NationStates

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:06 am**

Thinking about issues being less Euro/American-centric, and found this article about a uniquely African situation. Have considered using @@ANIMAL@@ instead, but I think its better grounded in the reality of actual lions.

As to assumptions about player nations, I think it's no worse than assuming the nation has many of the other animals we've assumed.

The biggest worry here is overlap with 1298, which is why I've played down the real life issue of this being related to ranches and farmers, and made it purely about the human loss of life, which I think is enough to make it distinct. Opinions on that welcome, however.

IRL, they opted for option 2.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-48553562

draft 3:

TITLE:
A Question of Pride

VALIDITY:
top 75% environment

DESCRIPTION:
A pride of lions has come into conflict with their human neighbours, leading to the mauling and subsequent death of a young @@MAN@@.

OPTION 1a - ZOOS NOT BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains village elder @@randomname@@. "Put them in a zoo for tourists to gawk at, and turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 1b - ZOOS BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains farmer @@randomname@@. "Back in the old days we used to have zoos to keep beasts in, till some idiot closed them all down. Reinstate zoos, and you can turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 2
"The global wild lion population is down by 80% in the last 15 years, we can't diminish that further," snaps woke city-dwelling environmentalist @@randomname@@, clutching onto a plush lion toy, and a musical theatre program for West-End smash The Lion Monarch. "There's a fenced lion reserve on the other side of @@NAME@@. Why don't we just tranq these cats, bus them over, and let them start life anew in their new homes?"

OUTCOME:
public buses sometimes smell like animal transporters

OPTION 3
"You can't combine lion populations like that!" wails walking-stereotype scientist @@randomname@@, wearing white lab coat, goggles and latex gloves. "When two male alphas meet they'll fight, and the winner will kill all the cubs of his rivals. You want that blood on your hands? The problem here is human expansion! Pull back development from the edge of the lions' territory, and give them some space. We can all coexist!"

OUTCOME:
if someone says there's plenty of living space in @@NAME@@ they're probably lyin'

OPTION 4
"Lions! They are truly worthy foes, by Crom!" roars Conan Schwarzenmomoa, a big game hunter with a preference for double-handed swords. "Stand aside and I -- with my huntsman companions -- will deal with the beasts in the only manner that is fit! I WILL CLEAVE THEIR SKULLS!"

OUTCOME:
real men are rare (mostly because real men wrestle lions)

draft 2:

TITLE:
A Question of Pride

VALIDITY:
top 75% environment

DESCRIPTION:
A pride of lions has come into conflict with their human neighbours, leading to the mauling and subsequent death of a young @@MAN@@.

OPTION 1a - ZOOS NOT BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains village elder @@randomname@@. "Put them in a zoo for tourists to gawk at, and turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 1b - ZOOS BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains farmer @@randomname@@. "Back in the old days we used to have zoos to keep beasts in, till some idiot closed them all down. Reinstate zoos, and you can turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 2
"The global wild lion population is down by 80% in the last 15 years, we can't diminish that further," snaps woke city-dwelling environmentalist @@randomname@@, clutching onto a plush lion toy, and a musical theatre program for West-End smash The Lion Monarch. "There's a fenced lion reserve on the other side of @@NAME@@. Why don't we just tranq these cats, bus them over, and let them start life anew in their new homes?"

OUTCOME:
public buses sometimes smell like animal transporters

OPTION 3
"You can't combine lion populations like that!" wails walking-stereotype scientist @@randomname@@, wearing white lab coat, goggles and latex gloves. "When two male alphas meet they'll fight, and the winner will kill all the cubs of his rivals. You want that blood on your hands? The problem here is human expansion! Pull back development from the edge of the lions' territory, and give them some space. We can all coexist!"

OUTCOME:
if someone says there's plenty of living space in @@NAME@@ they're probably lyin'

DRAFT 1:

TITLE:
A Question of Pride

VALIDITY:
top 75% environment, agriculture exists, not vegetarian,

DESCRIPTION:
A pride of fifteen lions has come into conflict with their human neighbours in the last year, leading to the mauling and subsequent death of a young @@MAN@@.

