New TG system: Q&A Thread

[Sanctaria]

Except that it increases the likelihood of illegal proposals getting to quorum. I think perhaps you should check in with the WA mods as well, before you rush into this. Neglecting to do so has reaped disastrous results in the past...

Oh, believe me, I don't touch the WA any more without sign-off from a small army of mods and stakeholders. This is what I mean by "requires a proper discussion."

Good to hear, because I don't like Quelesh's suggestion, as beneficial as it may be to us authors.

[[violet]]

It'll probably be late in the week. I don't want to change docs until their instructions will actually work, and the Mass TG stuff is going to be the last part to come online.

Could you post a draft version in a separate place for now (don't replace the existing API docs), just so we developers can get ready?

Sending telegrams via the API

1. Compose your telegram, addressing it to "tag:api". You may wish to make use of the %NATION% macro, which auto-expands into the name of each recipient.
2. Click SEND.
3. Your telegram will be registered as a template, and you will be shown instructions on how to deliver it. This involves noting two pieces of information: its TGID and its secret key. You can then use these to make API calls to:
   
   

   Code: Select all

   http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/api.cgi?a=sendTG&to=(nation_name)&tgid=(TGID)&key=(secret key)

[Auralia]

Could you post a draft version in a separate place for now (don't replace the existing API docs), just so we developers can get ready?

Sending telegrams via the API

1. Compose your telegram, addressing it to "tag:api". You may wish to make use of the %NATION% macro, which auto-expands into the name of each recipient.
2. Click SEND.
3. Your telegram will be registered as a template, and you will be shown instructions on how to deliver it. This involves noting two pieces of information: its TGID and its secret key. You can then use these to make API calls to:
   
   

   Code: Select all

   http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/api.cgi?a=sendTG&to=(nation_name)&tgid=(TGID)&key=(secret key)

How do you address a telegram to "tag:api"? For how long do templates remain valid? What do you mean when you say that we "will be shown instructions on how to deliver it"?

[Cerberion]

Could you post a draft version in a separate place for now (don't replace the existing API docs), just so we developers can get ready? :)

Sending telegrams via the API

1. Compose your telegram, addressing it to "tag:api". You may wish to make use of the %NATION% macro, which auto-expands into the name of each recipient.
2. Click SEND.
3. Your telegram will be registered as a template, and you will be shown instructions on how to deliver it. This involves noting two pieces of information: its TGID and its secret key. You can then use these to make API calls to:
   
   

   Code: Select all

   http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/api.cgi?a=sendTG&to=(nation_name)&tgid=(TGID)&key=(secret key)

Okay, gbut if it's a recruitment TG how does the API get notified of this?

I can see a lot of good reasons to push stuff through the API, from forum integration as well as regional announcements. Some might be considered bulk, but others might be highly important and need to be treated ike a direct TG.

Shouldn't there either be an additional variable to identify the type of message?

[Lazzarania]

Lazzarania: No... I feel like you're just trying to argue. So unless you actually figure out what I'm talking about and come up with an argument that's even talking about the same things as me, I'm probably not going to bother with your "replies".

I don't care what you "feel"? I could just as easily say, "I feel you are being obtuse, so please go right ahead and cease bothering with me, as it suits me just fine." And, the "other" possibility is that you don't have the foggiest about what I'm talking about.

[The Ben Boys]

I totally agree, I was merely saying that it should be the next major update or improvement. Now that we actually have a method in which to pay the site, I'm probably going to set up a PayPal for the first time ever.

You don't need to actually, it'll take it directly last I heard.

And I don't think they'd be able to make it free, since saving each theme takes up space on the server. We have over 100k nations in the game at any given point in time, if say maybe 5% use the custom themes, that's still 5000 nations worth of custom themes.

And? I'm referring to the box at the top, which should still have parameters similar to the thousands of custom flags (a bit larger, of course).

[Frisbeeteria]

How do you address a telegram to "tag:api"? For how long do templates remain valid? What do you mean when you say that we "will be shown instructions on how to deliver it"?

Y'know, if you waited until the TG system was actually delivered, the answers would almost certainly be obvious.

