[MEGATHREAD] Unusual Issue Effects

[Mothra Queen of the Monsters]

Not sure if banner weirdness goes here but... I just answered 897 with option three, and got the Hallowed Halls banner for supporting traditional religion. Now I know the game makes a distinction between traditional and alternative religion, but i haven't done anything yet to indicate whether i'm supporting a traditional one or and alternative one.

[The Free Joy State]

Not sure if banner weirdness goes here but... I just answered 897 with option three, and got the Hallowed Halls banner for supporting traditional religion. Now I know the game makes a distinction between traditional and alternative religion, but i haven't done anything yet to indicate whether i'm supporting a traditional one or and alternative one.

Banners are automatically activated when your hidden stats pass specified levels; they are coded by admin not editors. They can be triggered at any time, after answering an issue (if you now meet the conditions), and are not triggered by answering one specific issue.

When you answered this issue, due to various factors, the related stat happened to meet the assigned threshhold triggering the banner.

The stats assigned to that option are correct.

If you don't want to see that banner, you can go to your nation page, click on "choose banners" and turn it off.

[Otira]

I passed a bill where "discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation is illegal" and the rudeness level in my nation seemed to skyrocket.

Is that normal?

[The Free Joy State]

I passed a bill where "discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation is illegal" and the rudeness level in my nation seemed to skyrocket.

Is that normal?

I can confirm that rudeness did not change as a result of this particular decision.

In future, when making reports, please provide the name/number of the issue, the option you chose, the effect, the date (if not today) and the nation if you answered by a puppet.

[Ghost Land]

On my puppet Penny and Jenny, I picked option 69.1, which increased my tourism score, as expected. However, I also got the "Cracked" banner, indicating having trouble attracting tourists, even though my score went up and was over 1000 to begin with. What gives?

[The Free Joy State]

On my puppet Penny and Jenny, I picked option 69.1, which increased my tourism score, as expected. However, I also got the "Cracked" banner, indicating having trouble attracting tourists, even though my score went up and was over 1000 to begin with. What gives?

Basically, this is caused by a knock-on effect of the coded stats, altering the hidden stats to which this particular banner is linked.

Banners aren't coded or assigned by editors, they are coded by Admin and received automatically when the particular, assigned stats reach a particular level and trigger it -- no matter what issue you answer or what your other stats are doing.

The stats for this option are correct.

If you don't want to see the banner, I suggest you turn it off.

[Ghost Land]

On my puppet Penny and Jenny, I picked option 69.1, which increased my tourism score, as expected. However, I also got the "Cracked" banner, indicating having trouble attracting tourists, even though my score went up and was over 1000 to begin with. What gives?

Basically, this is caused by a knock-on effect of the coded stats, altering the hidden stats to which this particular banner is linked.

Banners aren't coded or assigned by editors, they are coded by Admin and received automatically when the particular, assigned stats reach a particular level and trigger it -- no matter what issue you answer or what your other stats are doing.

The stats for this option are correct.

If you don't want to see the banner, I suggest you turn it off.

I'm not complaining; I was just curious as to why I got it. I use the antiquity theme anyway, so turning it off would have no effect. Weird how the whole thing works.

[Skoitra Tusdeta]

Why does it weaken Niceness and Compassion to protect citizens from being arbitrarily kidnapped by foreign militaries in "Westfailian Sovereignty" (Issue 981)?

[The Free Joy State]

Why does it weaken Niceness and Compassion to protect citizens from being arbitrarily kidnapped by foreign militaries in "Westfailian Sovereignty" (Issue 981)?

Compassion drops because the option entails shooting people "on sight", which is an uncompassionate act, as it doesn't allow for time for people to say who they are or what they want.

Niceness is a secondary stat. Secondary stats are impacted both by your nation's own stats and by the stats coded into the issue interacting. They can be slightly unpredictable, but I don't see anything unusual here.

The issue's working as intended.

[TalAkMaChen]

I was wondering, is there some publicly available list of which stats a primary stat and which stats are secondary? I see there are lots of examples and one could gather all into a list, but that seems pretty cumbersome.

[The Free Joy State]

I was wondering, is there some publicly available list of which stats a primary stat and which stats are secondary? I see there are lots of examples and one could gather all into a list, but that seems pretty cumbersome.

We're not going to release info on all our backstage stats and tell you exactly how they interact.

[Candlewhisper Archive]

To be clear, we're not allowed to.

