Pacifica Embassy: Relocation to Thalassia

[RiderSyl]

Where is all this outrage from the peanut gallery when The Black hawks have for years now refused to participate in AntiFash operations if defenders were also present? Seems that people are more aiming at an easy target than being actualy outraged about this - otherwise I'd expect some more consistent applications of outrage.

Good point Tim.

[Lord Dominator]

Where is all this outrage from the peanut gallery when The Black hawks have for years now refused to participate in AntiFash operations if defenders were also present? Seems that people are more aiming at an easy target than being actualy outraged about this - otherwise I'd expect some more consistent applications of outrage.

My guess was that Cormac was the one posting it as a big official thing

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Where is all this outrage from the peanut gallery when The Black hawks have for years now refused to participate in AntiFash operations if defenders were also present? Seems that people are more aiming at an easy target than being actualy outraged about this - otherwise I'd expect some more consistent applications of outrage.

You act like it hasn’t been an on and off shitfest for years of people trying to force us to surrender our operational discretion. Like CAIN wasn’t rife with that sort of talk. I got quite a kick the other day out of someone describing it as the last truly non-political antifash group, lol.

TBH’s stance is pretty simple. We’re raiders. We already bend our rules a sieable amount to assist with antifash ops. The line we draw is working with our canon enemies. Even then, we don’t begrudge any members who choose to do so under another flag, unlike we might care about them running any other lib as such. We draw a line at surrendering our base ideology and allowing others to dictate which operations we must drop everything to officially, as an org, participate in. Pacifica’s stance seems remarkably similar - they are, by and large and throughout recent history, and anti-Pacific region. It’s completely understandable for them to draw a line at anything which might obligate them to work against their core regional alignment.

---

Roavin - check the NSGP discord server, I believe in regards to posts from Ark. Might also have been some info from AMOM.

[USS Monitor]

meme

Don't spam.

[Salvarity]

A reasonable foreign policy decision by Pacifica.

Hopefully ANTIFA's operational capabilities aren't too diminished by this. Furthermore hope that the NPO can not successfully use this to claw themselves back into the game.

[Roavin]

Roavin - check the NSGP discord server, I believe in regards to posts from Ark. Might also have been some info from AMOM.

Can't find anything....

[Vetelo]

I do believe that is MORE important the mission of Antifa, that any related things, Rach mention to me,I do not care. If Attero, Alvero or whatever is called now, was marked as Fascist or not, that happen in 2012? is 2019!?

Actually the accusations of me being a fascist, or more commonly a "fascist collaborator" or "fascist sympathizer" are far more recent than 2012. I wasn't even deeply involved in anti-fascist operations until 2015 (or NS at all for that matter). Only recently have regions like TCB been trying to smear my name. I would also like to re-iterate that it is absurd to think that someone who's been running a leftist region for years has anything to do with fascism. We have a zero-tolerance policy to fascist rhetoric and hate speech. One visit to the USSD and you'd realise that immediately upon joining. (I'd also like to note that Alvero is not even me, he's the former Speaker of the Soviet, and now a resident of Democratic Socialist Assembly)

Furthermore, for Pacifica, joining ANTIFA was entirely a PR move. You obviously don't care about fighting fascism if you withdrew from the organization just because someone you don't like is in it. Anti-fascists should be a united front. The difference between normal people like us and fascists is that fascists are not a united front and never will be. They are petty towards each other and disorganized. They can be easily confronted and defeated by a coalition of sound-minded people. Regions like Pacifica stand to benefit from being among that coalition. Not just because of improving your reputation, but to show the fash that no one will stand with them, that we will all be united against tyranny. However, you, Cormac have chosen the cowardly route. As little as I am informed about the affairs of this sphere of gameplay these days, I do know that Pacifica did not greatly contribute to ANTIFA even when it was a member. You sent minuscule numbers of troops as a token force, to show off. Now you are acting as if you always showed them your full support and always will. Clearly you do not support them fully if you can't tolerate one of the largest militaries in NS joining forces with them. I fought with and alongside the NPO Revolutionary Guard, and they have a very capable and dedicated anti-fascist force, unlike yours. Nobody should be agreeing with this action, let alone commending it, it is only damaging to the anti-fascist cause. I think it shines a light on the integrity of people in GP, that more people are not outraged by such a move. That's all I have to say on this matter.

[The Notorious Mad Jack]

You obviously don't care about fighting fascism if you withdrew from the organization just because someone you don't like is in it. Anti-fascists should be a united front.

Two thoughts strike me reading this part in particular. Firstly, you can care about fighting fascism whilst having problems with other people who fight fascism - there are enough people and groups involved in the fight against fascism that you can still do anti-fash operations and not be involved with groups who allow the NPO to participate. That can and does happen - antifa is not the sole organisation that fights fascists.

Secondly, of course you would want anti-fascists to be a united front. That being the case creates a space where blacklisted players like yourself can worm your way back into the wider gameplay sphere.

[Vetelo]

You obviously don't care about fighting fascism if you withdrew from the organization just because someone you don't like is in it. Anti-fascists should be a united front.

Two thoughts strike me reading this part in particular. Firstly, you can care about fighting fascism whilst having problems with other people who fight fascism - there are enough people and groups involved in the fight against fascism that you can still do anti-fash operations and not be involved with groups who allow the NPO to participate. That can and does happen - antifa is not the sole organisation that fights fascists.

