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The (Regenerated) Doctor Who Thread: Reverse the Polarity!

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Postby Ameriganastan » Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:55 pm

Alvecia wrote:
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C'mon Huskar, you know Ameri doesn't actually like things

I like plenty of things.
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Postby Tokuopolis » Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:44 am

I'm looking forward to Fugitive of the Judoon, but I do have a question:aren't the Judoon not allowed to land on earth (on purpose, anyway)? How are they going to explain that?
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New yugoslavaia
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Postby New yugoslavaia » Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:57 am

Tokuopolis wrote:I'm looking forward to Fugitive of the Judoon, but I do have a question:aren't the Judoon not allowed to land on earth (on purpose, anyway)? How are they going to explain that?


They won't.
Yugoslavia's back baby...

How the hell did this happen?
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Postby Earthbound Immortal Squad » Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:14 pm

Tokuopolis wrote:I'm looking forward to Fugitive of the Judoon, but I do have a question:aren't the Judoon not allowed to land on earth (on purpose, anyway)? How are they going to explain that?


Earthbound Immortal Squad wrote:Liked this episode, but I'm thinking about the next episode and a few potential plot holes. If these Judoon are part of the Shadow Proclamation I thought Earth was only a class 5 planet so they couldn't conduct operations directly. Hence they took the hospital in the moon in "Smith and Jones". I recall a Judoon being on Earth during a Sarah Jane Adventures episode but that one was forced to crash land if I recall correctly. So either these are not S.P Judoon, Earth is now higher than class 5 which would be about time, the person they are tracking is so dangerous that direct intervention is necessary. Any thoughts?


My personal theories.
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Tokuopolis
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Postby Tokuopolis » Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:09 am

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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:00 pm

This was an OK story brought down by
the bizarre and distracting waste of Captain Jack to just have him tease a future adventure. The other Doctor reveal was enough (Although it kind of fell apart at that point), they didn't need that arsing about.
Last edited by Philjia on Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Earthbound Immortal Squad » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:04 pm

That episode was weird. I felt it should have been split into two parts.
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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:05 pm

Earthbound Immortal Squad wrote:That episode was weird. I felt it should have been split into two parts.

I mean that describes basically every story in New Who, but it was more obvious here.
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Earthbound Immortal Squad
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Postby Earthbound Immortal Squad » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:06 pm

Philjia wrote:
Earthbound Immortal Squad wrote:That episode was weird. I felt it should have been split into two parts.

I mean that describes basically every story in New Who, but it was more obvious here.


On the plus side I couldn't see any heavy political message here.
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New yugoslavaia
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Postby New yugoslavaia » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:08 pm

Well, that was quite the unexpected mindf**K

That whole plot significant time lord technology being hidden in a grave bit is making me think of a certain seventh doctor story...
Yugoslavia's back baby...

How the hell did this happen?
Well...we don't actually know. Sure, there's factbooks and stuff, but they don't really matter because the owner of this account is a lazy, unproductive, indecisive loser who may or may not have a thing for half human hybrids, big mechs and even bigger ships.
Is it a reunited Yugoslavia in the 21st century? Is a rebel colony world in the far future? Who knows, who cares?
New Yugoslavia just is.

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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:16 pm

I can imagine giant comedy pound signs lighting up in Nick Briggs's eyes the moment that reveal happened.
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Postby Stiltball » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:16 pm

Philjia wrote:I think Chibnall's improving. Slowly.



and then all of a sudden it's all our Christmases at once with the best episode for a long time. A case of Who's who and Capt Jack. Could do with watching it again as it was a full episode - and no pop up historical figures- breath of relief until proven wrong.

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The Archregimancy
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Postby The Archregimancy » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:20 pm

I've been watching Doctor Who since the Pertwee era*, and....

I really rather enjoyed that.



*It's not unlikely that my parents propped me up in my cot when Troughton was the Doctor, but I wouldn't remember that.

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Tokuopolis
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Postby Tokuopolis » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:34 pm

A really fun and weird episode

Time Lord Twist was good

Captain Jack's return was a treat
Last edited by Tokuopolis on Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:41 pm

If this plotline gets resolved with
an alternate universe, I'll be pleased, because alternate universe Doctors are cool, which is why I have one in my flag. If it's actually meant to be part of some "unseen" part of the original Doctor's lifecycle, fuck that. It wasn't good when Moffat did it and it wouldn't be good again.
High wire fencing on the playground / High rise housing all around / High rise prices on the high street / High time to pull it all down
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Dwarf Land4
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Postby Dwarf Land4 » Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:53 pm

That was very, very enjoyable.
I mean, I was hyperventilating when Jack was back. And I love the Cybermen, so this'll be fun.
All we need are Weeping Angels, Pyroviles or Midnight and we'll be great
Last edited by The Archregimancy on Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Archregimancy
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Postby The Archregimancy » Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:07 pm

Dwarf Land4 wrote:That was very, very enjoyable.
I mean, I was hyperventilating when Jack was back. And I love the Cybermen, so this'll be fun.
All we need are Weeping Angels, Pyroviles or Midnight and we'll be great


I took the liberty of abusing my mod powers to spoiler the, well, spoilers in your post.

