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Protecting Our Players Accord

Talk about regional management and politics, raider/defender gameplay, and other game-related matters.
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Aynia Moreaux
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Postby Aynia Moreaux » Sun Mar 24, 2019 7:35 am

While I'm not sure how sexting can be policed, since that involvs texting on a phone or dm's, I'm all for standing together against bringing things of a sexual nature into the game. I've seen it happen in a few places and it really never ends well for anyone.
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Cormactopia Prime
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Postby Cormactopia Prime » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:10 am

Aynia Moreaux wrote:While I'm not sure how sexting can be policed, since that involvs texting on a phone or dm's, I'm all for standing together against bringing things of a sexual nature into the game. I've seen it happen in a few places and it really never ends well for anyone.

I don't want to speak for the signatories, but I doubt they have any plans to proactively police it, given the impracticality of that task. It's just not practical or, y'know, reasonable, to say "I want to see your text messages/DMs" and I'm sure no one is planning to do that. What this policy does though is make clear to everyone what isn't acceptable. So, for example, if something is reported as sexual harassment, they don't really have to weigh whether it is or isn't sexual harassment, which can sometimes be a difficult decision. They can instead say "you know the rules about sexting/ERP," and whether it constituted harassment or not, that person/those people are gone. There will be no excuses of "well I didn't know this wasn't allowed" anymore.

That's the way I figure it's going to work at least, but of course the signatories can correct me if I'm wrong.
Last edited by Cormactopia Prime on Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:11 am, edited 2 times in total.
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The Holy Principality of Saint Mark
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Postby The Holy Principality of Saint Mark » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:51 am

Cormactopia Prime wrote:
Aynia Moreaux wrote:While I'm not sure how sexting can be policed, since that involvs texting on a phone or dm's, I'm all for standing together against bringing things of a sexual nature into the game. I've seen it happen in a few places and it really never ends well for anyone.

I don't want to speak for the signatories, but I doubt they have any plans to proactively police it, given the impracticality of that task. It's just not practical or, y'know, reasonable, to say "I want to see your text messages/DMs" and I'm sure no one is planning to do that. What this policy does though is make clear to everyone what isn't acceptable. So, for example, if something is reported as sexual harassment, they don't really have to weigh whether it is or isn't sexual harassment, which can sometimes be a difficult decision. They can instead say "you know the rules about sexting/ERP," and whether it constituted harassment or not, that person/those people are gone. There will be no excuses of "well I didn't know this wasn't allowed" anymore.

That's the way I figure it's going to work at least, but of course the signatories can correct me if I'm wrong.


Yes, it is impossible to police everyone's messages and we have no intention to attempt to do so. The purpose of this statement is as you say ... to set the standard in plain view. Sexual behaviors are not allowed in our regions. We hope that others will adopt this stance as well.
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Tim-Opolis
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Postby Tim-Opolis » Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:54 pm

Full support. This isn't the website for that kind of comtent, and people who want to use it for that shouldn't be welcome in our community.

Want that kind of shit? Download Tinder like a normal person.
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The Gilded Star
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Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby The Gilded Star » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:17 pm

Tim-Opolis wrote:Want that kind of shit? Download Tinder like a normal person.


I'm not sure if people that rule 34 nations count as normal.

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Greater vakolicci haven
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Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:23 am

Tim-Opolis wrote:Full support. This isn't the website for that kind of comtent, and people who want to use it for that shouldn't be welcome in our community.

Want that kind of shit? Download Tinder like a normal person.

and if you really want to ERP, private channels that have nothing to do with the region are your friends. Just make sure the other guy really wants to do it as well.

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Xoriet
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Postby Xoriet » Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:58 am

We went ahead and just banned all ERP/sexting/exchanging of explicit content between members after a particular incident that started in another Pacific last year and almost bled over into our region. As far as I've seen, pretty much nothing good has come of it, even between adults, and most especially with minors, which is downright illegal. It can lead to acrimonious conversation between parties where things ended poorly, false reporting in regards to the status of consent in the same situation, or can lead to someone getting heavily catfished. These are just some of the scenarios of what can happen in situations involving intimate relations between NSers. We vastly prefer to keep it all out of our community no matter what the age of the parties.