Secondly, of course you would want anti-fascists to be a united front. That being the case creates a space where blacklisted players like yourself can worm your way back into the wider gameplay sphere.

ANTIFA is the largest, longest standing, most dedicated, and most reputable anti-fascist organization. Choosing not to work with ANTIFA means you not an anti-fascist. You also wrongly assume that I want to be part of the "wider gameplay sphere". I cannot stand the amount of petty drama. I am perfectly content with being in just my own region and a few of its close allies. All I want is for there to be unity against the fash, that's the only way they will be entirely removed. It is not just about open confrontations on the battlefield, it is about giving no platform to fascists whatsoever. Pacifica leaving ANTIFA shows weakness, and fascists will always try to capitalize on perceived weaknesses.

[The Church of Satan]

Choosing not to work with ANTIFA means you not an anti-fascist.

That is not correct. Antifa is not all of anti-fascism. Anti-fascism does exist outside of Antifa.

Two thoughts strike me reading this part in particular. Firstly, you can care about fighting fascism whilst having problems with other people who fight fascism - there are enough people and groups involved in the fight against fascism that you can still do anti-fash operations and not be involved with groups who allow the NPO to participate.

He's right Vetelo. Antifa is not the end-all-be-all of fighting fascism.

[Vetelo]

That is not correct. Antifa is not all of anti-fascism. Anti-fascism does exist outside of Antifa.

I did not say anti-fascism does not exist outside of Antifa. I said that if you choose not to work with them, then you are not an anti-fascist. There is a difference to those two statements. You are not dedicated to the cause if you choose not to work with them.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I said that if you choose not to work with them, then you are not an anti-fascist.

You are not dedicated to the cause if you choose not to work with them.

Thanks for summing up exactly why people leave or never join such group efforts - the “if you and your org don’t support my thing and do everything I tell you to do, you’re bad people” line ain’t new, or unique to this, but it’s definitely still annoying.

[The Church of Satan]

And you may not have outright said it but your statement does heavily imply it. Perhaps you should choose your words more carefully next time.

[Vetelo]

And you may not have outright said it but your statement does heavily imply it. Perhaps you should choose your words more carefully next time.

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

Translation:

of course you would want anti-fascists to be a united front. That being the case creates a space where blacklisted players like yourself can worm your way back into the wider gameplay sphere.

[Vetelo]

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

Translation:

of course you would want anti-fascists to be a united front. That being the case creates a space where blacklisted players like yourself can worm your way back into the wider gameplay sphere.

I already addressed this exact message in a previous post. I do not want to be in the wider GP sphere. All I wish is for closer ties to other leftists and anti-fascists. I will not be responding to any more of your posts, as I have you blacklisted and all you seem to do is repeat the same things other people have already said.

[The Church of Satan]

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

This is GP. Sadly politics encompass everything here. >_<

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I will not be responding to any more of your posts, as I have you blacklisted and all you seem to do is repeat the same things other people have already said.

Blacklist doesn’t seem to be working very well.

Also, that translation wasn’t for your benefit.

[The Gilded Star]

It would make about as much sense for Pacifica to work with its antithesis, the NPO, as it would for Antifa to work with their antithesis, fascists. Not to mention that I think there's some people in the Pacifica circle that believe the NPO is fascist which makes it doubly worse to work with them.

Pacifica still opposes fascism, but it will find a way to do so without breaking bread with the NPO.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

This reminds me of some Antifa Op we were a part of and then someone complained to the Op leaders about us being in there as well and threatened to leave if we wouldn't.

[The Tri State Area and Maine]

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

This is GP. Sadly politics encompass everything here. >_<

I honestly have no idea what you think it should encompass.

[Draganisia]

Pacifica still opposes fascism, but it will find a way to do so without breaking bread with the NPO.

Did you ever think that maybe it is time to end that "war" since those you were angry at were either banned or otherwise significantly reduced in power?

[Aclion]

And you may not have outright said it but your statement does heavily imply it. Perhaps you should choose your words more carefully next time.

I mean you got me there. I just think that ANTIFA does what needs to be done, plain and simple. Politics don't have to be involved. Everyone should put aside their differences for pure, unadulterated, fash bashing.

Antifa is steeped in politics, though.

That is not correct. Antifa is not all of anti-fascism. Anti-fascism does exist outside of Antifa.

I did not say anti-fascism does not exist outside of Antifa. I said that if you choose not to work with them, then you are not an anti-fascist. There is a difference to those two statements. You are not dedicated to the cause if you choose not to work with them.

If you oppose fascism you are an anti-fascist. The fact that you choose not to associate with equally disgusting people, who use the banner of antifascism to grasp at some sort of moral legitimacy, does not change that.

[Lord Dominator]

Pacifica still opposes fascism, but it will find a way to do so without breaking bread with the NPO.

Did you ever think that maybe it is time to end that "war" since those you were angry at were either banned or otherwise significantly reduced in power?

Because that's a totally new question that hasn't been asked in some manner in the last several months

[The Gilded Star]

Did you ever think that maybe it is time to end that "war" since those you were angry at were either banned or otherwise significantly reduced in power?

Considering the amounts of "Praise Pergamon" and "Remember Francos Spain" comments I've noticed popping up around the game lately, I'm once again becoming inclined to believe that either the NPO is insincere about their change and is simply waiting things out, or they have old guard acting in open defiance of their new Emperor, which raises questions about how stable and unified the current regime is.

So no.