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[MEGATHREAD] Unusual Issue Effects

A place to spoil daily issues for those who haven't had them yet, snigger at typos, and discuss ideas for new ones.

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Verdant Haven
Issues Editor
 
Posts: 1107
Founded: Feb 26, 2013
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Verdant Haven » Wed Jan 30, 2019 7:25 am

Valrifell wrote:542.3 gave Valrifell WMDs I was not expecting, I've reread the option a few times and I don't think it should be doing that.


542.3 includes the text "reallocate the plutonium to weapons manufacture." You're building thermonuclear bombs with that one.
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The Free Joy State
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 15327
Founded: Jan 05, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Free Joy State » Wed Jan 30, 2019 7:26 am

Valrifell wrote:542.3 gave Valrifell WMDs I was not expecting, I've reread the option a few times and I don't think it should be doing that.

The option does promise to produce WMDs (emphasised):

"Once again, Science has the answer!" proclaims physics professor @@RANDOMNAMEFEMALE@@, striking her best heroic pose and pointing symbolically to the distant horizon. "Vitrification! Ion exchange! Synroc! We can separate out the components of the waste, burn off the long-lived stuff in fast reactors, reallocate the plutonium to weapons manufacture, and leave only short-lived waste that lasts merely hundreds of years. This will mean that we will not run out of fuel, and the environment will be spared from contamination. Increased industrial expenses? Yes. Necessary security costs and extensive safety regulations? Yes, sure, whatever. But, awesome Super Science? Triple yes, yes, yes!"


The effect is expected with this option.
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Ganymede
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 3
Founded: May 12, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Ganymede » Thu Jan 31, 2019 11:34 am

Issue 265

I opted to cut spending on both business subsidies and social welfare programs. Business subsidization, public health, and public education all increased.

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Apabeossie
Envoy
 
Posts: 243
Founded: Jun 04, 2018
New York Times Democracy

Postby Apabeossie » Thu Jan 31, 2019 4:29 pm

Issue 16 Option 1(@@majorindustry@@ Workers Strike!)

It was to give the workers a wage rise, but it increased wealth gaps, economic freedom, and employment
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The Free Joy State
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 15327
Founded: Jan 05, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Free Joy State » Thu Jan 31, 2019 9:18 pm

Ganymede wrote:Issue 265

I opted to cut spending on both business subsidies and social welfare programs. Business subsidization, public health, and public education all increased.

Looks like a secondary knock-on effect caused by another stat. All the changes were very small and won't make any long-term impact on your nation.

Apabeossie wrote:Issue 16 Option 1(@@majorindustry@@ Workers Strike!)

It was to give the workers a wage rise, but it increased wealth gaps, economic freedom, and employment

Yes. That option can only raise restrictions on employers' (having to pay fair wages) so high. You were already beyond that, so it only took into account the new powers to the employees which gave a knock-on effect to these secondary stats.

Working as intended.
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Ryanasic
Attaché
 
Posts: 71
Founded: Dec 14, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Ryanasic » Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:04 am

1160.1, Issue about I think dairy industry.
Option one was trust laws and restrictions on business iirc, yet it acts like I picked the second, business friendly choice.

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The Plutonian Empire
Diplomat
 
Posts: 935
Founded: Nov 15, 2004
Libertarian Police State

Postby The Plutonian Empire » Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:53 pm

Is it me, or are more and more Sex/Reproduction/Relationship issues being ruined, modified, or deleted by prudes?
Last edited by The Plutonian Empire on Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sanctaria
Issues Editor
 
Posts: 7757
Founded: Sep 12, 2008
New York Times Democracy

Postby Sanctaria » Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:58 pm

The Plutonian Empire wrote:Is it me, or are more and more Sex/Reproduction/Relationship issues being ruined, modified, or deleted by prudes?

Wrong thread. Since this is just a general unhelpful and antagonistic comment about issues, it goes in the Writers' Block, though alternatively it staying in your drafts is also a good place to keep it.
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The Plutonian Empire
Diplomat
 
Posts: 935
Founded: Nov 15, 2004
Libertarian Police State

Postby The Plutonian Empire » Sat Feb 02, 2019 6:05 pm

Sanctaria wrote:
The Plutonian Empire wrote:Is it me, or are more and more Sex/Reproduction/Relationship issues being ruined, modified, or deleted by prudes?