Remember not everyone watches it immediately.

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Eastfield Lodge
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Postby Eastfield Lodge » Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:54 pm

Very interesting episode, but oh my god it feld so rushed.
Philjia wrote:If this plotline gets resolved with
an alternate universe, I'll be pleased, because alternate universe Doctors are cool, which is why I have one in my flag. If it's actually meant to be part of some "unseen" part of the original Doctor's lifecycle, fuck that. It wasn't good when Moffat did it and it wouldn't be good again.

Eh, Moffat barely touched it tbh. I said it before, but I wouldn't be surprised if Chibnall's planning to explore the Cartmel Masterplan in some way. If it is a past regeneration, must mean the Doctor has had an entire regen cycle before Hartnell, or otherwise stolen regens from Gallifray as part of it.
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Postby Kannap » Sun Jan 26, 2020 7:24 pm

OH MY GOD THAT WAS AMAZING

Hands down the best episode we've had in a long time - Hell, maybe the best episode we've had since the Matt Smith era. Definitely in love

And oh my god, Captain Jack. My heart, my soul!


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The Archregimancy
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Postby The Archregimancy » Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:04 am

Eastfield Lodge wrote:Very interesting episode, but oh my god it feld so rushed.
Philjia wrote:If this plotline gets resolved with
an alternate universe, I'll be pleased, because alternate universe Doctors are cool, which is why I have one in my flag. If it's actually meant to be part of some "unseen" part of the original Doctor's lifecycle, fuck that. It wasn't good when Moffat did it and it wouldn't be good again.

Eh, Moffat barely touched it tbh. I said it before, but I wouldn't be surprised if Chibnall's planning to explore the Cartmel Masterplan in some way. If it is a past regeneration, must mean the Doctor has had an entire regen cycle before Hartnell, or otherwise stolen regens from Gallifray as part of it.


Chibnall doesn't necessarily need the
Cartmel Masterplan;
he simply needs to follow through with certain things than were strongly implied in The Brain of Morbius (and which Hinchcliffe openly admitted he was trying to imply) - though these seem to have been strongly contradicted by the First Doctor as recently as Twice Upon a Time.

That said....

The interior of the buried Tardis was clearly meant to strongly imply an earlier incarnation, but I think alternative universes / timelines are more likely, perhaps following through on Orphan 55's apparently throwaway line about potential futures - roundly derided at the time as breaking Who canon on timelines, but potentially now taking on more significance. It would make more sense, and would require less hand-waving to explain away existing canon. So the new incarnation of the Doctor is likely an early regeneration from an alternative universe/timeline.


But what do I know? I'm almost always wrong about this sort of thing.


Edit:

But have just thought of something that might indicate those of us thinking along these lines are right:

Dr Ruth's Tardis also takes the form of a police box. The Tardis only became stuck in that form at the very beginning of the First Doctor's term - as explicitly established in the second episode of the very first serial, when Susan expresses surprise that 'It's still a police box! Why hasn't it changed?' And when the First Doctor is shown 'borrowing' his Tardis in The Name of the Doctor, it's in its uncamouflaged plain cylinder form.

So if the Tardis is stuck as a 1960s London police box, then Dr Ruth has to date after the First Doctor - making alternative realities/timestreams far more likely as an explanation. Either that, or Dr Ruth is the First Doctor in her reality; but then we're still talking about alternative realities/timestreams.
Last edited by The Archregimancy on Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:22 am, edited 2 times in total.

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The Huskar Social Union
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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Mon Jan 27, 2020 8:49 am

I quite liked that episode, it was a decent enough fun episode.

The reveal of another Doctor was a bit of a mindfuck, didnt see that coming. I wonder if it will be an alternate universe like others have said, or a hidden regeneration. Or maybe its not actually the Doctor and its another timelord who is up to something.

I thought Jack was weird, like... he didnt really factor into the episode at all but i liked him being back, he is always fun to have around. Hope he shows up again in another episode, if this was all that would be a waste.

Also bring on the Cybermen, always enjoy a good cybermen story, they are fun.
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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Mon Jan 27, 2020 9:37 am

The Archregimancy wrote:But have just thought of something that might indicate those of us thinking along these lines are right:

Dr Ruth's Tardis also takes the form of a police box. The Tardis only became stuck in that form at the very beginning of the First Doctor's term - as explicitly established in the second episode of the very first serial, when Susan expresses surprise that 'It's still a police box! Why hasn't it changed?' And when the First Doctor is shown 'borrowing' his Tardis in The Name of the Doctor, it's in its uncamouflaged plain cylinder form.

