God of the New World?

[The Two Jerseys]

Because power corrupts.

It depends on the person.

Sounds like an assumption.

And since we can't prove that someone won't be corrupted by power until they actually have power, then it's best not to risk giving them absolute power in the first place.

[Gauthier]

It depends on the person.

Sounds like an assumption.

And since we can't prove that someone won't be corrupted by power until they actually have power, then it's best not to risk giving them absolute power in the first place.

Anyone truly responsible enough to wield power would go out of their way to avoid having it in the first place.

[Dakini]

"Kira" is usually a woman's name...

It's the phonetization of "killer".

Oh Jesus. Japan seriously needs to stop katakana-izing things like that.

Also, seriously, "Kira" is still a woman's name. "キラ" might not be because nobody would name their child that (even in Japan, where this is a given name and a family name that romanizes the same way, they use kanji for that).

edit: And now that the thread has been moved to the appropriate folder, I don't have any objections.

[Deanson]

Let us discuss the following hypothetical.

Death Note is real. The notebook of death is real. If you write someone's name in the notebook, they will die of a heart attack (or in any other way specified by the writer). A student calling himself "Kira" has this notebook; he is using this notebook to execute violent criminals on a daily basis. Years have passed and many criminals have died. The police are trying to catch him. "Kira" has gained a cult following and many see him as a god of justice in the new world. Ever since Kira's activities have begun, wars have stopped and crime has gone down by over 70 percent.

The world has become divided between those voices that support Kira (some seeing him as a god of justice who has created a safer world and will eradicate crime) and those who oppose him, believing he is a threat to the rule of law and democracy.

In such a world, politically, would you support or oppose Kira?

Please explain.

The results speak for themselves (crime has gone down) so clearly, its working. And since God himself seems to have no problems with a world where violent crimes exist, I am perfectly okay with replacing him with a new god. I would have no problem declaring Kira the god of the new world.

He would be too powerful and not trustworthy enough, stopping him would be optimal.

That said, I would have no overall moral issue with what he has actually done and in fact would think he's been a great influence so far considering how much he has helped, objectively speaking. The question of how much we can trust him would be too big a deal though.

[Genivaria]

Because power corrupts.

It depends on the person.

Sounds like an assumption.

It really isn't, you're just being naive.

[Infected Mushroom]

And since we can't prove that someone won't be corrupted by power until they actually have power, then it's best not to risk giving them absolute power in the first place.

Anyone truly responsible enough to wield power would go out of their way to avoid having it in the first place.

And leave this world in its rotten state? How's that responsible?

It's like Kira said.

"When I found that note book all those years ago I knew that I HAD TO DO IT. I understood that killing people was a crime. ... BUT THERE WAS NO OTHER WAY THE WORLD HAD TO BE FIXED! A PURPOSE GIVEN TO ME! ... Only I could do it. WHO ELSE COULD HAVE DONE IT? AND COME THIS FAR? WOULD THEY HAVE KEPT GOING?!... The only one who can create a new world, is me."

It doesn't get any simpler.

[Infected Mushroom]

It depends on the person.

Sounds like an assumption.

It really isn't, you're just being naive.

I've found that this is mostly a platitude. The person is the same whether or not he has the power. Its just that they can act more openly without fear of retaliation. Power "corrupts" suggests that it changes people's inherent states. While really, its more that lack of power creates inhibitions.

[Gauthier]

Anyone truly responsible enough to wield power would go out of their way to avoid having it in the first place.

And leave this world in its rotten state? How's that responsible?

It's like Kira said.

"When I found that note book all those years ago I knew that I HAD TO DO IT. I understood that killing people was a crime. ... BUT THERE WAS NO OTHER WAY THE WORLD HAD TO BE FIXED! A PURPOSE GIVEN TO ME! ... Only I could do it. WHO ELSE COULD HAVE DONE IT? AND COME THIS FAR? WOULD THEY HAVE KEPT GOING?!... The only one who can create a new world, is me."

It doesn't get any simpler.

Self rationalization.

[The Two Jerseys]

Anyone truly responsible enough to wield power would go out of their way to avoid having it in the first place.

And leave this world in its rotten state? How's that responsible?

It's like Kira said.

"When I found that note book all those years ago I knew that I HAD TO DO IT. I understood that killing people was a crime. ... BUT THERE WAS NO OTHER WAY THE WORLD HAD TO BE FIXED! A PURPOSE GIVEN TO ME! ... Only I could do it. WHO ELSE COULD HAVE DONE IT? AND COME THIS FAR? WOULD THEY HAVE KEPT GOING?!... The only one who can create a new world, is me."

It doesn't get any simpler.

And for every George Washington or Cincinnatus, we have dozens of Napoleons, Hitlers, Stalins, and various other tin-pots...

[Infected Mushroom]

And leave this world in its rotten state? How's that responsible?

It's like Kira said.

"When I found that note book all those years ago I knew that I HAD TO DO IT. I understood that killing people was a crime. ... BUT THERE WAS NO OTHER WAY THE WORLD HAD TO BE FIXED! A PURPOSE GIVEN TO ME! ... Only I could do it. WHO ELSE COULD HAVE DONE IT? AND COME THIS FAR? WOULD THEY HAVE KEPT GOING?!... The only one who can create a new world, is me."

It doesn't get any simpler.

