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Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) Images doesn't Work

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Indo States
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Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) Images doesn't Work

Postby Indo States » Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:53 pm

When I was Making a News Article in my Thread, suddenly, the Error Message in Forums says "It was not possible to determine the dimensions of the image. Please verify that the URL you entered is correct.", and I was Using a Image from Wikipedia. I do not know what Causes this? Probably due to a New Rule to Prevent Users from Spamming NSFW Images? Or if is a Problem in Wikipedia's Side?

Here is the Code, and please look at this Problem, if this Problem was occurring in your side, this probably a bug in NS to Embed Wikipedia Images. If it is in my side, Probably I need to Clear the Cache and Log back in?

Code: Select all
[img]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/35/February_21_Joint_Ateneo-UP_Student_Protests_2.jpg/800px-February_21_Joint_Ateneo-UP_Student_Protests_2.jpg[/img]
Last edited by Indo States on Tue Jun 29, 2021 11:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The Free Joy State
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Postby The Free Joy State » Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:06 am

Just to note that I have also found the same issue this morning with Wiki Commons images, so the issue doesn't appear to be exclusive to the OP.
Last edited by The Free Joy State on Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:36 am

The Free Joy State wrote:Just to note that I have also found the same issue this morning with Wiki Commons images, so the issue doesn't appear to be exclusive to the OP.


It makes me believe that wiki commons images are banned for the same reason as discord images being banned here. If this was not real, I believe it has something to do with the bbcode and a Site Admin might've been solve this issue.
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SherpDaWerp
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Postby SherpDaWerp » Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:09 am

Well, this is odd; if for no other reason than it should have come up long before now.

Image
This image works, and yet yours definitely doesn't. I took the liberty of playing around and this image has pretty clearly obvious "dimensions" that got sent along with it, and the image you linked doesn't.
EDIT 2: Curbing misinformation. The dimensions aren't as readily obvious as I'd hoped; alternative versions of the original, non-working image with the same dimension attributes as this one didn't work, with the same error.

So it might just be that the error message is telling the entire problem, and you're trying to use an image that doesn't have any dimensions for NS to determine?

EDIT: Also, there's a special message for trying to use a blocked image host - it says "Your image is hosted on a prohibited channel." So it's definitely not that wiki is a blocked image host.
Last edited by SherpDaWerp on Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:28 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:17 am

SherpDaWerp wrote:Well, this is odd; if for no other reason than it should have come up long before now.

This image works, and yet yours definitely doesn't. I took the liberty of playing around and this image has pretty clearly obvious "dimensions" that got sent along with it, and the image you linked doesn't.

So it might just be that the error message is telling the entire problem, and you're trying to use an image that doesn't have any dimensions for NS to determine?

EDIT: Also, there's a special message for trying to use a blocked image host - it says "Your image is hosted on a prohibited channel." So it's definitely not that wiki is a blocked image host.


i am just using that image, but it was totally working for me Previously. but for now, it's still doesn't work and do i need to change that dimensions?
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SherpDaWerp
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Postby SherpDaWerp » Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:42 am

Indo States wrote:do i need to change that dimensions?

You can't. The dimensions are provided by whoever hosts the image (in this case, wikimedia commons). What could have caused wiki to stop providing them is beyond me.

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The Two Jerseys
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Postby The Two Jerseys » Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:52 am

SherpDaWerp wrote:
Indo States wrote:do i need to change that dimensions?

You can't. The dimensions are provided by whoever hosts the image (in this case, wikimedia commons). What could have caused wiki to stop providing them is beyond me.

Weird, I opened the URL that OP provided in my browser and it says the image is 800x600 pixels.

OP, does Wikipedia have that image available in any other sizes that you can try?
Last edited by The Two Jerseys on Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Estado Novo Portugues » Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:07 am

Indo States wrote:Or if is a Problem in Wikipedia's Side?

Might be an intentional feature to block "hot-linking", since Wikipedia has to pay for the bandwidth and they don't want others to use them as an image-hosting service.
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Bears Armed
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Postby Bears Armed » Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:26 am

If you save a copy of it into an actual image-hosting site, can you then adjust the size satisfactorily there?
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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:44 am

Estado Novo Portugues wrote:
Indo States wrote:Or if is a Problem in Wikipedia's Side?

