[R] Trolling in Japanese Assassination Thread

[Great Heathen Air Force]

I'm not sure if this crosses the line into trolling. But I find it to be an extremely inappropriate and provocative to react this way to an assassination. In particular, tying the assassin to a character from the anime Death Note is very distasteful. It feels like the poster is going out of their way to offend.

What an unexpected turn of events! Wow.

NHK has named the suspect arrested in Shinzo Abe shooting as Tetsuya Yamagami, a man who is said to be 42 years old. He is arrested for attempted murder.

Yamagami…

Wait. Yamagami… Yagami… Light Yagami????

[Ephemerald]

Not sure if this is the right tone either:

I'm absolutely speechless. It's not something you'd expect from Japan and I personally I always quite liked Abe.

This is very shocking and very sad.



That's spurious to the point of being monumentally stupid.

Aside from there being no evidence whatsoever behind any of your claims, it should be noted that Fumio Kishida is a protégé of Shinzo Abe's who has himself stated that he would like to revise Article 9 of the Japanese constitution.

But hey don't let facts stop you from trotting out a crazy conspiracy theory that tries to link a recent death with whichever group or groups you happen to feel prejudiced against or paranoid about. Obviously his assassination was orchestrated by the illuminati to stop him from revealing that the moon landing was fake.

Abe was about to reveal the secret Martian Moon bases obviously.

Radiatia makes a point about the solemnity of the thread, albeit in a somewhat personal-insulting way.

Heloin tries to turn that into a joke, and run with it? Borderline trolling to both sides.

And here is a reaction that verges into dismissive snark:

Lol, bringing in illuminati and all those pills and all is one of the most funny stereotype of being overly defensive.

At the end of the day, my views, your views don’t matter. As we don’t have access to police investigations, we will believe in things told by MSM.

Why to get so overly defensive to try and crush someone just to make a point which is not important anyways. If any of our views mattered, the world would be a cesspool and plus none know the art of politics except for those who are politicians, in which case, they are not on this forum or if they are, they will remain silent.

Chill out those who bring in such funny things and pass your time discussing.

In the words of the great Dril “I’m not owned. I’m not owned, I continue to insist as I slowly shrink and transform into a corn cob.”

Just because it is a quote does not make it OK.

[Ephemerald]

Who would have thought that the fascist supports Japan hiding its role in committing war crimes? I am shocked, I tell you, shocked that, when questioned regarding on whose side the neo-Nazi is on, he has put his foot down and said definitively that he is on the side of war crimes. Truly a groundbreaking development.

Not sure whether calling other forum users fascists is a proper way to discuss.

And while we are on the subject, here is a misrepresentation of San Lumen´s contributions:

The term war crimes is misused by so many and honestly why debate this here? a former PM was murdered in cold blood. Take this debate elsewhere.

Maybe war crime apologist is not the path you want to go down here San.

[Pasong Tirad]

Who would have thought that the fascist supports Japan hiding its role in committing war crimes? I am shocked, I tell you, shocked that, when questioned regarding on whose side the neo-Nazi is on, he has put his foot down and said definitively that he is on the side of war crimes. Truly a groundbreaking development.

The person being referred to as a fascist has openly called himself a fascist, eco-fascist, neo-Nazi and a combination of the three in multiple instances in the past and I'm not sure if calling a spade a spade should be an offense in this situation.

That's my defense then, and I'll not comment any further on the matter.

[The Archregimancy]

Ruling in the thread:

This is a reminder that we tend to be much stricter in applying rules on trolling, etc. in threads relating to the death of a significant national leader (past or present); this is particularly true when a significant national leader has been assassinated.

We're likely to look particularly unkindly on posts of the "well, he was an awful person, and I'm not going to pretend to mourn him" variety; like this one:

anyways who really cares

the dude was a neofascist and a historical revisionist, i see absolutely no reason to mourn him. yeah sure his family is probably sad but im not gonna sit here and pretend to be

*** Hispida warned for trolling. ***


Elsewhere, there have been a fair number of posts that are borderline, some which are just silly, and a fair amount speculation veering between sensible to outlandish, but none I currently feel inclined to issue another formal warning over.

But some ground rules:

1) NO GLOATING.

2) While Sino-Japanese relations are relevant to a discussion of Abe's record, be very careful about the direction you take this; avoid expressing pleasure in Abe's death, stating 'it was no less than he deserved', or similar opinions.

3) NO GLOATING.

4) I know humour is a standard NSG coping mechanism, but remember that not everyone shares a sense of humour; this is the sort of situation where humour can be misread.

5) NO GLOATING.


I'll now unlock the thread.

I'll be taking no further action on the existing reports in the present thread.

[Hispida]

Ruling in the thread:

This is a reminder that we tend to be much stricter in applying rules on trolling, etc. in threads relating to the death of a significant national leader (past or present); this is particularly true when a significant national leader has been assassinated.

