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GP Embassy of the New Pacific Order: News and Communication

Talk about regional management and politics, raider/defender gameplay, and other game-related matters.
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Cormactopia Prime
Minister
 
Posts: 2014
Founded: Sep 21, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cormactopia Prime » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:46 pm

Pierconium wrote:We wouldn’t know, the membership of the APC seems so changeable these days, how would we even find out their opinions?

And yet I remain in the Pacific.

Yes, you remain in the Pacific, where the NPO today ejected 135 natives for no reason. Let's stay on track here. I know that's difficult for you to do, because it turns out you're not very good at defending the indefensible, which is why you constantly deflect and try to talk about other things.

Why does the NPO believe it's okay to indiscriminately eject natives who have done absolutely nothing to warrant ejection?
Cormac Skollvaldr
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Pierconium
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Posts: 1125
Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:51 pm

Cormactopia Prime wrote:
Pierconium wrote:We wouldn’t know, the membership of the APC seems so changeable these days, how would we even find out their opinions?

And yet I remain in the Pacific.

Yes, you remain in the Pacific, where the NPO today ejected 135 natives for no reason. Let's stay on track here. I know that's difficult for you to do, because it turns out you're not very good at defending the indefensible, which is why you constantly deflect and try to talk about other things.

Why does the NPO believe it's okay to indiscriminately eject natives who have done absolutely nothing to warrant ejection?

I have nothing to defend. This is not an unusual practice.

You are welcome to reach out to those 135 nations. I’m sure their high activity levels and engagement with the community around them would be a great asset to the APC.

Good luck!
Last edited by Pierconium on Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

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Lord Dominator
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Posts: 3798
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Lord Dominator » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:53 pm

Oddly, that wouldn't seem to answer the given question :roll:
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Pierconium
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Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:54 pm

Lord Dominator wrote:Oddly, that wouldn't seem to answer the given question :roll:

Which question?
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

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The Gilded Star
Attaché
 
Posts: 73
Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Gilded Star » Sun Feb 10, 2019 4:42 pm

Jar Wattinree wrote:
The Gilded Star wrote:I'm curious at the method of choice to lower Aleisyr's influence. I assume the intent was to do it more or less instantaneously and keep him fully present in The Pacific.

Lord Dominator wrote:Given they were only banned, they're presumably allowed back in anyways, so not much harm to really be had :p

Can either clarify what you mean by these statements?


Late response at this point, but what I mean is that kicking the however many nations to drop influence seems awkward. If Aleisyr took a vacation to one of the NPO's password-protected regions (like his own created and aptly named The New Pacific Order), his influence in The Pacific should decay quickly (depending on how the decay is calculated anyway), but he'd be obviously absent from The Pacific meanwhile, which maybe y'all didn't want for security reasons.

Alternatively I've read that nations can kick themselves from their own region to instantly halve their influence, but I don't have any experience with that tactic to know how it works.

That being said, this isn't intended as some sort of criticism or attack of how it was done, mind you.

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Jar Wattinree
Diplomat
 
Posts: 871
Founded: Dec 14, 2016
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Jar Wattinree » Sun Feb 10, 2019 4:50 pm

The Gilded Star wrote:
Jar Wattinree wrote:
Can either clarify what you mean by these statements?


Late response at this point, but what I mean is that kicking the however many nations to drop influence seems awkward. If Aleisyr took a vacation to one of the NPO's password-protected regions (like his own created and aptly named The New Pacific Order), his influence in The Pacific should decay quickly (depending on how the decay is calculated anyway), but he'd be obviously absent from The Pacific meanwhile, which maybe y'all didn't want for security reasons.

Alternatively I've read that nations can kick themselves from their own region to instantly halve their influence, but I don't have any experience with that tactic to know how it works.

That being said, this isn't intended as some sort of criticism or attack of how it was done, mind you.

Thank you for the response.
Krystal is the best lady ever
Tribune of the New Pacific Order

  • Governor of Province Ardere
  • Praetorian of the New Pacific Order
There is no right or wrong in our profession. The present changes the past from moment to moment. Only pray for the future to vindicate your action.

