Imperial Japanese Navy - A Defender Military

[Yokosuka Naval District]

To answer some questions:

1. No, we are not fascist, nor advocating for war crimes or crimes against humanity.
2. The theme is more in-line with the Meiji-era (Russo-Japanese War), but not any specific era. The post-1942 ranks were chosen more because I prefer the specific titles to the pre-1942 ones. They might even change to the kanji for the JMSDF, to separate from history.
3. In reality, the name was chosen over the current Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force because the latter implies that we would be restricted, when we intend to do more than that.

Why was a naval theme even necessary, though? Japan has plenty of history with land based warfare, too

I am an IRL sailor, so I am biased towards navies. Plus, every other organisation is an army.

[Salvarity]

Best of luck with your military. Will be nice to see another contender on the update field.

Although treading on dangerous ground being founderless and defender.

[Reploid Productions]

I am an IRL sailor, so I am biased towards navies. Plus, every other organisation is an army.

My first guess given the anime tag would have been "Because somebody in charge is a KanColle fan.", but this was my second guess.

[Yokosuka Naval District]

I am an IRL sailor, so I am biased towards navies. Plus, every other organisation is an army.

My first guess given the anime tag would have been "Because somebody in charge is a KanColle fan.", but this was my second guess.

We have KanColle fans amongst us, too. We even had enlistments from said fans, too.

[Sahansahiye Iran]

Why was a naval theme even necessary, though? Japan has plenty of history with land based warfare, too

I am an IRL sailor, so I am biased towards navies. Plus, every other organisation is an army.

So, it wasn't necessary, you just wanted it and in that fashion named it after the IJN. Got ya.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Did you just lose your sponsorship from the actual region of Japan?

I'm interested in an answer to this as well, since closure of embassies between Japan and Yokosuka has been ordered.

[Yokosuka Naval District]

Did you just lose your sponsorship from the actual region of Japan?

I'm interested in an answer to this as well, since closure of embassies between Japan and Yokosuka has been ordered.

There was an argument. We were ordered to stand-down, so we split.

[Wycliffe]

That is certainly discouraging to hear. The IJN has become a regional military without a region. Do you plan to address the issue I raised about the flag?

[Yokosuka Naval District]

That is certainly discouraging to hear. The IJN has become a regional military without a region. Do you plan to address the issue I raised about the flag?

Yes; the modern JMSDF still uses the rising sun ensign, and it was the ensign of the IJN as early as 1889, so I see no problem with it.

[Sahansahiye Iran]

That is certainly discouraging to hear. The IJN has become a regional military without a region. Do you plan to address the issue I raised about the flag?

Yes; the modern JMSDF still uses the rising sun ensign

Yes. Amidst numerous complaints from American WWII veterans' groups, China, and both Koreas. So... good job, I guess?

But whatever. If you want to continue to insist on using fash-associated imagery, that's on you and on you to deal with the wider consequences.

[Yokosuka Naval District]

Yes; the modern JMSDF still uses the rising sun ensign

Yes. Amidst numerous complaints from American WWII veterans' groups, China, and both Koreas. So... good job, I guess?

But whatever. If you want to continue to insist on using fash-associated imagery, that's on you and on you to deal with the wider consequences.

The point is that is is NOT fash-associated imagery; unlike, say, the Swastika, which is associated with a specific period of time in Germany, the rising sun is a national icon, pre-dating WWII by decades. At that point, you are demanding that Japan ditch a part of its national identity.

Meanwhile, in the context it is used in, it isn't fash, either, as the theme of this organisation is more of Meiji-era Japan (the image used is from the Russo-Japanese War, and my flag is the Z flag, from the Battle of Tsushima), which, again, is before fascism.

If this is abstract for you, should Italy give-up il tricolore, since it was used (defaced with the Arms of Savoy) under Mussolini? By your standard, it is "fash-associated imagery".

[Armaros]

Yes. Amidst numerous complaints from American WWII veterans' groups, China, and both Koreas. So... good job, I guess?

But whatever. If you want to continue to insist on using fash-associated imagery, that's on you and on you to deal with the wider consequences.

The point is that is is NOT fash-associated imagery; unlike, say, the Swastika, which is associated with a specific period of time in Germany, the rising sun is a national icon, pre-dating WWII by decades. At that point, you are demanding that Japan ditch a part of its national identity.

