Deleting My Nation From NationStates

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

A while ago, my uncle and I created a fictional country and I told him about NationStates and suggested that we create it here. He approved and I made it here.

However, we are now having second thoughts. We want it to be just our concept, something just between us. However, I have already posted on my regional RMB many times and my nation is influential, so when I search my nation's name on DuckDuckGo, my NationStates page and my region page are the first results.

Is there any way to completely wipe out my nation's existence? If I let it CTE, it will still show its name and its internet exposure will not change. I know that I can not completely wipe it out of existence due to some people mentioning or quoting me, but I would like to wipe it out as much as possible.

Note: I am not talking about this nation, but a different nation. I am keeping my nation and region vague for now so the problem does not worsen.

Renaming my nation is also fine, though I do not think this is possible.

Thank you for your time.

[Toaslandia]

A while ago, my uncle and I created a fictional country and I told him about NationStates and suggested that we create it here. He approved and I made it here.

However, we are now having second thoughts. We want it to be just our concept, something just between us. However, I have already posted on my regional RMB many times and my nation is influential, so when I search my nation's name on DuckDuckGo, my NationStates page and my region page are the first results.

Is there any way to completely wipe out my nation's existence? If I let it CTE, it will still show its name and its internet exposure will not change. I know that I can not completely wipe it out of existence due to some people mentioning or quoting me, but I would like to wipe it out as much as possible.

Note: I am not talking about this nation, but a different nation. I am keeping my nation and region vague for now so the problem does not worsen.

Renaming my nation is also fine, though I do not think this is possible.

Thank you for your time.

You could wait until an apocalypse happens in your nation. To do that you have to be inactive for about a month. After that, your nation will be declared dead.

[Silver Commonwealth]

If you are a last poster in some forum thread, and no one else has posted, you can delete that post. You can also edit your posts, if thread is open, so they would not show anything (If someone has quoted them, the original post will stay, though). You can also delete your factbooks, if you want, and your signature as well, if you have an one. Otherwise, I don't have much suggestions for that.

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

A while ago, my uncle and I created a fictional country and I told him about NationStates and suggested that we create it here. He approved and I made it here.

However, we are now having second thoughts. We want it to be just our concept, something just between us. However, I have already posted on my regional RMB many times and my nation is influential, so when I search my nation's name on DuckDuckGo, my NationStates page and my region page are the first results.

Is there any way to completely wipe out my nation's existence? If I let it CTE, it will still show its name and its internet exposure will not change. I know that I can not completely wipe it out of existence due to some people mentioning or quoting me, but I would like to wipe it out as much as possible.

Note: I am not talking about this nation, but a different nation. I am keeping my nation and region vague for now so the problem does not worsen.

Renaming my nation is also fine, though I do not think this is possible.

Thank you for your time.

You could wait until an apocalypse happens in your nation. To do that you have to be inactive for about a month. After that, your nation will be declared dead.

I thought about that, but I realized that even if it CTE's, its name will still be visible.

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

If you are a last poster in some forum thread, and no one else has posted, you can delete that post. You can also edit your posts, if thread is open, so they would not show anything (If someone has quoted them, the original post will stay, though). You can also delete your factbooks, if you want, and your signature as well, if you have an one. Otherwise, I don't have much suggestions for that.

I do not post in forums much, but your advice is good for RMBs as well, so I will use it there.

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

A while ago, my uncle and I created a fictional country and I told him about NationStates and suggested that we create it here. He approved and I made it here.

However, we are now having second thoughts. We want it to be just our concept, something just between us. However, I have already posted on my regional RMB many times and my nation is influential, so when I search my nation's name on DuckDuckGo, my NationStates page and my region page are the first results.

Is there any way to completely wipe out my nation's existence? If I let it CTE, it will still show its name and its internet exposure will not change. I know that I can not completely wipe it out of existence due to some people mentioning or quoting me, but I would like to wipe it out as much as possible.

Note: I am not talking about this nation, but a different nation. I am keeping my nation and region vague for now so the problem does not worsen.

Renaming my nation is also fine, though I do not think this is possible.