And for every George Washington or Cincinnatus, we have dozens of Napoleons, Hitlers, Stalins, and various other tin-pots...

but the fact that we have George Washingtons debunk the whole notion that power by definition corrupts

[Gauthier]

And for every George Washington or Cincinnatus, we have dozens of Napoleons, Hitlers, Stalins, and various other tin-pots...

but the fact that we have George Washingtons debunk the whole notion that power by definition corrupts

Have you looked at the ratio?

[Infected Mushroom]

but the fact that we have George Washingtons debunk the whole notion that power by definition corrupts

Have you looked at the ratio?

there is no "ratio"

"Power corrupts" is simply too simplistic a notion of what power does.

[Gauthier]

Have you looked at the ratio?

there is no "ratio"

"Power corrupts" is simply too simplistic a notion of what power does.

How many dictators were there compared to how many closer to Washington?

[Infected Mushroom]

there is no "ratio"

"Power corrupts" is simply too simplistic a notion of what power does.

How many dictators were there compared to how many closer to Washington?

the vast majority of kings throughout history were closer to Washington than Stalin

monarchy has been the default government for centuries and most of it quite uneventful

[The Two Jerseys]

And for every George Washington or Cincinnatus, we have dozens of Napoleons, Hitlers, Stalins, and various other tin-pots...

but the fact that we have George Washingtons debunk the whole notion that power by definition corrupts

A couple people surviving doesn't debunk the notion that jumping out of an airplane without a parachute will kill you.

[The Two Jerseys]

How many dictators were there compared to how many closer to Washington?

the vast majority of kings throughout history were closer to Washington than Stalin

monarchy has been the default government for centuries and most of it quite uneventful

Yeah, I really think you need to brush up on your history...

[Genivaria]

the vast majority of kings throughout history were closer to Washington than Stalin

monarchy has been the default government for centuries and most of it quite uneventful

Yeah, I really think you need to brush up on your history...

Along with everything else.

[Infected Mushroom]

the vast majority of kings throughout history were closer to Washington than Stalin

monarchy has been the default government for centuries and most of it quite uneventful

Yeah, I really think you need to brush up on your history...

Nope. I'm quite the expert already.

[Infected Mushroom]

It depends on the person.

Sounds like an assumption.

And since we can't prove that someone won't be corrupted by power until they actually have power, then it's best not to risk giving them absolute power in the first place.

I'm not sure where this is connected to the thread.

Does Kira have absolute power in this hypothetical situation? Where did I say he did?

[The Two Jerseys]

Yeah, I really think you need to brush up on your history...

Nope. I'm quite the expert already.

Yeah, I'm just gonna preserve this for when you start whining to the mods about "personal attacks"...

[Genivaria]

Yeah, I really think you need to brush up on your history...

Nope. I'm quite the expert already.

Yes I know you have a high opinion of yourself.

[The Two Jerseys]

And since we can't prove that someone won't be corrupted by power until they actually have power, then it's best not to risk giving them absolute power in the first place.

I'm not sure where this is connected to the thread.

Does Kira have absolute power in this hypothetical situation? Where did I say he did?

They write someone's name in a book, that person dies.

I don't know how much more absolute their power can get...

[Infected Mushroom]

Let us discuss the following hypothetical.

Death Note is real. The notebook of death is real. If you write someone's name in the notebook, they will die of a heart attack (or in any other way specified by the writer). A student calling himself "Kira" has this notebook; he is using this notebook to execute violent criminals on a daily basis. Years have passed and many criminals have died. The police are trying to catch him. "Kira" has gained a cult following and many see him as a god of justice in the new world. Ever since Kira's activities have begun, wars have stopped and crime has gone down by over 70 percent.

The world has become divided between those voices that support Kira (some seeing him as a god of justice who has created a safer world and will eradicate crime) and those who oppose him, believing he is a threat to the rule of law and democracy.

In such a world, politically, would you support or oppose Kira?

Please explain.

The results speak for themselves (crime has gone down) so clearly, its working. And since God himself seems to have no problems with a world where violent crimes exist, I am perfectly okay with replacing him with a new god. I would have no problem declaring Kira the god of the new world.

He would be too powerful and not trustworthy enough, stopping him would be optimal.

That said, I would have no overall moral issue with what he has actually done and in fact would think he's been a great influence so far considering how much he has helped, objectively speaking. The question of how much we can trust him would be too big a deal though.

why wouldn't you trust him?

[The Great Devourer of All]

>Inb4 his cultists find out it's literally impossible for any notebook to hold more than a few thousand names

Just let him have his fun until he runs out of space, then assassinate him before another magical notebook falls into his hands. I'd also support the UN making an international, highly militarized police force dedicated to finding and destroying any other notebooks, if they exist. The post-notebook cultists would be treated like any other religious group, that is, they would be allowed to do whatever they want so long as they don't break any laws.

[Infected Mushroom]

>Inb4 his cultists find out it's literally impossible for any notebook to hold more than a few thousand names

Just let him have his fun until he runs out of space, then assassinate him before another magical notebook falls into his hands. I'd also support the UN making an international, highly militarized police force dedicated to finding and destroying any other notebooks, if they exist. The post-notebook cultists would be treated like any other religious group, that is, they would be allowed to do whatever they want so long as they don't break any laws.

I believe somewhere in the anime it said that the pages never run out

can't be sure though, its been a while since I read it