The Kemetic Chronicle ~ Osirian ConCon in Chaos

[Ikania]

I suppose the bored though must manufacture drama. All the other things one could be doing, building a community etc and this is what is important. The goal is to .... create activity...? Hmm...now I see why that continues to be a problem.

Part of building a community is having a constitution that works for the community. Activity is a problem in Sinkers because we have low activity populations in comparison to Feeders. Why it's a problem in the South Pacific, a Feeder, is anyone's guess.

Part of building a community is actually listening to said community and caring about its opinion instead of ignoring it when it doesn't suit your power plays.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Part of building a community is having a constitution that works for the community. Activity is a problem in Sinkers because we have low activity populations in comparison to Feeders. Why it's a problem in the South Pacific, a Feeder, is anyone's guess.

Part of building a community is actually listening to said community and caring about its opinion instead of ignoring it when it doesn't suit your power plays.

58% voted in favor of the constitution I proposed. It would have passed with just four more votes. That you're advocating for me to ignore the decisive majority of Osirans and somehow listen to the 42% minority who flooded in and voted against in the last few hours of voting, after not having ever participated in the discussion or giving me any chance at all to listen to their concerns, is mind boggling. That you're siding with the people who wanted even more power for the Pharaoh than I did -- they essentially wanted the NPO on steroids, but didn't want to bother doing the work to draft a constitution based on that when I wouldn't -- is just bizarre. You're not even considering the possibility that someone besides me could be wrong.

[Mallorea and Riva]

• Create a constitution designed to institute a permanent dictatorship
• Let NK get the delegacy, or better yet have him trick a defender group into pushing him into the delegacy
• #NKCoup2017
• Dali and Nev come out of the woodwork like they always do to help out
• The people used as tools for this endeavor are given the heave-ho from the region after being told that they aren't going to be given a slice of the pie
• Have one of the scorned plotters of the coup lead a countercoup effort which will eventually succeed due to RL business of NK et al.
• Let a few years pass, repeat.
• ???
• Profit!!!

Osiris never ceases to entertain.

Starts tabulating the odds to set up a betting pool on which of the scorned plotters will lead the countercoup effort

[Cormactopia Prime]

With permission from Pharaoh Syberis, the constitutional convention has been made visible to the general public (here), so that everyone can see for themselves what's true and what isn't and arrive at their own judgment of the situation.

[Escade]

Yes, it seems that certain elements of NSGP takes political inspiration from the middle school playground. Of course in real life, we do have Trump in power now and he certainly wishes to use Twitter to bait and egg on other nations. However, before him most presidents had a certain element of class or finesse. I suppose the bored though must manufacture drama.

Glad to see TSP is recognizing the type of politics it leads the field in, even if I cannot personally support it.

Aww a "no u," what else could be expected from your level of politics though. Sputter sputter fail and flail. When you or yours can engage in cogent, civilized discourse...oh who I am kidding...that's not happening any time soon. TSP is as, a whole, a healthy region of good people who do pretty well in the various things we do. Most of our player base doesn't follow NSGP or care because NSGP literally is some rancid wannabe version of Mean Girls where most of you can't even play by any set of standards. Not even the street bootleg version, its like below that.

"Oh noes, she's going to bring up rainbows and sunshine." Yes, in fact I will. There's nothing stopping you from creating beautiful things for your community or groups. There is nothing stopping you from being positive and having a healthy outlook. There is nothing stopping you from enjoying a game that should be entertaining and fun. There is nothing stopping you from minding your own business instead of screeching at people or things that don't particularly care about you or whatever your dark cynical views are and have articulated in multiple ways, "leave us alone." It's simple - don't like someone or something - stay out of it.

The unpetty live their lives and enjoy them while the morose seem to follow our every move and obsess over us. So boring, they don't even do something worthy of our commenting upon it even if just with a bored sigh.

With permission from Pharaoh Syberis, the constitutional convention has been made visible to the general public (here), so that everyone can see for themselves what's true and what isn't and arrive at their own judgment of the situation.

Cormac, I wasn't referring to the constitutional issue but the prescription of TSP. If TSP was having activity issues that would make the prescriptions all the more hilariously ironic. Of course the fact is that we are highly active so that is a moot point. Can't have it both ways unless you are simply prescribing us because of the actions of one citizen and are basically doing some sort of massive Salem Witch trials where everyone with red hair is burned at the stake because guilty by association. I am not particularly bothered by the prescription anymore since it speaks to like having some sort of "thumbs down" button which as you wish. The majority of our people are not affected by prescriptions since we weren't interested anyway and had and have no ill intent towards other regions. My personal belief is that if more regions were active and healthy we would have more people to do events or other fun things with.