So if the Tardis is stuck as a 1960s London police box, then Dr Ruth has to date after the First Doctor - making alternative realities/timestreams far more likely as an explanation. Either that, or Dr Ruth is the First Doctor in her reality; but then we're still talking about alternative realities/timestreams.

Season 6B theory, developed to reconcile how The Two Doctors fits into continuity, says that there's unseen adventures between the events of The Wargames and Spearhead from Space where the Doctor operated as a Celestial Intervention Agency agent, but as the Second Doctor used a sonic screwdriver it seems unlikely that Ruth could be a Doctor after him, and Season 6B would need to have been very long for the regeneration cycles to match up. The only other Doctor who did not explicitly regenerate into his next incarnation on screen is the Time War Doctor.
Last edited by Philjia on Mon Jan 27, 2020 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
High wire fencing on the playground / High rise housing all around / High rise prices on the high street / High time to pull it all down
⚧ Gender and sex aren't the same thing. ⚧
Pragmatic utopian socialist, IE I'm for whatever kind of socialism is the most moral and practical. Pro LGBT rights and gay marriage, pro gay adoption, generally internationalist, ambivalent on the EU, atheist, pro free speech and expression, pro legalisation of prostitution and soft drugs, and pro choice. Anti authoritarian, anti bigotry, anti radfem. White cishet male.

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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Mon Jan 27, 2020 6:24 pm

Image
Aight looks like continuity's completely fucked boys.

Also, parallel Doctors are valid Chibnall, you wanker.
Last edited by Philjia on Mon Jan 27, 2020 6:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
High wire fencing on the playground / High rise housing all around / High rise prices on the high street / High time to pull it all down
⚧ Gender and sex aren't the same thing. ⚧
Pragmatic utopian socialist, IE I'm for whatever kind of socialism is the most moral and practical. Pro LGBT rights and gay marriage, pro gay adoption, generally internationalist, ambivalent on the EU, atheist, pro free speech and expression, pro legalisation of prostitution and soft drugs, and pro choice. Anti authoritarian, anti bigotry, anti radfem. White cishet male.

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New yugoslavaia
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Postby New yugoslavaia » Tue Jan 28, 2020 12:45 am

Philjia wrote:
(Image)
Aight looks like continuity's completely fucked boys.

Also, parallel Doctors are valid Chibnall, you wanker.


Chibnall: Valid screenwriting? Pfft, what's that?
Yugoslavia's back baby...

How the hell did this happen?
Well...we don't actually know. Sure, there's factbooks and stuff, but they don't really matter because the owner of this account is a lazy, unproductive, indecisive loser who may or may not have a thing for half human hybrids, big mechs and even bigger ships.
Is it a reunited Yugoslavia in the 21st century? Is a rebel colony world in the far future? Who knows, who cares?
New Yugoslavia just is.

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The Archregimancy
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Postby The Archregimancy » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:01 am

Philjia wrote:
(Image)
Aight looks like continuity's completely fucked boys.

Also, parallel Doctors are valid Chibnall, you wanker.


Showrunners, like the Doctor, lie; or at least mislead. It's in their interest to do so. Otherwise we wouldn't be having these conversations.


Philjia wrote:
Season 6B theory, developed to reconcile how The Two Doctors fits into continuity, says that there's unseen adventures between the events of The Wargames and Spearhead from Space where the Doctor operated as a Celestial Intervention Agency agent, but as the Second Doctor used a sonic screwdriver it seems unlikely that Ruth could be a Doctor after him, and Season 6B would need to have been very long for the regeneration cycles to match up. The only other Doctor who did not explicitly regenerate into his next incarnation on screen is the Time War Doctor.


So we know Dr Ruth can't predate Hartnell because the TARDIS is stuck as a police box. We know she can't come between Troughton and Pertwee because she doesn't recognise the sonic screwdriver - which seems like an obvious Chekov's gun; why raise it otherwise? For what it's worth, I disagree over the War Doctor - there's a millisecond of Eccleston's face showing that he regenerates into the 9th Doctor - but I don't think that's relevant anyway; Dr Ruth is clearly wanted on Gallifrey, which at that point everyone believed had been destroyed, and was trapped in a pocket universe. So there wouldn't have been Gallifreyan police running around the rest of the universe at that point.

I still think that alternative universes and/or timestreams are the most likely explanation, not least because both Spyfall and Orphan 55 have heavily introduced these as plot points, and that Chibnall is engaging in some misdirection.

And what's to say that the 13th Doctor is in the correct reality? Perhaps she didn't make it into the correct reality in Spyfall, and she's the alternative reality interloper, and Dr Ruth is the real Doctor in this reality. I don't actually believe that's the direction we'll take, but it shows how this sort of issue can be resolved via semantic hair-splitting.

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