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Initial Thoughts on Discovery

Love it
20
13%
Like it
37
25%
So-so
47
32%
Dislike it
17
11%
Hate it
28
19%
 
Total votes : 149

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:42 am

Grenartia wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:It is no surprise really, as the war resulted in catastrophic Federation losses. I don't ever remember a casualty number being given in any of the episodes though.


Not directly related, but why haven't I seen "AR-558, but instead of Vic Fontaine, its Fortunate Son"?

Tbh I always thought that the AR-558 episode was a thinly veneered take on Vietnam, with the omnipresent booby traps, and constant threat of attack by the enemy.
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Grenartia
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Postby Grenartia » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:44 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
Not directly related, but why haven't I seen "AR-558, but instead of Vic Fontaine, its Fortunate Son"?

Tbh I always thought that the AR-558 episode was a thinly veneered take on Vietnam, with the omnipresent booby traps, and constant threat of attack by the enemy.


I thought it was as blatant as the anti-income inequality take in Past Tense.
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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:36 am

Grenartia wrote:
Ameriganastan wrote:Well, there was a war going on. Chances are if no Dominion War, Nog wouldn't have been so fast-tracked.


Indeed. Plus, there's almost no room for advancement on Voyager, short of a more senior officer buying the farm. And furthermore, half of the ship is Maquis. They probably dumped all the less-knowledgeable Maquis on Kim. Tuvok was afraid of mutiny, so he probably kept as much of his staff Starfleet as possible. Hard to imagine that many Maquis having a lot of Starfleet engineering experience, so much of Torres's staff is likely fleet as well. Nav/helm is probably mostly Maquis, but that still requires some advanced knowledge. Apparently, aside from Kes, the Doctor never needed much help, so limited slots in Medical. All you have left is Ops and Science, which Kim headed. So anyone without enough technical experience to compete with a fleeter in any other department is left scrubbing plasma conduits, mopping up the holodeck, sliding their fingers up and down the transporter controls, looking out a window to make sure the visual sensors aren't glitching out, etc.


And then Seven of Nine came along, and dare I say sank his aspirations with a double torpedo broadside.
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:38 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
Not directly related, but why haven't I seen "AR-558, but instead of Vic Fontaine, its Fortunate Son"?

Tbh I always thought that the AR-558 episode was a thinly veneered take on Vietnam, with the omnipresent booby traps, and constant threat of attack by the enemy.


It was. The director was a 'Nam vet. There's also supposed to be shades of Guadalcanal in there as well.
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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:42 am

Vassenor wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Tbh I always thought that the AR-558 episode was a thinly veneered take on Vietnam, with the omnipresent booby traps, and constant threat of attack by the enemy.


It was. The director was a 'Nam vet. There's also supposed to be shades of Guadalcanal in there as well.


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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:49 pm

Man, Dr. Phlox has gone crazy lately. First that wackadoo anti-vaxxer on The Orville, now a dementia addled serial killer on The Rookie.

He likes playing wackos these days.
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Grenartia
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Postby Grenartia » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:15 am

Tarsonis wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
Indeed. Plus, there's almost no room for advancement on Voyager, short of a more senior officer buying the farm. And furthermore, half of the ship is Maquis. They probably dumped all the less-knowledgeable Maquis on Kim. Tuvok was afraid of mutiny, so he probably kept as much of his staff Starfleet as possible. Hard to imagine that many Maquis having a lot of Starfleet engineering experience, so much of Torres's staff is likely fleet as well. Nav/helm is probably mostly Maquis, but that still requires some advanced knowledge. Apparently, aside from Kes, the Doctor never needed much help, so limited slots in Medical. All you have left is Ops and Science, which Kim headed. So anyone without enough technical experience to compete with a fleeter in any other department is left scrubbing plasma conduits, mopping up the holodeck, sliding their fingers up and down the transporter controls, looking out a window to make sure the visual sensors aren't glitching out, etc.


And then Seven of Nine came along, and dare I say sank his aspirations with a double torpedo broadside.


Not necessarily. AFAIK, she didn't even have a rank. She was basically Neelix, except hotter. And Borg.
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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:19 am

Grenartia wrote:Not necessarily. AFAIK, she didn't even have a rank. She was basically Neelix, except hotter. And Borg.