My hopes are Osiris can put itself together again in a healthy and whole way.

Anyways, good luck Osi.

[Miporin]

"Oh noes, she's going to bring up rainbows and sunshine."

Your strawman's looking a bit shabby; might want to get a replacement sometime

My best wishes to Osiris in getting their new constitution in order.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Glad to see TSP is recognizing the type of politics it leads the field in, even if I cannot personally support it.

Aww a "no u," what else could be expected from your level of politics though. Sputter sputter fail and flail. When you or yours can engage in cogent, civilized discourse...oh who I am kidding...that's not happening any time soon. TSP is as, a whole, a healthy region of good people who do pretty well in the various things we do. Most of our player base doesn't follow NSGP or care because NSGP literally is some rancid wannabe version of Mean Girls where most of you can't even play by any set of standards. Not even the street bootleg version, its like below that.

"Oh noes, she's going to bring up rainbows and sunshine." Yes, in fact I will. There's nothing stopping you from creating beautiful things for your community or groups. There is nothing stopping you from being positive and having a healthy outlook. There is nothing stopping you from enjoying a game that should be entertaining and fun. There is nothing stopping you from minding your own business instead of screeching at people or things that don't particularly care about you or whatever your dark cynical views are and have articulated in multiple ways, "leave us alone." It's simple - don't like someone or something - stay out of it.

The unpetty live their lives and enjoy them while the morose seem to follow our every move and obsess over us. So boring, they don't even do something worthy of our commenting upon it even if just with a bored sigh.

You really should invest in a mirror.

Who makes GP "mean girls?"

Who continually tries to stop people from creating what they want to see in their regions, when it doesn't fit their own view of how other regions should be run?

Who is always "screeching at people" instead of "minding [their] own business?"

Actions speak louder than words. Practice the crap you preach, and maybe this cesspit would have a few less shits floating in it.

If you’re so certain that you’re the bigger, better people who are above engaging in constant criticism, pettiness, etc, then damn well act like it, be the bigger person and ignore it, instead of going full hypocrite in public, eh? Or, stop acting all high and mighty when you’re as much a cause of it as anyone else here, if not moreso.

[Queen Yuno]

Yeah. I don't think talking crap about other people or calling people toxic is going to solve anything. And if anyone needs to devote entire multi paragraph posts to doing that without getting straight to the point, that is not substance, only more fuel to the fire.

From what I gather, this is my perspective of the summary of events.

1) There was a Constitution convention lasting for 2+ weeks. Everyone acted fine with it.
2) numerous guardians coordinated to votestack Nay on the Constitution at the last minute.
3) most of Osiris got mad about being blindsided like that, so those three guardians quit the region and moved to Lazarus.
4) This event being all private for citizens-only, was leaked onto here.
5) some people act as un-diplomatic as ever. Without reading the mood. Without regard that there are tensions from having lost three guardians just like that, or the anger for last second votestacks, or even the fact that a region's private conflicts were published without permission into random NS gameplay forums. For foreign regions to comment on. Diplomatic foreign nations would stay out of speculating publicly and commenting on any material coming provided by an openly malicious leak. But it's not diplomatic foreign nations I see here, but the opposite. Foreign nations who are flat out not reading the mood, with a victim-blaming mentality, not caring how much turmoil the victims just went through. I use the word "un-diplomatic" but it's a light word that understates the poor conduct I noticed. There are stronger adjectives... but I think un-diplomatic nations shouldn't be shocked when they make exposions simply because:
Sometimes they get away with it, but
sometimes, they don't.

[Zaolat]

• Create a constitution designed to institute a permanent dictatorship
• Let NK get the delegacy, or better yet have him trick a defender group into pushing him into the delegacy
• #NKCoup2017
• Dali and Nev come out of the woodwork like they always do to help out
• The people used as tools for this endeavor are given the heave-ho from the region after being told that they aren't going to be given a slice of the pie
• Have one of the scorned plotters of the coup lead a countercoup effort which will eventually succeed due to RL business of NK et al.
• Let a few years pass, repeat.
• ???
• Profit!!!

Osiris never ceases to entertain.

