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Star Wars: Through Power, I Gain Victory

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:06 am
by Bralia
A long time ago, in a place far away from where I live, a man created a story. George Lucas, a man now simultaneously revered and somewhat reviled, created a universe which has stood the test of time and has become a legend. This is his story:

It was about a farm boy named Luke Skywalker. He lived in the frontier fringe of entire galaxy full of people, bustling to the brim with aliens of any and all possible descriptions. This kid was destined for greatness, yet he did not know it. After his parents were killed by the ruling Galactic Empire, he followed a friend and mentor off-planet in an effort to seek out his heritage, a heritage lost to time. Legend had told of a more civilized age, where there were a group of people who stood against tyranny. Their icon was a powerful weapon, known as a lightsaber. Together, Luke and his mentor, Ben Kenobi sought out people who remembered the old ways and challenge the Empire. Along the way to their destination, it was discovered that a weapon of mass destruction had been used against an entire planet of people who sheltered the this Rebel Alliance. United more than ever to challenge the Empire, Luke evaded capture with their newfound traveling companions (who wanted nothing to do with a confrontation) from a powerful warrior of the Empire known as Darth Vader. But it came at a cost. Ben Kenobi sacrificed himself to see them off. With knowledge that had been picked up along the way, Luke Skywalker and his increasingly sizable entourage escaped to a Rebel Alliance base, who then took that knowledge and utterly destroyed the weapon of mass destruction, and crippling Darth Vader.

While I've put this story very simply here, this was a story that captivated everybody's minds everywhere. This was a story that was designed to stand alone. An episode, taking place in the unseen story of an entire galaxy. The world enjoyed the story so much, the praise was overwhelming. George Lucas took this to heart and decided to continue the story of Luke Skywalker, whose role in his galaxy was just beginning. Two episodes later, George Lucas finished Luke's story, to the adoration of many. But . . . the story wasn't complete. Lucas had built episodes 4 -6 and people clamored for the origin story. And so ~20 years later, the prequel trilogy began to come out. Lucas' vision burned many people when he made Episode 1, a movie intended to appeal to a family friendly audience. Lucas continued his work and set out to create a grand epic of a tale. Admittedly at the cost of character credibility, at times, which certainly did not help people who had adored the Original Trilogy. And so spawned the movement of originalists, who wanted more Star Wars and wanted to recreate the atmosphere of the OT. Lucas had given away his empire to Disney, who in turn gave people the opportunity to do exactly that.

The story of Star Wars inspired people over the years to build upon the galaxy that Lucas had created. And while the stories that spawned from this movement weren't a part of Lucas' vision, he gave people license to create their own work. Great works have been created in the name of Star Wars, that many respect today. Grand Admiral Thrawn. Knights of the Old Republic. The Yuuzhan Vong. These may be the grandest and/or most liked of works that have been created, but there are so, so, so many works out there that fill out a galaxy rich with new stories, filling out an entire history of existence. These stories are works of love for Star Wars, the people who create these want to see more Star Wars just like everybody else.


PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:09 am
by The first Galactic Republic
I said it in the old thread and I’ll say it again. It’s a crime to not call this Episode II... or maybe III.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:35 am
by Bralia
The first Galactic Republic wrote:I said it in the old thread and I’ll say it again. It’s a crime to not call this Episode II... or maybe III.

*waves hand*

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:21 am
by Anywhere Else But Here
One more day until I finally see this fucking film. If I don't have strong feelings about it one way or the other, I'm going to be very disappointed

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:22 am
by Liriena
Well hello there!

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:25 am
by Pax Nerdvana
Please don't spoil TLJ. I haven't seen it yet. We were supposed to see it yesterday, but we couldn't get tickets. :(

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:28 am
by Astrolinium
Anywhere Else But Here wrote:One more day until I finally see this fucking film. If I don't have strong feelings about it one way or the other, I'm going to be very disappointed


I know very few people who haven't had strong feelings about it one way or the other. It seems you either adore it or despise it.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:30 am
by Pasong Tirad
Honestly there are a lot of very very valid criticisms about The Last Jedi that should be heard and tackled. What I can't handle is the entitled fanboy griping about the movie being an "SJW-fest" or whatever about the movie being "too political," as though Star Wars wasn't political from the very beginning (at least, if the evidence is to be believed about George Lucas' inspirations).


I'm still split on whether I like TESB or TLJ more, though.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:35 am
by Astrolinium
Pasong Tirad wrote:
Honestly there are a lot of very very valid criticisms about The Last Jedi that should be heard and tackled. What I can't handle is the entitled fanboy griping about the movie being an "SJW-fest" or whatever about the movie being "too political," as though Star Wars wasn't political from the very beginning (at least, if the evidence is to be believed about George Lucas' inspirations).


I'm still split on whether I like TESB or TLJ more, though.


There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:38 am
by Skylus
White lightsaber is best lightsaber FIGHT MOI.

Anyway, my brother and dad saw it on Friday. My dad gave it a B.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:39 am
by Bralia
Astrolinium wrote:
Anywhere Else But Here wrote:One more day until I finally see this fucking film. If I don't have strong feelings about it one way or the other, I'm going to be very disappointed


I know very few people who haven't had strong feelings about it one way or the other. It seems you either adore it or despise it.