Wrong thread. Since this is just a general unhelpful and antagonistic comment about issues, it goes in the Writers' Block, though alternatively it staying in your drafts is also a good place to keep it.

Ja I see that now. Thanks.
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Snowman
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 134
Founded: Dec 31, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Snowman » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:31 pm

Sorry, this was either yesterday or a few days ago, but it doesn't sit right with me. I've had illegal divorce for the longest time, & I never meant for that. I finally, after over a year, get the chance to change that with issue 482 & picking option 1, to make divorce legal. I still have the illegal divorce policy though.

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Sanctaria
Issues Editor
 
Posts: 7757
Founded: Sep 12, 2008
New York Times Democracy

Postby Sanctaria » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:37 pm

Snowman wrote:Sorry, this was either yesterday or a few days ago, but it doesn't sit right with me. I've had illegal divorce for the longest time, & I never meant for that. I finally, after over a year, get the chance to change that with issue 482 & picking option 1, to make divorce legal. I still have the illegal divorce policy though.

Looks like an editor edited it twelve days ago and accidently took the policy removal off that option. Fixed now.

We don't usually do this but in this specific instance, because it was an error on our part (and it was so recent and you were waiting so long), I've sent the fixed issue back to you.
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Dr. Bethany Greer ORD, Sanctarian Ambassador to the World Assembly
Author of:
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Frisbeeteria wrote:Do people not realize that moderators can tell when someone is wanking?

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Snowman
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 134
Founded: Dec 31, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Snowman » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:51 pm

Sanctaria wrote:
Snowman wrote:Sorry, this was either yesterday or a few days ago, but it doesn't sit right with me. I've had illegal divorce for the longest time, & I never meant for that. I finally, after over a year, get the chance to change that with issue 482 & picking option 1, to make divorce legal. I still have the illegal divorce policy though.

Looks like an editor edited it twelve days ago and accidently took the policy removal off that option. Fixed now.

We don't usually do this but in this specific instance, because it was an error on our part (and it was so recent and you were waiting so long), I've sent the fixed issue back to you.


#blessed

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Candlewhisper Archive
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 23002
Founded: Aug 28, 2015
Anarchy

Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Sanctaria wrote:
Snowman wrote:Sorry, this was either yesterday or a few days ago, but it doesn't sit right with me. I've had illegal divorce for the longest time, & I never meant for that. I finally, after over a year, get the chance to change that with issue 482 & picking option 1, to make divorce legal. I still have the illegal divorce policy though.

Looks like an editor edited it twelve days ago and accidently took the policy removal off that option. Fixed now.

We don't usually do this but in this specific instance, because it was an error on our part (and it was so recent and you were waiting so long), I've sent the fixed issue back to you.


Thanks for the catch.

I will find the editor responsible for that error and hit him on the back of the head.

Ouch! Ouch! Who's hitting me? :blush:
editors like linguistic ambiguity more than most people

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Garden at 6th Mile Road
Diplomat
 
Posts: 625
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Garden at 6th Mile Road » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:08 am

Issue 591, option 1.

It would appear that for my nation, my Environmental Beauty went up, BUT Trout Fishing Industry also went up, and the Eco-Friendliness dropped.

Maybe I didn't understand it clearly, but shouldn't the industry went down, and the eco-friendliness go up as well?

“Salmon are a crucial link in the food chains of both the ocean AND river systems!” asserts Sigourney Farnsworth, a surprisingly knowledgeable 10-year old, clutching a tear-drenched plush salmon. “The wild stocks of both Maxtopia and Blackacre are already irreparably depleted by sea lice and overfishing, and if we do nothing, Garden at 6th Mile Road is next. You need to severely tighten regulations for the farm barons: make them clean up their act before it’s too late!


That would imply that the industry was more kept tightly, isn't it?

