ASoIAF/Game of Thrones general Discussion Thread

[Infected Mushroom]

How come they wouldn't avenge the Dragon Queen by waging war on Westeros? Together they would have enough Unsullied and Essos troops to win right?

What was keeping that army afloat was goddamn Drogon. Sansa said it herself, "we surround you with a thousand northmen" or something like that. Implying they outnumber them. However given the lack of consistency, "fuck numbers", is the right approach to take here.

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

[Holy Tedalonia]

What was keeping that army afloat was goddamn Drogon. Sansa said it herself, "we surround you with a thousand northmen" or something like that. Implying they outnumber them. However given the lack of consistency, "fuck numbers", is the right approach to take here.

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

Nah, Grey Worm totally just wanted justice brought to him. I dont know why he would settle with a deal that spares his life, and ultimately bring him to a place that doesnt matter any longer. Jon is more questionable, I always take Jon as honorable to a fault and not stupid to a fault, but if he betrayed his queen, what makes you think he'd turn himself in? I mean he had already betrayed his principles. I just hated how they dealt with Jon in every way.

[Holy Tedalonia]

why didnt that happen? Made perfect sense lol

Cause it wasn't just the unsullied. Half the lords of westeros weren't happy with the stabby stabby

Honestly I think they made it sound that way, but really its just the greyjoy girl. And she didnt even have a proper reason to support Danyss. I mean she didn't even get what she wanted at all. She fought for independence, and right in front of her Sansa gets independence but not her. How the hell is she ok with that?

[Infected Mushroom]

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

Nah, Grey Worm totally just wanted justice brought to him. I dont know why he would settle with a deal that spares his life, and ultimately bring him to a place that doesnt matter any longer. Jon is more questionable, I always take Jon as honorable to a fault and not stupid to a fault, but if he betrayed his queen, what makes you think he'd turn himself in? I mean he had already betrayed his principles. I just hated how they dealt with Jon in every way.

because that’s what a Japanese anime main character would do when he situationally chooses to do something like what Jon did. The whole “I don’t want the throne” thing, his heroic/unstrategic antics throughout the series etc...

Basically when it comes to Jon and predicting what he does (after the writing went a bit downhill) is:

“What would an anime main character do in this situation?”

[Des-Bal]

Wow, what an ending! Tyrion not being especially witty or smart, Jon continuing to be sad and continuing to not want to be King, and many many cuts that could have just ended the episode. Jon walks places, things happen, Jon's sad, I wonder if he'll change his mind and be cool with it? While stuff was still happening there were just so many scenes that could have been put in any order. Should have been titled "spinning our wheels and awaiting forgone conclusions."

It sure was nice of Tyrion to explain Daenarys' arc because the writers couldn't be bothered to show it.

Favorite moment of the episode: Tyrion, as a prisoner, addresses the most powerful people in Westeros (and also some people with no reason to be there) and restructures the feudal system into an elective monarchy. When offered to the position of Hand declares he shouldn't be trusted to make big decisions.

I think this might be my least favorite episode. There are so many episodes I've been angrier at but I don't think I ever felt one limp to the finish line quite this badly. After Jon stabbed Daenarys I was waiting for the episode to end and couldn't muster any interest. There were sooo many places I was waiting for the cut to black. Brienne finishing Jaime's entry, the small council scene, the Starks saying goodbye, and always another scene I felt nothing about. I hate that I watched this, I think I would have been happier with the bleak open note that s8e5 ended on.

[Des-Bal]

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

In character for Grey Worm is hard to pin down. He's gone through some major changes that were never really properly explored. That said I couldn't think of a single reason he would care about making a bargain with that particular chip.

[Holy Tedalonia]

because that’s what a Japanese anime main character would do when he situationally chooses to do something like what Jon did. The whole “I don’t want the throne” thing, his heroic/unstrategic antics throughout the series etc...

