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[Q] Arabic Language Ruling

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Jolthig
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[Q] Arabic Language Ruling

Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:52 am

I have a question for the mod team, given the recent ruling on usage of Arabic words. Can any Muslim say untranslated Arabic words in IDT, but just not any other thread since we cannot say untranslated words in others?
Last edited by Jolthig on Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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ECKU
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Postby ECKU » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:00 pm

And is there actually a rule that bans us saying "Asslaamu 'Alaikum (wa RaHmatullahi wa Barakaatuhu)"? And I really think an exception should be made when we speak in Islamic Arabic to each other. We all know what each other is saying, and we're not talking to non-Muslims, so there should be a reason to translate.
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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:05 pm

ECKU wrote:And is there actually a rule that bans us saying "Asslaamu 'Alaikum (wa RaHmatullahi wa Barakaatuhu)"? And I really think an exception should be made when we speak in Islamic Arabic to each other. We all know what each other is saying, and we're not talking to non-Muslims, so there should be a reason to translate.

Not to mention, if we are in IDT, shouldn't free arabic usage be fine? I know we are in English only forum, but specifically for communities like IDT. And not just arab speaking communities, but jewish and Christian's too with their own languages.
Ahmadi Muslim • Khaddam of Ahmadiyya • debater • defender of Islam & Ahmadiyya from its critics • theistic evolutionist • Star Wars fan • rock and metal fan • Pragmatic on politics
Bernie Sanders 2020

Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:06 pm

This is an English-language forum. Post in English. There are a few ... I repeat, a few words and phrases that are wide-spread enough to pass muster here (and no, I won't list them). Otherwise post in English or post a translation in parens. The IDT does not exist outside the rules. It is a thread like any other and Moderation rules apply there are they do everywhere else.
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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:09 pm

Farnhamia wrote:This is an English-language forum. Post in English. There are a few ... I repeat, a few words and phrases that are wide-spread enough to pass muster here (and no, I won't list them). Otherwise post in English or post a translation in parens. The IDT does not exist outside the rules. It is a thread like any other and Moderation rules apply there are they do everywhere else.

Right, but my given that IDT is a Muslim thread by itself, and hardly any non Muslim comes these days other than if Amin or Al Mumtahanah or Khaitaiy throw controversy around, people will get what the other is saying. To say English only applies to IDT too for certain arabic phrases is quite ridiculous imo, and I would go further and say why is it now that these rules are being enforced. If these were applied to other threads like RWDT and all the others, that's understandable, but IDT? A muslim community? Where hardly any non Muslim goes to other than speaking out against controversial posts by Muslims? That is a bit ridiculous. Unless if this is a recent ruling, I request an appeal. Especially from Arch who is well versed in Islamic religion.
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Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:13 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:This is an English-language forum. Post in English. There are a few ... I repeat, a few words and phrases that are wide-spread enough to pass muster here (and no, I won't list them). Otherwise post in English or post a translation in parens. The IDT does not exist outside the rules. It is a thread like any other and Moderation rules apply there are they do everywhere else.

Right, but my given that IDT is a Muslim thread by itself, and hardly any non Muslim comes these days other than if Amin or Al Mumtahanah or Khaitaiy throw controversy around, people will get what the other is saying. To say English only applies to IDT too for certain arabic phrases is quite ridiculous imo, and I would go further and say why is it now that these rules are being enforced. If these were applied to other threads like RWDT and all the others, that's understandable, but IDT? A muslim community? Where hardly any non Muslim goes to other than speaking out against controversial posts by Muslims? That is a bit ridiculous. Unless if this is a recent ruling, I request an appeal. Especially from Arch who is well versed in Islamic religion.

It's not a community, it's a discussion thread. It says so in the title. The rules apply there just as they do everywhere else. Or are you suggesting we create a "no go" thread, where only Muslims can post? Maybe you can have your own Moderators, too, and throw non-Muslims out. Not going to happen. Post in English or, as I said when I posted the ruling, in some form tat we can translate via Google or another translation mechanism.
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And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
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Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:16 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Right, but my given that IDT is a Muslim thread by itself, and hardly any non Muslim comes these days other than if Amin or Al Mumtahanah or Khaitaiy throw controversy around, people will get what the other is saying. To say English only applies to IDT too for certain arabic phrases is quite ridiculous imo, and I would go further and say why is it now that these rules are being enforced. If these were applied to other threads like RWDT and all the others, that's understandable, but IDT? A muslim community? Where hardly any non Muslim goes to other than speaking out against controversial posts by Muslims? That is a bit ridiculous. Unless if this is a recent ruling, I request an appeal. Especially from Arch who is well versed in Islamic religion.