And actually good for something.
Last edited by Ameriganastan on Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Incompetent Critic
DENVER BRONCOS fan
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Force of nature.
The Ameri Train.
The Ameri song
Tsundere Ameri.
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Ameri goes to court.
Universal Constant
Edward Richtofen wrote:Ameri's so tough that he criticized an Insane Asylum and was promptly let out

Ameri does the impossible.
Fire the Ameri.
Sinovet wrote:Ameri's like Honey badger. He don't give a fuck.

Krazakistan wrote: He is a force of negativity for the sake of negativity

Onocarcass wrote:Trying to change Ameri, is like trying to drag a 2 ton block of lead with your d**k.

Immoren wrote:When Ameri says something is shit it's good and when Ameri says some thing is good it's great. *nods*

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La Paz de Los Ricos
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Postby La Paz de Los Ricos » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:24 am

Grenartia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
And then Seven of Nine came along, and dare I say sank his aspirations with a double torpedo broadside.


Not necessarily. AFAIK, she didn't even have a rank. She was basically Neelix, except hotter. And Borg.


Was she really? Neelix was the happy-go-lucky type who tried to make everyone be friendly and needed to be taught a serious lesson or two, like when he died that one time.

Seven is the opposite, a serious, efficiency-oriented person struggling to figure out her humanity, who now and then had a few silly subplots and light moments.

In my opinion, the two are as opposite as possible.

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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:42 am

Grenartia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
And then Seven of Nine came along, and dare I say sank his aspirations with a double torpedo broadside.


Not necessarily. AFAIK, she didn't even have a rank. She was basically Neelix, except hotter. And Borg.


True but she basically took over all science related tasks on the ship, which left Kim with just ops. Not a lot of room for meritorious advancement when your responsibilities consist mainly of answering the com
Proud NS Keyboard Warrior since 2005. M.A.R. Yale Divinity School ‘18.
Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
James I of Aragon "Have you ever considered that our position is Idolatry to the Rabbi?"
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The New California Republic
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:00 am

Tarsonis wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
Not necessarily. AFAIK, she didn't even have a rank. She was basically Neelix, except hotter. And Borg.


True but she basically took over all science related tasks on the ship, which left Kim with just ops. Not a lot of room for meritorious advancement when your responsibilities consist mainly of answering the com

Kim was a brown nosing little nobody. I would have taken great pleasure in seeing him in the possible future in the Endgame episode as still having the rank of ensign. :lol2:
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the complete victory over Caesar's Legion, and the pacification and annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.
Current President of The NCR: Aaron Kimball.
Current NCR Ambassador to The World Assembly: Colonel James Hsu, NCR Army (Ret.)
.

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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:15 am

Side note, just learned that Halston Sage and Seth were dating behind the scenes and broke up last fall. Suddenly her departure from The Orville makes much more sense.
Proud NS Keyboard Warrior since 2005. M.A.R. Yale Divinity School ‘18.
Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
James I of Aragon "Have you ever considered that our position is Idolatry to the Rabbi?"
Debating Christian Theology with Non-Christians pretty much anybody be like

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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:03 pm

Okay, I'm getting kind of sick of Kylden. Guy is always bitching and moaning, nearly killed Bortus and now
destroys a dudes life by outing him as...gay? Bi? Whatever.
Prick.
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Ameri does the impossible.
Fire the Ameri.
Sinovet wrote:Ameri's like Honey badger. He don't give a fuck.

Krazakistan wrote: He is a force of negativity for the sake of negativity

Onocarcass wrote:Trying to change Ameri, is like trying to drag a 2 ton block of lead with your d**k.

Immoren wrote:When Ameri says something is shit it's good and when Ameri says some thing is good it's great. *nods*

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Ism
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Postby Ism » Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:28 am

Ameriganastan wrote:Okay, I'm getting kind of sick of Kylden. Guy is always bitching and moaning, nearly killed Bortus and now
destroys a dudes life by outing him as...gay? Bi? Whatever.
Prick.


Ed’s comments on the Moclans being difficult allies makes me wonder if there’s going to be some sort of Union civil war in the future. Their culture definitely seems to be incompatible with Union values.

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Myrensis
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Postby Myrensis » Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:18 am

Grenartia wrote:
Ameriganastan wrote:Well, there was a war going on. Chances are if no Dominion War, Nog wouldn't have been so fast-tracked.