It's worth noting though that the terms secondary and primary stats may be misleading. Al visible stats are different from the stats we use backstage. So basically ALL stats are secondary stats, as far as players are concerned.

[Menta Lee-IL]

It seems, and I could be wrong, that I have no way to boost my military spending anymore, no matter what issue I answer that should give a positive increase; yet I can very easily lower that spending detrimentally.

e.g. Issue #24, "Budget Time: Accountants Excited," despite answering to raise military and law enforcement spending (option 2), it resulted in a slight bump to law enforcement but zero to my defence. If this issue can't raise it, then what can?

e.g. 2: Issue #99, "We Need Cash, Sharpish, Say Librarians," by answering option 2, used to give a nice bump to my economy which included defence spending as well; now, nothing.

[Ransium]

It seems, and I could be wrong, that I have no way to boost my military spending anymore, no matter what issue I answer that should give a positive increase; yet I can very easily lower that spending detrimentally.

e.g. Issue #24, "Budget Time: Accountants Excited," despite answering to raise military and law enforcement spending (option 2), it resulted in a slight bump to law enforcement but zero to my defence. If this issue can't raise it, then what can?

e.g. 2: Issue #99, "We Need Cash, Sharpish, Say Librarians," by answering option 2, used to give a nice bump to my economy which included defence spending as well; now, nothing.

When a stat change is under some threshold, I believe 0.05% of the current total, it will no longer show up in the issue effects. Admin designed this to avoid being overwhelmed by small movements from secondary and tertiary effects, but when you have some super extreme baseline stats for your nation it can mute primary effects that are reasonably large. Weather changes of only a point and most small environmental changes don’t show up for me, for example. The underlying stat is still changing though. I think this is what’s happening with you. Hope that helps.

[Menta Lee-IL]

It seems, and I could be wrong, that I have no way to boost my military spending anymore, no matter what issue I answer that should give a positive increase; yet I can very easily lower that spending detrimentally.

e.g. Issue #24, "Budget Time: Accountants Excited," despite answering to raise military and law enforcement spending (option 2), it resulted in a slight bump to law enforcement but zero to my defence. If this issue can't raise it, then what can?

e.g. 2: Issue #99, "We Need Cash, Sharpish, Say Librarians," by answering option 2, used to give a nice bump to my economy which included defence spending as well; now, nothing.

When a stat change is under some threshold, I believe 0.05% of the current total, it will no longer show up in the issue effects. Admin designed this to avoid being overwhelmed by small movements from secondary and tertiary effects, but when you have some super extreme baseline stats for your nation it can mute primary effects that are reasonably large. Weather changes of only a point and most small environmental changes don’t show up for me, for example. The underlying stat is still changing though. I think this is what’s happening with you. Hope that helps.

I appreciate the reply. It just seems a tad unfair that I can easily reduce this stat (military) through options but in order to recover where I once was, I have few (if any) issues that can lift up my military in any similar way, or even remotely give it a smaller sized bump.

[Australian rePublic]

With such high civil rights, how in the fudge do I qualify for 494?

[Godular]

So, I've noticed that I have largely stopped getting bonuses to my Scientific Advancement score when answering issues that previously would have conferred a benefit to that score. Does it just not note them anymore, or was some kind of cap instituted?

[Phydios]

So, I've noticed that I have largely stopped getting bonuses to my Scientific Advancement score when answering issues that previously would have conferred a benefit to that score. Does it just not note them anymore, or was some kind of cap instituted?

Your Scientific Advancement score is outrageously high. Raising it any higher is going to be very difficult- much like how speeding up takes increasingly more energy as you get closer to the speed of light. As far as I know, there's no hard cap, but raising any stat becomes increasingly harder the higher it is.

[The Free Joy State]

With such high civil rights, how in the fudge do I qualify for 494?

Because had not been condemned for low civil rights generally, but for specific human rights abuses due to practising corporal punishment.

And validity questions belong on this thread. Thanks.

So, I've noticed that I have largely stopped getting bonuses to my Scientific Advancement score when answering issues that previously would have conferred a benefit to that score. Does it just not note them anymore, or was some kind of cap instituted?

Your Scientific Advancement score is outrageously high. Raising it any higher is going to be very difficult- much like how speeding up takes increasingly more energy as you get closer to the speed of light. As far as I know, there's no hard cap, but raising any stat becomes increasingly harder the higher it is.

This is pretty much correct.

