NationStates

Kaltovar wrote:

Infected Mushroom wrote:
popular means, having "widespread support" the support cannot be said to be widespread if not even half of the people would join the protestors

I'm starting to seriously think you're either trolling, or unable to form new short-term memories.

Kaltovar wrote:Alright. Now that they've logged off and that horrific incident of terror is over ... YAY HONGKONG! Hope you guys get your freedom, and I'm glad to hear Taiwan is taking refugees!

Purgatio wrote:

Infected Mushroom wrote:I've heard that some of the protestors are now going:

"Let's all take all of our savings out of HK's banks, HK's economy will collapse and China will meet our demands."

...

Can someone explain to me how this Protest/Demonstration strategy is supposed to work in a non democratic system?

The protestors seem to be thinking... "Well if we cause enough trouble for the average HK person, bring enough attention to HK by causing disruption/destruction/mass marches... then at SOME POINT China will give us the democracy."

The last part is where I'm confused.

Where's the leverage exactly?

I mean, isn't this basically "I'm going to destroy/threaten to destroy my home UNLESS I get all my demands met?"

That's a weird way to go about trying to get leverage.

So then let's say HK burns... now WHY exactly would China then go... "okay HK is 100% ruined now, let's give them democracy/let's give them what they want."

Where's the INCENTIVES? Where's the leverage here?

Can they not see that China can still 100% function even if HK goes down? Can they not see that there's no Best Case I Win scenario here?

What's the Best Outcome they are hoping for exactly?

Right now you don't even have 50% of the people protesting, is it even 10% of HK? Let's say that 100% of HKers decided "we're going to destroy/disrupt HK now."

Okay, HK's economy is down and life is now unsustainable here.

But how do you go from there to China saying: "Okay, you get 100% of your demands now"?

The protestors in Hong Kong have proven by now they aren't really interested in getting democracy or any of their demands met. Any real activist that is interested in having certain policies but into place would focus their efforts on lobbying the influential business community or engaging in peaceful protests to draw attention to their plight, not engaging in wanton vandalism and violent attacks on law enforcement and passers-by and making a mockery of your own movement. The violence of the protestors is so utterly self-defeating, the only possible sensible explanation to make sense of it is that these people don't care about getting their insipid demands met. These are antisocial deviants and hooligans who have always been itching to break the law, to cause chaos, violence, strife, pain and injury onto perfectly innocent people, and now they have a trumped-up, semi-plausible pretext to do so, all this 'democracy' nonsense is disingenuous virtue-signalling for goons and thugs to go around hurting people and destroying property and trashing their own city. These animals, these monsters, they''ve always wanted to do this and now they have an excuse and they're gonna use it and milk that excuse until they burn their own city to the ground.

Kaltovar wrote:Yes I did notice that, which is why I said India. It's clear by your response you don't take them seriously, but I do and so should anyone with a brain in their skull. India is in the position now that China was in the early 90s, about to explode onto the world stage in a big way. If you can't see that, you can't see.

Purgatio wrote:Just to explain the context, I don't see how its trolling to refer to rioters and violent attackers as 'monsters' and 'animals'. This is the kind of hyperbolic language used in relation to violent criminals all the time. 'This monster attacked her', or 'this animal raped her'. It's nothing more than the expression of a strongly-negative opinion about the infliction of violence, it's an attempt to condemn the infliction of violence in the strongest possible terms. I don't quite see how that's trolling.

Heloin wrote:

Kaltovar wrote:Yes I did notice that, which is why I said India. It's clear by your response you don't take them seriously, but I do and so should anyone with a brain in their skull. India is in the position now that China was in the early 90s, about to explode onto the world stage in a big way. If you can't see that, you can't see.

Also this as well.

Farnhamia wrote:

Purgatio wrote:Just to explain the context, I don't see how its trolling to refer to rioters and violent attackers as 'monsters' and 'animals'. This is the kind of hyperbolic language used in relation to violent criminals all the time. 'This monster attacked her', or 'this animal raped her'. It's nothing more than the expression of a strongly-negative opinion about the infliction of violence, it's an attempt to condemn the infliction of violence in the strongest possible terms. I don't quite see how that's trolling.

You seem to like reducing people you disapprove of to less than human, though. You were warned for something similar in July. You're warned for this, too. There are ways to express your opinion without tarring an entire group of people with the same brush.

Belagia wrote:

Tuthina wrote:It will, just probably not the resolution many of us would like. Maybe I'm still too pessimistic, but I still think that the crisis will end when one side has bled too much to continue, which most likely would be the protesters and the general population. For that, the city will bleed.

If the City bleeds... So will the Yangtze, but in Napalm blaze.

#BombTheFuckOutOfChinaGang

New Bremerton wrote:

Belagia wrote:
If the City bleeds... So will the Yangtze, but in Napalm blaze.

#BombTheFuckOutOfChinaGang

Sounds like advocating death to me. Emphasis mine.

Bienenhalde wrote:

Neko-koku wrote:Hmm..I have a question..Are there wumaos on NSG?

Purgatio sounds like one of them.

New Bremerton wrote:

Bienenhalde wrote:
Purgatio sounds like one of them.

Trollnaming. Wumao (lit. 50 cents) is a term used to refer to pro-CCP online trolls who are paid Y0.50 by the Chinese government for every post they make.

New Bremerton wrote:

Bienenhalde wrote:
Purgatio sounds like one of them.

Trollnaming. Wumao (lit. 50 cents) is a term used to refer to pro-CCP online trolls who are paid Y0.50 by the Chinese government for every post they make.

Neko-koku wrote:

New Bremerton wrote:
Trollnaming. Wumao (lit. 50 cents) is a term used to refer to pro-CCP online trolls who are paid Y0.50 by the Chinese government for every post they make.

I didn't say that Purgatio is or is probably a wumao because I'm aware of the rule.

Farnhamia wrote:

New Bremerton wrote:
Trollnaming. Wumao (lit. 50 cents) is a term used to refer to pro-CCP online trolls who are paid Y0.50 by the Chinese government for every post they make.

Neko-koku wrote:I didn't say that Purgatio is or is probably a wumao because I'm aware of the rule.

I'm going to call it borderline.