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Myrth
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 260
Founded: Antiquity
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Myrth » Sun Feb 10, 2019 4:57 pm

Cormactopia Prime wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Hail Pacifica!

Thank you!

Pierconium wrote:This is correct. The nations removed were not banned. The highest influence non-WA nations were targeted. Aleisyr’s remaining Influence will decay as East Durthang’s continues to grow.

So just to be clear, the NPO indiscriminately ejected natives of the Pacific who had done nothing to warrant ejection, just to reduce Aleisyr's influence?

And yet you ask why others consider the NPO to be a dictatorial regime that has no legitimate right to govern the Pacific. There's part of the answer.


Oh do give it a rest, Cormac. The NPO is the sole legitimate government of the Pacific and has that right purely by holding the position of WA delegate, boosted by the fact that we've held it for 16+ years. "Not being liked by Cormac" fortunately isn't the baseline for the legitimacy of a government. Here I thought the days of crybabies forming "governments in exile" and the like died a death back in 2004 but I guess I was wrong!
Last edited by Myrth on Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Cormactopia Prime
Minister
 
Posts: 2014
Founded: Sep 21, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cormactopia Prime » Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:15 pm

Myrth wrote:Here I thought the days of crybabies forming "governments in exile" and the like died a death back in 2004 but I guess I was wrong!

Who has formed a government-in-exile? :unsure:
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Wycliffe
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 48
Founded: Aug 10, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Wycliffe » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:09 pm

Myrth wrote:
Cormactopia Prime wrote:Thank you!


So just to be clear, the NPO indiscriminately ejected natives of the Pacific who had done nothing to warrant ejection, just to reduce Aleisyr's influence?

And yet you ask why others consider the NPO to be a dictatorial regime that has no legitimate right to govern the Pacific. There's part of the answer.


Oh do give it a rest, Cormac. The NPO is the sole legitimate government of the Pacific and has that right purely by holding the position of WA delegate, boosted by the fact that we've held it for 16+ years. "Not being liked by Cormac" fortunately isn't the baseline for the legitimacy of a government. Here I thought the days of crybabies forming "governments in exile" and the like died a death back in 2004 but I guess I was wrong!

ITT: Myrth declares that the best reason he can give for dispassionately removing Pacifican natives to speed up the new leader's ascendance is "because I said so".
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RiderSyl
Senator
 
Posts: 4395
Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Mother Knows Best State

Postby RiderSyl » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:37 pm

Drop Your Pants wrote:Where's your shitposting now Syl? Going to complain about the flag next? :rofl:

Huh? The flag looks fine. Boring, but fine. :p

Congrats to the Emperor for finally getting his throne. Took 'em long enough.
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RiderSyl
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Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Mother Knows Best State

Postby RiderSyl » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:41 pm

Also, holy shit. The whole "natives getting kicked" thing was something I was gonna overlook because I figured it was a few of them. Not 100+ nations.

I didn't realize "burning influence" meant griefing your own region.
Last edited by RiderSyl on Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Jar Wattinree
Diplomat
 
Posts: 871
Founded: Dec 14, 2016
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Jar Wattinree » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:56 pm

RiderSyl wrote:Also, holy shit. The whole "natives getting kicked" thing was something I was gonna overlook because I figured it was a few of them. Not 100+ nations.

I didn't realize "burning influence" meant griefing your own region.

:eyebrow:
Krystal is the best lady ever
Tribune of the New Pacific Order

  • Governor of Province Ardere
  • Praetorian of the New Pacific Order
There is no right or wrong in our profession. The present changes the past from moment to moment. Only pray for the future to vindicate your action.