OPTION 1a - ZOOS NOT BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains village elder @@randomname@@. "Put them in a zoo for tourists to gawk at, and turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 1b - ZOOS BANNED
"Everybody likes lions, but human life has to come first," complains farmer @@randomname@@. "Back in the old days we used to have zoos to keep beasts in, till some idiot closed them all down. Reinstate zoos, and you can turn that savannah over for much needed farming and urban development. Give me a home where the buffalo roam, and I'll give you sustainable economic growth and increased local employment. Ka-ching!"

OUTCOME:
the simile "as sad as a caged lion" is used to describe depressed people

OPTION 2
"The global wild lion population is down by 80% in the last 15 years, we can't diminish that further," snaps woke city-dwelling environmentalist @@randomname@@, clutching onto a plush lion toy, and a musical theatre program for West-End smash The Lion Monarch. "There's a fenced lion reserve on the other side of @@NAME@@. Why don't we just tranq these cats, bus them over, and let them start life anew in their new homes?"

OUTCOME:
public buses sometimes smell like animal transporters

OPTION 3
"You can't combine lion populations like that!" wails walking-stereotype scientist @@randomname@@, adjusting @@HIS@@ white lab coat, goggles and Bunsen burner. "When two male alphas meet they'll fight, and the winner will kill all the cubs of his rivals. You want that blood on your hands? The problem here is human expansion! Pull back development from the edge of the lions' territory, and give them some space. We can all coexist!"

OUTCOME:
grieving parents are told their children were sacrificed for the greater environmental good

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:18 am**

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:VALIDITY:
top 75% environment, agriculture exists, not vegetarian,

How is vegetarianism relevant? The lions are eating meat (which I guess a really radical vegetarian might take offense at), but none of the options involve humans eating the lions, and though the first option probably implicitly involves humans making their own meat to feed the lions, that's more of a "hey wait..." thing.

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:OUTCOME:
public buses sometimes smell like animal transporters

I seriously doubt you'd use public buses for this. All those chairs don't leave much room to plop down a cage.

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:OUTCOME:
grieving parents are told their children were sacrificed for the greater environmental good

Huh? This isn't a "just let lions continue to eat people" option, the proposed course of action (pulling away all human settlements from where the lions are) does resolve that conflict. If any human deaths result they would probably be from starvation due to reduced farmland, which is rather of a stretch.

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:46 am**

How is vegetarianism relevant? The lions are eating meat (which I guess a really radical vegetarian might take offense at), but none of the options involve humans eating the lions, and though the first option probably implicitly involves humans making their own meat to feed the lions, that's more of a "hey wait..." thing.

It's... hmm.

It was relevant in my first unseen draft where there were cattle ranchers. I'll take it off!

I seriously doubt you'd use public buses for this. All those chairs don't leave much room to plop down a cage.

Yeah, it's meant to be the joke. The option is using "bus them over" as a figure of speech, but then the effect line makes a joke of taking that literally.

Huh? This isn't a "just let lions continue to eat people" option, the proposed course of action (pulling away all human settlements from where the lions are) does resolve that conflict. If any human deaths result they would probably be from starvation due to reduced farmland, which is rather of a stretch.

Fair point. Let me think on that one. Ideas for an alternative line would be welcome.

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 7:07 am**

This is a great issue!

Two things:
The outcome for option three confuses me. Presumably, if the lions are being given more space, no sacrifices of children are being made (and no children are dying because they're being kept away from the lions). Is there humour I'm missing somewhere…?
And also — I like the "walking stereotype" thing, but a Bunsen burner isn't really "adjusted". The way you mention it, you make it sound like an article of clothing. And maybe it's just me, but stereotyping a chemist (or some type of scientist who would use a Bunsen burner) with a zoologist feels a tad weird. I get that he's meant to be a generic scientist, but seeing as that profession doesn't really exist, the mentioning of a Bunsen burner at all seems strange.

Then again, this is just my opinion. Really, a great issue.

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 7:47 am**

Good points, will make some changes for draft 2.

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 9:06 am**

"One bullet each should do the trick," bluntly states a mustachioed local-government employee while loading a revolver. "Problem solved."

