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by The Huskar Social Union » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:13 am
by Tarsonis » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:15 am
Tracian Empire wrote:Tarsonis wrote:....we know all of those already. (In the show at least) The Night King was a weapon created by the Children of the forest, to help them fight off The First Men.True, but I would have loved to get a bit more information about what had happened in the previous Long Night. That's my bigger issue, considering what epic prophecies we had, Arya underhandedly stabbing the Night King with a dagger seems a little bit too.. simple?
I can't say that I was fully a fan of the idea of Jon killing the Night King, it would have been too obvious, but I was really hyped for the whole story of Azor Ahai having to kill a loved one, Lightbringer, everything.
by Atholl » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:16 am
Ethel mermania wrote:meh
Not enough people died. Simply based on what we saw, , Jamie, brienne, Sam and grey worm should all be dead.
The episode was to long. I understand why the lighting was done the way it was, but I would rather see what was going on.
And why does ghost look so damm small?
by The Huskar Social Union » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:34 am
by Ethel mermania » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:36 am
Atholl wrote:Ethel mermania wrote:meh
Not enough people died. Simply based on what we saw, , Jamie, brienne, Sam and grey worm should all be dead.
The episode was to long. I understand why the lighting was done the way it was, but I would rather see what was going on.
And why does ghost look so damm small?It would be way better payoff for Jaime and Brienne to die in the final act in King's Landing.
Sam is arguably the character most likely to survive, I mean, didn't GRRM say he was essentially himself?
Agree with you on Grey Worm, though I would have preferrred to have either Tormund or Gendry go too.
Any thoughts on Gilly? It looked like she got killed by the Wights in the Crypt but it was so chaotic I could not really tell.
by Battlion » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:49 am
Pasong Tirad wrote:MY DARLING BABY GHOST YOU SURVIVED (according to the episode 4 trailer)
Episode was really fun. Holding my breath during the entire ending, and Arya's whole stealth level at the library. Would have thought Jon would have been a little more useful but I guess the spotlight did have to go on to other characters. Arya FTW.
by The Huskar Social Union » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:51 am
Oh and another thingThe Huskar Social Union wrote:I love the tidal wave effect the undead had in the opening parts of the battle, especially when they hit the Living Infantry.
Shoutout to the dothraki for their suicide charge, that was... a brilliant plan. Maybe they should have been deployed on the flanks and hit from the side after the undead hit the burning stake line, but heck all probably would have died anyway, like.... every other fucking soldier did. For the most part i really liked the battle, thought that was a bit eh though, but for the most part, very good, well done, well done indeed. Especially the carnage that unfolds when the door gets knocked down and the undead come tumbling in over the walls. RIP Unsullied though who got slaughtered outside, must have been brutal for Greyworm to drop the bridge across the stake line leaving them out there.
I thought more people would have died, i was expecting Brienne or Tormund to go down, same with Greyworm. But Jorah died in an awesome way, going down to protect Daenerys, Lady Mormont died killing a fucking wight giant! Go on little girl!
Sad Theon died, but i saw it coming when he said he would protect Bran. He ended up one of my favourite characters and Alfie Allen did a fantastic job in the role. Beric died, saw that coming, but i liked him so was still sad.
I was kind of hoping Jon would kill the Night King, but i did like the twist where Arya killed him near the end, pullin a move similar to rey in tlj in the throne room scene.
And everyone's theory about the undead in the crypts came true, though i doubt skeletons could punch through stone like that, but ah well, its fucking zombies.
by Pasong Tirad » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:22 am
Battlion wrote:Pasong Tirad wrote:MY DARLING BABY GHOST YOU SURVIVED (according to the episode 4 trailer)
Episode was really fun. Holding my breath during the entire ending, and Arya's whole stealth level at the library. Would have thought Jon would have been a little more useful but I guess the spotlight did have to go on to other characters. Arya FTW.Where did you see Ghost surviving out of interest?
by G-Tech Corporation » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:29 am
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Oh and another thingThe Huskar Social Union wrote:I love the tidal wave effect the undead had in the opening parts of the battle, especially when they hit the Living Infantry.
