Dragon Ball Discussion Thread - WAIFU WARS: THE DBZ FRONT

[Narintia]

So, what are y'all favourite techniques/transformations/attacks/whatever?

Technique wise:

1.) Death Impact
2.) Salza Blade
3.) Masenko

Transformation:

1.) Ultra Super Saiyan
2.) Super Saiyan III
3.) Super Saiyan Rosé

You're doing it wrong
Techniques:
1.) Aura Slide
2.) God Split Cut
3.) Violent Fierce God Slicer

Transformation:
1.) Super Saiyan Rosé
2.) ummmmmmmmm

[Gurori]

A Meme rises from the grave... And it's perfect.

[New Rnclave]

Technique wise:

1.) Death Impact
2.) Salza Blade
3.) Masenko

Transformation:

1.) Ultra Super Saiyan
2.) Super Saiyan III
3.) Super Saiyan Rosé

You're doing it wrong
Techniques:
1.) Aura Slide
2.) God Split Cut
3.) Violent Fierce God Slicer

Transformation:
1.) Super Saiyan Rosé
2.) ummmmmmmmm

Tbh Super Saiyan Rosé isn't really that cool beyond its color and the whole being a mutation of Blue thing

[Gurori]

You're doing it wrong
Techniques:
1.) Aura Slide
2.) God Split Cut
3.) Violent Fierce God Slicer

Transformation:
1.) Super Saiyan Rosé
2.) ummmmmmmmm

Tbh Super Saiyan Rosé isn't really that cool beyond its color and the whole being a mutation of Blue thing

Sure it looks cool, but it's concept (being exclusive to Black) makes it seem like one of those cancerous "Original Forms"

insert vietnam-esque flashbacks of super saiyan 10,000 here

[New Rnclave]

Tbh Super Saiyan Rosé isn't really that cool beyond its color and the whole being a mutation of Blue thing

Sure it looks cool, but it's concept (being exclusive to Black) makes it seem like one of those cancerous "Original Forms"

insert vietnam-esque flashbacks of super saiyan 10,000 here

...No? It really doesn't.

It's exclusive to Black because it's like I said, a mutation of Super Saiyan Blue, it's nothing near those forms.

[Gurori]

Sure it looks cool, but it's concept (being exclusive to Black) makes it seem like one of those cancerous "Original Forms"

insert vietnam-esque flashbacks of super saiyan 10,000 here

...No? It really doesn't.

It's exclusive to Black because it's like I said, a mutation of Super Saiyan Blue, it's nothing near those forms.

The fact that like Blue, is almost just a recolour of the original Super Saiyan form makes it seem like a fan-created form in that exact sense is what I meant.

On the subject of "fan made forms", I'd like to see who can find the most disgusting abomination of "originality".

[Britanania]

...No? It really doesn't.

It's exclusive to Black because it's like I said, a mutation of Super Saiyan Blue, it's nothing near those forms.

The fact that like Blue, is almost just a recolour of the original Super Saiyan form makes it seem like a fan-created form in that exact sense is what I meant.

On the subject of "fan made forms", I'd like to see who can find the most disgusting abomination of "originality".

Super in general seems like a bad fan fic from my perspective.

[New Rnclave]

The fact that like Blue, is almost just a recolour of the original Super Saiyan form makes it seem like a fan-created form in that exact sense is what I meant.

On the subject of "fan made forms", I'd like to see who can find the most disgusting abomination of "originality".

Super in general seems like a bad fan fic from my perspective.

I still think the Zamasu arc is one of the better stories in the DB universe, but besides that, you aren't wrong.

Power scaling is God awful, Goku acts like a mentally handicapped child 99% of the time, completely throwing out his more mature personality from Cell and Buu, and canon is thrown away right and left because Toei forgets about it or doesn't care.

[Britanania]

Super in general seems like a bad fan fic from my perspective.

I still think the Zamasu arc is one of the better stories in the DB universe, but besides that, you aren't wrong.

Power scaling is God awful, Goku acts like a mentally handicapped child 99% of the time, completely throwing out his more mature personality from Cell and Buu, and canon is thrown away right and left because Toei forgets about it or doesn't care.

Yeah I'm glad I don't watch it. The more I hear about the current arc, the more done I am with DBS

[New Rnclave]

I still think the Zamasu arc is one of the better stories in the DB universe, but besides that, you aren't wrong.