Starts tabulating the odds to set up a betting pool on which of the scorned plotters will lead the countercoup effort

NK was just the previous Delegate, Mall.

[Escade]

Aww a "no u," what else could be expected from your level of politics though. Sputter sputter fail and flail. When you or yours can engage in cogent, civilized discourse...oh who I am kidding...that's not happening any time soon. TSP is as, a whole, a healthy region of good people who do pretty well in the various things we do. Most of our player base doesn't follow NSGP or care because NSGP literally is some rancid wannabe version of Mean Girls where most of you can't even play by any set of standards. Not even the street bootleg version, its like below that.

"Oh noes, she's going to bring up rainbows and sunshine." Yes, in fact I will. There's nothing stopping you from creating beautiful things for your community or groups. There is nothing stopping you from being positive and having a healthy outlook. There is nothing stopping you from enjoying a game that should be entertaining and fun. There is nothing stopping you from minding your own business instead of screeching at people or things that don't particularly care about you or whatever your dark cynical views are and have articulated in multiple ways, "leave us alone." It's simple - don't like someone or something - stay out of it.

The unpetty live their lives and enjoy them while the morose seem to follow our every move and obsess over us. So boring, they don't even do something worthy of our commenting upon it even if just with a bored sigh.

You really should invest in a mirror.

Who makes GP "mean girls?"

Who continually tries to stop people from creating what they want to see in their regions, when it doesn't fit their own view of how other regions should be run?

Who is always "screeching at people" instead of "minding [their] own business?"

Actions speak louder than words. Practice the crap you preach, and maybe this cesspit would have a few less shits floating in it.

If you’re so certain that you’re the bigger, better people who are above engaging in constant criticism, pettiness, etc, then damn well act like it, be the bigger person and ignore it, instead of going full hypocrite in public, eh? Or, stop acting all high and mighty when you’re as much a cause of it as anyone else here, if not moreso.

Aww...we should be the bigger people? At least you admit to starting stuff and instigating and then expecting the other side to not respond. That's only how it works when the rancid mean girl clique actually dominates and isn't some low rent etc. That's also how people explain things to kids when they're trying to teach them the world is an unfair place because they want to avoid conflict and it's also a nice shield to hide behind since it absolves you from instigating. Or is that how Pontius explained his actions, "Why don't you be the better person?" LOL, "you shouldn't respond back or do anything when people start drama because like we expect you to be Jesus." Sorry, just human and capable of clapbacks.

#sorry-not-sorry. Who's threads are you constantly in....oh yeah ours. Point to how many of your threads we particularly engage in or care about and how many times you've jumped into the TSP embassy or other threads that have nothing to do with you or are actually about festivals or some such thing. Even the particular players responding into this thread are doing so because of the drama brought up about us being prescribed with attacks against specific players having gone on for months. Not to mention certain players who've stalked our Discord, sent us TGs or DMs even after politely and repeatedly being told "not interested or leave it alone."

Your role in this game as defined by one of the people you speak for is "bulldog." It has a definition, too and its pretty clear when you're doing it.

~

As for the random - Miporin. I think people misunderstand sunshine and rainbows philosophy. It's a mode of being and it operates on peace, love and light but also when push comes to shove...lightning and thunder. Spark-ly.
~

As for the rest and the carefully constructed indirect blah...same...except TSP is my region so I defend my region and its people. I might call out my fellow region mates but usually in private because I guess that's the difference between friends and enemies. I don't particularly care that half of GP hates on one or two or however many people. I find it amusing that so much time is spent for that.

As for empathy and lessons in diplomacy....yes the TSP embassy thread really shows how empathetic and diplomatic foreign nations are. Let me pull up this imgur album of the highlights reel. If you don't have empathy or diplomacy for your alleged regions or people but only a certain group and when the timing is convenient well there are adjectives for that as well. I mean we all know which side we stand on by the people we end up defending or not. And the word "victim," should be used carefully and considerately as well. Words have power and meaning and the misuse of them conflates between actual victims and what seems to be on par for the course although I'm missing some of the pieces to what Mall is explaining is "on par for the course." As in the case of Lazarus, same thing applies - hope that the long term players and region builders get a say and things work out.

I guess we go back to the central point of the argument. Either the rules apply to everyone about empathy, diplomacy, standards of discourse, or they don't seem to apply at all.

[Pollaetorian]

With permission from Pharaoh Syberis, the constitutional convention has been made visible to the general public (here), so that everyone can see for themselves what's true and what isn't and arrive at their own judgment of the situation.