Factionalism. It's everywhere these days.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:40 am
by The first Galactic Republic
Astrolinium wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:
Honestly there are a lot of very very valid criticisms about The Last Jedi that should be heard and tackled. What I can't handle is the entitled fanboy griping about the movie being an "SJW-fest" or whatever about the movie being "too political," as though Star Wars wasn't political from the very beginning (at least, if the evidence is to be believed about George Lucas' inspirations).


I'm still split on whether I like TESB or TLJ more, though.


There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

I kind of hated Poe’s plot as it was happening, but it made a lot of sense as it ended. The truth ending up being completely obvious, but I don’t feel like the conflict was forced. Poe is kind of a hot head, so I think it makes sense for him to act the way he did. I don’t understand why Leia didn’t let him in on the plan, but she was incapacitated early on so there wasn’t much time for her to tell him. Given that she was still upset about his earlier behavior, I can see why she wouldn’t feel like telling him right then.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:41 am
by Pasong Tirad
Astrolinium wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:
Honestly there are a lot of very very valid criticisms about The Last Jedi that should be heard and tackled. What I can't handle is the entitled fanboy griping about the movie being an "SJW-fest" or whatever about the movie being "too political," as though Star Wars wasn't political from the very beginning (at least, if the evidence is to be believed about George Lucas' inspirations).


I'm still split on whether I like TESB or TLJ more, though.


There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

My biggest problem right now is how Holdo's sacrifice was framed as heroic, but Finn's attempted sacrifice was framed as unnecessary martyrdom - even though both characters, in my opinion, were essentially performing the same task.

Although, that vacuum-of-space silence after Holdo's light speed jump into the First Order's Fleet was fucking beautiful. The whole cinema was stunned silent except for the usual gasps and "holy shit" reactions. It was just, my God, I don't even know how to put into words how much I loved that part.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:44 am
by The first Galactic Republic
Pasong Tirad wrote:
Astrolinium wrote:
There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

My biggest problem right now is how Holdo's sacrifice was framed as heroic, but Finn's attempted sacrifice was framed as unnecessary martyrdom - even though both characters, in my opinion, were essentially performing the same task.

Although, that vacuum-of-space silence after Holdo's light speed jump into the First Order's Fleet was fucking beautiful. The whole cinema was stunned silent except for the usual gasps and "holy shit" reactions. It was just, my God, I don't even know how to put into words how much I loved that part.

Finn’s wasn’t going to do anything. He couldn’t have blown up that huge cannon.

Also Rose had a point. Finn was trying to kill something he hated. Jurassic Park lady was trying to save the resistance, or in other words she was saving something she loved. Her sacrifice was more necessary. Without it the Star Destroyers could have bombarded the base.

I’m not sure how the small ones were destroyed though. Her ship seems to have physically passed through Snoke’s ship, so I’m not sure why the small ships were also hit.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:45 am
by Astrolinium
The first Galactic Republic wrote:
Astrolinium wrote:
There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

I kind of hated Poe’s plot as it was happening, but it made a lot of sense as it ended. The truth ending up being completely obvious, but I don’t feel like the conflict was forced. Poe is kind of a hot head, so I think it makes sense for him to act the way he did. I don’t understand why Leia didn’t let him in on the plan, but she was incapacitated early on so there wasn’t much time for her to tell him. Given that she was still upset about his earlier behavior, I can see why she wouldn’t feel like telling him right then.

I agree, I just think things could have been fleshed out more. Poe's character work ended up being fairly light compared to Finn's or Rey's, and I feel like I didn't really get to know Holdo very well either.


Pasong Tirad wrote:
Astrolinium wrote:
There were definitely valid criticisms, but I think there was also a huge amount to love, and overall it's a really excellent film. I'd say the weakest point is Poe's plot, I think in large part because it ends up having to be the framing device for nearly everything else, but even so, it produces some truly great content.

My biggest problem right now is how Holdo's sacrifice was framed as heroic, but Finn's attempted sacrifice was framed as unnecessary martyrdom - even though both characters, in my opinion, were essentially performing the same task.

Although, that vacuum-of-space silence after Holdo's light speed jump into the First Order's Fleet was fucking beautiful. The whole cinema was stunned silent except for the usual gasps and "holy shit" reactions. It was just, my God, I don't even know how to put into words how much I loved that part.


That's an issue, definitely. I mostly excuse it because Holdo's sacrifice is so fucking awesome. I also think there is a bit of a difference in that Holdo was going to be staying on the ship to die anyway while the Resistance transports fucked off to Crait, and so the kamikaze lightspeed ram isn't quite the same as Finn's decision to ram the cannon.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:47 am
by Pasong Tirad
The first Galactic Republic wrote:
Pasong Tirad wrote:
My biggest problem right now is how Holdo's sacrifice was framed as heroic, but Finn's attempted sacrifice was framed as unnecessary martyrdom - even though both characters, in my opinion, were essentially performing the same task.