There is no cap, but -- the closer you get to any extreme with the stats -- the harder it is for visible changes to occur. If changes that occur are less than one hundredth of a percent of your total, you won't see them represented in your stats. There is still a background change occurring that we can see.

[Candlewhisper Archive]

I appreciate the reply. It just seems a tad unfair that I can easily reduce this stat (military) through options but in order to recover where I once was, I have few (if any) issues that can lift up my military in any similar way, or even remotely give it a smaller sized bump.

I think re this and the scientific advancement question, what needs to be made clear is that this isn't so much about it being harder to increase the stat, it's about the stat change not being visible any more because it represents too small a percentage change.

An issue that gives you an extra "point" of advancement or military or whatever is still giving you that extra point. It's just that it isn't visible on your reported stats for that issue -- you'll need to look at the numbers on your individual graphs to spot the change.

No-one is being "penalised", it's just down to how the software decides which changes are visibly reported to you.

[Bear Connors Paradiso]

Why did my taxes go up?????

1183, last option, submitted just now. Not letting women work stressful jobs because they got pissy pantsed about working during their periods.

Got a myriad of other non-conventional effects like compassion going up, income equality and income of the poor/average and general economy going up (if women cant work, how can their income go up?) , rudeness going down (it sure was a rude/misogynistic thing to do) , drug use going down (no work = more free time for drugs) . You guys don't need to account for these, but they certainly are not what would be expected.

[The Free Joy State]

Why did my taxes go up?????

1183, last option, submitted just now. Not letting women work stressful jobs because they got pissy pantsed about working during their periods.

Got a myriad of other non-conventional effects like compassion going up, income equality and income of the poor/average and general economy going up (if women cant work, how can their income go up?) , rudeness going down (it sure was a rude/misogynistic thing to do) , drug use going down (no work = more free time for drugs) . You guys don't need to account for these, but they certainly are not what would be expected.

There's nothing unusual about these effects.

Tax is a known limitation in our simulation, referring only to income tax. As for your economic changes, they have a very complex simulation behind them (as it say in the OP of this thread), each with a vast array of stats playing into them. They can be unpredicable.

The game links lower civil rights (as you received) and lower drug use. It's a known bug in the simulation.

A small compassion rise is due to all the condescending concern for the 'frailties' of the 'fair sex', though it comes from a place of sexism. The rudeness fall is a secondary stat, and couldn't be controlled for.

[The World Capitalist Confederation]

My rich incomes went down by over 50%, and my income inequality went down by about 70% too, all because I abolished feudalism. This doesn't make any sense because:

A. When feudalism is abolished, it generally causes it to go up, thanks to the displacement of feudal lords by capitalists (such as in the industrial revolution)
B. It went down when I put feudalism in, now it went down when I abolished it. Help?

[Candensia]

My rich incomes went down by over 50%, and my income inequality went down by about 70% too, all because I abolished feudalism. This doesn't make any sense because:

A. When feudalism is abolished, it generally causes it to go up, thanks to the displacement of feudal lords by capitalists (such as in the industrial revolution)
B. It went down when I put feudalism in, now it went down when I abolished it. Help?

A. When feudalism is abolished, it generally causes it to go up, thanks to the displacement of feudal lords by capitalists (such as in the industrial revolution)

I believe you chose 894.3. From what I read, rich incomes dropping, and income inequality dropping makes sense, as rich and powerful nobles are deposed (perhaps even by force.) The assumption that capitalists would fill the void of these nobles, causing income inequality and rich income to rise, was misplaced in this instance, as 894.3 has a socialist speaker, who would very likely advocate for the opposite.

With regards to question B, I must apologize, as I do not know the issue you received, or the option you chose.

[Bear Connors Paradiso]

Why did my taxes go up?????

1183, last option, submitted just now. Not letting women work stressful jobs because they got pissy pantsed about working during their periods.

Got a myriad of other non-conventional effects like compassion going up, income equality and income of the poor/average and general economy going up (if women cant work, how can their income go up?) , rudeness going down (it sure was a rude/misogynistic thing to do) , drug use going down (no work = more free time for drugs) . You guys don't need to account for these, but they certainly are not what would be expected.

There's nothing unusual about these effects.

If there is never anything unusual, we wouldn't have a second 100 page thread having to explain them. Are the devs just dead set against telling us what the effects will be before we choose them? Then your job would be a lot easier!

Somehow the tax was still never explained (in a way that I could understand, even though I read the first post before posting here). Thanks for the other info, I guess, even though I disagree with the mechanics!