It's not a community, it's a discussion thread. It says so in the title. The rules apply there just as they do everywhere else. Or are you suggesting we create a "no go" thread, where only Muslims can post? Maybe you can have your own Moderators, too, and throw non-Muslims out. Not going to happen. Post in English or, as I said when I posted the ruling, in some form tat we can translate via Google or another translation mechanism.

What I'm arguing for Farn is exceptions. Yes, even for discussion threads. All the rest of what you said has absolutely nothing to do with my post. If you feel disrespected by me, my apologies, but this ruling is quite extreme imo. Even for IDT, a discussion thread, where it is going to involve mostly muslims discussing that faith. We already have exceptions on rulings when it comes to discussing punishments prescribed by certain faiths where it is a bankable offense in other threads, but not the religious threads. Language shouldn't be any different.
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Bernie Sanders 2020

Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Farnhamia
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Postby Farnhamia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:18 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:It's not a community, it's a discussion thread. It says so in the title. The rules apply there just as they do everywhere else. Or are you suggesting we create a "no go" thread, where only Muslims can post? Maybe you can have your own Moderators, too, and throw non-Muslims out. Not going to happen. Post in English or, as I said when I posted the ruling, in some form tat we can translate via Google or another translation mechanism.

What I'm arguing for Farn is exceptions. Yes, even for discussion threads. All the rest of what you said has absolutely nothing to do with my post. If you feel disrespected by me, my apologies, but this ruling is quite extreme imo. Even for IDT, a discussion thread, where it is going to involve mostly muslims discussing that faith. We already have exceptions on rulings when it comes to discussing punishments prescribed by certain faiths where it is a bankable offense in other threads, but not the religious threads. Language shouldn't be any different.

Why do you need exceptions? Just do this: "Arabic (English)". That's all we're asking for. It should be no problem.
Freedom ... or cake. ~ Ashmoria (RIP)
Make Earth Great Again: Stop Continental Drift!
And Jesus was a sailor when he walked upon the water ...
"Make yourself at home, Frank. Hit somebody." RIP Don Rickles
My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right. ~ Carl Schurz
<Sigh> NSG...where even the atheists are Augustinians. ~ The Archregimancy
Now the foot is on the other hand ~ Kannap
RIP Dyakovo

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ECKU
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Postby ECKU » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:19 pm

Yeah, I'm with Jolthig here. Arabic is literally the liturgical language of Al-Islam and some Islamic Arabic terms 1: can't be easily translated into English, and 2: even if they are translated, they don't convey the same meaning. I'd also like to what Arch has to say in this.

I'd also like to point out that the CDT uses Latin and Greek a fair amount of times when discussing Christianity, which isn't always translated.
Last edited by ECKU on Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:22 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Jolthig wrote:What I'm arguing for Farn is exceptions. Yes, even for discussion threads. All the rest of what you said has absolutely nothing to do with my post. If you feel disrespected by me, my apologies, but this ruling is quite extreme imo. Even for IDT, a discussion thread, where it is going to involve mostly muslims discussing that faith. We already have exceptions on rulings when it comes to discussing punishments prescribed by certain faiths where it is a bankable offense in other threads, but not the religious threads. Language shouldn't be any different.

Why do you need exceptions? Just do this: "Arabic (English)". That's all we're asking for. It should be no problem.

Yeah, I'll go with that of course whether or not I succeed in discussing this with you guys, (temporary obliging until the rule is overturned), but a simple Assalaam o alakium (peace be with you) is not going to make this forum any less English than it is. We have people posting French poems on occasions. We have people who post Biblical language stuff.