We applaud TEP, TWP, and Osiris for taking a strong stance on it.
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Ballpit
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Postby Ballpit » Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:35 am

Personally, it’s good to see what you guys are doing here, and I wholly support it. IMO such declarations are long overdue, but on the same token, it’s sad that such declarations are even necessary in the first place. o/

~my views are my own, and not representative of any region or organisation I take part in.
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Entendre Cordial
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Postby Entendre Cordial » Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:02 pm

The Gilded Star wrote:
Tim-Opolis wrote:Want that kind of shit? Download Tinder like a normal person.


I'm not sure if people that rule 34 nations count as normal.


Putting it this way was in poor taste imho given the thread topic
Last edited by Entendre Cordial on Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Consular
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Postby Consular » Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:40 pm

Kinda disturbing that this is even necessary

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The Gilded Star
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby The Gilded Star » Mon Mar 25, 2019 6:47 pm

Entendre Cordial wrote:
The Gilded Star wrote:
I'm not sure if people that rule 34 nations count as normal.


Putting it this way was in poor taste imho given the thread topic


Fair enough, allow me to rectify my poor comment by agreeing with Tim's original point: the important thing is that people should go to appropriate sites for dating or romance and avoid doing so in places where under-aged people will be. Those that are deliberately choosing a site where under-aged players are present for sexual content should not be tolerated, period.

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Cerillium
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Postby Cerillium » Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:31 pm

Zaolat wrote:
Aclion wrote:No one's criticizing what they're doing, only that they're getting on a pedestal about it.

Yeah, well in a game where we've had unsavoury shit happen over and over, after years of people not sweeping shit under the rug and regions banding together to blacklist those types rather than it be one region or two, yet those types keep doing it over and over. To the point many of us are so sick and tired of the shit, we look at every single potential innocent thing as possibly suspicious. Adults being emotionally manipulated and taken advantage of, kids being taken advantage of, fuck that crap.

I'd rather more people be forthright and holier than thou with this stuff. It's necessary. In game moderation does what it can with what info they have, out of game it's up to each group and community to stamp it out. It's impossible to fully do that, but no one should make it easier to exist doing that type of shit.


This is a solid point. It does fall upon our communities, regardless of location on this site, to enforce boundaries that should not be crossed. I also believe it falls upon the individual regardless of their community. (I disagree with people behaving "holier than thou" however. Rather, I see it as a quiet rage that manifests itself as a complete intolerance of specific illicit or harmful practices.)



The Holy Principality of Saint Mark wrote:
NationStates is a community populated by many people who are under the age of consent.The signatories to this accord agree that sexting, sexual role-play, and otherwise trading communications of a sexual nature are not welcome in their respective regions. In no way is this meant to condemn consensual adult relationships outside of NS, even among those who met through NS.

While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that by taking this stand against certain behaviours in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.

The undersigned represent our regions in this accord
and hope that all NS regions will join us in promoting the safety of our members.

The accord, as written, lacks substance and definition.

    The signatories to this accord agree that sexting, sexual role-play, and otherwise trading communications of a sexual nature are not welcome in their respective regions. In no way is this meant to condemn consensual adult relationships outside of NS, even among those who met through NS.
Un/Appropriate sexual character* roleplay isn't a new topic in the RP or Mod forums. For example: Writing for sake of instant physical gratification (sexting) is not the same as two or more writers painstakingly crafting a series of Nation or Region RP IC posts that fade to black. Whereas regions should seek to ban the former, the latter allows the reader's imagination to complete the scene sans any further (or sexually explicit) effort by the writer.

    While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that by taking this stand against certain behaviours in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.
How, exactly? Substance is needed here otherwise all the undersigned are doing is agreeing to take a stand by "promoting a climate".

May I suggest something commensurable to-
While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that, by taking this stand against certain behaviors in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.
    The leaders and members of [insert region/group here] will:
    • Police our own off-site forums and report [insert behavior] to that site's host when applicable;
    • keep an eye on not only our community's minors but also on known issues;
    • put aside politics and popularity to protect those that have not yet learned to protect themselves - even if those inexperienced persons are adults;
    • encourage a victim to file a GHR regardless of the victim's age or gender should the incident transpire on any part of NS;
    • implement the Wall of Silence - the community turning its collective back on a player punished for inappropriate activity - rather than using the situation for political GP bullshit.