Shoutout to the dothraki for their suicide charge, that was... a brilliant plan. Maybe they should have been deployed on the flanks and hit from the side after the undead hit the burning stake line, but heck all probably would have died anyway, like.... every other fucking soldier did. For the most part i really liked the battle, thought that was a bit eh though, but for the most part, very good, well done, well done indeed. Especially the carnage that unfolds when the door gets knocked down and the undead come tumbling in over the walls. RIP Unsullied though who got slaughtered outside, must have been brutal for Greyworm to drop the bridge across the stake line leaving them out there.
I thought more people would have died, i was expecting Brienne or Tormund to go down, same with Greyworm. But Jorah died in an awesome way, going down to protect Daenerys, Lady Mormont died killing a fucking wight giant! Go on little girl!
Sad Theon died, but i saw it coming when he said he would protect Bran. He ended up one of my favourite characters and Alfie Allen did a fantastic job in the role. Beric died, saw that coming, but i liked him so was still sad.
I was kind of hoping Jon would kill the Night King, but i did like the twist where Arya killed him near the end, pullin a move similar to rey in tlj in the throne room scene.
And everyone's theory about the undead in the crypts came true, though i doubt skeletons could punch through stone like that, but ah well, its fucking zombies.Why the fuck, did they have their artillery outside the walls, and in front of their infantry? Sure you should have had those, inside the walls, or at the least, infront of the walls but behind the infantry lines.
by Tracian Empire » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:31 am
Tarsonis wrote:Tracian Empire wrote:True, but I would have loved to get a bit more information about what had happened in the previous Long Night. That's my bigger issue, considering what epic prophecies we had, Arya underhandedly stabbing the Night King with a dagger seems a little bit too.. simple?
I can't say that I was fully a fan of the idea of Jon killing the Night King, it would have been too obvious, but I was really hyped for the whole story of Azor Ahai having to kill a loved one, Lightbringer, everything.Right but that was never part of the prophecy. Never said Azor Ahai reborn would have to go through the events again.
by Tarsonis » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:36 am
Tracian Empire wrote:Tarsonis wrote:Right but that was never part of the prophecy. Never said Azor Ahai reborn would have to go through the events again.It never did, but I don't like what the show did with the prophecy. I'm not even sure how it could be explained with what happened in this episodes. And yes, prophecies don't have be true, but that doesn't change the fact that for many, Arya just killing him like that was underwhelming.
And they could have at the very least done that without such a deus ex machina.
by Joohan » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:38 am
by Otira » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:43 am
by Tracian Empire » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:44 am
Tarsonis wrote:Tracian Empire wrote:It never did, but I don't like what the show did with the prophecy. I'm not even sure how it could be explained with what happened in this episodes. And yes, prophecies don't have be true, but that doesn't change the fact that for many, Arya just killing him like that was underwhelming.
And they could have at the very least done that without such a deus ex machina.I think Martin might be touching on particular issue regarding prophecy: they're usually vague and can be fulfilled by anybody, and people will often apply the loosest interpretation of a prophecy to claim it's true. That might be a copout, but it does fit given his inspirations
by Tarsonis » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:47 am
Tracian Empire wrote:Tarsonis wrote:I think Martin might be touching on particular issue regarding prophecy: they're usually vague and can be fulfilled by anybody, and people will often apply the loosest interpretation of a prophecy to claim it's true. That might be a copout, but it does fit given his inspirationsIn my opinion it's just lazy writing. There are other ways you could deal with that prophecy, there are other ways Arya could have ended up killing the Night King if she was supposed to, instead she just teleports over half of Winterfell, sneaks up on the Night King and all of his White Walkers and kills him with suck a trick. It is certainly cool from a certain perspective, but it also feels very underwhelming, and I am very happy that the books will most likely deal with the White Walkers/Others differently.
And you are right, prophecies are vague, and they can be fulfilled by anybody, but the whole prophecy of Azor Ahai has so much detail about it, and seems to be so central to the story, at least in the books, that just ignoring it like this seems well, like I said, lazy. A line mentioned by Melisandre that isn't even in the books as far as I know is a pretty weak way of dealing with the whole prophecy thing.
by Otira » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:48 am
Tarsonis wrote:Tracian Empire wrote:It never did, but I don't like what the show did with the prophecy. I'm not even sure how it could be explained with what happened in this episodes. And yes, prophecies don't have be true, but that doesn't change the fact that for many, Arya just killing him like that was underwhelming.