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Elegarth
Envoy
 
Posts: 212
Founded: Feb 08, 2006
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Elegarth » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:34 pm

Someone please show me an official document, treaty or guide that says that Cormac's opinion defines what is legitimate in this realm? I thought the delegacy defined it, but who am I to follow Max rules? *rolling eyes*
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RiderSyl
Senator
 
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Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Mother Knows Best State

Postby RiderSyl » Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:20 pm

Jar Wattinree wrote:
RiderSyl wrote:Also, holy shit. The whole "natives getting kicked" thing was something I was gonna overlook because I figured it was a few of them. Not 100+ nations.

I didn't realize "burning influence" meant griefing your own region.

:eyebrow:


Literally over 100 nations ejected from The Pacific. Y'all griefed your own region just to get Ale's influence down.
Last edited by RiderSyl on Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Ashmoria
Karpathos
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Cormactopia Prime
Minister
 
Posts: 2014
Founded: Sep 21, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cormactopia Prime » Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:21 pm

Elegarth wrote:Someone please show me an official document, treaty or guide that says that Cormac's opinion defines what is legitimate in this realm? I thought the delegacy defined it, but who am I to follow Max rules? *rolling eyes*

I take it you're fine with ejecting 135 native nations for no reason but to burn influence? Disgraceful.
Cormac Skollvaldr
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RiderSyl
Senator
 
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Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Mother Knows Best State

Postby RiderSyl » Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:34 pm

As much as I'd love to think the APC somehow rushed the NPO into making this mistake, I know this is just another fuck-up by the NPO.

When you've got a coalition against you that accuses you of being a government that does more harm to your region than good, and your plan to transition your delegacy includes harming your region, then you're just being stupid with that.

135 ejections, of issues-answerers and roleplayers? Fucking really? Well, thanks for the free ammunition. Jesus.
Last edited by RiderSyl on Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
R.I.P. Dyakovo
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Ashmoria
Karpathos
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RiderSyl
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Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Mother Knows Best State

Postby RiderSyl » Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:41 pm

And I'm going to take a minute here for some self-awareness. I know that Cormac and I are your usual voices from the peanut gallery of this forum. This time, though, there's really something serious there. We aren't crying wolf, there's an actual wolf here. If TBH did this, or any other UCR, they'd be universally condemned forever. This is a lot of innocent players getting kicked out of their home. Check into it for yourself. This is something that shouldn't go unnoticed just because of who's pointing it out.
Last edited by RiderSyl on Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Ashmoria
Karpathos
~ You may think I’m small, but I have a universe inside my mind. ~

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Pierconium
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Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:14 am

RiderSyl wrote:And I'm going to take a minute here for some self-awareness. I know that Cormac and I are your usual voices from the peanut gallery of this forum. This time, though, there's really something serious there. We aren't crying wolf, there's an actual wolf here. If TBH did this, or any other UCR, they'd be universally condemned forever. This is a lot of innocent players getting kicked out of their home. Check into it for yourself. This is something that shouldn't go unnoticed just because of who's pointing it out.

Nothing was griefed. First, because griefing is no longer a thing. Second, because by definition, when it was a thing, griefing was the removal of all native nations (or at least a significant percentage of them). Third, because griefing was deemed impossible in a feeder both pre- and post-Influence.

If TBH raided a region and kicked less than 2% of the population, which is what happened here, no one would give a damn, because that is a ridiculous thing to get upset about.
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

NPO - EMPIRE - TRIUMVIRATE - NPD

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Armaros
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Posts: 331
Founded: Apr 06, 2018
Father Knows Best State

Postby Armaros » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:23 am

Pierconium wrote:
RiderSyl wrote:And I'm going to take a minute here for some self-awareness. I know that Cormac and I are your usual voices from the peanut gallery of this forum. This time, though, there's really something serious there. We aren't crying wolf, there's an actual wolf here. If TBH did this, or any other UCR, they'd be universally condemned forever. This is a lot of innocent players getting kicked out of their home. Check into it for yourself. This is something that shouldn't go unnoticed just because of who's pointing it out.

Nothing was griefed. First, because griefing is no longer a thing. Second, because by definition, when it was a thing, griefing was the removal of all native nations (or at least a significant percentage of them). Third, because griefing was deemed impossible in a feeder both pre- and post-Influence.