[Individuality-ness]

You don't need to actually, it'll take it directly last I heard.

And I don't think they'd be able to make it free, since saving each theme takes up space on the server. We have over 100k nations in the game at any given point in time, if say maybe 5% use the custom themes, that's still 5000 nations worth of custom themes.

And? I'm referring to the box at the top, which should still have parameters similar to the thousands of custom flags (a bit larger, of course).

I'm not sure whether that's really negotiable, flags are like avatars and they can be changed easily, but the headers are part of the stylesheet of the theme, and if you let them mess with the stylesheet with the header, then you'd have to do the same for everything else, which brings us back to the beginning.

[[violet]]

How do you address a telegram to "tag:api"? For how long do templates remain valid? What do you mean when you say that we "will be shown instructions on how to deliver it"?

Y'know, if you waited until the TG system was actually delivered, the answers would almost certainly be obvious.

This is true: There's a limit to how well I can describe what you're about to see, and you're going to see it soon enough anyway. You will have time to prepare; the bulk of the new TG system will come online first, without Mass TGs or the API.

Templates remain valid forever.

[Auralia]

Templates remain valid forever.

Really! That's really interesting. You're not concerned about storage space?

[Tramiar]

I don't care what you "feel"? I could just as easily say, "I feel you are being obtuse, so please go right ahead and cease bothering with me, as it suits me just fine." And, the "other" possibility is that you don't have the foggiest about what I'm talking about.

Except from your posts, I'm judging we're on the same side, yet you continue trying to argue with me. Which means this is pointless. At any rate, this conversation isn't helping what this thread is about.


When you say we're going to have this new system in "a few days", does that mean like 3, or more like a week and a half?

[Lazzarania]

I don't care what you "feel"? I could just as easily say, "I feel you are being obtuse, so please go right ahead and cease bothering with me, as it suits me just fine." And, the "other" possibility is that you don't have the foggiest about what I'm talking about.

Except from your posts, I'm judging we're on the same side, yet you continue trying to argue with me. Which means this is pointless. At any rate, this conversation isn't helping what this thread is about.

I'm happy that you finally noticed that I made the mistake of confusing Tim-Opolis for Afforess. My original post makes no sense if I were agreeing with Afforess. So, let's celebrate the fact that both of us agree on the basics.

[Todd McCloud]

So I finally spotted this feature (coming soon) that will allow the ability for myself to send a mass-TG to my region. All I could think of was this (warning: has images):

But seriously, and I apologize if this has already been asked, but does this feature apply to everyone in the region? Like, say I was disgruntled and had no power in the region, but a lot of cash to purchase stamps, could I send out mass TG after mass TG telling everyone the delegate was a dork?

[Great Nepal]

Templates remain valid forever.

Really! That's really interesting. You're not concerned about storage space?

Well, I think storing hundreds of identical recruitment tg's is more demanding on storage than one copy of recruitment tg. Atleast unless someone wants to crash NS...

[Jormengand]

So I finally spotted this feature (coming soon) that will allow the ability for myself to send a mass-TG to my region. All I could think of was this (warning: has images):

(Image) (Image) (Image)

But seriously, and I apologize if this has already been asked, but does this feature apply to everyone in the region? Like, say I was disgruntled and had no power in the region, but a lot of cash to purchase stamps, could I send out mass TG after mass TG telling everyone the delegate was a dork?

Yes; the fact that the mods might not like you much for it is another matter.

[Torisakia]

Just a question, will we be able to opt out of receiving TGs entirely? Because most of the ones I get don't even have anything nice to say.

[Jormengand]

Just a question, will we be able to opt out of receiving TGs entirely? Because most of the ones I get don't even have anything nice to say.

From what's already been said, you can opt out of every category of TGs, and all untyped mass TGs. I think that the only ones you can't opt out of are untyped non-mass ones.

[Torisakia]

Just a question, will we be able to opt out of receiving TGs entirely? Because most of the ones I get don't even have anything nice to say.

From what's already been said, you can opt out of every category of TGs, and all untyped mass TGs. I think that the only ones you can't opt out of are untyped non-mass ones.