* Character roleplay, not Persona interactions. IMHO, GP tends to blur 'persona' and 'RP character'. The "but it was in character!" excuse for abusive/salty posts irritates more than a few GP denizens.
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Vanquaria
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Postby Vanquaria » Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:37 pm

Very well written
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Kurnugia
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Postby Kurnugia » Tue Mar 26, 2019 2:12 am

Cerillium wrote:snip

^this

atm, this accord sounds generic af. Hence my reservations on it.
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Darkesia
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Postby Darkesia » Tue Mar 26, 2019 6:34 am

Generic af is good. It's voluntary, generalized acknowledgement that the regional mod/admin groups will eliminate ~to the best of their ability~ this behavior in their respective domains.
This is not Nation RP. This is not the WA. This is not something you get to criticize for it's grammar or perceived in-game RP strength or some other weirdness.

This is real PLAYERS in GP taking a stand against exploitative and inappropriate behavior by other PLAYERS within their game environments. Nothing more. Nothing less.

It's generic af for a reason. Want something specific? Write it for your own region.
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The Blaatschapen
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Postby The Blaatschapen » Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:31 am

Cerillium wrote:
Zaolat wrote:Yeah, well in a game where we've had unsavoury shit happen over and over, after years of people not sweeping shit under the rug and regions banding together to blacklist those types rather than it be one region or two, yet those types keep doing it over and over. To the point many of us are so sick and tired of the shit, we look at every single potential innocent thing as possibly suspicious. Adults being emotionally manipulated and taken advantage of, kids being taken advantage of, fuck that crap.

I'd rather more people be forthright and holier than thou with this stuff. It's necessary. In game moderation does what it can with what info they have, out of game it's up to each group and community to stamp it out. It's impossible to fully do that, but no one should make it easier to exist doing that type of shit.


This is a solid point. It does fall upon our communities, regardless of location on this site, to enforce boundaries that should not be crossed. I also believe it falls upon the individual regardless of their community. (I disagree with people behaving "holier than thou" however. Rather, I see it as a quiet rage that manifests itself as a complete intolerance of specific illicit or harmful practices.)



The Holy Principality of Saint Mark wrote:
NationStates is a community populated by many people who are under the age of consent.The signatories to this accord agree that sexting, sexual role-play, and otherwise trading communications of a sexual nature are not welcome in their respective regions. In no way is this meant to condemn consensual adult relationships outside of NS, even among those who met through NS.

While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that by taking this stand against certain behaviours in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.

The undersigned represent our regions in this accord
and hope that all NS regions will join us in promoting the safety of our members.

The accord, as written, lacks substance and definition.

    The signatories to this accord agree that sexting, sexual role-play, and otherwise trading communications of a sexual nature are not welcome in their respective regions. In no way is this meant to condemn consensual adult relationships outside of NS, even among those who met through NS.
Un/Appropriate sexual character* roleplay isn't a new topic in the RP or Mod forums. For example: Writing for sake of instant physical gratification (sexting) is not the same as two or more writers painstakingly crafting a series of Nation or Region RP IC posts that fade to black. Whereas regions should seek to ban the former, the latter allows the reader's imagination to complete the scene sans any further (or sexually explicit) effort by the writer.

    While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that by taking this stand against certain behaviours in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.
How, exactly? Substance is needed here otherwise all the undersigned are doing is agreeing to take a stand by "promoting a climate".

May I suggest something commensurable to-
While it is not possible for regional governments to police every interaction, nor is it possible to guarantee the safety of any of its members, it is the hope of the signatories that, by taking this stand against certain behaviors in our regions, we will promote a climate where keeping others safe is a goal for everyone.
    The leaders and members of [insert region/group here] will:
    • Police our own off-site forums and report [insert behavior] to that site's host when applicable;
    • keep an eye on not only our community's minors but also on known issues;
    • put aside politics and popularity to protect those that have not yet learned to protect themselves - even if those inexperienced persons are adults;
    • encourage a victim to file a GHR regardless of the victim's age or gender should the incident transpire on any part of NS;
    • implement the Wall of Silence - the community turning its collective back on a player punished for inappropriate activity - rather than using the situation for political GP bullshit.







* Character roleplay, not Persona interactions. IMHO, GP tends to blur 'persona' and 'RP character'. The "but it was in character!" excuse for abusive/salty posts irritates more than a few GP denizens.


