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OSRS update: English language

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Sedgistan
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OSRS update: English language

Postby Sedgistan » Sat May 21, 2022 1:55 pm

The following section has been added to the OSRS:

English Language: NationStates is an English language website. We ask that posts on the official forums be made in English, outside of the dedicated specific language threads in the General forum. We do not normally enforce an English language requirement on other areas of the site (e.g. Regional Message Boards), with the exception of all communication with site staff, which must be made in English.


This codifies a long-standing policy, and isn't meant to change the status quo. Please feel free to ask any questions you have regarding this.

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Thousand Branches
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Postby Thousand Branches » Sat May 21, 2022 8:44 pm

Is this a warn-able offense or just privy to post removal/thread deletion? The softer language of “we ask that” would put me towards the latter option there, but I just want to confirm.
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Reploid Productions
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Postby Reploid Productions » Sat May 21, 2022 9:15 pm

Thousand Branches wrote:Is this a warn-able offense or just privy to post removal/thread deletion? The softer language of “we ask that” would put me towards the latter option there, but I just want to confirm.

In practice, it's warnable if it is egregious or persistent enough to get smacked for spam. As a one-off, it's mainly just in unofficial reminder territory.
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Thousand Branches
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Postby Thousand Branches » Sat May 21, 2022 9:19 pm

Reploid Productions wrote:
Thousand Branches wrote:Is this a warn-able offense or just privy to post removal/thread deletion? The softer language of “we ask that” would put me towards the latter option there, but I just want to confirm.

In practice, it's warnable if it is egregious or persistent enough to get smacked for spam. As a one-off, it's mainly just in unofficial reminder territory.

Copy, thanks!
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RiderSyl
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Postby RiderSyl » Sun May 22, 2022 8:43 am

The section only mentions the dedicated language threads in the General forums as an exception. Does this mean it is not legal to use foreign languages in roleplay?
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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Sun May 22, 2022 10:53 am

Yes. But we're not intending to crack down on posts that have some scattered foreign language words in them.

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Sarzonia
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Postby Sarzonia » Mon May 23, 2022 5:19 am

I'm not 100 percent thrilled with the prospect of this being enforced in roleplaying, especially since one of frequent collaborators created their own language for their country.

That said, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to write something like, "said in Spanish" or "wrote in Pacitalian" in a RP.
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Lamoni
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Postby Lamoni » Mon May 23, 2022 6:05 am

We likely will not be cracking down on Roleplaying posts, unless the use of another language is to conceal otherwise rulebreaking material. Moderation is fully aware of the use of different languages in roleplay, but we would be remiss to accept the use of "but I was just roleplaying!" to excuse rulebreaking behavior.
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Santheres
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Postby Santheres » Mon May 23, 2022 9:22 am

Sarzonia wrote:I'm not 100 percent thrilled with the prospect of this being enforced in roleplaying, especially since one of frequent collaborators created their own language for their country.

That said, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to write something like, "said in Spanish" or "wrote in Pacitalian" in a RP.


I don't want to introduce ambiguity, but I do not believe that Lamoni's post was accurate.

As stated by Sedge, scattered usage throughout a post is fine. It becomes a problem when we're being forced to moderate posts that are majority not in English. So, yes, I absolutely am intending on making sure that by and large RPs are in English. That isn't to say you can't have words or sentences in another language, and we certainly will warn if the language change is introduced in an attempt to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior, but attempting to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior is not the only potential case.

That said, I sincerely doubt this will come up very often at all. I don't recall the last time I saw an RP post that was majority non-English. If you have any examples, feel free to provide and we can discuss whereabouts the line might be.

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Sarzonia
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Postby Sarzonia » Mon May 23, 2022 11:03 am

Santheres wrote:
Sarzonia wrote:I'm not 100 percent thrilled with the prospect of this being enforced in roleplaying, especially since one of frequent collaborators created their own language for their country.