Ok. Because the only TGs I get(mostly during football season) are about how much of an "asshole" I am. So unless it's an untyped non-mass TG, I won't receive it.

[Jormengand]

From what's already been said, you can opt out of every category of TGs, and all untyped mass TGs. I think that the only ones you can't opt out of are untyped non-mass ones.

Ok. Because the only TGs I get(mostly during football season) are about how much of an "asshole" I am. So unless it's an untyped non-mass TG, I won't receive it.

...

Unfortunately, that's going to be the most likely category (or lack thereof). Why not send GHRs if it's getting bad?

[Torisakia]

Ok. Because the only TGs I get(mostly during football season) are about how much of an "asshole" I am. So unless it's an untyped non-mass TG, I won't receive it.

...

Unfortunately, that's going to be the most likely category (or lack thereof). Why not send GHRs if it's getting bad?

Nah. I usually delete them. I did report one once, but I got in trouble because the mods thought that I "provoked" them into sending it.

[Laevendell]

Are there any plans on the API to handle some kind of login access to telegrams, apart from using telegrams templates, but working in a similar fashion? I know implementing OAuth is a hassle, but what if a nation could go to a certain page when logged in on the site (the Settings page or something logical) and generate a secret key.

This key could then be used in API calls to identify the nation and perform some actions, like sending a telegram to one nation as if it was sent on the site or fetching your inbox (perhaps with an offset, if it would be too much for the server to parse out many at once).
A user could then optionally use this key in external applications to access these functionalities and they should be able to regenerate (and perhaps turn off) the secret key, if they think it might be compromised.

If this (or similar solutions) won't work or can't be implemented at this time, is it still fine for an external application to log in to the site, fetch telegrams and send from there (not automatically, but responding to user input)?

[Treznor]

I apologize for re-posting it, but the discussion appears to have moved past my comment and I'd really like to see a response to this:

Plus, will there then be offenses for not clicking a "Recruitment Telegram" button? What if I forget or think I click it and it doesn't register. Will I then get a Warning on my nation for such a trivial thing?

The system pops up a warning if you attempt to send a Mass TG (i.e. a telegram that's going out to more than just one nation) that's not a recruitment or campaign TG, just to make sure. So hopefully no-one does this by accident. But to answer the question: Yes, it will definitely be an offense to send a recruitment TG without marking it as such. We won't be draconian about this while everyone's getting used to it, but it will be a violation of the spam rules.

Well, I see that I'll be looking forward to having my inbox inundated with spam until you crack down on this. People don't read the rules as they are now; this will just make it easier for them to make a mistake.

Proposal: make recruitment "opt-in" until the trial period has expired, then flip it to "opt-out." People who frequently appear in the top rankings are among the top targets for recruitment spam because of newbies who can't be bothered to read the rules.

[Atmos]

Suggestion: Perhaps the enabling of the [img] tag in TG's could be added to one of the two Postmaster features?

I think that's edging into dangerous territory, since recruitment messages with images would be far more arresting than text ones, and it would therefore make a paid account pretty much essential for any recruiter. That's not something we want to do.

I appreciate the response, and you're likely right. At the risk of being Captain Obvious... If that's the only thing holding you back, perhaps the tag could be enabled for all nations, as part of the new TG system. But I'm sure that's something you've considered already.

Either way, well done. I'm looking forward to the documented API, as it sounds like it's coming along nicely!

[Jormengand]

I think that's edging into dangerous territory, since recruitment messages with images would be far more arresting than text ones, and it would therefore make a paid account pretty much essential for any recruiter. That's not something we want to do.

I appreciate the response, and you're likely right. At the risk of being Captain Obvious... If that's the only thing holding you back, perhaps the tag could be enabled for all nations, as part of the new TG system. But I'm sure that's something you've considered already.

Either way, well done. I'm looking forward to the documented API, as it sounds like it's coming along nicely!

Images take space. Space takes time. People don't want to spend time waiting for their TG box to open each time.

[Buddyland]

Will we be allowed to transfer telegram stamps between nations?