Thanks for your time, and sorry I didn't understand this clearly. :P
Last edited by Garden at 6th Mile Road on Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:12 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Gnejs
Issues Editor
 
Posts: 2973
Founded: May 11, 2006
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Gnejs » Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:16 am

I see how that can be confusing, but the “industry” here can be understood as twofold. There’s fish farming, and there’s fishermen catching fish the good old fashioned way. By tightening regulations for the farms, you’re stopping the farmed fish contaminating the wild fish, and as the “supply” of wild fish grows (because they’re healthier), the regular fishermen are able to catch more fish. So there’s a tiny bump to the fishing industry to represent that. Of course, we only have one “fishing industry” and we have to use that to simulate changes to both sides, so if you side with the farmers, you’d see changes to the same industry. The drop to eco-friendliness - which is just a measure of what you spend on the environment - went down ever so slightly as a knock-on effect caused by your fishing industry making up a bigger part of your overall economy.

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Ghost Land
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1421
Founded: Feb 14, 2014
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Ghost Land » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:33 pm

Why did 451.1 cause that big of an increase in civil rights? It's literally saying religious texts should be burned, so I would have expected either flat or decreasing civil rights.
Last edited by Ghost Land on Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The Free Joy State
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 15327
Founded: Jan 05, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Free Joy State » Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:09 pm

Ghost Land wrote:Why did 451.1 cause that big of an increase in civil rights? It's literally saying religious texts should be burned, so I would have expected either flat or decreasing civil rights.

It's worth remembering here that civil rights are a specific metric on NS: freedom from government control. By allowing people to express their indignation in this way, your civil rights would usually rise. The religion itself is not impinged by the option.

As for the size of the rise, in raw numbers it rose from 1.92 to 2.31. Although the percentage seems substantial, in raw numbers, it's not so large.
Last edited by The Free Joy State on Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Valentine Z
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11632
Founded: Nov 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Valentine Z » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:05 am

Gnejs wrote:I see how that can be confusing, but the “industry” here can be understood as twofold. There’s fish farming, and there’s fishermen catching fish the good old fashioned way. By tightening regulations for the farms, you’re stopping the farmed fish contaminating the wild fish, and as the “supply” of wild fish grows (because they’re healthier), the regular fishermen are able to catch more fish. So there’s a tiny bump to the fishing industry to represent that. Of course, we only have one “fishing industry” and we have to use that to simulate changes to both sides, so if you side with the farmers, you’d see changes to the same industry. The drop to eco-friendliness - which is just a measure of what you spend on the environment - went down ever so slightly as a knock-on effect caused by your fishing industry making up a bigger part of your overall economy.


Ahh, okay. I guess that makes sense to me. Thanks for the clarification! :D
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Kommunes Consiviz
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Jan 19, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Kommunes Consiviz » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:53 am

Greetings, my moderator overlords! ;)

So I just got an issue effect that I strongly suspect is an error.

I chose option 5 for issue #581 Fair to Say...? Literally the only result I got was a small reduction in voter apathy. Just that one attribute: there were no other results.
I thought at the very least I'd get a boost to income equality for advocating for global communism. :lol2:
Maybe it has to do with having had the window open too long or answering issues in too quick a succession? I honestly have little idea how this game operates so I'll leave any diagnoses up to you all.

Issue #581 is the last issue I've answered so far. The nation that was affected was Kommunes Consiviz. And the effect was encountered just a little while ago, today.

If this has been a weird fluke or error, if you could re-send me the issue to re-answer I'd greatly appreciate it. :) Also, please let me know what I did wrong so that I don't repeat the mistake in the future.

Thank you in advance!

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The Free Joy State
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 15327
Founded: Jan 05, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Free Joy State » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:20 am

Kommunes Consiviz wrote:Greetings, my moderator overlords! ;)

Greetings. But the staff on this forum, unless wearing red badges, are Issues Editing People (we also quake before our moderator overlords).

So I just got an issue effect that I strongly suspect is an error.

I chose option 5 for issue #581 Fair to Say...? Literally the only result I got was a small reduction in voter apathy. Just that one attribute: there were no other results.
I thought at the very least I'd get a boost to income equality for advocating for global communism. :lol2:
Maybe it has to do with having had the window open too long or answering issues in too quick a succession? I honestly have little idea how this game operates so I'll leave any diagnoses up to you all.

Issue #581 is the last issue I've answered so far. The nation that was affected was Kommunes Consiviz. And the effect was encountered just a little while ago, today.

If this has been a weird fluke or error, if you could re-send me the issue to re-answer I'd greatly appreciate it. :) Also, please let me know what I did wrong so that I don't repeat the mistake in the future.

Thank you in advance!