Thank you for your time.

You could wait until an apocalypse happens in your nation. To do that you have to be inactive for about a month. After that, your nation will be declared dead.

If you are a last poster in some forum thread, and no one else has posted, you can delete that post. You can also edit your posts, if thread is open, so they would not show anything (If someone has quoted them, the original post will stay, though). You can also delete your factbooks, if you want, and your signature as well, if you have an one. Otherwise, I don't have much suggestions for that.

Thanks for both of your advices!

[Silver Commonwealth]

You could wait until an apocalypse happens in your nation. To do that you have to be inactive for about a month. After that, your nation will be declared dead.

If you are a last poster in some forum thread, and no one else has posted, you can delete that post. You can also edit your posts, if thread is open, so they would not show anything (If someone has quoted them, the original post will stay, though). You can also delete your factbooks, if you want, and your signature as well, if you have an one. Otherwise, I don't have much suggestions for that.

Thanks for both of your advices!

Good, that it helped.

I am more of a F7 dweller, but I have been active in region RMB's for a few times as well.

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

If any more people have some more advice, then please give it because I feel it good to have advice from multiple people in situations like this.

[Omega State]

In my opinion, there should be a simple "Delete your nation" button. would be much better than waiting a month. Even because, sometimes, that we want to play again.

[Flanderlion]

You can contact google etc. to get the results removed once you CTE. I've done it a few times, little less sure about some of the smaller search engines that don't repackage bigger ones results, but I'm pretty sure it'll also be doable on those.

[Gosnfuxvsmcusvwgahx]

Oh, BTW the only things I do on the nation in question are talking in the RMB and building embassies. But the region is large and it is one of those regions that requests embassies with everyone, so I have built 90 embassies. And I posted in an embassy region's RMB a few times.

In my opinion, there should be a simple "Delete your nation" button. would be much better than waiting a month. Even because, sometimes, that we want to play again.

I agree!

You can contact google etc. to get the results removed once you CTE. I've done it a few times, little less sure about some of the smaller search engines that don't repackage bigger ones results, but I'm pretty sure it'll also be doable on those.

That sounds like a good idea! Can my information such as my nation name and RMB posts be removed from NS itself as well, or just from web browsers?

[Dreshand]

Oh, BTW the only things I do on the nation in question are talking in the RMB and building embassies. But the region is large and it is one of those regions that requests embassies with everyone, so I have built 90 embassies. And I posted in an embassy region's RMB a few times.

In my opinion, there should be a simple "Delete your nation" button. would be much better than waiting a month. Even because, sometimes, that we want to play again.

I agree!

You can contact google etc. to get the results removed once you CTE. I've done it a few times, little less sure about some of the smaller search engines that don't repackage bigger ones results, but I'm pretty sure it'll also be doable on those.

That sounds like a good idea! Can my information such as my nation name and RMB posts be removed from NS itself as well, or just from web browsers?

The nation name will take a while, but rmb posts can be edited to just show a
--deleted--
Or something

[USS Monitor]

Oh, BTW the only things I do on the nation in question are talking in the RMB and building embassies. But the region is large and it is one of those regions that requests embassies with everyone, so I have built 90 embassies. And I posted in an embassy region's RMB a few times.


I agree!

That sounds like a good idea! Can my information such as my nation name and RMB posts be removed from NS itself as well, or just from web browsers?

The nation name will take a while, but rmb posts can be edited to just show a
--deleted--
Or something

RMB posts can be actually self-deleted, not just edited.

You can't delete your nation, though, just let it CTE.

If the name and concept of the nation were your original creations, you still own the rights to do whatever you want with it outside NS. For example, if you write a story about your nation, NS would not stop you from publishing the story.

[Omega State]

The nation name will take a while, but rmb posts can be edited to just show a
--deleted--
Or something

RMB posts can be actually self-deleted, not just edited.

You can't delete your nation, though, just let it CTE.

If the name and concept of the nation were your original creations, you still own the rights to do whatever you want with it outside NS. For example, if you write a story about your nation, NS would not stop you from publishing the story.

Is there any possibility of adding the "delete your nation" button in the future?