I wish to engage the services of "Wolfram and Hart - Attorneys at Law" to review this region's constitution. I hope the NS community would respect the judgement of an impartial 3rd party.

Have we tried unplugging Osiris and plugging it back in again? What the hell, man. *roars with laughter*

Yes, it was called the Osiris Fraternal Order and came into being in December 2013. The main Hard-Drive was replaced in 2016 because of disk writing errors.

---

Can someone link a copy of the constitutional draft that was thrown out? I'd like to take a read and judge for myself.

Failing that, now that it's public, time for Raven to fulfil his public duties for the NS community.

[Glen-Rhodes]

Yuno, you’re my favorite raider... but..... Osiris lost any claim to deserving respectful diplomacy a long time ago

[Roavin]

With permission from Pharaoh Syberis, the constitutional convention has been made visible to the general public (here), so that everyone can see for themselves what's true and what isn't and arrive at their own judgment of the situation.

Interesting. So the OP isn't necessarily wrong regarding its central claim - under the Scroll of Horus, Cormac and NK would be automatic Guardians that can only be removed with the assent of the Council of Scribes, unlike "normal" Guardians. But what the OP (probably deliberately) mischaracterizes is that this is granted specifically to former Pharaohs, so if Syberis were to abdicate it would apply to him as well. The forum posts don't reveal why this is (it's hinted that discussion on that happened on Discord), though if I had to guess, it might be so that previous Pharaohs, which had been in the position of ultimate trust before, should be the one group able to provide checks on the Pharaoh. Considering the context of the autocratic systems proposed, that actually seems reasonable, I guess.

Contrary to what Koth said, there was actually one post by one of the three - Adytus had asked specifically about the former Pharaoh clauses and asked why they were still in there, to which Cormac replied that he was encouraged by several people to add it back in. Other than that, statements from Koth/KQ/Wymond/Cormac/etc. (including that the other draft had even more power vested in the Pharaoh) seem to check out.

(also, I just noticed: wouldn't Adytus have been considered part of the establishment, since he's been Chief Vizier and Chief Scribe and whatnot in Osiris since OFO 2.0?)

TL;DR: the OP doesn't check out, and it looks like a minor disagreement was made into an excuse to ragequit rather ungracefully.

[SYG]

I’d rather read 20 OnderPosts than 1 EscadePost..

[Glen-Rhodes]

I’d rather read 20 OnderPosts than 1 EscadePost..

Stream of consciousness > calculated jargony pseudo-intellectualism!!

[Mallorea and Riva]

• Create a constitution designed to institute a permanent dictatorship
• Let NK get the delegacy, or better yet have him trick a defender group into pushing him into the delegacy
• #NKCoup2017
• Dali and Nev come out of the woodwork like they always do to help out
• The people used as tools for this endeavor are given the heave-ho from the region after being told that they aren't going to be given a slice of the pie
• Have one of the scorned plotters of the coup lead a countercoup effort which will eventually succeed due to RL business of NK et al.
• Let a few years pass, repeat.
• ???
• Profit!!!

Osiris never ceases to entertain.

Starts tabulating the odds to set up a betting pool on which of the scorned plotters will lead the countercoup effort

NK was just the previous Delegate, Mall.

So? Time wasn't right for #NKCoup2017 at that point.

[Drop Your Pants]

I’d rather read 20 OnderPosts than 1 EscadePost..

No one is forcing you to read them or even comment. Go read the LKE topic.

[Mommy Yuno]

Yuno, you’re my favorite raider... but..... Osiris lost any claim to deserving respectful diplomacy a long time ago

I just don't like to see two NS communities at war with each other. When you post what sums up as "serves ya right" on a controversial Osiris (leak) thread, you just did yourself a diplomatic disaster.

*rubs temples*

[Ikania]

Part of building a community is actually listening to said community and caring about its opinion instead of ignoring it when it doesn't suit your power plays.

58% voted in favor of the constitution I proposed. It would have passed with just four more votes. That you're advocating for me to ignore the decisive majority of Osirans and somehow listen to the 42% minority who flooded in and voted against in the last few hours of voting, after not having ever participated in the discussion or giving me any chance at all to listen to their concerns, is mind boggling. That you're siding with the people who wanted even more power for the Pharaoh than I did -- they essentially wanted the NPO on steroids, but didn't want to bother doing the work to draft a constitution based on that when I wouldn't -- is just bizarre. You're not even considering the possibility that someone besides me could be wrong.

