New TG system: Q&A Thread

[Auralia]

What about a %%REGION%% tag/whatever you call it thingy? When sending WA TGs, I often like to include their region name. Sometimes WADs are replaced between when I send the TG and when they read it, or perhaps they move, etc., so that helps to clarify who/why I'm sending the TG to them.

I'm used to hand-typing the nation and region name, but ... I'm okay with making that part of my TG process easier ...

EDIT: Unless such a tag would change as the target nation moves from region to region? I'd figure that if it would stay static as whatever region they resided in when the TG was sent, it could be useful.

There was some discussion about this in the API thread, starting here.

[Atmos]

I appreciate the response, and you're likely right. At the risk of being Captain Obvious... If that's the only thing holding you back, perhaps the tag could be enabled for all nations, as part of the new TG system. But I'm sure that's something you've considered already.

Either way, well done. I'm looking forward to the documented API, as it sounds like it's coming along nicely!

Images take space. Space takes time. People don't want to spend time waiting for their TG box to open each time.

That would be the case if the images were hosted on NS's server. Given they'd be off-server links, there would be no delay in the TG box opening. The only possible delay you'd have, if you were on a slow connection, is in seeing the actual images. But the message itself would load as fast as it would if no images were present. You'd just see a blank area in the message until the image loaded.

[The Most Glorious Hack]

I would imagine current rules continue to apply, i.e. there will still be situations where some messages are arguably recruitment TGs and arguably not. But under the new system, only messages marked as recruitment TGs get the 1-click "move to <region>" button, so any "stealth recruitment TG" would miss out on that.

But overall, are the rules of what constitutes recruitment going to be more relaxed?

Yes, yes, we know what you're driving at.

[Mallorea and Riva]

Recruitment is recruitment is recruitment is recruitment.

Except none of those are really recruitment.

Except the mods determined that the first was recruitment when they deleted Unibot II, the second after explaining it to Unibot, and the third just seems like a way to get around the recruitment rules by directing them to go to a site where they can be recruited.

[Mahaj]

Except none of those are really recruitment.

Except the mods determined that the first was recruitment when they deleted Unibot II, the second after explaining it to Unibot, and the third just seems like a way to get around the recruitment rules by directing them to go to a site where they can be recruited.

I fail to see how "Hey Mall, can we talk on IRC?" is recruitment.

[Warhaven]

If I beg really hard would that get the new system installed sooner? If not, then what, besides the Q&A thread, is the hold up really?

[Sanctaria]

If I beg really hard would that get the new system installed sooner? If not, then what, besides the Q&A thread, is the hold up really?

I'm assuming [violet] has a day job, a family, and needs to sleep.

[Great Nepal]

If I beg really hard would that get the new system installed sooner? If not, then what, besides the Q&A thread, is the hold up really?

[violet] would be able to if he wasn't having to spend 24/7 answering questions here...

[Tramiar]

Except the mods determined that the first was recruitment when they deleted Unibot II, the second after explaining it to Unibot, and the third just seems like a way to get around the recruitment rules by directing them to go to a site where they can be recruited.

I fail to see how "Hey Mall, can we talk on IRC?" is recruitment.

Because we all know where you're going with that. Like Mall said, its a way to get around the recruitment rules. You don't just want to talk, you want to recruit them. I'm not sure why you even need a way around recruitment unless you're trying to recruit people who don't want recruited. In which case, take a hint and move on.

[Glen-Rhodes]

Except none of those are really recruitment.

Except the mods determined that the first was recruitment when they deleted Unibot II, the second after explaining it to Unibot, and the third just seems like a way to get around the recruitment rules by directing them to go to a site where they can be recruited.

Wasn't the ruling based on the fact that Unibot wasn't allowed to recruit in UCRs? Looking at the ruling, that was indeed the issue. Now that recruitment is player-centered, it doesn't matter where the player is. There's no issue of founders/delegates "controlling inboxes."

I don't see how that mod determination isn't nullified by this change. Tsaraine even seemed to allude to it.

[Tramiar]

Except the mods determined that the first was recruitment when they deleted Unibot II, the second after explaining it to Unibot, and the third just seems like a way to get around the recruitment rules by directing them to go to a site where they can be recruited.

Wasn't the ruling based on the fact that Unibot wasn't allowed to recruit in UCRs? Looking at the ruling, that was indeed the issue. Now that recruitment is player-centered, it doesn't matter where the player is. There's no issue of founders/delegates "controlling inboxes."

I don't see how that mod determination isn't nullified by this change. Tsaraine even seemed to allude to it.

Just because it's allowed now doesn't mean it isn't recruitment. It's only legal recruitment.

