Scifi TV Discussion Thread

[New haven america]

Hmm...I kind of wanna see Trek in the 26th century, like with the Enterprise-J and Dauntless Classes...

Or more Enterprise Era, cause I like that Aesthetic.

I want a series in the 25th century, about 30-70 years after Nemesis.

But alas, CBS doesn't agree...

[Harbertia]

...

What do ya'll think of a TV show; a drama, set prior to and during the Eugenics Wars?

SPOCK: From 1992 through 1996, absolute ruler of more than a quarter of your world. From Asia through the Middle East.
MCCOY: The last of the tyrants to be overthrown.
SCOTT: I must confess, gentlemen. I've always held a sneaking admiration for this one.
KIRK: He was the best of the tyrants and the most dangerous. They were supermen, in a sense. Stronger, braver, certainly more ambitious, more daring.
SPOCK: Gentlemen, this romanticism about a ruthless dictator is
KIRK: Mister Spock, we humans have a streak of barbarism in us. Appalling, but there, nevertheless.
SCOTT: There were no massacres under his rule.
SPOCK: And as little freedom.
MCCOY: No wars until he was attacked.

-TOS: Space Seed-

The main limitation on liberty would be reproductive rights, and the show would take place in Star Trek's alternative 1990s, which we see a little bit of during an episode of DS9 where Sisko ends up taking the place of some historical figure who was killed as a result of Sisko's time travel.

VOY called Future's End.

In general it's a time where reproductive liberties are small, sperm banks high, hospitals active in screening for defects, and in parts of the world imposing abortion should the condition of the offspring warrant it.

Physical Education from sports to sex ed are a focus, and the selective breeding of humans taught along side animal husbandry to illustrate the benefit of controlled evolution.

Well, we've already seen how studios treat more dramatic and militaristic ST, and it does not end well...

Indeed it does not, which is why I'd rather it not focus on the armed forces. I'd like your opinion of the linked post.

[Brusia]

Hmm...I kind of wanna see Trek in the 26th century, like with the Enterprise-J and Dauntless Classes...

Or more Enterprise Era, cause I like that Aesthetic.

I want a series in the 25th century, about 30-70 years after Nemesis.

But alas, CBS doesn't agree...

Yeah, if they stick with the Kelvin-universe and STO's logic, I think it'd be really interesting to have a post Hobus-supernova show, working around how the end of the Romulan Empire shifts the balance in the Quadrant (maybe even have the show centered around the Romulan survivors instead of the Federation for a change).

[Harbertia]

I want a series in the 25th century, about 30-70 years after Nemesis.

But alas, CBS doesn't agree...

Yeah, if they stick with the Kelvin-universe and STO's logic, I think it'd be really interesting to have a post Hobus-supernova show, working around how the end of the Romulan Empire shifts the balance in the Quadrant (maybe even have the show centered around the Romulan survivors instead of the Federation for a change).

Star Trek Online has a hint of that (taking place after the Hobus-Supernova; I play Romulans from time to time). With that stated, I'd like to say that yes, a show set after that event would be interesting.

[Grenartia]

The DS9 episode you're thinking of is Past Tense, and that was set in 2024. The actual time we saw the 90s on Trek was during Future's End, which was the Voyager two-part time travel episode (aka: the one where Sarah Silverman and Tom Paris needed to get a room).

Personally, I feel the concept you're talking about would feel a little too much like a pre-FTL version of the Starship Troopers movie.

Thanks for the episode reference and correction.