That said, it shouldn't be too big of a deal to write something like, "said in Spanish" or "wrote in Pacitalian" in a RP.


I don't want to introduce ambiguity, but I do not believe that Lamoni's post was accurate.

As stated by Sedge, scattered usage throughout a post is fine. It becomes a problem when we're being forced to moderate posts that are majority not in English. So, yes, I absolutely am intending on making sure that by and large RPs are in English. That isn't to say you can't have words or sentences in another language, and we certainly will warn if the language change is introduced in an attempt to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior, but attempting to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior is not the only potential case.

That said, I sincerely doubt this will come up very often at all. I don't recall the last time I saw an RP post that was majority non-English. If you have any examples, feel free to provide and we can discuss whereabouts the line might be.


I just did a search for RP posts by Pacitalia that included Sarzonia's now-President because I had him address a letter to his counterpart in Pacitalian. That must have been on the Jolt forums, but in any event, it was a VERY long time ago in NS terms. It would be difficult for me to post that particular example.

Again, if need be, I can write a RP that references dialog meant to be in another language the way I suggested above. I'm concerned, however, that specifying enforcement of English only RPing when some of us roleplay countries that use other languages is a bit ... disappointing.
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Santheres
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Postby Santheres » Mon May 23, 2022 11:53 am

Sarzonia wrote:
Santheres wrote:
I don't want to introduce ambiguity, but I do not believe that Lamoni's post was accurate.

As stated by Sedge, scattered usage throughout a post is fine. It becomes a problem when we're being forced to moderate posts that are majority not in English. So, yes, I absolutely am intending on making sure that by and large RPs are in English. That isn't to say you can't have words or sentences in another language, and we certainly will warn if the language change is introduced in an attempt to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior, but attempting to hide otherwise rule-breaking behavior is not the only potential case.

That said, I sincerely doubt this will come up very often at all. I don't recall the last time I saw an RP post that was majority non-English. If you have any examples, feel free to provide and we can discuss whereabouts the line might be.


I just did a search for RP posts by Pacitalia that included Sarzonia's now-President because I had him address a letter to his counterpart in Pacitalian. That must have been on the Jolt forums, but in any event, it was a VERY long time ago in NS terms. It would be difficult for me to post that particular example.

Again, if need be, I can write a RP that references dialog meant to be in another language the way I suggested above. I'm concerned, however, that specifying enforcement of English only RPing when some of us roleplay countries that use other languages is a bit ... disappointing.


You may be overthinking this. I also RP a country that uses another language (a constructed creole of languages, in fact) and I do not envision myself having a problem while also still using the language itself rather than always saying "they said in Rezese". It might help to consider a metric of "will someone be able to understand what's being said without knowing the language?" and that is achievable through limited use + context clues.

Or just provide translations.

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Dexterra
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Postby Dexterra » Mon May 23, 2022 12:22 pm

Thank you site staff for the update. This might be a nothing-question, but just to be crystal clear, is it okay for GE&T storefront owners to give some products non-English names, as long as its description/the rest of the post itself is still in English? Thanks again, hope you all had a great weekend
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Laka Strolistandiler
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Postby Laka Strolistandiler » Mon May 23, 2022 12:24 pm

Is it warnable to make a few words in non-English languages? Not entire posts but rather a small paragraph or two
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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Mon May 23, 2022 1:22 pm

Dexterra wrote:Thank you site staff for the update. This might be a nothing-question, but just to be crystal clear, is it okay for GE&T storefront owners to give some products non-English names, as long as its description/the rest of the post itself is still in English? Thanks again, hope you all had a great weekend

Yes.

Laka Strolistandiler wrote:Is it warnable to make a few words in non-English languages? Not entire posts but rather a small paragraph or two

I would like to hope that we never have to hand out warnings (or bans) for violations of this rules - "please could you post in English" should suffice. There's quite a difference between "a few words" and "a small paragraph or two" in your question. The first is probably fine, the latter potentially not.