And they could have at the very least done that without such a deus ex machina.I think Martin might be touching on particular issue regarding prophecy: they're usually vague and can be fulfilled by anybody, and people will often apply the loosest interpretation of a prophecy to claim it's true. That might be a copout, but it does fit given his inspirations
by Tracian Empire » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:56 am
Tarsonis wrote:Tracian Empire wrote:In my opinion it's just lazy writing. There are other ways you could deal with that prophecy, there are other ways Arya could have ended up killing the Night King if she was supposed to, instead she just teleports over half of Winterfell, sneaks up on the Night King and all of his White Walkers and kills him with suck a trick. It is certainly cool from a certain perspective, but it also feels very underwhelming, and I am very happy that the books will most likely deal with the White Walkers/Others differently.
And you are right, prophecies are vague, and they can be fulfilled by anybody, but the whole prophecy of Azor Ahai has so much detail about it, and seems to be so central to the story, at least in the books, that just ignoring it like this seems well, like I said, lazy. A line mentioned by Melisandre that isn't even in the books as far as I know is a pretty weak way of dealing with the whole prophecy thing.
I disagree.
"There will come a day after a long summer when the stars bleed and the cold breath of darkness falls heavy on the world. In this dread hour a warrior shall draw from the fire a burning sword. And that sword shall be Lightbringer, the Red Sword of Heroes, and he who clasps it shall be Azor Ahai come again, and the darkness shall flee before him.”
There's little to no details in the prophecy.
by Andsed » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:07 am
by World Anarchic Union » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:17 am
by Tarsonis » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:26 am
Tracian Empire wrote:Tarsonis wrote:
I disagree.
"There will come a day after a long summer when the stars bleed and the cold breath of darkness falls heavy on the world. In this dread hour a warrior shall draw from the fire a burning sword. And that sword shall be Lightbringer, the Red Sword of Heroes, and he who clasps it shall be Azor Ahai come again, and the darkness shall flee before him.”
There's little to no details in the prophecy.There is also the whole prince who was promised part, the whole born amidst smoke and salt, and waking up stone dragons. And the whole story about what Azor Ahai actually did and about how he created Lightbringer.
I'm completely alright with the idea of the prophecy being vague, I'm also fully aware that the idea of literally having someone wave a burning sword around is pretty limited - every single word in the prophecy might have a different meaning than what would be obvious. My issue isn't with that, my issue is that Arya simply seems to sidestep the whole thing. The prophecy is just so central to the story that I don't particularly like the idea of it being thrown away like this.
by Tracian Empire » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:28 am
Tarsonis wrote:Tracian Empire wrote:There is also the whole prince who was promised part, the whole born amidst smoke and salt, and waking up stone dragons. And the whole story about what Azor Ahai actually did and about how he created Lightbringer.
I'm completely alright with the idea of the prophecy being vague, I'm also fully aware that the idea of literally having someone wave a burning sword around is pretty limited - every single word in the prophecy might have a different meaning than what would be obvious. My issue isn't with that, my issue is that Arya simply seems to sidestep the whole thing. The prophecy is just so central to the story that I don't particularly like the idea of it being thrown away like this.It's also possible that, that is Martin's goal all along: prophecies are bullshit to begin with. Someone mentioned it on this thread a way back, that Martin himself isn't a fan of prophecy. Maybe the whole idea all along was for it never to be fulfilled.
by The Huskar Social Union » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:34 am
by Tarsonis » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:36 am
Tracian Empire wrote:Tarsonis wrote:It's also possible that, that is Martin's goal all along: prophecies are bullshit to begin with. Someone mentioned it on this thread a way back, that Martin himself isn't a fan of prophecy. Maybe the whole idea all along was for it never to be fulfilled.Then at the very least they could have killed NK in a better way. There were just so many other ways through which Arya could have killed NK if they had decided to have her do that.
by Infected Mushroom » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:39 am
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