I intiailly felt defensive regarding your comparison of the concept to Starship Troopers. Due to such work's military focus. Eugenics in it's self isn't a militaristic ideal though supporters have at times been authoritarian with laws (including some passed in the US penal code regarding castration) having been made. Nikola Tesla having been a supporter of Eugenics. [Tesla: The life and times of an electric messiah by Nigel Cawthorne page 166; quote below]

"By year 2100 will see eugenics universally established. In past ages, the law governing the survival of the fittest roughly weeded out the less desirable strains. Then man's new sense of pity began to interfere with teh ruthless workings of nature. As a result, we continue to keep alove and to breed the unfit. The only method compatible with our notions of civilization and the race is to prevent the breeding of the unfit by sterilization and the deliberate guidance of the mating instinct. Several European countries and a number of states of the American Union sterilize the criminal and the insane. This is not sufficient. The trend of opinion among eugenicists is that we must make marriage more difficult. Certainly no one who is not a desirable parent should be permitted to produce progeny. A century from now it will no more occur to a normal personal to mate with a person eugenically unfit than to marry a habitual criminal."
- From Tesla's last Interview conducted by George S. Viereck

The main focus of the series should always be on Eugenics, and it's ills while also hosting a nod towards it's benefits- to explain why it's supported. We know that the people rebelled against the supermen, so we know which side the series must focus on and support in the tradition of star trek. There is a cost that must be established- the massacres of the era exposed, along with the very ills that lead to such sterilization of criminals discontinuing (that being that one can be convicted yet latter acquitted of a crime and thus innocents where also castrated under such laws before their innocence proven).

It is science fiction after all, and the science of Eugenics should be the focus along with it's social and political impacts that lead to both the wars and rebellions. Thus establishing United Earth's ban on Eugenics; a ban eventually adopted by the Federation.

Edit: I understand that it'll have to include war, you can't have Eugenics Wars with out Wars. Also upon peer review of my statement, I've decide to state that my initial defensiveness may have come from the fact that I don't like Starship Troopers though upon such review certain scientific elements; such as an elite unit tasked with studying the aliens for weakness has been brought to my attention.

Edit: Though really I dislike Starship Troopers too much to find such a minor grain worthy of redeeming it.

Honestly, I feel its kind of hard to divorce eugenics from fascist overtones (because the two go together like peanut butter and jelly). Trek has already done enough episodes about fascism, and more directly, eugenics. I honestly just don't see the need for what you're talking about.

I don't get it

Janeway started out in engineering. They wear gold shirts.

Actually, her pre-command background was in science, not engineering. Sisko was the engineer. Didn't even need to visit Memory Alpha for that one.

Hmm...I kind of wanna see Trek in the 26th century, like with the Enterprise-J and Dauntless Classes...

Or more Enterprise Era, cause I like that Aesthetic.

We'd all like that.

But we got Discovery.

I would have liked to have seen the Earth-Romulan War in ENT, and then have the finale be the actual formation of the Federation.

[New haven america]

Well, we've already seen how studios treat more dramatic and militaristic ST, and it does not end well...

Indeed it does not, which is why I'd rather it not focus on the armed forces. I'd like your opinion of the linked post.

Ok.

Starship Troopers is great. *Nod*

[Ameriganastan]

Actually, her pre-command background was in science, not engineering. Sisko was the engineer. Didn't even need to visit Memory Alpha for that one.

I stand corrected then.

[Ameriganastan]

Indeed it does not, which is why I'd rather it not focus on the armed forces. I'd like your opinion of the linked post.

Ok.

Starship Troopers is great. *Nod*

Word. Giant bugs, explosions, boobies, gore and NPH.

[Harbertia]

Ok.

Starship Troopers is great. *Nod*

Word. Giant bugs, explosions, boobies, gore and NPH.

I'm just not into it- it's too comedic and satirish and I dislike satire when it's unavoidable. Like- I can get past Fallout because I assume that's just how people have remained stable (if a bit insane) through it all. But when it's needless and in your face it just repels me. Like- I don't even laugh at Starship Troopers nor revel in the 'victory'. The only Starship Troopers I have enjoyed is the animated 'Roughnecks' series which keeps the sci-fi- dishes the satire- and is modeled after the very serious book series.

[Grenartia]

Ok.