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Pasong Tirad
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Postby Pasong Tirad » Mon May 23, 2022 10:11 pm

Are "Country X Discussion Threads" covered in the category of "dedicated specific language threads" or will we have to limit discussions to English?

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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Mon May 23, 2022 10:42 pm

They aren't, so would be expected to be in English.

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Pasong Tirad
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Postby Pasong Tirad » Mon May 23, 2022 10:48 pm

Sedgistan wrote:They aren't, so would be expected to be in English.

Thank you for the clarification.

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Karazicu
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Postby Karazicu » Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:01 am

Sorry if this constitutes as gravedigging, but I have to ask: to what extent might this rule extend to forum signatures, like how my signature as of now contains a dabbling of Spanish in it?
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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:35 am

Karazicu wrote:Sorry if this constitutes as gravedigging, but I have to ask: to what extent might this rule extend to forum signatures, like how my signature as of now contains a dabbling of Spanish in it?

It doesn't apply to signatures.
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Nacrad
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Postby Nacrad » Sat Jun 11, 2022 9:55 am

If I type something in another language for rp purposes (I tend to use Chinese/Cantonese because of my nation) and immediately follow it with a translation, is that permissible?
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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Sat Jun 11, 2022 12:13 pm

Nacrad wrote:If I type something in another language for rp purposes (I tend to use Chinese/Cantonese because of my nation) and immediately follow it with a translation, is that permissible?

We'll create a special thread here where you can post everything you want to post. Our crack team of language experts will review it and let you know. Be aware that it routinely takes a minimum of two weeks for approvals to go through the entire process. :)
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The Sarangtus Lands
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Postby The Sarangtus Lands » Sun Jun 12, 2022 5:52 am

Nacrad wrote:If I type something in another language for rp purposes (I tend to use Chinese/Cantonese because of my nation) and immediately follow it with a translation, is that permissible?

Not a moderator, but this was answered earlier by a moderator:
Santheres wrote:
Sarzonia wrote:
I just did a search for RP posts by Pacitalia that included Sarzonia's now-President because I had him address a letter to his counterpart in Pacitalian. That must have been on the Jolt forums, but in any event, it was a VERY long time ago in NS terms. It would be difficult for me to post that particular example.

Again, if need be, I can write a RP that references dialog meant to be in another language the way I suggested above. I'm concerned, however, that specifying enforcement of English only RPing when some of us roleplay countries that use other languages is a bit ... disappointing.


You may be overthinking this. I also RP a country that uses another language (a constructed creole of languages, in fact) and I do not envision myself having a problem while also still using the language itself rather than always saying "they said in Rezese". It might help to consider a metric of "will someone be able to understand what's being said without knowing the language?" and that is achievable through limited use + context clues.

Or just provide translations.


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Santheres
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Postby Santheres » Sun Jun 12, 2022 10:57 am

The Sarangtus Lands wrote:
Nacrad wrote:If I type something in another language for rp purposes (I tend to use Chinese/Cantonese because of my nation) and immediately follow it with a translation, is that permissible?

Not a moderator, but this was answered earlier by a moderator:
Santheres wrote:
You may be overthinking this. I also RP a country that uses another language (a constructed creole of languages, in fact) and I do not envision myself having a problem while also still using the language itself rather than always saying "they said in Rezese". It might help to consider a metric of "will someone be able to understand what's being said without knowing the language?" and that is achievable through limited use + context clues.

Or just provide translations.


highlighted for emphasis


I will still say, however, that if you type out an entire post in Cantonese or whatever other language, and thusly have to provide a translation for the entire post, then you could be seen as borderline spamming, and also who are you actually writing for re. the Cantonese? Do you have a Cantonese-speaking RP group? If you have to provide a full-post translation, that's what everyone will be reading, so just post that.

The sparing use of language across a post would be the ideal way to go.


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