Imposing communism would normally cause an impact on economic rights in this issue. However, your economic rights have nowhere to move so the only thing that changed was apathy.

It's working as intended.

EDIT: You didn't make any mistake. Some stats can only move so far.
Last edited by The Free Joy State on Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Candlewhisper Archive
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 23002
Founded: Aug 28, 2015
Anarchy

Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:21 am

Kommunes Consiviz wrote:Greetings, my moderator overlords! ;)

So I just got an issue effect that I strongly suspect is an error.

I chose option 5 for issue #581 Fair to Say...? Literally the only result I got was a small reduction in voter apathy. Just that one attribute: there were no other results.
I thought at the very least I'd get a boost to income equality for advocating for global communism. :lol2:
Maybe it has to do with having had the window open too long or answering issues in too quick a succession? I honestly have little idea how this game operates so I'll leave any diagnoses up to you all.

Issue #581 is the last issue I've answered so far. The nation that was affected was Kommunes Consiviz. And the effect was encountered just a little while ago, today.

If this has been a weird fluke or error, if you could re-send me the issue to re-answer I'd greatly appreciate it. :) Also, please let me know what I did wrong so that I don't repeat the mistake in the future.

Thank you in advance!


Welcome to the forums.

For the record, it's primarily Issue Editors who answer here, not moderators.

The opening post of this thread is worth a read as it explains a little about how stats work, including the possibility that an issue may have no effect on one nation while having notable effects on another.

It's all working as intended.

Also, there's no difference in answering issues in quick succession, or with an hour between each. Each issue resolves its outcomes in full as you answer them. Leaving the window open won't make a difference either, unless it is snowing outside and the cold makes your numb fingers press the wrong button :lol: .

We don't reissue issues, except in the most exceptional circumstances. And you didn't do anything wrong. You got an issue, you picked an option. That's pretty much as right as you can get.
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Candlewhisper Archive
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 23002
Founded: Aug 28, 2015
Anarchy

Postby Candlewhisper Archive » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:21 am

Oooh, simultaneipost!

Good thing we didn't contradict each other, eh?
Last edited by Candlewhisper Archive on Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
editors like linguistic ambiguity more than most people

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Kommunes Consiviz
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Jan 19, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Kommunes Consiviz » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:02 pm

The Free Joy State wrote:
Kommunes Consiviz wrote:Greetings, my moderator overlords! ;)

Greetings. But the staff on this forum, unless wearing red badges, are Issues Editing People (we also quake before our moderator overlords).

So I just got an issue effect that I strongly suspect is an error.

I chose option 5 for issue #581 Fair to Say...? Literally the only result I got was a small reduction in voter apathy. Just that one attribute: there were no other results.
I thought at the very least I'd get a boost to income equality for advocating for global communism. :lol2:
Maybe it has to do with having had the window open too long or answering issues in too quick a succession? I honestly have little idea how this game operates so I'll leave any diagnoses up to you all.

Imposing communism would normally cause an impact on economic rights in this issue. However, your economic rights have nowhere to move so the only thing that changed was apathy.

It's working as intended.

EDIT: You didn't make any mistake. Some stats can only move so far.

Gotcha. :)
I've actually had income equality higher in the past. Am I to take it then that if I keep answering questions in a way that increases it, that it will push my score up eventually, even if it didn't do anything this time? If this is the case, will my answer to this question be noted, or will it not have any effect on my future answers?
Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Welcome to the forums.

For the record, it's primarily Issue Editors who answer here, not moderators.

The opening post of this thread is worth a read as it explains a little about how stats work, including the possibility that an issue may have no effect on one nation while having notable effects on another.

It's all working as intended.

Also, there's no difference in answering issues in quick succession, or with an hour between each. Each issue resolves its outcomes in full as you answer them. Leaving the window open won't make a difference either, unless it is snowing outside and the cold makes your numb fingers press the wrong button :lol: .

We don't reissue issues, except in the most exceptional circumstances. And you didn't do anything wrong. You got an issue, you picked an option. That's pretty much as right as you can get.

Thank you for the welcoming! Good to know, and I'm very glad if everything is working as intended!
I admit that I still feel paranoid, especially because I noticed the other day that the names change in the text of an unanswered issue if I don't answer it fast enough. :unsure:
In this instance, the names didn't change, but I did log out and log back in in a different tab with the tab with the issue still open....
Candlewhisper Archive wrote:Oooh, simultaneipost!