Starship Troopers is great. *Nod*

Word. Giant bugs, explosions, boobies, gore and NPH.

Only problem I had with it was that Paul Verhoeven basically stopped reading the book halfway through, and the movie suffered accordingly.

[Harbertia]

Honestly, I feel its kind of hard to divorce eugenics from fascist overtones (because the two go together like peanut butter and jelly). Trek has already done enough episodes about fascism, and more directly, eugenics. I honestly just don't see the need for what you're talking about.

Avoid having the show set in Serbia, and instead have it set in the Great Khanate. As for the need, one has to realize that Eugenics is gaining ground again in our century- it has a lot of defenders even if they don't call themselves Eugenicists- it's fitting that a show step forward to remind us of why we moved away from it. It wasn't 'racial purity' as so many look at it now- it's Human Improvement through selective breeding, sterilization, state imposed abortion, pre-natal screening associated with such, criminalization of homosexuality as such doesn't cycle the gene pool, etc. It's a threat to an individual's liberty to pursue love as they deem fit. It's a policy of genocide even if such is in the form of sterilization rather then murder. It's a threat on one's choice regarding having or not having a child. It's an attack on love as anything more then biological impulse- it's an assault on human compassion.

[Ameriganastan]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

[Harbertia]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

This is the star trek thread.

[New haven america]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

This is the star trek thread.

And The Orville is our new ST, as STD has failed us all.

And I think Alara, cause IIRC, can't she break through or seriously dent metal?

[Ameriganastan]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

This is the star trek thread.

You were just talking about Starship Troopers. So don't get snippy with me, chachi.

[Harbertia]

This is the star trek thread.

You were just talking about Starship Troopers. So don't get snippy with me, skippy.

You need to look back at the posts; my suggestion that a Star Trek TV show set during the Eugenics Wars would be interesting got compared to Starship Troopers and to that I responded by letting my dislike of Starship Troopers be known. I did not bring that series up- it was brought up in a discussion about a proposed Star Trek TV series.

[Ameriganastan]

This is the star trek thread.

And The Orville is our new ST, as STD has failed us all.

And I think Alara, cause IIRC, can't she break through or seriously dent metal?

Yeah, but doors and whatnot don't fight back.

[The Huskar Social Union]

This is the star trek thread.

And The Orville is our new ST, as STD has failed us all.

And I think Alara, cause IIRC, can't she break through or seriously dent metal?

I like it actually, more than Orville.

[Tarsonis]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

Well Alara wrecked Isaac in Firestorm.

[Ameriganastan]

Who do you think would win in a fight between Alara and Isaac from The Orville? I say Isaac, cause he has the advantage of not feeling pain.

Well Alara wrecked Isaac in Firestorm.

That was just a simulation, though.

[Tarsonis]

Well Alara wrecked Isaac in Firestorm.

That was just a simulation, though.

Eh still counts

[Ameriganastan]

Ah, season 4. Where we gain Worf, but lose the good version of the opening theme.

[New haven america]

Ah, season 4. Where we gain Worf, but lose the good version of the opening theme.

Season 4 intro is best intro.

[Auristania]

You were just talking about Starship Troopers. So don't get snippy with me, skippy.

You need to look back at the posts; my suggestion that a Star Trek TV show set during the Eugenics Wars would be interesting got compared to Starship Troopers and to that I responded by letting my dislike of Starship Troopers be known. I did not bring that series up- it was brought up in a discussion about a proposed Star Trek TV series.

Evil political Manipulator being better at manipulation that the Others. Excellent, that's House of Cards, expecially if Khan is played by Charles Dance.

But it aint Trek. Khan's saga is set on Earth. There is no Space. There is no triumph of Good.

[Ameriganastan]

Ah, season 4. Where we gain Worf, but lose the good version of the opening theme.

Season 4 intro is best intro.

I disagree. It sounds like someone was playing the regular intro, but accidentally left it on 1.25 speed.