I always see 'fade to black' as how it works in a romantic comedy.

...

Anyway, it's good to see that the offsite communities band together on this one :)
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New Rogernomics
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Postby New Rogernomics » Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:40 am

Lazarus already enforces PG-13 off-site, though it is easier to block derogatory terms and pornography hosts via word filter on a forum. Discord is more difficult, unless they improve their generic filter or there is a bot to do it.

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Kurnugia
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Postby Kurnugia » Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:44 am

Darkesia wrote:Generic af is good. It's voluntary, generalized acknowledgement that the regional mod/admin groups will eliminate ~to the best of their ability~ this behavior in their respective domains.
This is not Nation RP. This is not the WA. This is not something you get to criticize for it's grammar or perceived in-game RP strength or some other weirdness.

This is real PLAYERS in GP taking a stand against exploitative and inappropriate behavior by other PLAYERS within their game environments. Nothing more. Nothing less.

It's generic af for a reason. Want something specific? Write it for your own region.

Chances are this will be read by people that already agree with those acknowledgements. After the initial interest, I predict, this will be forgotten without making a difference.
Author of Issue no 1201
If you want to add me as a discord friend, no. Not intersted in NSGP. If it's for banter, sure.

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Darkesia
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Founded: Mar 01, 2005
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Darkesia » Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:18 am

Kurnugia wrote:Chances are this will be read by people that already agree with those acknowledgements. After the initial interest, I predict, this will be forgotten without making a difference.


I'm not sure why you seem set against people reaffirming their standards for an environment free of inappropriate behavior. But lucky for those who do wish to do so, your bias will not be forgotten and thus will help make a difference. Spite is often a great motivator of good. Thank you!
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The Holy Principality of Saint Mark
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Founded: May 20, 2016
Corporate Bordello

Postby The Holy Principality of Saint Mark » Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:31 am

This was intentionally general, as it is a statement of principle.
It is left up to each region to determine how protecting its players is achieved.
Dark's point is right on the mark.
It's sad that some people would be against such a statement, but not surprising.
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Greater vakolicci haven
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Anarchy

Postby Greater vakolicci haven » Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:35 am

New Rogernomics wrote:Lazarus already enforces PG-13 off-site, though it is easier to block derogatory terms and pornography hosts via word filter on a forum. Discord is more difficult, unless they improve their generic filter or there is a bot to do it.

There are quite a few word censor bots for Discord, I believe that KoGB used to use one.

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Kurnugia
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Founded: Feb 21, 2017
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Kurnugia » Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:43 am

Darkesia wrote:
Kurnugia wrote:Chances are this will be read by people that already agree with those acknowledgements. After the initial interest, I predict, this will be forgotten without making a difference.


I'm not sure why you seem set against people reaffirming their standards for an environment free of inappropriate behavior. But lucky for those who do wish to do so, your bias will not be forgotten and thus will help make a difference. Spite is often a great motivator of good. Thank you!

I certainly hope that my harshness will motivate them to take things further.
Author of Issue no 1201
If you want to add me as a discord friend, no. Not intersted in NSGP. If it's for banter, sure.

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Flame of Dio
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Founded: Nov 28, 2018
Right-wing Utopia

Postby Flame of Dio » Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:18 pm

I shouldn’t have been surprised that there is controversy regarding as noble a cause as this, but here I am. To the detractors, all I can really say is that at some point you have to stop searching for the bad in things and start looking for the good in them. Applaud the parties that joined in, you’re making the community safer for players of all ages.
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The Holy Principality of Saint Mark
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Posts: 84
Founded: May 20, 2016
Corporate Bordello

Postby The Holy Principality of Saint Mark » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:12 pm

Thank you to the administrative team of The South Pacific for taking seriously the protection of NS players.
Marcarius Halo Rahl
TWP Delegate

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Archbishop of Albion

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Democratic Republic Of Unified States
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Posts: 53
Founded: Dec 27, 2018
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Democratic Republic Of Unified States » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:00 pm

I agree with this, may be lost in the crowd, but if this starts spreading, how many posts will be spread. The Pacific, Pacifica, TBH, TRR, all will be affected if we do not take a stand on this. I would suggest a treaty that people sign onto, but I feel that it wouldn't work

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