Meanwhile, in the context it is used in, it isn't fash, either, as the theme of this organisation is more of Meiji-era Japan (the image used is from the Russo-Japanese War, and my flag is the Z flag, from the Battle of Tsushima), which, again, is before fascism.

If this is abstract for you, should Italy give-up il tricolore, since it was used (defaced with the Arms of Savoy) under Mussolini? By your standard, it is "fash-associated imagery".

You could have drawn upon literal centuries of themes and material. Instead, you chose the flag of fascist Japan, which many have complained about irl; you chose the post 1940 ranks; Oh, and let's not forget that that Russo Japanese war you're using the image from was started by Japan, who were looking to conquer and subjugate Korea and China (who many of them saw as "inferior").

[Aclion]

The point is that is is NOT fash-associated imagery; unlike, say, the Swastika, which is associated with a specific period of time in Germany, the rising sun is a national icon, pre-dating WWII by decades. At that point, you are demanding that Japan ditch a part of its national identity.

Meanwhile, in the context it is used in, it isn't fash, either, as the theme of this organisation is more of Meiji-era Japan (the image used is from the Russo-Japanese War, and my flag is the Z flag, from the Battle of Tsushima), which, again, is before fascism.

If this is abstract for you, should Italy give-up il tricolore, since it was used (defaced with the Arms of Savoy) under Mussolini? By your standard, it is "fash-associated imagery".

You could have drawn upon literal centuries of themes and material. Instead, you chose the flag of fascist Japan, which many have complained about irl; you chose the post 1940 ranks; Oh, and let's not forget that that Russo Japanese war you're using the image from was started by Japan, who were looking to conquer and subjugate Korea and China (who many of them saw as "inferior").

That's not the flag of fascist japan. That's the Rising Sun flag. Specifically the variant flag of the Japanese navy. It is not exclusive to Japans facist period. In fact it is still used by Japan's Maritime Self-Defense Force, which is basically Japan's Navy-But-Not-Really-A-Navy-Pinky-Swear
For the record; the flag of Fascist Japan was the Hinomaru which looks like this;

It has been the de facto national flag since the Meiji reformation.

I'm getting pretty sick and tired of people coming out of the wordwork to make OOC accusations every time someone tries to do something in GP.

[Castelia]

Don't let these people stop you, OP. If you wanna use the picture of a Japanese soldier chopping off the head of a PoW, be my guest.

Serious: Okay, seriously now. I really get what you're saying, but you must also understand that your chosen ranks and picture CAN be offensive.

Then again, these days people are easily offended. I've had the lovely experience of someone accusing me of being a fascist just because I expressed admiration for the Panzer IV tank once.

[Yokosuka Naval District]

Don't let these people stop you, OP. If you wanna use the picture of a Japanese soldier chopping off the head of a PoW, be my guest.

Serious: Okay, seriously now. I really get what you're saying, but you must also understand that your chosen ranks and picture CAN be offensive.

Then again, these days people are easily offended. I've had the lovely experience of someone accusing me of being a fascist just because I expressed admiration for the Panzer IV tank once.

Then have some JMSDF ranks. Now it has no association at all with WWII.

[Grater Tovakia]

The point is that is is NOT fash-associated imagery; unlike, say, the Swastika, which is associated with a specific period of time in Germany, the rising sun is a national icon, pre-dating WWII by decades. At that point, you are demanding that Japan ditch a part of its national identity.

Meanwhile, in the context it is used in, it isn't fash, either, as the theme of this organisation is more of Meiji-era Japan (the image used is from the Russo-Japanese War, and my flag is the Z flag, from the Battle of Tsushima), which, again, is before fascism.

If this is abstract for you, should Italy give-up il tricolore, since it was used (defaced with the Arms of Savoy) under Mussolini? By your standard, it is "fash-associated imagery".

You could have drawn upon literal centuries of themes and material. Instead, you chose the flag of fascist Japan, which many have complained about irl; you chose the post 1940 ranks; Oh, and let's not forget that that Russo Japanese war you're using the image from was started by Japan, who were looking to conquer and subjugate Korea and China (who many of them saw as "inferior").