[Glen-Rhodes]

Just because it's allowed now doesn't mean it isn't recruitment. It's only legal recruitment.

I don't understand what you're trying to say, here. :| Does the UDL just not want to be called a recruiter or something? It seems to me that Unibot is now allowed to do what he wanted to a while ago. That is, the UDL as an organization is allowed to advertise its "affiliate regions" and even advertise its own region/organization. This is because recruiting rules are no longer going to be region-based, and the mod rulings all relied on region-based things.

[Tramiar]

Just because it's allowed now doesn't mean it isn't recruitment. It's only legal recruitment.

I don't understand what you're trying to say, here. :| Does the UDL just not want to be called a recruiter or something?

That was my question for my post before that last one. Mahaj seems determined to make sure that it won't be called recruitment. The only reason I can think of he would want it to not be recruitment is to get past the recruiting rules, and to attempt to recruit those who have blocked recruitment TGs.

[Sedgistan]

Yeah, Tramiar is right - Mahaj's questions seem to be leading towards whether a recruiting TG for defending/the UDL would have to be labelled as a recruiting one when sent through the TG system. We haven't set up definite rules for the new TG system, but the answer is probably yes - if you're recruiting, whether for a region or an organisation, you're going to have to label that as a recruiting telegram.

If you want to rules lawyer it down to "but can I use it to promote defending, or to ask whether someone can join an IRC channel (where you'll try to recruit him)" then you need to ask yourself why you're trying to get around someone choosing to block recruiting TGs.

[Johz]

Yeah, Tramiar is right - Mahaj's questions seem to be leading towards whether a recruiting TG for defending/the UDL would have to be labelled as a recruiting one when sent through the TG system. We haven't set up definite rules for the new TG system, but the answer is probably yes - if you're recruiting, whether for a region or an organisation, you're going to have to label that as a recruiting telegram.

If you want to rules lawyer it down to "but can I use it to promote defending, or to ask whether someone can join an IRC channel (where you'll try to recruit him)" then you need to ask yourself why you're trying to get around someone choosing to block recruiting TGs.

Perhaps because of the "move to" button? If you had some sort of aregional organisation, like the UDL is, then having a big button telling people to move to a region isn't very helpful. As a result, I suspect Mahaj was trying to ask if he could send normal TGs that don't include a "move to this region" button, but still recruit through them.

[Glen-Rhodes]

Perhaps because of the "move to" button? If you had some sort of aregional organisation, like the UDL is, then having a big button telling people to move to a region isn't very helpful. As a result, I suspect Mahaj was trying to ask if he could send normal TGs that don't include a "move to this region" button, but still recruit through them.

I don't think TGs recruiting to anything should be sent as anything other than recruitment TGs. The "move region" button doesn't seem like a big enough reason to not label them as recruitment TGs.

[Johz]

Perhaps because of the "move to" button? If you had some sort of aregional organisation, like the UDL is, then having a big button telling people to move to a region isn't very helpful. As a result, I suspect Mahaj was trying to ask if he could send normal TGs that don't include a "move to this region" button, but still recruit through them.

I don't think TGs recruiting to anything should be sent as anything other than recruitment TGs. The "move region" button doesn't seem like a big enough reason to not label them as recruitment TGs.

True. Maybe a better solution would be the "move region" button being optional (defaulting to on)?

[Riemstagrad]

seems to be a big improvement, that new system!

congrats on everyone who worked on it!

[All Good People]

Agreed, I'm looking forward to it. And I really appreciate the effort. Thank you

[Abatael]

I believe it says somewhere in here, but I can't find it, but is this planned to be released within the week?

[West Guyua]

When will the new TG system be activated?

[Jamie Anumia]

I believe it says somewhere in here, but I can't find it, but is this planned to be released within the week?

When will the new TG system be activated?

Here.

[Hileville]

I believe it says somewhere in here, but I can't find it, but is this planned to be released within the week?

When will the new TG system be activated?

Here.

So if everyone wants it to be implemented stop answering questions. I think a lot of the questions that have been asked about this are extremely hypothetical and it would be best to just wait and see what happens after release.

[Mallorea and Riva]

GR see everything Tram and Sedge said, they hit it on the head. I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying, I'm just saying that it *is* recruitment. Whether or not it will be legal is up to the mods.

[Jamie Anumia]

Here.

So if everyone wants it to be implemented stop answering questions. I think a lot of the questions that have been asked about this are extremely hypothetical and it would be best to just wait and see what happens after release.

I disagree actually. I think some of the questions are best to be answered now. The TG system will be finished sooner or later anyway.
On that note, I do have a question. Will these 'recruitment reports' be statistic based - such as "10% of nations move to your region.." or just general showing which nations moved to the region?