Star Wars: Debate Thread

[Bearon]

The pure bloods or the Massassi?

Massassi are a sub species of Pureblood are they not?

I'm not sure.

Well likely the same thing would have happened if Darth Vader had survived and remained on the Dark Side. In essence I'm not arguing which faction was stronger but who was personally stronger.

Revan's system ensured powerful enough underlings for his empire to survive.

Sidious basically took the rule of two and added a bunch of blaster firing soldiers, and a few acolytes.

Well actually wasn't the system Revan has pretty much the same in practice as Sidious's own? That's actually what Bane based the Rule of Two off of I think.

Exactly.

Palpatine was the kingpin of the sith empire. Without him, the empire faded away into a wimpy remnant.

When Revan disappeared, another took his place.

By the way the Empire survived. You should read the Dark Empire Arc. Palpatine survived the Death Star. Also the Imperial Remnant was still a powerhouse in those times and it was what was left of the Galactic Empire

Yes I know but I'm speaking of the Galactic Empire not the Imperial Remnant.

[Spoder]

The pure bloods or the Massassi?

Massassi are a sub species of Pureblood are they not?

They're supposed to be the most fearsome and willful of the purebloods.

[United States Kingdom]

You mean Darth Malak who had to resort to being a pussy and betraying Revan in another ship than fighting Revan head on?

That doesn't help your argument at all.

The fact that his own apprentice, who was also utilizing the power of the Star Forge had to resort to underhanded tactics (and still failed) only strengthens my argument.

What are you even talking about?

[Bearon]

You mean Darth Malak who had to resort to being a pussy and betraying Revan in another ship than fighting Revan head on?

That doesn't help your argument at all.

The fact that his own apprentice, who was also utilizing the power of the Star Forge had to resort to underhanded tactics (and still failed) only strengthens my argument.

That doesn't necessarily speak volumes about Revan's strength it spoke more of Malak's own personal weakness.

[United States Kingdom]

Massassi are a sub species of Pureblood are they not?

They're supposed to be the most fearsome and willful of the purebloods.

and also the most animalistic unlike the Kissai who are intelligent and don't act like Darth Maul

[Bearon]

Massassi are a sub species of Pureblood are they not?

They're supposed to be the most fearsome and willful of the purebloods.

Actually what I'm reading about these Massassi on Wookipeedia is that they are very malleable and were bred for obedience.

[Bearon]

I found it!

"Sadow fled to the jungle moon of Yavin 4 along with a contingent of Massassi followers to escape the pursuing Jedi and the Galactic Republic. There, Sadow committed cruel experiments on his own Massassi warriors which resulted in them becoming dark side wielding savages. Despite these abuses, the Massassi treated Sadow as a god, building huge temples and palaces to honor their Lord. Eventually the Massassi on the moon devolved into a primitive hunter-warrior society. At some point during the construction of the Massassi Temple's, they created the Yavin Vassilika that contained a key to one of the more strategically important temples.

In 3997 BBY, Exar Kun elevated himself to the status of a god and enslaved the Massassi members on Yavin IV. He then forced them to construct a great complex of temples that were used in arcane Sith ceremonies and rites. He also experimented on his slaves and created the Golden Globe that trapped the children of the Massassi and allowed him to drain their energies for his own purposes. During the Sith War in 3996 BBY, Exar Kun sapped the life out most of the Massassi on Yavin 4 so that he could free his soul from his body in order to escape the pursuing Jedi. Some of the Massassi survived Kun's ritual, one example was Kalgrath. In addition, there were Massassi living on other worlds. For example, there was at least one Massassi living on Korriban in 3993 BBY, and reports of isolated villages of both Kissai and Massassi on Korriban and Tund.