Good thing we didn't contradict each other, eh?

Am I to understand that Candlewhisper Archive and The Free Joy State are secret twins? :blink:

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Temosia
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 11
Founded: Jan 20, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Temosia » Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:03 pm

Hey!

So I just answered issue No. 229 with option 2, to enact freedom of information. My political freedom just went down, which doesn't make a lick of sense to me.

So I understand how that could happen if I chose option 1, because that option just punishes individual politicians for corruption without making the process any more democratic, but option 2 increases governmental transparency, which logically should increase political freedom by making politicians more accountable to voters and the laws that they pass. After all, political freedom would increase if the dealings of a country's dictator were made publicly available, I'm sure you'd agree. Option 3 is obviously the pro-corruption choice, and one could make an argument as to whether allowing bribery increases political freedom or not, but among the three choices, and certainly between the two anti-corruption choices, option 2 is clearly making the country more democratic and thus more politically free. But I'm being pedantic because all of this is self-evident to you all. L.o.l.

The choice also had other weird affects, like making my country's ignorance go up. I mean, I'm trying to have an ignorant populace so that's not an issue for me in particular, but I think it only stands to reason that my country's ignorance should go down as a trade-off to making my citizens more aware of what their country's politicians are doing: knowledge being power and all that jazz.

I read that in the initial post that issues with bribery and political freedom had just been "fixed" in an update, so I'm confused as to why this happened.
This is definitely something you should take a look at.

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The Free Joy State
Senior Issues Editor
 
Posts: 15327
Founded: Jan 05, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Free Joy State » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:19 pm

Kommunes Consiviz wrote:
The Free Joy State wrote:Greetings. But the staff on this forum, unless wearing red badges, are Issues Editing People (we also quake before our moderator overlords).


Imposing communism would normally cause an impact on economic rights in this issue. However, your economic rights have nowhere to move so the only thing that changed was apathy.

It's working as intended.

EDIT: You didn't make any mistake. Some stats can only move so far.

Gotcha. :)
I've actually had income equality higher in the past. Am I to take it then that if I keep answering questions in a way that increases it, that it will push my score up eventually, even if it didn't do anything this time? If this is the case, will my answer to this question be noted, or will it not have any effect on my future answers?

Economic freedoms and income equality are actually two separate stats.

Income equality can rise much higher.

Temosia wrote:Hey!

So I just answered issue No. 229 with option 2, to enact freedom of information. My political freedom just went down, which doesn't make a lick of sense to me.

So I understand how that could happen if I chose option 1, because that option just punishes individual politicians for corruption without making the process any more democratic, but option 2 increases governmental transparency, which logically should increase political freedom by making politicians more accountable to voters and the laws that they pass. After all, political freedom would increase if the dealings of a country's dictator were made publicly available, I'm sure you'd agree. Option 3 is obviously the pro-corruption choice, and one could make an argument as to whether allowing bribery increases political freedom or not, but among the three choices, and certainly between the two anti-corruption choices, option 2 is clearly making the country more democratic and thus more politically free. But I'm being pedantic because all of this is self-evident to you all. L.o.l.

The choice also had other weird affects, like making my country's ignorance go up. I mean, I'm trying to have an ignorant populace so that's not an issue for me in particular, but I think it only stands to reason that my country's ignorance should go down as a trade-off to making my citizens more aware of what their country's politicians are doing: knowledge being power and all that jazz.

I read that in the initial post that issues with bribery and political freedom had just been "fixed" in an update, so I'm confused as to why this happened.
This is definitely something you should take a look at.

Freedoms in NS work on a specific metric: freedom from government control.

People gain the right to vote for whoever they want, you gain rights.
People gain the right to marry whoever they want, you gain rights.
People gain the right to protest however they want, you gain rights.

(Be aware that some effects may not be felt on all nations due to their personal stats and some options may have a trade-off between two conflicting freedoms, which may impact the result).

Here -- by compelling ministers to detail all financial gifts and contributions and depriving them of their privacy -- you are reducing their freedoms to keep such details private.
"If there's a book that you want to read, but it hasn't been written yet, then you must write it." - Toni Morrison

My nation does not represent my beliefs or politics.

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