[USS Monitor]

RMB posts can be actually self-deleted, not just edited.

You can't delete your nation, though, just let it CTE.

If the name and concept of the nation were your original creations, you still own the rights to do whatever you want with it outside NS. For example, if you write a story about your nation, NS would not stop you from publishing the story.

Is there any possibility of adding the "delete your nation" button in the future?

I don't see a need, but it's up to admins.

[Omega State]

Is there any possibility of adding the "delete your nation" button in the future?

I don't see a need, but it's up to admins.

Ok.

[Phydios]

Is there any possibility of adding the "delete your nation" button in the future?

I don't see a need, but it's up to admins.

There's also this from the FAQ, which seems to say that the lack of this button is very much intentional on Max's part:

How do I delete my nation?

You can't. I decided it's better to have people upset because they can't start over with the same nation name than people upset because their nations got accidentally deleted. If you don't log into your nation, it will be deleted automatically in 28 days.

[Enfaru]

I don't see a need, but it's up to admins.

There's also this from the FAQ, which seems to say that the lack of this button is very much intentional on Max's part:

How do I delete my nation?

You can't. I decided it's better to have people upset because they can't start over with the same nation name than people upset because their nations got accidentally deleted. If you don't log into your nation, it will be deleted automatically in 28 days.

It's that latter bit that's the issue. While some nations get destroyed completely and the name basically put up for immediate reuse, other nations are not.

I'd definitely like a "Delete me now!" button in line with the GDPR's forget me provisions.

edit: To clarify, I would only expect this to be valid on nations who have actually CTE'd for six months or more. So as well as a 'Restore me' feature there's a 'Forget me' element. Perhaps using an email as a 2 factor authentication (which would require nations without to restore the nation, grab an email, wait for it to CTE again...delete...just to make life really difficult).

[Frisbeeteria]

While some nations get destroyed completely and the name basically put up for immediate reuse, other nations are not.

Explain this statement, please. It's simply not true ... unless you're trying to say something using words that actually mean something else.

I personally delete more nations than anyone other than Update, and none of them are ever "destroyed completely". They get archived just like every CTE nation. Neither CTE nor DEAT nations are available for "immediate reuse". The difference is that mod-deleted nations cannot be refounded.

I'd definitely like a "Delete me now!" button in line with the GDPR's forget me provisions.

GDPR is about getting rid of personally identifying information (PII). Nation names, fields, and issue outcome text are not PII. We do remove actual PII content within the nation (email, IPs, and other GDPR relevant content.)

Perhaps using an email as a 2 factor authentication

How can we hang on to an email address as part of a 2FA scheme and also comply with GDPR? The email address is one of the essential things to be removed.

[Enfaru]

Disclaimer: I am aware this proposal has not a chance in hell, because nation deletion has already been long thrown out. I might not necessarily be happy with that but meh. The below is provided as an option should Max ever consider lightening up the policy. Additionally the below should be taken with the knowledge that I'm a overly paranoid (Tor user), data sensitive (pgp user), disestablishmentarian (you have first hand knowledge)...with a probably not healthy streak of libertarianism (EFF supporter), fool (see all of the above), who is more than happy to engage in hypothetical exercises when given the opportunity. The below should not be taken as a final proposal, errors are quite likely scattered throughout and could quite honestly do with some tweaking.

While some nations get destroyed completely and the name basically put up for immediate reuse, other nations are not.

Explain this statement, please. It's simply not true ... unless you're trying to say something using words that actually mean something else.

If I CTE, two years later I can restore my nation quite happily with all of its dispatches and settings. Just an example of how some nations are not destroyed completely. Nowadays even some flag choices are saved and I'm beginning to suspect (albeit haven't tested) that user uploaded flags are also saved. (Not that I object to that). If nation who does not meet certain criteria they are effectively wiped from existence and the names recycled as dictated by the Name Reuse policy.

I personally delete more nations than anyone other than Update, and none of them are ever "destroyed completely". They get archived just like every CTE nation. Neither CTE nor DEAT nations are available for "immediate reuse". The difference is that mod-deleted nations cannot be refounded.