Indeed. Plus, there's almost no room for advancement on Voyager, short of a more senior officer buying the farm. And furthermore, half of the ship is Maquis. They probably dumped all the less-knowledgeable Maquis on Kim. Tuvok was afraid of mutiny, so he probably kept as much of his staff Starfleet as possible. Hard to imagine that many Maquis having a lot of Starfleet engineering experience, so much of Torres's staff is likely fleet as well. Nav/helm is probably mostly Maquis, but that still requires some advanced knowledge. Apparently, aside from Kes, the Doctor never needed much help, so limited slots in Medical. All you have left is Ops and Science, which Kim headed. So anyone without enough technical experience to compete with a fleeter in any other department is left scrubbing plasma conduits, mopping up the holodeck, sliding their fingers up and down the transporter controls, looking out a window to make sure the visual sensors aren't glitching out, etc.


Counter Argument: Deanna Troi. In any realistic scenario she would have been an Ensign, an Lt at best, who served under Crusher, but on the Enterprise somehow she's part of the senior staff and holds appropriate rank.

Or other argument: Why does Tom need to be a commissioned officer, hold any rank, or get promoted no less? He's the pilot and...that's it, he has no authority over anyone else, no staff, no crew, but he gets a commission, a promotion, a demotion, and repromoted, while Harry languishes.

Harry's perpetual Ensignhood doesn't really make any sense given everything else we've ever seen about Starfleets rather laidback attitude toward the officer corps and ship command structure.

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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:24 am

Myrensis wrote:Counter Argument: Deanna Troi. In any realistic scenario she would have been an Ensign, an Lt at best, who served under Crusher, but on the Enterprise somehow she's part of the senior staff and holds appropriate rank.

Well, she was an empath. And however largely useless her mind reading usually was in the situation, it makes sense someone with those abilities would be pretty high up.

Also, I think the rank is mostly so her patients would take her seriously. I mean, would you take counselling from an ensign?
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Force of nature.
The Ameri Train.
The Ameri song
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Edward Richtofen wrote:Ameri's so tough that he criticized an Insane Asylum and was promptly let out

Ameri does the impossible.
Fire the Ameri.
Sinovet wrote:Ameri's like Honey badger. He don't give a fuck.

Krazakistan wrote: He is a force of negativity for the sake of negativity

Onocarcass wrote:Trying to change Ameri, is like trying to drag a 2 ton block of lead with your d**k.

Immoren wrote:When Ameri says something is shit it's good and when Ameri says some thing is good it's great. *nods*

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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:48 am

Myrensis wrote:
Grenartia wrote:
Indeed. Plus, there's almost no room for advancement on Voyager, short of a more senior officer buying the farm. And furthermore, half of the ship is Maquis. They probably dumped all the less-knowledgeable Maquis on Kim. Tuvok was afraid of mutiny, so he probably kept as much of his staff Starfleet as possible. Hard to imagine that many Maquis having a lot of Starfleet engineering experience, so much of Torres's staff is likely fleet as well. Nav/helm is probably mostly Maquis, but that still requires some advanced knowledge. Apparently, aside from Kes, the Doctor never needed much help, so limited slots in Medical. All you have left is Ops and Science, which Kim headed. So anyone without enough technical experience to compete with a fleeter in any other department is left scrubbing plasma conduits, mopping up the holodeck, sliding their fingers up and down the transporter controls, looking out a window to make sure the visual sensors aren't glitching out, etc.


Counter Argument: Deanna Troi. In any realistic scenario she would have been an Ensign, an Lt at best, who served under Crusher, but on the Enterprise somehow she's part of the senior staff and holds appropriate rank.

Or other argument: Why does Tom need to be a commissioned officer, hold any rank, or get promoted no less? He's the pilot and...that's it, he has no authority over anyone else, no staff, no crew, but he gets a commission, a promotion, a demotion, and repromoted, while Harry languishes.

Harry's perpetual Ensignhood doesn't really make any sense given everything else we've ever seen about Starfleets rather laidback attitude toward the officer corps and ship command structure.


She's effectively the Starfleet equivalent of a 230X Medical Service Corps Officer with six years of service as of TNG S1. What makes that unreasonable?
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:49 am

Ameriganastan wrote:
Myrensis wrote:Counter Argument: Deanna Troi. In any realistic scenario she would have been an Ensign, an Lt at best, who served under Crusher, but on the Enterprise somehow she's part of the senior staff and holds appropriate rank.

Well, she was an empath. And however largely useless her mind reading usually was in the situation, it makes sense someone with those abilities would be pretty high up.

Also, I think the rank is mostly so her patients would take her seriously. I mean, would you take counselling from an ensign?


