Frontiers, Governors, Successors and Injunctions

[Sedgistan]

Changes to Census rankings affect every nation across the site, and while regional gameplayers may not realise it, there are far more players who care very strongly about their stats and rankings than care about the factors that affect where nations are founded. Changes to rankings are not "tweaks".

That's it with the threadjack. If you have something to say on Frontiers, Governors, Successors and Injunctions then do so, otherwise, there's no reason for you to be posting here.

[Sedgistan]

In particular, those regions with 5+ endorsements will enjoy a significantly greater advantage over those with less endorsements.

I should clarify a mistake on my part here: the code is actually >5 verified endorsements, which means 6+ endorsements are required to be above that cliff-edge. I had only changed the modifiers in Violet's code and hadn't clocked that she'd coded the tiers as "greater than" x endorsements rather than "greater than or equal to".

[Tinhampton]

Can the Governor of a class region convert it to a Frontier (like Governors and executive Delegates of non-class regions can, although class delegates are non-executive by design)?

[United Calanworie]

No. I hope, at least, we specifically tested to see if that would work during the initial testing, and it... didn't. So.

[Sedgistan]

Can confirm the above. It was part of the design and testing, excluding Class regions from switching to Frontier, and also preventing them from having Successors.

Wasn't sure if this deserved its own thread, but I'm WAD of a governorless/founderless region (the governor/founder was disgraced) and am finding myself unable to dismiss the officers with Successor authority that were appointed (and are currently also disgraced) by the Governor while he was still around. It seems pointless to have these officers around when they can't be used or dismissed, so can it be made so WADs of disgraced-governorless regions can dismiss Successors?

WA Delegates of regions that have a CTEd Governor are now able to dismiss ROs that have Succession authority.

It would be desirable to have them allowed to selectively remove that authority rather than dismiss the RO entirely, but that's technically challenging to implement, and therefore I'm not sure if it's a good use of Violet's time.

[Sedgistan]

Any early reactions to the changes in spawn rate factors? Does anyone keep data of spawnings across Frontiers?

We're still intending to add something that'll show if a Frontier is eligible for spawns or not, and if eligible, then probably also a broad idea of the rate it's receiving them at.

In case it interests anyone, the top three regions for spawn factors (Concord, Europeia, The Amaranthine Isles) have a score around 11 times higher than the lowest (four regions tied at 29=). Those top three have factors around 2.5 times higher than regions just under the 6 endo cliff edge (e.g. Alcatraz, Algerheaven).

[Fort Concord]

Any early reactions to the changes in spawn rate factors? Does anyone keep data of spawnings across Frontiers?

We're still intending to add something that'll show if a Frontier is eligible for spawns or not, and if eligible, then probably also a broad idea of the rate it's receiving them at.

In case it interests anyone, the top three regions for spawn factors (Concord, Europeia, The Amaranthine Isles) have a score around 11 times higher than the lowest (four regions tied at 29=). Those top three have factors around 2.5 times higher than regions just under the 6 endo cliff edge (e.g. Alcatraz, Algerheaven).

There's still data here: https://esfalsa.github.io/founding-rates/

The issue is it only does the last week, so unless someone is documenting it on their own by week, it's tough. It also doesn't take into account how many spawns there are broadly unless you add it all up (250 spawns in a week is less impressive if there's more spawns than usual, than it would be during a more average/mundane period).

I think the new change provides a good balance. One such example I noticed is The Wellspring and Sophia being similar, one is much older but The Wellspring has more endorsements (though not by an extreme amount), so both factors are at play reasonably.

WA endorsements is by far the best way to measure gameside integration ability so it remains a good metric in my view (and also makes for an interesting dynamic when occupations happen).

[Esfalsa]

The issue is it only does the last week, so unless someone is documenting it on their own by week, it's tough.

It's not quite week-by-week coverage, but there are some snapshots in the Wayback Machine (and if enough people are interested in week-by-week coverage, that's one way to pool resources :P).

