Postmaster-General Auto-Forward TG Option

[[violet]]

So as I've been going crazy creating more puppets of late, I started thinking about what if I get important TGs sent to them? I don't intend to check the vast majority of these puppets at any frequency. 90% will likely be in vacation mode and only see me when the apocalypse is approaching.

I've found some prior material on the issue:
https://forum.nationstates.net/search.php?keywords=forwarding&fid%5B0%5D=15
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=359310&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=317697&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=258279&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=169721&hilit=forwarding

From what I can tell no one has specifically mentioned adding it as a Postmaster-General feature. If my memory serves many of those threads predate the implementation of the PMG. How it would work would be that any PMG can set up an automatic forwarding of TGs from other nations, requiring of course some form of consent from the other nation. The feature could be limited to XXX number of nations if there are technical limitations to be had of having too many "links" so to speak between nations.

This would add further reason to upgrade at least one nation to the PMG, which would serve nations and of course help keep the lights on.

Just a thought I figured I'd share. Comments from the peanut gallery?

[United German Regions]

So as I've been going crazy creating more puppets of late, I started thinking about what if I get important TGs sent to them? I don't intend to check the vast majority of these puppets at any frequency. 90% will likely be in vacation mode and only see me when the apocalypse is approaching.

I've found some prior material on the issue:
https://forum.nationstates.net/search.php?keywords=forwarding&fid%5B0%5D=15
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=359310&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=317697&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=258279&hilit=forwarding
https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=169721&hilit=forwarding

From what I can tell no one has specifically mentioned adding it as a Postmaster-General feature. If my memory serves many of those threads predate the implementation of the PMG. How it would work would be that any PMG can set up an automatic forwarding of TGs from other nations, requiring of course some form of consent from the other nation. The feature could be limited to XXX number of nations if there are technical limitations to be had of having too many "links" so to speak between nations.

This would add further reason to upgrade at least one nation to the PMG, which would serve nations and of course help keep the lights on.

Just a thought I figured I'd share. Comments from the peanut gallery?

So, the puppet accounts would not require any sort of additional membership? This would be a neat feature to see come and would make me have reason to upgrade my account.

[Almonaster Nuevo]

One general problem with auto-forwarding is creating loops. (e.g. A->B, B-A; or A->B, B->C, C->A). Those tend to break the system.
How would you propose preventing them?

[Kanzaki Ranko]

One general problem with auto-forwarding is creating loops. (e.g. A->B, B-A; or A->B, B->C, C->A). Those tend to break the system.
How would you propose preventing them?

Would it be possible to make it so nations registered as recipients could not also be senders of automatically forwarded TGs?

[Almonaster Nuevo]

There are many ways of doing it, and most of them have some technicalities involved. I was looking to get a response from the OP to see which variant fits their intentions.

[Frisbeeteria]

This would add further reason to upgrade at least one nation to the PMG, which would serve nations and of course help keep the lights on.

This would be relatively easy if we used a Master Account which held all your nations. You'd simply have a nice communal inbox if you wanted it.

But that's not the reality here. Each player has somewhere between one and ten thousand individual nations, effectively unrelated to one another. There's no easy way to automatically say "all these nations belong to this player". You can't use IP addresses, or all 78 of the kids attending Podunkville Middle School would share a mailbox. You can't use email addresses, because I could steal your telegrams if I knew your email address (we don't require email verification except for WA membership).

I'm sure you could set up an auto-forward system, but it would be cumbersome and clunky and difficult to verify. I think it would also require PmG membership for EACH puppet, which probably prices it out of almost everyone's reach. I can't imagine it would be a high priority for the admins.

[United German Regions]

This would add further reason to upgrade at least one nation to the PMG, which would serve nations and of course help keep the lights on.

This would be relatively easy if we used a Master Account which held all your nations. You'd simply have a nice communal inbox if you wanted it.

But that's not the reality here. Each player has somewhere between one and ten thousand individual nations, effectively unrelated to one another. There's no easy way to automatically say "all these nations belong to this player". You can't use IP addresses, or all 78 of the kids attending Podunkville Middle School would share a mailbox. You can't use email addresses, because I could steal your telegrams if I knew your email address (we don't require email verification except for WA membership).

I'm sure you could set up an auto-forward system, but it would be cumbersome and clunky and difficult to verify. I think it would also require PmG membership for EACH puppet, which probably prices it out of almost everyone's reach. I can't imagine it would be a high priority for the admins.

There could be an ID given to each nation in their settings menu that a nation could insert in a "link" type box on a puppet to tell the telegram system what ID to re-direct to. This would be a somewhat reasonable system.