Six abstentions, not to mention. I'm not at all part of the crowd that insists abstaining is anything but validating whatever low-turnout outcome is produced from the people who bothered to vote, but either way this referendum definitely lacked a decisive opinion in favor on the part of the citizenry. To me, any constitution stripping the people of their capability to have any say in their Delegate, and their Judiciary, isn't worth voting for. I hope enough Osirans can see things the same way next time this issue comes around.

[McChimp]

No one is forcing you to read them or even comment. Go read the LKE topic.

Something doesn't have to be compulsory to be flawed and criticised. If criticism is above your endurance, don't post controversial stuff.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Six abstentions, not to mention. I'm not at all part of the crowd that insists abstaining is anything but validating whatever low-turnout outcome is produced from the people who bothered to vote, but either way this referendum definitely lacked a decisive opinion in favor on the part of the citizenry. To me, any constitution stripping the people of their capability to have any say in their Delegate, and their Judiciary, isn't worth voting for. I hope enough Osirans can see things the same way next time this issue comes around.

There were six abstentions on the other proposal, offered by Gibraltarica. There were only three abstentions on my proposal -- and one of them was me. So yes, tell me again how three abstentions, only two of which weren't me, means it lacked a decisive opinion in favor on the part of the citizenry.

I repeat: 58% of the voting citizenry voted in favor of it. And regardless, there is no support -- none -- for your "democracy" mongering. Even those who voted Nay weren't voting Nay because they wanted more "democracy," they voted Nay because they wanted less.

[Kylia Quilor]

Yes, back when I still had an ounce of belief that getting involved in GCR politics was useful for a UCR region.

GCR politics is a gaping black hole of attention and focus, and UCRs as a whole should not waste their time trying to sway them one way or the other or getting involved in their drama. People who want to play GCRs, go there, but UCR governments as a whole, IMO, should generally avoid the GCRs. Been a view of mine since I came back at the beginning of the year, and honestly, I was halfway there by late 2013.

The treaty with TSP was made in the aftermath of the MiloTrollcoup, and as we both know, never amounted to much.

There are some particular cases where GCRs like to almost “toy” and “test the boundaries” with newfound partners to the extent that they can feel more like a frenemy than an ally. When they’re a bit more mature than that, however, I would just say the dividends of your relationship reflect the commitments you make in them.

The Treaty with TSP and Kantrias was a mistake on my part. I was operating under the belief that the route to formal validation as a meaningful UCR of note ran through getting a treaty with a GCR. I changed my mind about that several months later, but since the NAP cost no one anything, didn't see any need to make any effort to repeal it.

EDIT: Ikania, as far as I know, I'm the only Osirian who argued at any length for increasing the democracy in the new Scolls from Cormac's initial draft.

[SYG]

I’d rather read 20 OnderPosts than 1 EscadePost..

No one is forcing you to read them.

Thank god

[Reventus Koth]

Six abstentions, not to mention. I'm not at all part of the crowd that insists abstaining is anything but validating whatever low-turnout outcome is produced from the people who bothered to vote, but either way this referendum definitely lacked a decisive opinion in favor on the part of the citizenry. To me, any constitution stripping the people of their capability to have any say in their Delegate, and their Judiciary, isn't worth voting for. I hope enough Osirans can see things the same way next time this issue comes around.

In addition to Cormac's post pointing out there were only 3 abstentions on his draft, I'd like to say that as someone who abstained on both, I simply didn't even bother to read either of them. Point being that my abstention was out of apathy, not indecisiveness.

Also, nobody cares what you would or would not vote for in Osiris.

[Ikania]

Six abstentions, not to mention. I'm not at all part of the crowd that insists abstaining is anything but validating whatever low-turnout outcome is produced from the people who bothered to vote, but either way this referendum definitely lacked a decisive opinion in favor on the part of the citizenry. To me, any constitution stripping the people of their capability to have any say in their Delegate, and their Judiciary, isn't worth voting for. I hope enough Osirans can see things the same way next time this issue comes around.

In addition to Cormac's post pointing out there were only 3 abstentions on his draft, I'd like to say that as someone who abstained on both, I simply didn't even bother to read either of them. Point being that my abstention was out of apathy, not indecisiveness.

Also, nobody cares what you would or would not vote for in Osiris.

It is not my business whether or not the Osiran people want to vote like sheep. I am a simple man. I see controversy, I comment.