Basically when it comes to Jon and predicting what he does (after the writing went a bit downhill) is:

“What would an anime main character do in this situation?”

Someone call the finest anime studios in Japan, we will forge a new GoT in the fires of the angry fans, it shall be called, "Game of Thrones: Brotherhood".

[Ifreann]

What was keeping that army afloat was goddamn Drogon. Sansa said it herself, "we surround you with a thousand northmen" or something like that. Implying they outnumber them. However given the lack of consistency, "fuck numbers", is the right approach to take here.

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

One assumes that Davos made it clear pretty rapidly that killing Jon Snow would mean war in the streets between the Northerners and Unsullied and this was sufficiently threatening to get Grey Worm to hold off.

[Des-Bal]

One assumes that Davos made it clear pretty rapidly that killing Jon Snow would mean war in the streets between the Northerners and Unsullied and this was sufficiently threatening to get Grey Worm to hold off.

The Unsullied have no special love for the northmen, no fear of war, and no real fear of death.

[Baltenstein]

because that’s what a Japanese anime main character would do when he situationally chooses to do something like what Jon did. The whole “I don’t want the throne” thing, his heroic/unstrategic antics throughout the series etc...

Basically when it comes to Jon and predicting what he does (after the writing went a bit downhill) is:

“What would an anime main character do in this situation?”

Someone call the finest anime studios in Japan, we will forge a new GoT in the fires of the angry fans, it shall be called, "Game of Thrones: Brotherhood".

They're actually working on that, they've already done the opening.

[Platypus Bureaucracy]

So since I was sick, and my grandmother took the tv, I didnt have much of a choice to watch the final GoT episode. I can confirm that the leak I read was true, despite my hope of it not being true.

I came across it at one point but I dismissed it out of hand along with several other "crackpot" leaks because I thought to myself...

SURELY there was no way this person would end up on the throne. SURELY it wouldn't make any amount of sense.

I'd argue it actually does make thematic sense. The idea of stories and mythology is pretty important, with people overly-concerned about their legacies, or romanticising history, or securing their position by controlling the narrative. Sage Hyden did a good video on it. Crowning the one person who knows the truth of history is pretty on-point.

[Ethel mermania]

it makes no sense that Grey Worm didn’t just kill Jon immediately out of anger

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised that Jon would have turned himself in like right after and gone “yup I did it, do as you will”

And Grey Worm actually thought “let’s keep him as a bargaining chip”?

Is that in character?

One assumes that Davos made it clear pretty rapidly that killing Jon Snow would mean war in the streets between the Northerners and Unsullied and this was sufficiently threatening to get Grey Worm to hold off.

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

[Holy Tedalonia]

One assumes that Davos made it clear pretty rapidly that killing Jon Snow would mean war in the streets between the Northerners and Unsullied and this was sufficiently threatening to get Grey Worm to hold off.

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

Another point of that is not considered, was after the war Grey Worm was going to Naath with Me-Sundae. However it seemed like Daenarys wanted to take things to a world conquest level, I wonder how Greyworm would have felt, becoming a pawn or pretty much slave to the whims of Dany, I mean helping her claim Westeros is one thing, but if you keep on doing wars for a ruler, without pay, without reward, are you truly free?

[Ifreann]

One assumes that Davos made it clear pretty rapidly that killing Jon Snow would mean war in the streets between the Northerners and Unsullied and this was sufficiently threatening to get Grey Worm to hold off.

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

Makes sense.

Still can't imagine what the point of the Night's Watch is any more, though.

[Holy Tedalonia]

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

Makes sense.

Still can't imagine what the point of the Night's Watch is any more, though.

At the start it was to fuck with the Wildlings, but now its kinda useless considering wildlings are the norths besties. The only purpose I can see for them is to use them like the US border control. The wall covers everything save for the gateways, so the border can effectively be controlled. Basically Donald Trumps wet dream.