Might be an intentional feature to block "hot-linking", since Wikipedia has to pay for the bandwidth and they don't want others to use them as an image-hosting service.


Probably, I think [v] has to Contact Wikipedia for that Issue. However, Wikipedia Images worked fine in a Dispatch, but the Forumside doesn't seems to work. We need to wait for [v] (or [violet]) to fix this Issue, and they might've also contacted wikipedia.

Also, is there anybody that can Provide any Features that he'd said? If Wikipedia has totally Blocked the Use of their Image, I think NationStates was now a Victim of a Copyright Strike and it would've been a Pain not just for us but also for Max Barry, since NationStates already Received a Cease and Desist Order from the United Nations. If Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) has filed a Cease and Desist Order against NationStates, I think we need to use Image Host Services but there are some that Doesn't Allow "Copyrighted Content", and Users who uploaded that might've been Greeted with a Ban.

To solve this Issue, I think Max Barry might've Talked to his Lawyer or to Visit any Copyright Offices, or as well to Contact Wikipedia to deal with this Issue. If NationStates did not Receive a Cease and Desist Order from Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) and Intentionally Blocked their Images to be used in NationStates Fourms, he might've should Contact Wikipedia to Whitelist them and to Allow NationStates Users to use Wikipedia Images without any Issue.

But if this was a Bug or a BBCode Issue, NationStates Forums should have a Overhaul, or a Maintenance to Fix this Issue. If this was totally doesn't work, then it is a another Issue.

Lastly, if NationStates Intentionally Banned Wikipedia Images for the Same Reason as Discord Images being Banned in NationStates, which it was to Prevent Users from Posting NSFW Content, this was also a Pain and it is Considered to be a Censorship. We Understand that we need to Follow Rules just like in a "Father Knows Best" State, but Censoring Image Hosting Sites is just Losing User's Creativity Ways to show their Masterpiece and also to Add the Taste for the Roleplay.

However, this Wikipedia Issue was being Different from Ban on Discord Images, and it has Something to do with the Dimensions. However, the Dimensions was Totally Correct and it doesn't still us Upload any Images with Wikipedia. I hope the Site or Forum Admins of NationStates Forums would look into this Issue, and User's Troubleshooting Tips on this Issue doesn't seems to help.
Last edited by Indo States on Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:01 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Frisbeeteria
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Postby Frisbeeteria » Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:17 am

Indo States wrote:It makes me believe that wiki commons images are banned for the same reason as discord images being banned here.

No
Indo States wrote:I believe it has something to do with the bbcode and a Site Admin might've been solve this issue.

No
Indo States wrote:If Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) has filed a Cease and Desist Order against NationStates,

No
Estado Novo Portugues wrote:Might be an intentional feature to block "hot-linking", since Wikipedia has to pay for the bandwidth and they don't want others to use them as an image-hosting service.

Highly likely
Indo States wrote:Probably, I think [v] has to Contact Wikipedia for that Issue.

Absolutely not. If you're going to post images (and lots of people post copyrighted content without permission), that's entirely on you. If a site doesn't want to pay for bandwidth thieves, that's entirely their prerogative. Site staff will NOT be asking them to change those policies.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:55 am

Frisbeeteria wrote:Absolutely not. If you're going to post images (and lots of people post copyrighted content without permission), that's entirely on you. If a site doesn't want to pay for bandwidth thieves, that's entirely their prerogative. Site staff will NOT be asking them to change those policies.


I'm not here to Argue, but is this Issue has totally Related to Copyright? Most of NationStates Users use Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) Images, which i also use them for my News Articles, and my Actions are sometimes Considered to be "Fair Use". Because Fair Use has totally Allowed Users to Use Copyrighted Content without any Permission from the Original Owner to just Criticize, or to use it in News (or Journalism), Education, Commentary and Research.

(in US copyright law) the doctrine that brief excerpts of copyright material may, under certain circumstances, be quoted verbatim for purposes such as criticism, news reporting, teaching, and research, without the need for permission from or payment to the copyright holder.


