the argument about weapons being inaccurate seriously because that's going to be a thing regardless. I don't think anyone should reasonably, actually be surprised that you can use an STG-44 in a game that's supposed to be around 1940, considering BF1 had guns that barely even existed, and BF4 and earlier had American troops using AK's and Chinese with L-86's in multiplayer. Most people can get over having different guns because it's an MP game, and you should be able to play with what you want. It'd be like saying that you're not allowed to use a needler in Halo because you're UNSC, or you can't use a Hammerburst in Gears of War because you're COG.

Wasn't BFV just Britain vs Germany? The scope probably was another nail in the coffin, and if there was an update on it, it was probably too late.

Yeah. It's actually going to have America and Japan...soon...and by soon, I mean almost a full year after launch...with only about three maps for them...

Still no USSR, Italy, Poland, France, Holland, Norway, or Greece in sight, either.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

The Sinister Reasons For Adding Microtransactions After Launch

Hell even BF1 had people running around with a bunch of prototype weapons that rarely if ever saw actual use in WW1. So saying some woman with a metal arm ruined the game from the very first trailer was a poor criticism.

It wasn't political, it was just a virtual woman with a virtual prosthetic arm that made the anti SJW crowd yell "FoRcEd DiVerSITy!!111". Everything afterwards was a shit show.

Nah, DICE kinda made it political real quick, even if the cyborg girl wasn't inherently political.

That would still be after the first trailer, and I recall that most of the criticism was just the fact that she was a she in that trailer.

[Purpelia]

What's sinister about it? They want to make idiotic amounts of money off games. They know the audience are a bunch of idiots willing to support that. So they do it.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

What's sinister about it? They want to make idiotic amounts of money off games. They know the audience are a bunch of idiots willing to support that. So they do it.

Its an unethical way of makeing money and has no place in a video game you pay up front to play.

[Skylus]

Even Nintendo has DLCs now.

[Ifreann]

People are very selective about the realism and historical accuracy they like to complain about being ruined in video games.

Example is Mordhau, women or non white male characters being in the game is unrealistic and ruins historical accuracy.

But fighting using a mish mash of weapons and equipment from the 700's-1500's is fine. Using executioner swords like frontline weapons is fine. Using rapiers with kite shields against enemies wearing heavy plate armour is fine. Literally killing a man in plate armour with pieces of shit you can throw at them is fine. A perk that gives you instant full health upon a kill is fine. Slashing someone to pieces in full plate armour with an arming sword and delimbing them is fine.

Add on top of that the combat system is not realistic either, its a fucking medieval based arcade fighting game.

Also there were women and non-white people in Medieval Europe, so this idea that it's "historically inaccurate" to feature them in this sort of vaguely "Medieval Europe"-y setting is just wrong.

[Holy Tedalonia]

People are very selective about the realism and historical accuracy they like to complain about being ruined in video games.

Example is Mordhau, women or non white male characters being in the game is unrealistic and ruins historical accuracy.

But fighting using a mish mash of weapons and equipment from the 700's-1500's is fine. Using executioner swords like frontline weapons is fine. Using rapiers with kite shields against enemies wearing heavy plate armour is fine. Literally killing a man in plate armour with pieces of shit you can throw at them is fine. A perk that gives you instant full health upon a kill is fine. Slashing someone to pieces in full plate armour with an arming sword and delimbing them is fine.

Add on top of that the combat system is not realistic either, its a fucking medieval based arcade fighting game.

Also there were women and non-white people in Medieval Europe, so this idea that it's "historically inaccurate" to feature them in this sort of vaguely "Medieval Europe"-y setting.

Id be disappointed if women are not in medieval Europe, what do you do on your free time? Movies and Video Games were common in that era.

On a serious note: I think it was left out originally because lack there of women knights (save that french lass), and non-white knights who did exist, albeit weren't the main focus in medieval Europe. Really this addition is a good thing, and those who complain are merely fear mongering on BF V fantastical dickery.

[Ifreann]

Also there were women and non-white people in Medieval Europe, so this idea that it's "historically inaccurate" to feature them in this sort of vaguely "Medieval Europe"-y setting.

Id be disappointed if women are not in medieval Europe, what do you do on your free time? Movies and Video Games were common in that era.

On a serious note: I think it was left out originally because lack there of women knights (save that french lass), and non-white knights who did exist, albeit weren't the main focus in medieval Europe.

Main focus?

Really this addition is a good thing, and those who complain are merely fear mongering on BF V fantastical dickery.

Don't forget the racists.

[Holy Tedalonia]

Id be disappointed if women are not in medieval Europe, what do you do on your free time? Movies and Video Games were common in that era.

On a serious note: I think it was left out originally because lack there of women knights (save that french lass), and non-white knights who did exist, albeit weren't the main focus in medieval Europe.

Main focus?

Really this addition is a good thing, and those who complain are merely fear mongering on BF V fantastical dickery.

Don't forget the racists.

When I picture medieval Europe I think fights between Europeans vying for control. That and crusades, but crusades tend to be outside of europe.