Though nearly annihilated, some Massassi had previously been taken off world which meant that the species was not largely extinct at the time. Some of its members, however, quickly went into the service of the new Sith Empire that had formed during the Jedi Civil War. Some also remained neutral as they were resentful of the treatment done to their race by the Sith. These Massassi either decided to continue a life where they could live in peace while others stayed in the fringes of society and sought revenge against the Sith."

This shows that while Sadow did telepathically enslave the Massassi and drain them of energy as Sidious did to those on Byss Sadow only did this to the small contingent he brought with him to Yavin IV. This is a VERY impressive feat but Sidious's trumps it.

[Bearon]

Spod I do have to thank you though for introducing me to Wookipeedia. It's truly an amazing site.

[-The Unified Earth Governments-]

I will say only this:Disney will ruin Star Wars.

Disney HAS ruined Star Wars but in this thread EU feats are applicable.

Star Wars was ruined by the AU.

[Bearon]

Disney HAS ruined Star Wars but in this thread EU feats are applicable.

Star Wars was ruined by the AU.

I think you mean EU.

And though I disagree I respect your opinion.

[-The Unified Earth Governments-]

Star Wars was ruined by the AU.

I think you mean EU.

And though I disagree I respect your opinion.

Fuck, I used a measurement instead of..ugh...

It fits in the setting at least.

[Bearon]

I think you mean EU.

And though I disagree I respect your opinion.

Fuck, I used a measurement instead of..ugh...

It fits in the setting at least.

What are you saying?

[-The Unified Earth Governments-]

Fuck, I used a measurement instead of..ugh...

It fits in the setting at least.

What are you saying?

You don't know what an AU is do you?

[Bearon]

What are you saying?

You don't know what an AU is do you?

Alternate Universe?

[-The Unified Earth Governments-]

You don't know what an AU is do you?

Alternate Universe?

Astronomical Unit

[Warpspace]

I'm fairly certain that Windu actually has bested Dooku in the past during the Clone Wars, not to mention he knows shatterpoint. Hell, he nearly took out Palpatine in a duel thanks to it. Seeing the weakness in every structure, form, and object is exceptionally useful in a fight. And Windu is not above the use of more aggressive kinetic attacks typically used exclusively by Sith.

Wait, people are seriously fucking suggessting Revan could beat Grand Master Luke Skywalker in a fight? Are you all insane? Luke's so fast at some points that I'm fairly certain he even went full FTL in one book. Luke if anything is essentially what Anakin could have become had he not been severely burned by Kenobi, and is far more level-headed then his father.

But seriously guys, Grand Master Luke Skywalker >>> Almost everyone in the EU. The only Sith that would stand a chance against him in a fight are Nihilus (although that's due to LOLHAX instagib abilities) and ehhh, I think that's it really. Nihilus is the only one who jumps to mind that could stop Skywalker, although even he might get speedblitzed.

[Bearon]

Alternate Universe?

Astronomical Unit

I was totally off.

[Warpspace]

Also, stop being disingenuous those arguing for Palpatine. Palpatine was never capable of simply popping a force storm out of no-where, he needed a Sith Artifact to summon them, and without it he couldn't control them and even lost one of his cloned bodies to a force storm gone awry.

[United States Kingdom]

Spod I do have to thank you though for introducing me to Wookipeedia. It's truly an amazing site.

Ik. Its like a fuckin archive. That's where I get all my shit and knowledge.

[United States Kingdom]

I'm fairly certain that Windu actually has bested Dooku in the past during the Clone Wars, not to mention he knows shatterpoint. Hell, he nearly took out Palpatine in a duel thanks to it. Seeing the weakness in every structure, form, and object is exceptionally useful in a fight. And Windu is not above the use of more aggressive kinetic attacks typically used exclusively by Sith.

Wait, people are seriously fucking suggessting Revan could beat Grand Master Luke Skywalker in a fight? Are you all insane? Luke's so fast at some points that I'm fairly certain he even went full FTL in one book. Luke if anything is essentially what Anakin could have become had he not been severely burned by Kenobi, and is far more level-headed then his father.