Most of Wikipedia's (or Wikimedia Commons) Images have Creative Commons Licenses, while some of them are Copyrighted (not allowed to use) or Public Domain (depending on your Country). That's why we use Fair Use for News Making, and all User's News Articles in this Forums are Fiction and not "Fake News", or Misinformation to Confuse People. However, this Content Block does lose our Creativity, since Fair Use does include News Making, which it was also Part of the Journalism.

For me, it is totally Frustrating when this Issue Occurs. I Use Images from Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) just to make News Articles Here, and this was Applied in Fair Use, and nothing to do with Copyright. However, I think some Countries has less Fair Use and sometimes Fair Use has been Illegal. However, I do not think Real Life journalists ask People for Permission to use any Images, because Some of them are Allowed to use Fair Use for News Making, some of them are not.

I hope you heard us, because We are not Bandwidth Stealers for Suspicious and Deceptive Practices, We are Roleplayers who use Images from Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) with FAIR USE. We do not use it for Misinformation and all of Articles here are not Considered to be False News, Role-playing is just a Game that Inspires us, and we use our Creativity to do RPs. I usually involve in News Making RPs, but sometimes in war and other RPs. Please don't threaten, warn or hate us.
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Frisbeeteria
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Postby Frisbeeteria » Wed Jun 30, 2021 10:15 am

Indo States wrote:Please don't threaten, warn or hate us.

I did none of those things. I stated that site staff would not contact any other site and complain about image hosting.

Indo States wrote:Most of NationStates Users use Wikipedia (or Wikimedia Commons) Images

That's just simply untrue. People who post images are a tiny subset of our player base. People who post from Wikipedia are an even smaller subset. While you personally may be careful about such things, most of those image posters pay no attention to the concept of Fair Use and just post images from wherever Google Search finds them. That's why I included copyright in my first response.

Indo States wrote:We are not Bandwidth Stealers for Suspicious and Deceptive Practices

Fair use doesn't require them to act as an image host. You need to read their own rules on https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Reusing_content_outside_Wikimedia#Downloading

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SherpDaWerp
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Postby SherpDaWerp » Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:03 pm

The Two Jerseys wrote:
SherpDaWerp wrote:You can't. The dimensions are provided by whoever hosts the image (in this case, wikimedia commons). What could have caused wiki to stop providing them is beyond me.
Weird, I opened the URL that OP provided in my browser and it says the image is 800x600 pixels.
The actual "dimensions" of the image are 3264×2448, 800×600 is just what your browser resized it to. The <title> (which is where the 800×600 lives) isn't the sort of place any script or site looks for image metadata; it's meant to be human-readable, not script-readable.

I can coax what should be useable metadata out of the URL with a fetch() request (different to just opening the URL with your browser), which is how I found the 3264×2448. Why NS can't see that information is beyond me, though I will grant I wasn't able to find the "source" of the dimensions, only that they existed in the response. The only other discernible difference between this and this is that the latter (which works) is a .webp, while the original (that doesn't work) is .jpg, but Imgur uses .jpg without problems.

So, like, not to be a pain, but it might actually be a NS-solveable-problem, if the dimensions are still being sent and the forums just isn't looking in the right place. However, the forums are janky as hell already, and if this is another thing on the pile of "yeah, wait for the new forum", then that's equally unsurprising.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:51 pm

SherpDaWerp wrote:The actual "dimensions" of the image are 3264×2448, 800×600 is just what your browser resized it to. The <title> (which is where the 800×600 lives) isn't the sort of place any script or site looks for image metadata; it's meant to be human-readable, not script-readable.

I can coax what should be useable metadata out of the URL with a fetch() request (different to just opening the URL with your browser), which is how I found the 3264×2448. Why NS can't see that information is beyond me, though I will grant I wasn't able to find the "source" of the dimensions, only that they existed in the response. The only other discernible difference between this and this is that the latter (which works) is a .webp, while the original (that doesn't work) is .jpg, but Imgur uses .jpg without problems.