If two muslims like Amin and I say assalaam o alakium to one another, we will understand each other as we aren't talking to non muslims. Sure, non muslims will look at it but they hardly join in.
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Bernie Sanders 2020

Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Postby The Chuck » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:42 pm

Since this is marked as [Q] I hope I'm not spamming moderation. But to answer ECKU's statement, yes, Arabic to English is "hard to translate" but from what I've seen, you seem to have a decent enough understanding of the English language to communicate many of your points. If you struggle with a translation, google translate is a good tool to assist you. Sure as you get more complex phrases, it gets worse but at least it will give some idea of what you're saying to those of us who aren't fluent in Arabic. If you don't know how to access it, here's a link. Punch in your Arabic in the left and copy and paste the right into your posts.
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Jolthig
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:55 pm

The Chuck wrote:Since this is marked as [Q] I hope I'm not spamming moderation. But to answer ECKU's statement, yes, Arabic to English is "hard to translate" but from what I've seen, you seem to have a decent enough understanding of the English language to communicate many of your points. If you struggle with a translation, google translate is a good tool to assist you. Sure as you get more complex phrases, it gets worse but at least it will give some idea of what you're saying to those of us who aren't fluent in Arabic. If you don't know how to access it, here's a link. Punch in your Arabic in the left and copy and paste the right into your posts.

Amin is an American Muslim so he's well versed in English.
Ahmadi Muslim • Khaddam of Ahmadiyya • debater • defender of Islam & Ahmadiyya from its critics • theistic evolutionist • Star Wars fan • rock and metal fan • Pragmatic on politics
Bernie Sanders 2020

Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Postby Nova Cyberia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:09 pm

Jolthig wrote:
The Chuck wrote:Since this is marked as [Q] I hope I'm not spamming moderation. But to answer ECKU's statement, yes, Arabic to English is "hard to translate" but from what I've seen, you seem to have a decent enough understanding of the English language to communicate many of your points. If you struggle with a translation, google translate is a good tool to assist you. Sure as you get more complex phrases, it gets worse but at least it will give some idea of what you're saying to those of us who aren't fluent in Arabic. If you don't know how to access it, here's a link. Punch in your Arabic in the left and copy and paste the right into your posts.

Amin is an American Muslim so he's well versed in English.

Then use fucking English.

Why's it so hard?
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:14 pm

Nova Cyberia wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Amin is an American Muslim so he's well versed in English.

Then use fucking English.

Why's it so hard?

It's easy lol. Yet, we are part of a faith that observes traditions. In my opinion, as long as its confined to IDT only, where it is mostly by Muslim NSGers, I don't see the problem with using Arabic phrases. If it's used in other threads with an English translation, that I can understand.
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Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Postby Paddy O Fernature » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:18 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Then use fucking English.

Why's it so hard?

It's easy lol.


So, is this admission that you are doing it deliberately then?

Just pointing out an observation for civil discussion.

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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:21 pm

Paddy O Fernature wrote:
Jolthig wrote:It's easy lol.


So, is this admission that you are doing it deliberately then?

Just pointing out an observation for civil discussion.

Deliberately? I post Arabic phrases to say greetings to my fellow Muslims. Some Arabic words, having common usage in english too when discussing Islamic concepts are also used a lot in discussions in NSG. What is there to admit to?
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Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:22 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Then use fucking English.

Why's it so hard?

It's easy lol. Yet, we are part of a faith that observes traditions. In my opinion, as long as its confined to IDT only, where it is mostly by Muslim NSGers, I don't see the problem with using Arabic phrases. If it's used in other threads with an English translation, that I can understand.

IDT is still a part of NS and has to follow the same rules as eveeronye else here.

And also, other posters can still visit IDT.
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Postby Jolthig » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:23 pm

Nova Cyberia wrote:
Jolthig wrote:It's easy lol. Yet, we are part of a faith that observes traditions. In my opinion, as long as its confined to IDT only, where it is mostly by Muslim NSGers, I don't see the problem with using Arabic phrases. If it's used in other threads with an English translation, that I can understand.

IDT is still a part of NS and has to follow the same rules as eveeronye else here.

And also, other posters can still visit IDT.

Then, by that logic, we should start enforcing these rules on other threads like CDT and any other thread that uses foreign languages.

Yes they can, but it's also still constiting mostly of muslims.
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Grenartia wrote:Then we Marshall Plan it.

Kowani wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Lol why

“Und Mirza”

:lol2:

Jean-Paul Sartre wrote:
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Isn't that what NSG is for though to a degree?

YOU’RE WRONG.

Allow me to explain using several fallacies, veiled insults, and insinuations that you’re ugly and dumb.

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Postby Paddy O Fernature » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:28 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:IDT is still a part of NS and has to follow the same rules as eveeronye else here.

And also, other posters can still visit IDT.

Then, by that logic, we should start enforcing these rules on other threads like CDT and any other thread that uses foreign languages.