But seriously guys, Grand Master Luke Skywalker >>> Almost everyone in the EU. The only Sith that would stand a chance against him in a fight are Nihilus (although that's due to LOLHAX instagib abilities) and ehhh, I think that's it really. Nihilus is the only one who jumps to mind that could stop Skywalker, although even he might get speedblitzed.

Watch this vid bro Link


I agree, people need to realize who Luke really is and the feats he has accomplished. Hell, he can make his body be with the force consciously even if it is going to make him have restrain in his body and he matches Yoda and Sidious in lightsaber prowess.

Shatterpoint could be a deciding factor but Dooku would most likely know that he has shatterpoint considering the fact that they served in the same council and were said to be friends. Also, Dooku with decades of refinement would probably wouldn't let his weaknesses show that easily. PS, Vaapad is Mace's main style despite mastering all the other Forms and Dooku has the advantage in lightsaber combat as Makashi is energy efficient not to mention Dooku has a general knowledge of all lightsaber forms, he has taught Ventress Jar'Kai, and has taught trained Grievous in the Jedi Arts to make him one of the top Jedi killers of his time(before Darth Vader) not to mention that I think that Dooku could have beaten Anakin, the only reason why Anakin one was because he is "the Chosen One" and is therefore protected.

By the way, Dooku has beaten Djem So users despite Makashi's weakness for this form and he can beat powerful Djem So users like Plo Koon.

[United States Kingdom]

Also, stop being disingenuous those arguing for Palpatine. Palpatine was never capable of simply popping a force storm out of no-where, he needed a Sith Artifact to summon them, and without it he couldn't control them and even lost one of his cloned bodies to a force storm gone awry.

Are you talking about the darkstaff which summons force storms? because from what I know, Sidious didn't own a darkstaff and I think darkstaffs are the only artifact that are capable of summoning force storms yet he didn't own one but is listed as a user of force storms in the Wookipidea thread.

[Warpspace]

I'm fairly certain that Windu actually has bested Dooku in the past during the Clone Wars, not to mention he knows shatterpoint. Hell, he nearly took out Palpatine in a duel thanks to it. Seeing the weakness in every structure, form, and object is exceptionally useful in a fight. And Windu is not above the use of more aggressive kinetic attacks typically used exclusively by Sith.

Wait, people are seriously fucking suggessting Revan could beat Grand Master Luke Skywalker in a fight? Are you all insane? Luke's so fast at some points that I'm fairly certain he even went full FTL in one book. Luke if anything is essentially what Anakin could have become had he not been severely burned by Kenobi, and is far more level-headed then his father.

But seriously guys, Grand Master Luke Skywalker >>> Almost everyone in the EU. The only Sith that would stand a chance against him in a fight are Nihilus (although that's due to LOLHAX instagib abilities) and ehhh, I think that's it really. Nihilus is the only one who jumps to mind that could stop Skywalker, although even he might get speedblitzed.

Watch this vid bro Link


I agree, people need to realize who Luke really is and the feats he has accomplished. Hell, he can make his body be with the force consciously even if it is going to make him have restrain in his body and he matches Yoda and Sidious in lightsaber prowess.

Shatterpoint could be a deciding factor but Dooku would most likely know that he has shatterpoint considering the fact that they served in the same council and were said to be friends. Also, Dooku with decades of refinement would probably wouldn't let his weaknesses show that easily. PS, Vaapad is Mace's main style despite mastering all the other Forms and Dooku has the advantage in lightsaber combat as Makashi is energy efficient not to mention Dooku has a general knowledge of all lightsaber forms, he has taught Ventress Jar'Kai, and has taught trained Grievous in the Jedi Arts to make him one of the top Jedi killers of his time(before Darth Vader) not to mention that I think that Dooku could have beaten Anakin, the only reason why Anakin one was because he is "the Chosen One" and is therefore protected.