If TBH raided a region and kicked less than 2% of the population, which is what happened here, no one would give a damn, because that is a ridiculous thing to get upset about.

TSP disagreed, and very loudly I might add, with everything you said when it happened to Lazarus last year. Which reminds me, where are they? They should be just as upset here as they were back then, no?
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Pierconium
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Posts: 1125
Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:29 am

Armaros wrote:TSP disagreed, and very loudly I might add, with everything you said when it happened to Lazarus last year. Which reminds me, where are they? They should be just as upset here as they were back then, no?

I don’t speak for TSP and I wasn’t here last year so I’m not familiar with the circumstances. I didn’t realise Lazarus focused the majority of its influence in the Delegate nation and limited the amount of influence it allowed other nations in the region to gain.

Of course, just off the top of my head without reading it, I would speculate (and it is just speculation that may be incorrect) that some of the disagreement was that Lazarus purported to be democratic and acted in an undemocratic fashion. We make no such claims.

I took a quick look and I believe you are talking about LWU in Lazarus from April of last year, correct? If so, I think raider/defender politicking had more to do with the relative positions than anything else. Also, I could not find raw numbers of my quick search, how many nations were ejected then and what was the total pre-ejection population of Lazarus? Just curious. Not that it actually matters, the circumstances are quite different and whataboutism doesn’t really fit here.
Last edited by Pierconium on Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:50 am, edited 4 times in total.
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

NPO - EMPIRE - TRIUMVIRATE - NPD

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Old Hope
Diplomat
 
Posts: 761
Founded: Sep 21, 2014
Tyranny by Majority

Postby Old Hope » Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:38 am

RiderSyl wrote:And I'm going to take a minute here for some self-awareness. I know that Cormac and I are your usual voices from the peanut gallery of this forum. This time, though, there's really something serious there. We aren't crying wolf, there's an actual wolf here. If TBH did this, or any other UCR, they'd be universally condemned forever. This is a lot of innocent players getting kicked out of their home. Check into it for yourself. This is something that shouldn't go unnoticed just because of who's pointing it out.

That's wrong.
If TBH would eject(not ban) all nations who aren't active in their region no one whould be surprised. Nor would most people have anything against it.
The reason is simple: These people weren't active in the community, they can always come back if they are suddenly interested in partipiciation in The Pacific(they weren't banned), and the place of residence has no effect on being able to answer issues. "Over 100 nations were ejected" sounds bad, but isn't, really.

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The Gilded Star
Attaché
 
Posts: 73
Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby The Gilded Star » Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:04 am

Pierconium wrote:If TBH raided a region and kicked less than 2% of the population, which is what happened here


Misleading Newspaper Headline: "The Pacific Raided and Sacked by The Black Hawk, says NPO Consul".

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Pierconium
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Posts: 1125
Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:14 am

The Gilded Star wrote:
Pierconium wrote:If TBH raided a region and kicked less than 2% of the population, which is what happened here


Misleading Newspaper Headline: "The Pacific Raided and Sacked by The Black Hawk, says NPO Consul".

This made me smile.
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

NPO - EMPIRE - TRIUMVIRATE - NPD

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Yokiria
Envoy
 
Posts: 226
Founded: Jan 24, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Yokiria » Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:17 am

Pierconium wrote:griefing is no longer a thing.


Incorrect.
Last edited by Yokiria on Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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and the shoreline disappears,
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This nation's views do not necessarily reflect the views of the player.

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Pierconium
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1125
Founded: Antiquity
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pierconium » Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:21 am

Yokiria wrote:
Pierconium wrote:griefing is no longer a thing.


Incorrect.

Please educate me with a game defined meaning then.
Consul of the Pacific

Tyrant (Ret.)


Tell me what you regard as your greatest strength, so I will know how best to undermine you; tell me of your greatest fear, so I will know which I must force you to face; tell me what you cherish most, so I will know what to take from you; and tell me what you crave, so that I might deny you…

NPO - EMPIRE - TRIUMVIRATE - NPD

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