[Des-Bal]

At the start it was to fuck with the Wildlings, but now its kinda useless considering wildlings are the norths besties. The only purpose I can see for them is to use them like the US border control. The wall covers everything save for the gateways, so the border can effectively be controlled. Basically Donald Trumps wet dream.

Also how are they besties? It wasn't a cultural misunderstanding, the wildlings wanted to rape and pillage and regularly snuck over the wall to do so. Plus Iron Islands.

[Holy Tedalonia]

At the start it was to fuck with the Wildlings, but now its kinda useless considering wildlings are the norths besties. The only purpose I can see for them is to use them like the US border control. The wall covers everything save for the gateways, so the border can effectively be controlled. Basically Donald Trumps wet dream.

Also how are they besties? It wasn't a cultural misunderstanding, the wildlings wanted to rape and pillage and regularly snuck over the wall to do so. Plus Iron Islands.

Wildlings are friends with Jon Snow, and Jon Snows loved by the North, so logic would dictate they'd be on good terms for the most part.

[Ism]

Also how are they besties? It wasn't a cultural misunderstanding, the wildlings wanted to rape and pillage and regularly snuck over the wall to do so. Plus Iron Islands.

Wildlings are friends with Jon Snow, and Jon Snows loved by the North, so logic would dictate they'd be on good terms for the most part.

For now. No reason things would stay that way, especially once the Freefolk population recovers and suddenly the land beyond the wall is a little cramped. Which could be made worse by Northern lords potentially trying to colonize/subjugate the land beyond the wall, which would quicken any sort of conflict based on resources and create a strong cultural friction between the two factions.

[Ethel mermania]

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

Makes sense.

Still can't imagine what the point of the Night's Watch is any more, though.

I dont get that bit either.

[Des-Bal]

Wildlings are friends with Jon Snow, and Jon Snows loved by the North, so logic would dictate they'd be on good terms for the most part.

Yeah but culturally they pillaging and practically they need resources. If it's possible for them to have peace just by liking Jon Snow it recasts the previous conflict, it only happened because they were assholes.

[Tarsonis]

Makes sense.

Still can't imagine what the point of the Night's Watch is any more, though.

I dont get that bit either.

I mean honestly, there wasn't that much point to begin with when you think about it. The NK was basically the stuff of legends, and besides the wildlings there wasn't much to do anyway. Basically its just a place to put people.

[Des-Bal]

I mean honestly, there wasn't that much point to begin with when you think about it. The NK was basically the stuff of legends, and besides the wildlings there wasn't much to do anyway. Basically its just a place to put people.

It was a place to put people but the wildlings were always threat, they raided northern lands. The reason Bear Island women are warriors is because they're the ones who have to kill wildlings when the men aren't around.

[Tarsonis]

I mean honestly, there wasn't that much point to begin with when you think about it. The NK was basically the stuff of legends, and besides the wildlings there wasn't much to do anyway. Basically its just a place to put people.

It was a place to put people but the wildlings were always threat, they raided northern lands. The reason Bear Island women are warriors is because they're the ones who have to kill wildlings when the men aren't around.

Well it's still a place to put people now.

[Ifreann]

It was a place to put people but the wildlings were always threat, they raided northern lands. The reason Bear Island women are warriors is because they're the ones who have to kill wildlings when the men aren't around.

Well it's still a place to put people now.

Westeros has invented gulags.

[Gravlen]

my take on this was grey worm wanted justice, and letting both Tyrion and jon off was a perversion of justice. By a rightful ruler punishing Jon with the wall, it was something he might not like, but could accept.

Makes sense.

Still can't imagine what the point of the Night's Watch is any more, though.

It's simply a means for the 3ER to get rid of someone with a legitimate claim to the throne. The son of a Targaryen king swears to "hold no lands, father no children" and "wear no crowns".

He won't be challenging Bloodraven's rule at any time, since Jon Snow is an honorable (and rather dense) man.