We're likely to look particularly unkindly on posts of the "well, he was an awful person, and I'm not going to pretend to mourn him" variety; like this one:



*** Hispida warned for trolling. ***


Elsewhere, there have been a fair number of posts that are borderline, some which are just silly, and a fair amount speculation veering between sensible to outlandish, but none I currently feel inclined to issue another formal warning over.

But some ground rules:

1) NO GLOATING.

2) While Sino-Japanese relations are relevant to a discussion of Abe's record, be very careful about the direction you take this; avoid expressing pleasure in Abe's death, stating 'it was no less than he deserved', or similar opinions.

3) NO GLOATING.

4) I know humour is a standard NSG coping mechanism, but remember that not everyone shares a sense of humour; this is the sort of situation where humour can be misread.

5) NO GLOATING.


I'll now unlock the thread.

I'll be taking no further action on the existing reports in the present thread.

no fucking way. that's bullshit. all i was saying was i'm not going to mourn him, i didn't say anything along the lines of "he deserved it" and i didn't even imply that by any stretch of the imagination. it's trolling to say a fact about someone's political beliefs? fucking DOS me for claiming stalin was a communist, then.

[Honeydewistania]

I'd also like to ask what part of that post is trolling. Hispida made no attempt to demean or laugh off the assassination. I'm asking because I was about to make a post along similar lines and would not like to be warned for trolling for expressing my sincere opinion on the situation.

[Celritannia]

I have to question Hispida's ruling, when others have made similar comments that recieved no action:

oh, no! anyways

He's a truly horrible man and I won't weep if this is his death, but precedent for political assassination in Japan is one of ultranationalism and not opposition to it. There could be other reasons he has been shot but this truly isn't an 'anyways' event to move on from.

[The Archregimancy]

I have to question Hispida's ruling, when others have made similar comments that recieved no action:

He's a truly horrible man and I won't weep if this is his death, but precedent for political assassination in Japan is one of ultranationalism and not opposition to it. There could be other reasons he has been shot but this truly isn't an 'anyways' event to move on from.

That was simply my missing Heloin's post. Unfortunately that sometimes happens when we have 13 pages to wade through. I will now go and hand out a warning to Heloin as well. Thank you for catching this.


Edit:

Both warnings are subject to Hispida's request for a second opinion; if a colleague overturns the Hispida warning, then Heloin's warning should also be overturned.

[Ephemerald]

DEFINITELY NOT A MOD, but for what it is worth:

Is there not a difference between gravedancing - such as what Hispadia has been warned for - and wishing death upon an individual who had not been confirmed dead yet at the time of Heloin´s post?

It should be remembered that Abe was confirmed dead between Heloin´s post and Hispadia´s post, which makes the circumstances of their transgressions maybe different. Calling for a living person to die seems not the same as gloating once someone is deceased.

Again, not a mod: but one of these things seems not like the other...

[The Archregimancy]

DEFINITELY NOT A MOD

This is a report thread; please review the rules on spamming moderation. I won't issue a warning for spamming moderation this time, but you should only be posting here to make a report, if you're the subject of a report, or if you have specific evidence relevant to the report.

But, for the record, I considered the issue that you've raised here.


Edit:

For clarity, I've sent out a request for other members of the team to review these rulings.

[Heloin]

Hipsadia’s appeal is basically the same as what I would say but I must state for myself can’t imagine why indifference can be considered similar to mocking or celebrating. Nor do I see how calling someone awful and expressing no sympathy towards them be considered wishing them dead. I don’t recall at any point expressing approval of the assassination or celebrating Shinzo’s death and I don’t see how my post in question could be considered either.

[Sedgistan]

I've reviewed the posts and am going to downgrade both Heloin and Hispida's *** warnings *** to unofficial warnings.

Emotions always run high in threads about the death of major political figures, and as Arch said, we are much stricter about applying the rules of trolling in them. That is because a post that is either gloating about, or expressing a lack of care about, the death of a major political figure is much more incendiary and much more likely to anger others if that person has just passed away.

Posts that are clearly gloating in such cases are definitely warnable, and likely to get an official warning. The "I don't care they are dead" type posts are more borderline, but can still be incendiary in nature - depending on context, wording, and the player's record they may get an unofficial tell-off or a more serious punishment. Really, if you do not care that someone has died, it is best to stay silent on the matter.

In both cases here, the posts were ill-advised, insensitive and had the potential to anger others. However, I do not feel they quite reach the level of warranting an official warning, hence the decision to downgrade.

[Neon Lunar Eclipse]

viewtopic.php?p=39771701#p39771701

This seems rather trolly.

[Neon Lunar Eclipse]

Bump

[Lamoni]

Addressed.