Although, that vacuum-of-space silence after Holdo's light speed jump into the First Order's Fleet was fucking beautiful. The whole cinema was stunned silent except for the usual gasps and "holy shit" reactions. It was just, my God, I don't even know how to put into words how much I loved that part.

Finn’s wasn’t going to do anything. He couldn’t have blown up that huge cannon.

Also Rose had a point. Finn was trying to kill something he hated. Jurassic Park lady was trying to save the resistance, or in other words she was saving something she loved. Her sacrifice was more necessary. Without it the Star Destroyers could have bombarded the base.

I’m not sure how the small ones were destroyed though. Her ship seems to have physically passed through Snoke’s ship, so I’m not sure why the small ship were also hit.

Wow, that actually makes more sense, now that I think about it. Alright, problem solved. I see it now.

Also, if I heard it correctly, the mouth of the cannon was actually its weak spot. If he made it to the mouth in time, I do think he would have been able to blow it up before it shot the gate down.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:49 am
by The first Galactic Republic
Pasong Tirad wrote:
The first Galactic Republic wrote:
Finn’s wasn’t going to do anything. He couldn’t have blown up that huge cannon.

Also Rose had a point. Finn was trying to kill something he hated. Jurassic Park lady was trying to save the resistance, or in other words she was saving something she loved. Her sacrifice was more necessary. Without it the Star Destroyers could have bombarded the base.

I’m not sure how the small ones were destroyed though. Her ship seems to have physically passed through Snoke’s ship, so I’m not sure why the small ship were also hit.

Wow, that actually makes more sense, now that I think about it. Alright, problem solved. I see it now.

Also, if I heard it correctly, the mouth of the cannon was actually its weak spot. If he made it to the mouth in time, I do think he would have been able to blow it up before it shot the gate down.

Even mini Death Stars have weak points. Lol.

As much as the writers were trying to deconstruct Star Wars with this movie, I honestly wonder if they put that in there as a joke. Apparently everything the bad guys build has a weak point. Considering that the cannon isn’t destroyed and the weak point doesn’t become a plot point, it honestly seems like they’re poking fun at Star Wars superweapons with that.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:50 am
by Astrolinium
Pasong Tirad wrote:
The first Galactic Republic wrote:
Finn’s wasn’t going to do anything. He couldn’t have blown up that huge cannon.

Also Rose had a point. Finn was trying to kill something he hated. Jurassic Park lady was trying to save the resistance, or in other words she was saving something she loved. Her sacrifice was more necessary. Without it the Star Destroyers could have bombarded the base.

I’m not sure how the small ones were destroyed though. Her ship seems to have physically passed through Snoke’s ship, so I’m not sure why the small ship were also hit.

Wow, that actually makes more sense, now that I think about it. Alright, problem solved. I see it now.

Also, if I heard it correctly, the mouth of the cannon was actually its weak spot. If he made it to the mouth in time, I do think he would have been able to blow it up before it shot the gate down.


I think the point was to introduce a large, foreign object into the mouth -- say, a ski speeder -- and so both damage the machine internally and also probably cause some sort of energy backup/overheating that would have blown it up. I imagine it would have worked, but it was also stupid. If Rose hadn't stopped him, sure, the base wouldn't have been breached, but the First Order would likely still have lain siege to it and the Resistance would have still been just as stuck as ever.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:17 pm
by Ism

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:17 pm
by The Huskar Social Union

Chiss are hotter.

*looks at Old Republic female Chiss*

God damn.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:20 pm
by The Huskar Social Union
Freedom Caucus wrote:The Last Jedi was a steaming pile of shit.

Just came back from seeing it, disagree quite strongly, but to each their own.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:31 pm
by The Huskar Social Union
Freedom Caucus wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Just came back from seeing it, disagree quite strongly, but to each their own.

It's all about modern politics. I cannot stand it. I want a Star Wars movie without "le social commentary xdd"

Personally think that is overblown as fuck but okay

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:32 pm
by Astrolinium
Freedom Caucus wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Just came back from seeing it, disagree quite strongly, but to each their own.

It's all about modern politics. I cannot stand it. I want a Star Wars movie without "le social commentary xdd"


Star Wars has always been political, it just happens that somehow we have fallen so far that "Nazis and Nazi imitators are bad, even in space" is now a controversial statement.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:34 pm
by The first Galactic Republic
Freedom Caucus wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Just came back from seeing it, disagree quite strongly, but to each their own.

It's all about modern politics. I cannot stand it. I want a Star Wars movie without "le social commentary xdd"

It’s just the old OT story again. Just with new takes on the characters and force.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:35 pm
by Ism
The Huskar Social Union wrote:

Chiss are hotter.

*looks at Old Republic female Chiss*

God damn.


Eh, Twi'lek dancers seemed more appropriate, given the original quote.

Freedom Caucus wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Just came back from seeing it, disagree quite strongly, but to each their own.

It's all about modern politics. I cannot stand it. I want a Star Wars movie without "le social commentary xdd"


There was social commentary in every Trilogy. Perhaps TLJ is more blunt about it, I haven't seen it so I can't comment on that, but social commentary is nothing new for Star Wars.