Power scaling is God awful, Goku acts like a mentally handicapped child 99% of the time, completely throwing out his more mature personality from Cell and Buu, and canon is thrown away right and left because Toei forgets about it or doesn't care.

Yeah I'm glad I don't watch it. The more I hear about the current arc, the more done I am with DBS

Well firstly, Krillen and 17 are even with Super Saiyan Blue Goku, while Gohan is even with SSjB Kaio-Ken Goku.

Oh, and Master Roshi is about on par with Goku's base form

[Finland SSR]

Y'all gopniks better not be hating on Su-

fuck.

If I wanted to see Super hate I'd go to Youtube comments. So I don't go to Youtube comments.

[Reploid Productions]

Power scaling is God awful, Goku acts like a mentally handicapped child 99% of the time, completely throwing out his more mature personality from Cell and Buu, and canon is thrown away right and left because Toei forgets about it or doesn't care.

To be fair, calling him "mature" in the later arcs of Z is being a tad... generous. Going from interviews Masako's quoted in his DB discussion videos, Toriyama never really intended Goku to be a pure heroic type, and now that he's a big enough deal he can kinda tell his editors to stuff it, it seems like in Super he's getting to have Goku be more what he was originally intended to be- a guy who just likes to fight strong opponents who is marginally on the side of good, but will often make stupid judgment calls in favor of getting a good fight. (Granted, some of his antics like forgetting to bring important items was still.... a tad much.)

As for the power scaling, the fact that SSJB seems to be in recent episodes less-than-impressive has a pretty reasonable explanation. Sure, in a straight up, no-holds-barred, no-limits battle, SSJB Goku could no doubt trounce any of the opponents who appeared in those recent episodes to actually be close to or an actual match.

These fights are not straight up, no-holds-barred, no-limits battles. These aren't desperate battles to the death, there are restrictions and limitations forcing Goku to fight in a manner he is not necessarily accustomed to, or at least hasn't been for a very long time. Plus, with the exception of that last match with Gohan, do you really think he was fighting super-seriously with any of his opponents? Doubtful, since beating the shit out of his teammates wouldn't be productive in the slightest. Even when he was using SSJB in those fights, I rather doubt he was fighting anywhere close to his full power even in that form. And even against Gohan, it was Gohan that insisted he get serious- up until Goku busted out the Kaioken Blue combo, I don't think he was fighting seriously at all because he just did not grasp what Gohan was after. And as we saw, Gohan despite his recent levels in badass still got his ass handed to him by Goku actually going at full power.

I kinda think that's part of why the big battle of the Tournament of Power has been set up the way it is. Basically, the power scaling is making it increasingly difficult to create actual tension precisely because Goku's strength at this point is so absurdly over the top. But by introducing these limitations, they've managed to create adequately high stakes with the whole "losers universes go boom" thing, while at the same time providing a way to sidestep the power scaling issue to make for a good fight. No killing in the tournament- well, right there he has to hold back his full strength to a degree because his power at this point is so great that he could very easily accidentally kill someone. Ring-outs are a thing- this means especially cunning or clever opponents can beat him by outwitting or outmaneuvering him. TEAMWORK- when was Goku last actually fighting in anything close to a truly coordinated manner against one or more opponents? Teamwork is most definitely NOT his strong suit, the vast majority of his fights especially in the past at least ten years of his life have been one-on-one or one-on-two, small melees at best. Basically, he is not good at being a team player.

tl;dr version: Does Super have flaws? Good gods yes. But so did Z before it. If I could love Z despite its flaws, I think I can love Super despite its flaws, too.

[Finland SSR]

tl;dr version: Does Super have flaws? Good gods yes. But so did Z before it.

This shit. This shit is important. We should frame it above this thread.

In my opinion, Z was not just merely flawed - it was really flawed. And it feels hypocritical to me when people easily criticize Super's flaws and yet love Z as it is.

Well firstly, Krillen and 17 are even with Super Saiyan Blue Goku, while Gohan is even with SSjB Kaio-Ken Goku.

Oh, and Master Roshi is about on par with Goku's base form

Those are not problems with Super, those are problems with the mindset that Z created in the brains of many fans. They've become Frieza Soldiers - as in, they see characters in the show as numbers, rather than people, and flip their shit when one of them has a number that they disagree with.