Now, on to the cost of the situation, I am pretty sure he was stating that the puppet accounts would not need PmG status, only the main account receiving these telegrams. Otherwise you would be right because I could not afford to spend money on NS to PmG the 300-400 accounts I own. Clearly though, this would suggest an increase in cost of PmG to some degree as it provides a significant advantage and allows players access to a more complicated addition.

[Lord Dominator]

If I'm understanding correctly, your proposed system is to give PMG accounts some sort of ID unique to this system that can be inputted into some new box on other accounts to automatically forward telegrams to the PMG account. If so, I support this.
The only concern I think that would arise from the this situation would be someone's ID getting out and then said person being spammed by telegrams by other people. This could presumably be solved either by allowing telegram blockage to apply to forwarders (if not already the case), or just treating sharing your ID with other people the same way sharing accounts already is.

[Frisbeeteria]

If I'm understanding correctly, your proposed system is to give PMG accounts some sort of ID unique to this system that can be inputted into some new box on other accounts to automatically forward telegrams to the PMG account.

I'm sure there are better ways. You could simply input a nation name, and then use an email address and password to log on and verify ownership of that related nation. Any unique "this is mine" field would be hidden from player view. Mind you, shared nations would majorly screw this up.

That said, it's not a compelling argument for what would doubtless be a MAJOR change to how telegrams are stored and held. We'd need a significant change in nation management, and a significant change in telegram management. Yes, it would be nice, but I'm not going to bet long odds on anyone tackling it at this time.

[Right-Wing _America]

One general problem with auto-forwarding is creating loops. (e.g. A->B, B-A; or A->B, B->C, C->A). Those tend to break the system.
How would you propose preventing them?

The most practical thing I can think of would be to code it in a way that limits the forwards to a single forward from A->B. Obviously more complex to do that but it would be necessary to prevent the problem.

This would add further reason to upgrade at least one nation to the PMG, which would serve nations and of course help keep the lights on.

This would be relatively easy if we used a Master Account which held all your nations. You'd simply have a nice communal inbox if you wanted it.

But that's not the reality here. Each player has somewhere between one and ten thousand individual nations, effectively unrelated to one another. There's no easy way to automatically say "all these nations belong to this player". You can't use IP addresses, or all 78 of the kids attending Podunkville Middle School would share a mailbox. You can't use email addresses, because I could steal your telegrams if I knew your email address (we don't require email verification except for WA membership).

I'm sure you could set up an auto-forward system, but it would be cumbersome and clunky and difficult to verify. I think it would also require PmG membership for EACH puppet, which probably prices it out of almost everyone's reach. I can't imagine it would be a high priority for the admins.

A Master Account would certainly make it easy. If a MA were instituted email verification could be extended beyond WA Membership. Even without a MA it could still be used for additional elements. I don't know what the arguments are for/against widening email verification. I personally don't know why it isn't used more broadly since it seems relatively standard among websites of all kinds.

You have a point about PMG membership for each puppet and it quickly kills the worth of the idea. Unless the store options are expanded. You could purchase a PMG package that can be applied to multiple nations, for a higher price of course. The problem of course goes back to verification, which I would point to expanding email verification.

There could be an ID given to each nation in their settings menu that a nation could insert in a "link" type box on a puppet to tell the telegram system what ID to re-direct to. This would be a somewhat reasonable system.

Now, on to the cost of the situation, I am pretty sure he was stating that the puppet accounts would not need PmG status, only the main account receiving these telegrams. Otherwise you would be right because I could not afford to spend money on NS to PmG the 300-400 accounts I own. Clearly though, this would suggest an increase in cost of PmG to some degree as it provides a significant advantage and allows players access to a more complicated addition.

Regarding the ID, the API Verification system essentially provides a unique code. That could just as easily be used for verification too. At least based on my understanding of how it all works.

Beside increasing cost of the current package, it could just be a matter of introducing more store options, with more price levels. I think the store needs more options anyway, even out of the context of auto forwarding.

As an example:
Supporter: $2.99 - One time
Sustaining Supporter: $2.99 - Monthly (Or Quarterly, Monthly & Yearly Options) (maybe the option to choose a custom amount too)
Postmaster - $4.99
Postmaster-General: $9.99 - One time (Auto-forwarding up to 10 nations)
Postmaster-General of the World - $24.99 - One time (Auto-forwarding up to 250 nations) (+2000 stamps instead of 500)
Postmaster-Czar - $49.99 - One Time (Auto-forwarding up for an *unlimited number of nations) (+5000 stamps)

[Flanderlion]

Or a subscription type thing ($2.99 to forward all TGs to an account) etc.

[Drasnia]

I would rather NS not adopt a subscription-based model for donations. I think if it were ever implemented (though it would most definitely be a lot of work and as such probably won't be), the unlimited number of forwards should get added to PMG and a limited number to PM.