So, like, not to be a pain, but it might actually be a NS-solveable-problem, if the dimensions are still being sent and the forums just isn't looking in the right place. However, the forums are janky as hell already, and if this is another thing on the pile of "yeah, wait for the new forum", then that's equally unsurprising.


Probably, which NationStates forums required to troubleshoot this problem.

Frisbeeteria wrote:
Indo States wrote:Fair use doesn't require them to act as an image host. You need to read their own rules on https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Reusing_content_outside_Wikimedia#Downloading


However, this is not the Case, and it has Something to do with the Dimensions. Image Dimensions displayed on a browser sounds like inaccurate, and it still doesn't work.
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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Wed Jun 30, 2021 10:14 pm

Bears Armed wrote:If you save a copy of it into an actual image-hosting site, can you then adjust the size satisfactorily there?


Image

It works in Pinterest, but the original link (from wikipedia) doesn't seems to work
Last edited by Indo States on Wed Jun 30, 2021 10:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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SherpDaWerp
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Postby SherpDaWerp » Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:57 am

Indo States wrote:Probably, which NationStates forums required to troubleshoot this problem.

No, not required. If you have one takeaway from my post, don't make it that. I said it might be possible that NS could fix it.

However, this is very unlikely, (and especially so if this is a new problem, which would indicate it's something the image host changed) and you are much better off to save the image and upload to Imgur or Pinterest or wherever else that is guaranteed to work.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:57 pm

SherpDaWerp wrote:
Indo States wrote:Probably, which NationStates forums required to troubleshoot this problem.

No, not required. If you have one takeaway from my post, don't make it that. I said it might be possible that NS could fix it.

However, this is very unlikely, (and especially so if this is a new problem, which would indicate it's something the image host changed) and you are much better off to save the image and upload to Imgur or Pinterest or wherever else that is guaranteed to work.


I will do that, but it might've been fixed soon as Site Admins founds out that there is an cause for this problem.
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Sandaoguo
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Postby Sandaoguo » Fri Jul 02, 2021 7:01 am

I can show the bug report to violet if she wants it, but I won’t post it here since it would expose the likely version of phpBB NS is running. But there’s a bug with the vendor code that’s used to determine image dimensions, and it should be relatively easy to update that package. Essentially, some JPG images don’t include the dimensions in the JFIF header (stores image metadata), but the dimension-finding code only looks at the header data. Because only some Wikipedia Commons JPGs don’t work, I suspect that’s the bug at play here.

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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Fri Jul 02, 2021 7:11 am

Please could you submit a GHR regarding that and I'll make sure it's seen.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Sat Jul 03, 2021 2:02 am

It is still not fixed, and i'm having the same issue. I hope it would be fixed soon.
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Sedgistan
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Postby Sedgistan » Sat Jul 03, 2021 2:15 am

Quit bumping the thread, Indo States. It won't speed anything up.

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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Sat Jul 03, 2021 2:44 am

Sedgistan wrote:Quit bumping the thread, Indo States. It won't speed anything up.


Apologies. I will not Bumping this thread to make sure this would speed anything up. Once Again, Apologies.
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Indo States
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Postby Indo States » Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:01 am

After many Weeks of Waiting, The Issue still Occurring and the Site Admins did not fixed this issue. Sandaoguo probably did not submit a GHR Report about this Bug in the Forums, and it is been a Weeks since this Issue Occured. I Suspect that Wikipedia Images are Blocked or Banned here to Prevent Spammers from using Porn Images from there, since Wikimedia Commons Allows Porn for Educational Purposes only and this might be the Reason. I Hope site admins would Heard my Follow-up Report and to Fix this Issue on time, i am not bumping this thread again, just to make sure that the Site Admins should fix this Issue Immediately and we have no Other Options to use Images from Wikimedia Commons (or Wikipedia).
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Sandaoguo
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Postby Sandaoguo » Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:33 pm

I did submit the GHR. There's no guarantee the bug report I found is relevant. You can take images from Wikipedia Commons and upload them elsewhere, as long as the license listed on the image page allows it. For the image you're concerned about, the license is CC BY-SA 4.0 which allows you to copy the image as long as you provide attribution.

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