By the way, Dooku has beaten Djem So users despite Makashi's weakness for this form and he can beat powerful Djem So users like Plo Koon.

This doesn't really matter considering that at his height, Mace WIndu was a telekinetic monster hopping around like he was on crack. The feats from the Clone Wars 2D cartoon simply blow Dooku out of the bloody water if we're going by Legends canon and not Disney.

[Bearon]

Also, stop being disingenuous those arguing for Palpatine. Palpatine was never capable of simply popping a force storm out of no-where, he needed a Sith Artifact to summon them, and without it he couldn't control them and even lost one of his cloned bodies to a force storm gone awry.

Sidious never needed an artifact. What are you talking about?

[Bearon]

I'm fairly certain that Windu actually has bested Dooku in the past during the Clone Wars, not to mention he knows shatterpoint. Hell, he nearly took out Palpatine in a duel thanks to it. Seeing the weakness in every structure, form, and object is exceptionally useful in a fight. And Windu is not above the use of more aggressive kinetic attacks typically used exclusively by Sith.

Wait, people are seriously fucking suggessting Revan could beat Grand Master Luke Skywalker in a fight? Are you all insane? Luke's so fast at some points that I'm fairly certain he even went full FTL in one book. Luke if anything is essentially what Anakin could have become had he not been severely burned by Kenobi, and is far more level-headed then his father.

But seriously guys, Grand Master Luke Skywalker >>> Almost everyone in the EU. The only Sith that would stand a chance against him in a fight are Nihilus (although that's due to LOLHAX instagib abilities) and ehhh, I think that's it really. Nihilus is the only one who jumps to mind that could stop Skywalker, although even he might get speedblitzed.

He never beat Dooku. They came close to fighting once but Dooku simply set his droids on Mace before leaving. He's used shatter points in duels before and though they've helped him it has never amounted to an instant win. Mace's telekinesis is nowhere near Dooku's level of telekinesis.

Agreed.

Nihilus would get speed blitzed by any force user in the top 10.

[Warpspace]

I'm fairly certain that Windu actually has bested Dooku in the past during the Clone Wars, not to mention he knows shatterpoint. Hell, he nearly took out Palpatine in a duel thanks to it. Seeing the weakness in every structure, form, and object is exceptionally useful in a fight. And Windu is not above the use of more aggressive kinetic attacks typically used exclusively by Sith.

Wait, people are seriously fucking suggessting Revan could beat Grand Master Luke Skywalker in a fight? Are you all insane? Luke's so fast at some points that I'm fairly certain he even went full FTL in one book. Luke if anything is essentially what Anakin could have become had he not been severely burned by Kenobi, and is far more level-headed then his father.

But seriously guys, Grand Master Luke Skywalker >>> Almost everyone in the EU. The only Sith that would stand a chance against him in a fight are Nihilus (although that's due to LOLHAX instagib abilities) and ehhh, I think that's it really. Nihilus is the only one who jumps to mind that could stop Skywalker, although even he might get speedblitzed.

He never beat Dooku. They came close to fighting once but Dooku simply set his droids on Mace before leaving. He's used shatter points in duels before and though they've helped him it has never amounted to an instant win. Mace's telekinesis is nowhere near Dooku's level of telekinesis.

Agreed.

Nihilus would get speed blitzed by any force user in the top 10.

Not very likely though. The problem with Nihilus is that the only way to fight him is to be a "blank" in the force, to be a wound like him. Otherwise he could even kill Palpatine instantly be simply speaking a word and sucking his soul out.

And no, Mace's TK is laughably above Dooku's feats.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF3ocZu4cZo

This scene in the Clone Wars by Mace is far above anything Dooku has ever demonstrated, with Mace pretty much flying across the battlefield while dropping TK force attacks that level hundreds of B2's instantly and would kill a human being instantly, including a Force Sensitive if it did (and likely would) penetrate Dooku's force shields eventually.