Case in point: Garak giving Ezri shit.
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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Fri Feb 15, 2019 8:41 am

Ameriganastan wrote:
Myrensis wrote:Counter Argument: Deanna Troi. In any realistic scenario she would have been an Ensign, an Lt at best, who served under Crusher, but on the Enterprise somehow she's part of the senior staff and holds appropriate rank.

Well, she was an empath. And however largely useless her mind reading usually was in the situation, it makes sense someone with those abilities would be pretty high up.

Also, I think the rank is mostly so her patients would take her seriously. I mean, would you take counselling from an ensign?


Also, iirc Picard specifically requested her.
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Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
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Imperial isa
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Postby Imperial isa » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:23 am

Ameriganastan wrote:Okay, I'm getting kind of sick of Kylden. Guy is always bitching and moaning, nearly killed Bortus and now
destroys a dudes life by outing him as...gay? Bi? Whatever.
Prick.

Makes me wish a krill attack does something to him.
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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:40 pm

Yeah Klyden is a katty bitch. On the flip side Big head dude is the Oh no gay guy from family guy, and that makes me happy.
Proud NS Keyboard Warrior since 2005. M.A.R. Yale Divinity School ‘18.
Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
James I of Aragon "Have you ever considered that our position is Idolatry to the Rabbi?"
Debating Christian Theology with Non-Christians pretty much anybody be like

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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 2:04 pm

Tarsonis wrote:Yeah Klyden is a katty bitch. On the flip side Big head dude is the Oh no gay guy from family guy, and that makes me happy.

He's also Cleveland, Consuela and Herbert.
The Incompetent Critic
DENVER BRONCOS fan
Eric Lumen: Ultimate Chad
Force of nature.
The Ameri Train.
The Ameri song
Tsundere Ameri.
HulkAmeri
Ameri goes to court.
Universal Constant
Edward Richtofen wrote:Ameri's so tough that he criticized an Insane Asylum and was promptly let out

Ameri does the impossible.
Fire the Ameri.
Sinovet wrote:Ameri's like Honey badger. He don't give a fuck.

Krazakistan wrote: He is a force of negativity for the sake of negativity

Onocarcass wrote:Trying to change Ameri, is like trying to drag a 2 ton block of lead with your d**k.

Immoren wrote:When Ameri says something is shit it's good and when Ameri says some thing is good it's great. *nods*

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Tarsonis
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Postby Tarsonis » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:43 pm

Ameriganastan wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:Yeah Klyden is a katty bitch. On the flip side Big head dude is the Oh no gay guy from family guy, and that makes me happy.

He's also Cleveland, Consuela and Herbert.


Yeah but the oh no totally came out when he was eating the cupcake and it made me happy.
Last edited by Tarsonis on Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Proud NS Keyboard Warrior since 2005. M.A.R. Yale Divinity School ‘18.
Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
James I of Aragon "Have you ever considered that our position is Idolatry to the Rabbi?"
Debating Christian Theology with Non-Christians pretty much anybody be like

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Ameriganastan
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Postby Ameriganastan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:43 pm

Dude, forget big head guy. That talking flower guy was Bruce Willis.
The Incompetent Critic
DENVER BRONCOS fan
Eric Lumen: Ultimate Chad
Force of nature.
The Ameri Train.
The Ameri song
Tsundere Ameri.
HulkAmeri
Ameri goes to court.
Universal Constant
Edward Richtofen wrote:Ameri's so tough that he criticized an Insane Asylum and was promptly let out

Ameri does the impossible.
Fire the Ameri.
Sinovet wrote:Ameri's like Honey badger. He don't give a fuck.

Krazakistan wrote: He is a force of negativity for the sake of negativity

Onocarcass wrote:Trying to change Ameri, is like trying to drag a 2 ton block of lead with your d**k.

Immoren wrote:When Ameri says something is shit it's good and when Ameri says some thing is good it's great. *nods*

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Tarsonis
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Posts: 5884
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Tarsonis » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:47 pm

Ameriganastan wrote:Dude, forget big head guy. That talking flower guy was Bruce Willis.


Now that you say that, holy shit I hear it now
Proud NS Keyboard Warrior since 2005. M.A.R. Yale Divinity School ‘18.
Ecclesiastes 1:18 "For in much wisdom is much vexation, and those who increase knowledge increase sorrow"
Galatians 6:7 " Do not be deceived; God is not mocked, for you reap whatever you sow."
1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
T. Stevens: "I don't hold with equality in all things, but I believe in equality under the Law."
James I of Aragon "Have you ever considered that our position is Idolatry to the Rabbi?"
Debating Christian Theology with Non-Christians pretty much anybody be like

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