[New Rnclave]

tl;dr version: Does Super have flaws? Good gods yes. But so did Z before it.

This shit. This shit is important. We should frame it above this thread.

In my opinion, Z was not just merely flawed - it was really flawed. And it feels hypocritical to me when people easily criticize Super's flaws and yet love Z as it is.

Well firstly, Krillen and 17 are even with Super Saiyan Blue Goku, while Gohan is even with SSjB Kaio-Ken Goku.

Oh, and Master Roshi is about on par with Goku's base form

Those are not problems with Super, those are problems with the mindset that Z created in the brains of many fans. They've become Frieza Soldiers - as in, they see characters in the show as numbers, rather than people, and flip their shit when one of them has a number that they disagree with.

I flip my shit when a character who has no reasonable explanation for being that strong is that strong. Back in Z, Super Saiyan III level of power was an unattainable level for anyone who wasn't Goku or a villain.

But now we have characters who trounce that, yet the only explanation is "secret training"

[Finland SSR]

Back in Z, Super Saiyan III level of power was an unattainable level for anyone who wasn't Goku or a villain.

So Gohan, Gotenks and Vegito don't exist to you?

The only relevant character in the Buu Saga who was not SSJ3 tier was Vegeta.

[Gurori]

Cabba teaches Caulifla and Kale how to go Super Saiyan, Kale probably goes LSSJ or some shit.

Buu isn't going to wake up, we already know this. Goku goes off to find a tenth member... Frieza?

Toppo continues to search for Universe 11 Team Members.

[New Rnclave]

Back in Z, Super Saiyan III level of power was an unattainable level for anyone who wasn't Goku or a villain.

So Gohan, Gotenks and Vegito don't exist to you?

The only relevant character in the Buu Saga who was not SSJ3 tier was Vegeta.

I'm talking end of Z, where everyone was irrelevant again.

[Gurori]

So Gohan, Gotenks and Vegito don't exist to you?

The only relevant character in the Buu Saga who was not SSJ3 tier was Vegeta.

I'm talking end of Z, where everyone was irrelevant again.

I think in terms of character relevancy, Super does a slightly better job. They ARE really trying to make some of the less powerful characters like Tien, Roshi, etc more relevant through the Universe Survival Saga.... with the exception of Yamcha but that's okay because his suffering is used for comedy.

[Finland SSR]

So Gohan, Gotenks and Vegito don't exist to you?

The only relevant character in the Buu Saga who was not SSJ3 tier was Vegeta.

I'm talking end of Z, where everyone was irrelevant again.

They were irrelevant because it was a three-episode story centered around Uub, not because they were actually weak.

End of Z is not an arc. It's just an ending.

[New Rnclave]

I'm talking end of Z, where everyone was irrelevant again.

They were irrelevant because it was a three-episode story centered around Uub, not because they were actually weak.

End of Z is not an arc. It's just an ending.

I'm not saying it was an arc.

[Finland SSR]

They were irrelevant because it was a three-episode story centered around Uub, not because they were actually weak.

End of Z is not an arc. It's just an ending.

I'm not saying it was an arc.

Yes, and since End of Z was not an arc, the concept of "being irrelevant" doesn't apply.

[Gurori]

I'm not saying it was an arc.

Yes, and since End of Z was not an arc, the concept of "being irrelevant" doesn't apply.

End of Z was part of the Buu Saga technically.

I have a feeling they'll reanimate it for Dragon Ball Super.

[Finland SSR]

Yes, and since End of Z was not an arc, the concept of "being irrelevant" doesn't apply.

End of Z was part of the Buu Saga technically.

I have a feeling they'll reanimate it for Dragon Ball Super.

Indeed, and as I said, the only relevant character in the Buu Saga who was not SSJ3 tier was Vegeta. That was the counterargument to Rn's original argument that only Goku and villains were SSJ3 tier.

I don't know why we ended up discussing End of Z, but now we are back, and let's stay on point this time.

[Imperializt Russia]

After being goaded into it by a few university friends, I've had the entirety of DragonBallZ: Kai on my "totally legitimate digital media" hard drive for about two years.
The other night, I started watching it.

What the fuck have I been watching.

[Sichem]

After being goaded into it by a few university friends, I've had the entirety of DragonBallZ: Kai on my "totally legitimate digital media" hard drive for about two years.
The other night, I started watching it.

What the fuck have I been watching.

Good things