Edit: Also you forgot to put [DRAFT] in the title.

Posted: **Mon Jan 20, 2020 9:57 am**

Jutsa wrote:Edit: Also you forgot to put [DRAFT] in the title.

[gaslight] It's there, it's always been there.[/gaslight]

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:20 am**

This is not a uniquely African thing. The Arctic has polar bears, the Outback has dingos, tropical Australia has crocodiles, and North America has bears and alligators. In fact, when my auntie went to Canada, she showed me a photo of a payphone deliberately destroyed by a bear attack. By that, I mean some idiot thought it would be a good idea to smother the thing in peanut butter so that a bear would attract a hungry bear. Also, remember Azaria Chamberlain? The re-trial determined that she really was taken by a dingo. I wouldn't be surprised if some kind of carnivoreous wild animal atracks on humans would exist in every inhabited continent except Europe (unless we count Svalbard and Greenland as part of Europe, which brings us back to polar bears). Therefore, I don't know why we limit this to lions. Further, in Svalbard, carrying a gun is compulsory for anyone travelling out to rural areas, and this law exists solely so that people can shoot polar bears shall they pose a risk. Maybe explore adding that as an option

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:34 am**

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Thinking about issues being less Euro/American-centric, and found this article about a uniquely African situation.

Not necasserily, for example 575 is a very Australian thing. I don't see people in too many other countries faking sick days so that they can go to the beach. I think you meant to say "Western" culture. And not all of Europe either. I have friends who are Australian, and also friends, like me, who are Mediterranean/Middle Eastern. Us Mediterranean/ME types very culturally different from White Australians. Even after a couple of generations of having lived in Australia. My sister and I are second generation Australians and we still notice cultural differences between us and our white Australian copatriots. We're more culturally similar to Arabs (especially Christian Arabs). Anyways, long story short, maybe Northern Europe is heavily represented in the issue base, however, Meditteranean/Middle Eastern culture, not so much. I'm not exactly sure how similar Hispanic culture is to M/ME culture (I used to work customer service in a place wherw maybe 70%+ of customers were born in Hispanic Latin America, and they were quite culturally similar to us Greeks). And you know, Spain is also in Europe...

Long story short,
Northern Europe is maybe represented in the issue base, Southern Europe less so

And as far as the culture of Eastern Europe is concerned (e.g. Russia, Bulgeria, the Slavic countries), there isn't much representation there either

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 5:09 am**

Fair enough.

I'll keep it as lions though, just for the title pun and the specific context.

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:11 am**

This is a very nice issue. A great concept I haven't seen and good wordplay.

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:36 am**

Maybe an option that goes down the Svalbard route and shoots the thing?

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:40 am**

Considered it, but seemed too obvious.

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:44 am**

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Considered it, but seemed too obvious.

What if it's only valid for countries who banned guns? That way, it could work as a reverse as well?

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:41 pm**

Too obvious? Maybe, but at the same time, an option about killing a plethora of endangered and majestic species would be a stark contrast to the three options protecting lions in some way.

Heck, if you really want to, you could purposely try to destroy all of them.

Posted: **Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:43 pm**

Jutsa wrote:Too obvious? Maybe, but at the same time, an option about killing a plethora of endangered and majestic species would be a stark contrast to the three options protecting lions in some way.

Heck, if you really want to, you could purposely try to destroy all of them.

I think the options are pretty fine as is, but another "shoot them" option that could work would be making it mandatory to have guns, you know, to deter the lions (could even take it further from the "just shoot them" but having the option present it as just to fire a few warning shots to scare them off)

Posted: **Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:34 am**

Jutsa wrote:Too obvious? Maybe, but at the same time, an option about killing a plethora of endangered and majestic species would be a stark contrast to the three options protecting lions in some way.

Heck, if you really want to, you could purposely try to destroy all of them.

Hmm, I'll think on it and see if there's some angle to make it original, then.

Okay done it.

DRAFT 3 HAS FOUR OPTIONS, BY CROM!

Posted: **Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:34 pm**

Heck yes. Approved.

NationStates

[DRAFT] A Question of Pride

[DRAFT] A Question of Pride