The qualifying statement is basically, as per the name re-use policy. I will concede I could have phrased that segment much better.

I'd definitely like a "Delete me now!" button in line with the GDPR's forget me provisions.

GDPR is about getting rid of personally identifying information (PII). Nation names, fields, and issue outcome text are not PII. We do remove actual PII content within the nation (email, IPs, and other GDPR relevant content.)

Perhaps using an email as a 2 factor authentication

How can we hang on to an email address as part of a 2FA scheme and also comply with GDPR? The email address is one of the essential things to be removed.

At the moment you currently hang on to email addresses after a nation has CTE'd, how else can a user reset a password to a CTE'd account? This information is not scrubbed to my knowledge. The two factor scheme would work as such.


Nation CTE's, max has made it clear he'd like to give users an extended chance to come back, some information isn't deleted automatically.

Six months later, nation decides, "Nope I want them to destroy the nation completely including scrubbing all my dispatches, uploaded information, personal information and so on."

User comes to the Nationstate's site, attempts to log into their nation.

Nationstates brings up two options: 1. Restore. 2. Eradicate and allow name to be reused.

Choosing option 2 sends an email to the user for them to verify they know what they want to do and that it is irreversible.

User confirms via email and Nationstates scrubs everything. A good old, shred and randomize would be very effective here, although I appreciate that forum content cannot easily be removed. If a nation wishes to do that, they can delete the content themselves if not the posts. In other words, it is only at this point that the personal data and copyrighted submissions (because the granted copyright license can be revoked) can and should be removed.

[Phydios]

If nation does not meet certain criteria they are effectively wiped from existence and the names recycled as dictated by the Name Reuse policy.

I can't speak with the authoritative voice of a moderator, but I don't think that's how it works. Experience with the Boneyard and the name release thread seems to show something rather different. Below is my understanding.

All nation names are reserved for at least five years, during which time the nation is preserved and eligible for revival. Only then may be the name be available for reuse, and only if it meets the criteria. The nation may be revived at any time unless the name is reused, at which point the original nation is marked "ancient" and can no longer be revived. (I would expect it to be deleted at this time, but again, I don't have knowledge there.) A nation is never "destroyed completely" unless it CTE'd over 5 years ago and its name is reused.

[Starpoint]

I think if you go into the settings you can rename your nation. If the one you made is still around, you could do that. I’m not sure if that works for you or not.

[Tinhampton]

I think if you go into the settings you can rename your nation. If the one you made is still around, you could do that. I’m not sure if that works for you or not.

Not quite. The name change only allows for recapitalisations (for instance, I can change my name from "Tinhampton" to "TiNhAmPtOn" or "TINHAMPTON," but I cannot change it to - say - "Bigtopia," even if that name were available).

[Starpoint]

I think if you go into the settings you can rename your nation. If the one you made is still around, you could do that. I’m not sure if that works for you or not.

Not quite. The name change only allows for recapitalisations (for instance, I can change my name from "Tinhampton" to "TiNhAmPtOn" or "TINHAMPTON," but I cannot change it to - say - "Bigtopia," even if that name were available).

Ah, okay. My mistake.

[Frisbeeteria]

I can't speak with the authoritative voice of a moderator, but I don't think that's how it works.

I can. That's not how it works.

If nation who does not meet certain criteria they are effectively wiped from existence and the names recycled as dictated by the Name Reuse policy.

(I would expect it to be deleted at this time, but again, I don't have knowledge there.) A nation is never "destroyed completely" unless it CTE'd over 5 years ago and its name is reused.

It's not "destroyed" even then. It just goes into an irretrievable archive. Game Mods and admins have full access to the old content, with the proviso that anyone who chooses to "scrub" GDPR data does in fact remove that PII content. Stuff like "nation stats", "issues answered" and "zombie choices" aren't PII, and are preserved for eternity ... or until something comes along and wipes out our hard drives and all backups. Even the over-full disk destruction of the "0 of 0" nations a few years back didn't touch our backups. Most or all of the nations lost to that hardware fault were eventually restored.