It also doesn't take into account how many spawns there are broadly unless you add it all up

The total number of foundings is at the top of the page — that includes refounds, though.

[Quebecshire]

The issue is it only does the last week, so unless someone is documenting it on their own by week, it's tough.

It's not quite week-by-week coverage, but there are some snapshots in the Wayback Machine (and if enough people are interested in week-by-week coverage, that's one way to pool resources ).

Yeah, what I mean is more that it's typically "the last week, whenever you view it", unless I've misread things in that regard. Usually it seems to have data from early in the morning to a week before that when I check.

It also doesn't take into account how many spawns there are broadly unless you add it all up

The total number of foundings is at the top of the page — that includes refounds, though.

Whoops, that's just me missing it. Thanks.

Ideally there would be a way to see without refounds so the percentages might be more accutate (i.e. X% of new nation spawns might be more useful for comparisons for Frontiers), but I know it's a more basic thing you tossed together + I won't complain since I couldn't build that shit myself. It's been very useful for keeping track of stuff as it is so thank you for putting it together.

Not really related to this but I find it interesting how many refounds there actually are, it's higher than I thought it would be, I guess.

[La Xinga]

Also, if a change-to-frontier takes 14 days, can't someone stack the SC with proposals to run out the clock?

yes. SC queue management is another topic, if people feel it needs discussing.

It may now. TMB has five days left until a governor gets appointed, while an injuction to stop it, despite having quite a lot of support, has no time to be brought to a vote even. I'm not saying anything should be done about this specific case, but in the future, can something be done to ensure this becomes rarer? For example, maybe if an injunction proposal receives ~75 approvals from delegates, it gets pushed up to the front of the queue?

[Lord Dominator]

yes. SC queue management is another topic, if people feel it needs discussing.

It may now. TMB has five days left until a governor gets appointed, while an injuction to stop it, despite having quite a lot of support, has no time to be brought to a vote even. I'm not saying anything should be done about this specific case, but in the future, can something be done to ensure this becomes rarer? For example, maybe if an injunction proposal receives ~75 approvals from delegates, it gets pushed up to the front of the queue?

We don’t currently have such an option with Liberations, which are against the more destructive refounds. More generally, given the political nature of the game it stands to reason that the appropriate solution to undesirable timing of a SC proposal is to lobby the authors of the proposals before you in queue - which is something defenders have done before.

[Sedgistan]

I think it's worth noting that Injunction was submitted late in the process - 8 days after the transition was initiated, and a further 9 on top of that since MKH Gyrfalcon Squadron was elected Delegate.

[MKH Gyrfalcon Squadron]

yes. SC queue management is another topic, if people feel it needs discussing.

It may now. TMB has five days left until a governor gets appointed, while an injuction to stop it, despite having quite a lot of support, has no time to be brought to a vote even. I'm not saying anything should be done about this specific case, but in the future, can something be done to ensure this becomes rarer? For example, maybe if an injunction proposal receives ~75 approvals from delegates, it gets pushed up to the front of the queue?

Bad example. Injunct Monarchist Bloc does not have 'quite a lot of support'. It has 60 approvals right now, just barely scraping into quorum. As others have pointed out, it had plenty of time to be submitted earlier, but they chose to wait two weeks after it had been piled to >60 endorsements with the explicit promise of "we will destroy this region" plastered everywhere it could be.

SC proposals, no matter what stripe, shouldn't be prioritised over others because a small group of people consider it more important than the SC's other matters. Players exist who actually know how to use the system to their advantage -- see Injunct Canada. MonBloc was a case of people with little gameplay/military experience being trumped by people with more gameplay/military experience; I don't see why mechanics need to be adjusted simply because X group lost a conflict and isn't happy about it.

[Zupitse]

I support the war against the Monarchist Bloc but a body called the "Security Council" should probably give priority to resolutions dealing with security matters over giving awards to whoever.