[Imperium of Texas]

Hipsadia’s appeal is basically the same as what I would say but I must state for myself can’t imagine why indifference can be considered similar to mocking or celebrating. Nor do I see how calling someone awful and expressing no sympathy towards them be considered wishing them dead. I don’t recall at any point expressing approval of the assassination or celebrating Shinzo’s death and I don’t see how my post in question could be considered either.

If there’s a thread about trolling in another thread. The people who made it are the kind of people who think anyone who doesn’t have the same opinion or agrees with them is trolling.

I'd also like to ask what part of that post is trolling. Hispida made no attempt to demean or laugh off the assassination. I'm asking because I was about to make a post along similar lines and would not like to be warned for trolling for expressing my sincere opinion on the situation.

They’re gonna call you a troll either way bro.

[Farnhamia]

Hipsadia’s appeal is basically the same as what I would say but I must state for myself can’t imagine why indifference can be considered similar to mocking or celebrating. Nor do I see how calling someone awful and expressing no sympathy towards them be considered wishing them dead. I don’t recall at any point expressing approval of the assassination or celebrating Shinzo’s death and I don’t see how my post in question could be considered either.

If there’s a thread about trolling in another thread. The people who made it are the kind of people who think anyone who doesn’t have the same opinion or agrees with them is trolling.

I'd also like to ask what part of that post is trolling. Hispida made no attempt to demean or laugh off the assassination. I'm asking because I was about to make a post along similar lines and would not like to be warned for trolling for expressing my sincere opinion on the situation.

They’re gonna call you a troll either way bro.

Do not post in report threads unless you are directly involved or can off relevant evidence. Your opinion is neither wanted nor helpful.

[Hispida]

Addressed.

if my last post wasn't trolling, how is this one trolling? it's way milder by any stretch of the imagination. keep in mind that when i posted this, we didn't know abe was dead or if his wounds were even life-threatening.

[Pasong Tirad]

Rest In Peace I guess, I can’t comment much because of the these three things.

A: I have better things to worry about in the future and present
B: I don’t care
C: I am not a basement dweller

Emphasis added cause somebody seems to think this report is about the not caring about his death and not the calling people who care basement dwellers.

[Hispida]

Addressed.

if my last post wasn't trolling, how is this one trolling? it's way milder by any stretch of the imagination. keep in mind that when i posted this, we didn't know abe was dead or if his wounds were even life-threatening.

it's been two days ish can this appeal get looked at

[Imperium of Texas]

If there’s a thread about trolling in another thread. The people who made it are the kind of people who think anyone who doesn’t have the same opinion or agrees with them is trolling.


They’re gonna call you a troll either way bro.

Do not post in report threads unless you are directly involved or can off relevant evidence. Your opinion is neither wanted nor helpful.

Cry.

[Crazy girl]

Addressed.

if my last post wasn't trolling, how is this one trolling? it's way milder by any stretch of the imagination. keep in mind that when i posted this, we didn't know abe was dead or if his wounds were even life-threatening.

You get an unofficial warning, then continue along the same vein...not a smart move.

Rest In Peace I guess, I can’t comment much because of the these three things.

A: I have better things to worry about in the future and present
B: I don’t care
C: I am not a basement dweller

Emphasis added cause somebody seems to think this report is about the not caring about his death and not the calling people who care basement dwellers.

viewtopic.php?p=39783602#p39783602

it's been two days ish can this appeal get looked at

If you are appealing, then please clearly state you are appealing. Denied.

Cry.

Considering history, *** 1 day forum ban for spamming Moderation. ***

[Heloin]

if my last post wasn't trolling, how is this one trolling? it's way milder by any stretch of the imagination. keep in mind that when i posted this, we didn't know abe was dead or if his wounds were even life-threatening.

You get an unofficial warning, then continue along the same vein...not a smart move.

No he didn’t. The post that recived a warning was made 8 hours before the post that was knocked back to an unofficial warning.

oh, no! anyways

This was posted at 12:05 AM EST as it reads for me.

anyways who really cares

the dude was a neofascist and a historical revisionist, i see absolutely no reason to mourn him. yeah sure his family is probably sad but im not gonna sit here and pretend to be

This was his post that received a warning now unofficial and it was posted at 8:19 AM EST as it reads for me.

[Lamoni]

You get an unofficial warning, then continue along the same vein...not a smart move.

No he didn’t. The post that recived a warning was made 8 hours before the post that was knocked back to an unofficial warning.

oh, no! anyways

This was posted at 12:05 AM EST as it reads for me.

anyways who really cares

the dude was a neofascist and a historical revisionist, i see absolutely no reason to mourn him. yeah sure his family is probably sad but im not gonna sit here and pretend to be

This was his post that received a warning now unofficial and it was posted at 8:19 AM EST as it reads for me.

We do not accept 3rd party appeals.