IDK what you have aginst this org but you are grasping for straws, "You could have drawn upon literal centuries of themes and material." how about you name another time period where Japan had a powerful navy, post 1940 ranks is hardly an indication of fash tendencies, and finally THIS IS A THEME, not an ednorsement of Japanese actions, this org is just trying to spice things up and you decided to accuse them of supporting fascism. This is so petty and I would expect more from NSGP.

[Zizou]

This is so petty and I would expect more from NSGP.

I wouldn't expect more from antifa

[Cormactopia Prime]

This is so petty and I would expect more from NSGP.

I wouldn't expect more from antifa

The person he's quoting is from Lazarus and Unknown, neither of which are Antifa regions.

Not that it even matters what region Jo (Armaros) is from or if it's an Antifa region. The points being made are what matter, despite a few attempts here and there to distract from those points, and the fact of the matter is everything Jo is saying is accurate. The OP's choices are very offensive.

[Zizou]

I wouldn't expect more from antifa

The person he's quoting is from Lazarus and Unknown, neither of which are Antifa regions.

Not that it even matters what region Jo (Armaros) is from or if it's an Antifa region. The points being made are what matter, despite a few attempts here and there to distract from those points, and the fact of the matter is everything Jo is saying is accurate. The OP's choices are very offensive.

Lol, I meant to say that NS antifa will be on this quick as hell, regardless of what anyone else thinks about it

[Yokosuka Naval District]

I wouldn't expect more from antifa

The person he's quoting is from Lazarus and Unknown, neither of which are Antifa regions.

Not that it even matters what region Jo (Armaros) is from or if it's an Antifa region. The points being made are what matter, despite a few attempts here and there to distract from those points, and the fact of the matter is everything Jo is saying is accurate. The OP's choices are very offensive.

So if I formed an organisation with an early 19th century Royal Navy theme, using the Union Jack as the regional flag, would that also be offensive? After all, the British Empire was the largest empire in history, with less savoury parts of its history, and some might find the Union Jack offensive.

Never mind the countless Soviet-themed regions, even when communist imagery can be offensive to many people (and even illegal in some former USSR/Warsaw Pact countries), and when the Soviets were guilty of a good number of things. And, unlike the Japanese Naval imagery I use, the Soviet imagery does correspond to a specific period of time, when they did horrible things.

Besides, if this operation on NationStates is considered offensive, shouldn't media like Kantai Collection, Space Battleship Yamato, and even Girls Und Panzer also be considered offensive? Kantai Collection is even based on the same Navy as this organisation, and Space Battleship Yamato prominently features the aforementioned Imperial Japanese Navy battleship Yamato.

[Aclion]

So if I formed an organisation with an early 19th century Royal Navy theme, using the Union Jack as the regional flag, would that also be offensive?

Yes, as you should be using the St George's ensign in that case.

[Malphe]

Eh. I'm not sure I get the outrage, how far does the logic go? Like I feel like even existing NS orgs would be incriminated by these standards, let alone hypothetical ones. Can we go like, a week without getting all up in arms about something?

[Aclion]

Eh. I'm not sure I get the outrage, how far does the logic go? Like I feel like even existing NS orgs would be incriminated by these standards, let alone hypothetical ones. Can we go like, a week without getting all up in arms about something?

No, because painting people as fascists and then getting offended by them is the only way for some people to stay relevant.

[Wycliffe]

I don't think people are going out of their way to find something to be offended about. The rising sun flag used by the region is deeply offensive to many people today. Period. History, previous uses, modern uses aside, the connotations, especially to Chinese and Koreans, are unacceptable.

[Qilai]

Nothing wrong with the theme. So what if it's based off of Imperial Japan?

Are we talking Sank Half the Tsarist Fleet in 1905 Imperial Japan? Or Rape of Nanking Imperial Japan? Because while there's a clear difference between those two eras, they do have in common the goal of getting in on the ground floor of mercilessly subjugating China and Korea, and someone else in the thread pointed out that they're using 1942-45 rank (names? insignia? I'm not quite clear on that). The former has some bad associations, but the latter is more or less akin to starting a GP group with a Mussolini or Franco theme.

While there is a difference in time periods with Imperial Japan, I feel the difference isn't as clear-cut to the average person as Imperial Germany and Nazi Germany would be.
I would discourage him from using 1942-1945 ranks if he's trying to make a distinction.