[Improper Classifications]

We haven’t had any critical bugs in a while, so now’s a good time to point this out.

In the image above we see a region with no founder but a Governor and WAD position. Now, that’s possible, of course - the region was very old and had no founder but was transitioned into having a Governor, right? Wrong. According to a WFE index, it was cleared by mods a week ago and yet never CTEd. Why? The mod region clear tool doesn’t clear the Governor because it hasn’t been updated to match F/S.

TL;DR, mod clear tool doesn’t clear Governor but only clears Founder.

[United Calanworie]

Mod-clear worked fine… I guess they just chose to re-establish it.

[Improper Classifications]

Mod-clear worked fine… I guess they just chose to re-establish it.

Even so, it would be appreciated if it could be updated for F/S - after all, what’s the point of a mod clear tool if it can be neutralized by the very thing it seeks to reject?

[Haganham]

It may now. TMB has five days left until a governor gets appointed, while an injuction to stop it, despite having quite a lot of support, has no time to be brought to a vote even. I'm not saying anything should be done about this specific case, but in the future, can something be done to ensure this becomes rarer? For example, maybe if an injunction proposal receives ~75 approvals from delegates, it gets pushed up to the front of the queue?

We don’t currently have such an option with Liberations, which are against the more destructive refounds. More generally, given the political nature of the game it stands to reason that the appropriate solution to undesirable timing of a SC proposal is to lobby the authors of the proposals before you in queue - which is something defenders have done before.

In the case of liberations the mechanic is influence.

[Sedgistan]

Tested and replicated - our tool for mod emptying a region doesn't remove the Governor. I've asked Violet to fix that.

Tested and replicated - our tool for mod emptying a region doesn't remove the Governor. I've asked Violet to fix that.

[The Centered Empire]

Question, does a Governor get Notified in any way (Email, Tg) if a region in which they hold Governor status, starts conversion into a Frontier?

[Socialist Platypus]

So I would assume this goes here, I wanted to note the fact that for some reason, Conch Kingdom transitioned back to Stronghold one update earlier than it was supposed to on paper. I have no idea what caused this, it wasn't really of any inconvenience but the fact that it happened is quite strange.

[Sedgistan]

So I would assume this goes here, I wanted to note the fact that for some reason, Conch Kingdom transitioned back to Stronghold one update earlier than it was supposed to on paper. I have no idea what caused this, it wasn't really of any inconvenience but the fact that it happened is quite strange.

Has anyone else experienced this? If so, it might give some clues as to what's going on.

[Frattastan IV]

Belgium finished the process of appointing a Governor today. It now requires a password to enter, in spite of being Liberated by the Security Council. Is this an intended effect? I don't think it has any downsides but it seems inconsistent with the SC Liberation, especially if it's a password that was set up in the distant past, by someone other than the Governor.

[Frattastan IV]

So I would assume this goes here, I wanted to note the fact that for some reason, Conch Kingdom transitioned back to Stronghold one update earlier than it was supposed to on paper. I have no idea what caused this, it wasn't really of any inconvenience but the fact that it happened is quite strange.

Has anyone else experienced this? If so, it might give some clues as to what's going on.

I didn't keep a close eye on it so I can't be very helpful, but something similar happened for Belgium in both directions.

At some point during the switch to Frontier, on June 30, 24 hours were "magically added" to the displayed counter. Similarly, the switch to Stronghold happened 12 hours earlier than some people were expecting (although I don't know when they had last checked the timer).

[Notanam]

Belgium finished the process of appointing a Governor today. It now requires a password to enter, in spite of being Liberated by the Security Council. Is this an intended effect? I don't think it has any downsides but it seems inconsistent with the SC Liberation, especially if it's a password that was set up in the distant past, by someone other than the Governor.

The definition of a liberation is "A resolution to strike down Delegate-imposed barriers to free entry in a region". By removing only passwords set while the region has no governor to control it, the Liberation is working as intended.