Yes they can, but it's also still constiting mostly of muslims.


To be fair, and mods please correct me if I am wrong on this one, but I'm confident in saying that these rules are enforced across the forum as a whole. While I can't grab a quote at the moment, mainly because I'm too lazy right now to dig one up, but I'm pretty sure I have seen similar rulings about language in the past on the forums here when it has become a big enough issue to warrant it.
Last edited by Paddy O Fernature on Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Nova Cyberia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:45 pm

Jolthig wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:IDT is still a part of NS and has to follow the same rules as eveeronye else here.

And also, other posters can still visit IDT.

Then, by that logic, we should start enforcing these rules on other threads like CDT and any other thread that uses foreign languages.

Yes they can, but it's also still constiting mostly of muslims.

IDT is still English-speaking.

If you want a thread where you can speak Arabic then go fucking make an Arabic thread.
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Postby Neutraligon » Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:58 pm

Paddy O Fernature wrote:
Jolthig wrote:Then, by that logic, we should start enforcing these rules on other threads like CDT and any other thread that uses foreign languages.

Yes they can, but it's also still constiting mostly of muslims.


To be fair, and mods please correct me if I am wrong on this one, but I'm confident in saying that these rules are enforced across the forum as a whole. While I can't grab a quote at the moment, mainly because I'm too lazy right now to dig one up, but I'm pretty sure I have seen similar rulings about language in the past on the forums here when it has become a big enough issue to warrant it.

Individual "boards" do have unique rules due to the different content of the boards. That exempted, yes all threads have the rules enforced. The only threads where extensive other language use without translations is allowed are other language threads.
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Postby Paddy O Fernature » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:16 pm

Neutraligon wrote:
Paddy O Fernature wrote:
To be fair, and mods please correct me if I am wrong on this one, but I'm confident in saying that these rules are enforced across the forum as a whole. While I can't grab a quote at the moment, mainly because I'm too lazy right now to dig one up, but I'm pretty sure I have seen similar rulings about language in the past on the forums here when it has become a big enough issue to warrant it.

Individual "boards" do have unique rules due to the different content of the boards. That exempted, yes all threads have the rules enforced. The only threads where extensive other language use without translations is allowed are other language threads.


Noted, and thank you for the clarification.

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Postby ECKU » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:53 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Rojava Free State wrote:
If God chooses the president, he coulda chosen someone genuinely good like Rand Paul, but nah, he chose the Orange man

Here's an idea they never considered. Maybe the voters choose the president

*** 3 day ban for political nicknaming. ***

Did you really think that calling Trump "the Orange man" added weight and a certain piquant je ne sais quoi to your post? Well, it didn't. You're into ban territory now, what with your shenanigans this month. Think about it on your vacation and straighten up.

So the mods harp on about this forum being English and banned Arabic to the point where we might not be able to say salaams to each other and then Farn whips out a "je ne sais quoi"????? وااااااو، هَذا لا خَيْر :roll:
Last edited by ECKU on Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Anybody who says that I support non-Islamic slavery, persecution of non-Muslims, rape, domestic violence, terrorism, pedophilia, killing homosexuals, hating Jews, etc is lying.

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Kyrusia
Senior Game Moderator
 
Posts: 9384
Founded: Nov 12, 2007
Capitalizt

Postby Kyrusia » Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:56 pm

Farnhamia wrote:This is an English-language forum. Post in English. There are a few ... I repeat, a few words and phrases that are wide-spread enough to pass muster here (and no, I won't list them). Otherwise post in English or post a translation in parens. The IDT does not exist outside the rules. It is a thread like any other and Moderation rules apply there are they do everywhere else.

And your threadjacking is not appreciated, ECKU. Emphasis added.
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Fartsniffage
Post Czar
 
Posts: 32600
Founded: Dec 19, 2005
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Fartsniffage » Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:00 pm

ECKU wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:*** 3 day ban for political nicknaming. ***

Did you really think that calling Trump "the Orange man" added weight and a certain piquant je ne sais quoi to your post? Well, it didn't. You're into ban territory now, what with your shenanigans this month. Think about it on your vacation and straighten up.

So the mods harp on about this forum being English and banned Arabic to the point where we might not be able to say salaams to each other and then Farn whips out a "je ne sais quoi"????? وااااااو، هَذا لا خَيْر :roll:


You could just say hello to each other and it wouldn't be an issue.....

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