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Talk about regional management and politics, raider/defender gameplay, and other game-related matters.
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Polldger
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 50
Founded: Jan 09, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Polldger » Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:32 am

I was originally going to suggest that we should give anarchy a chance. That instead of jumping to a default assumption that it has to transition to something, we should embrace it as an ongoing state of Lazarus. Lazarus finally has a chance to become a Peacezone, even it has to be rebrand into "Anarchy" to sell it (And I even once called it Anarchist-Socalist Peacezone Theory when I was implementing it in Eastern Europe back then).

After all according to the traditional definition of Peacezone Theory:

The WA Delegate holds no power whatsoever and nations cannot be ejected. - Check. Imki is chosen to use none of the powers of delegate and nations are not being ejected.

The World Factbook Entry will not be changed, and posts will not be suppressed. - Check. The WFE is neutral and does not advocate or endorse any particular government, making all the groups equally unofficial and valid, with their level of recognition earned by popularity. You may argue against existence of an "official" discord, but just like the region it has not shown any administration so I can adapt to that. Posts are not being suppressed

Movement in and out of the region is unrestricted, as no password can be imposed. - Check again.

This region will neither seek nor accept embassies, so don't bother to ask. - The existing tags and embassies were frozen in time rather than clearing (or accepting) all, but at least no further changes are being made.

I wish people could call it for what it is...

What needs to happen next is for class consciousness to occur so they accept that the current "anarchy" is here to stay. Everyone is still fighting for the delegacy, instead of adjusting to the new reality. The reality where you can still regional governments, organise cultural activities etc and you don't need access to regional controls as well as you have supporters and recognition. That it's ok to have the CU or the NLE or the Khanate are residing together in one region and people can freely choose the system they like best. They are not mutually exclusionary!


Open the spoiler if you want to read about that.....but Peacezone Theory is an old idea. 2018 demands new innovations!

Introducing the "Confederation of the Six (or Five)"

(We need a better name)

Transition has to occur but everyone is stuck into their old ways of thinking. Transition shouldn't be towards one regional government that governs control all 6 regional powers, but a loose confederation of six regional governments that each only control 1 regional power. Each of those 'governments' can develop their own culture and constitution to determine how they want to elect the 'delegate' of that regional power. We'll have a WA Voting Delegate, Appearance Delegate, Communications Delegate, Border Control Delegate, Embassies Delegate, Polls Delegate. They can engage in foreign relations with the other governments if they want to coordinate the use of the regional powers together.

This addresses the main 'flaw' from Peacezone Theory, that government and players within in need to hold some sort of institutional power that provides a purpose to exist.

From the current state of the Lazarus here is what I'll do:

- At some future point in time, top 5/6 most WA endorsements excluding the Game-Executive Delegate shall form the initial Confederation of the Six (or Five, depending on whether Border Control is delegated). Starting at the top each could pick the one power they want. This reflects the current situation quite nicely as Treadwellia currently 5th excluding the delegate and he was appointed Polls. We already have a start!

- The initial Five/Six Powers Delegates can decide whether claim the power for themselves as a dictator, or further delegate it by building a democratic government to determine how that power should be elected.

- The transition has to happen gradually, releasing one power at a time, for each of the Five/Six Powers Delegates can have time to find their feet and establish thier own presence. The populace also needs to be slowly introduced to the Confederation of the Six as they have been indoctrinated by the One Regional Government ideology thus far and it needs some adjustment. At the moment "Polls Delegate" is released, so the others are still up for grabs for those who can reach the most endorsements when the next release happens. This gradual releasing of powers one by one shall be the transition of Lazarus from Anarchy to a Confederation.

- If the power is to be claimed dictatorially, then I think there should be a fail safe clause where they have to remain in the top 5/6 endorsements. This means keeping your WA locked, so democracy has its advantages!

- If the power is claimed democratically, then the Powers Delegate with the selected power can then be passed down via the democratic process developed.

- As mentioned earlier, each of the Powers Delegate or their governments might want to form treaties so they work together. Or they might want to go rogue, powerplay etc. That's the fun!

- The Game Mechanic Executive Delegate exists only to safeguard the system, facilitate the passing down of Powers Delegates among those that have made democratic processes, and to vote the way the "WA Voting Delegate" votes.

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Ras al-Ghul
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 2
Founded: Apr 26, 2015
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Ras al-Ghul » Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:35 am

Marilyn Manson Freaks wrote:I could really dig a "rebirth" theme.


All can be reborn in the Lazarus Pit! Only the Batman party can save Lazarus now, we're the heroes Lazarus deserves!
Last edited by Ras al-Ghul on Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Demon's Head
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Join the League of Assassins: The Batman Party of Lazarus! All can be reborn in the Lazarus Pit!

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The Church of Satan
Minister
 
Posts: 2193
Founded: Apr 15, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Church of Satan » Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:44 am

Killer Kitty wrote:
Vadia wrote:-snip-


Ah look, the non-native Defender has arrived to lecture us about the true realties of Lazarus.

Oh please, tell me all about how Lazarus really is. As a non-defender native, I've been blind to the superior knowledge you have about my region. Knowledge that you have no doubted gained by being an armchair observer.

Oh right, because all of your defender conspiracies that you invented to justify your coup are just 100% true. >_>

So far the only thing your regime has achieved is to make raiders look bad. Maybe that's why so many raiders turned their back on you? Be glad you still have Balder and LKE.
The Rejected Realms: Former Delegate | Former Vice Delegate | Longest Consecutively Serving Officer in TRR History - 824 Days
Free the WA gnomes!

Chanku: This isn't an election it's an assault on the eyes. | Ikania: Hear! The Gospel of... Satan. Erh...
Yuno: Not gonna yell, but CoS is one of the best delegates ever | Ever-Wandering Souls: In the liberal justice system, raiding-based offenses are considered especially heinous. In The South Pacific, the dedicated defenders who investigate these vicious felonies are members of an elite squad known as the Council on Regional Security. These are their proscriptions. DUN DUN.

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Consular
Minister
 
Posts: 3019
Founded: Apr 10, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Consular » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:08 am

United Massachusetts wrote:
Lord Dominator wrote:Religion in NS is only allowed to be based around NSers :p
"Excuse me, have you heard the word of our Lord and chaser Vincent Drake?"

The Christian Commonwealth of Lazarus

*throws up*

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The New California Republic
Post Czar
 
Posts: 35483
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:19 am

Consular wrote:
United Massachusetts wrote:The Christian Commonwealth of Lazarus

*throws up*

It won't happen. I sincerely doubt there is enough of a Christian presence in Lazarus to justify such a thing, or to even make it happen in the first place.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
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They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Auralia
Senator
 
Posts: 4982
Founded: Dec 15, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Auralia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:45 am

Consular wrote:
United Massachusetts wrote:The Christian Commonwealth of Lazarus

*throws up*

Sounds like a great idea to me. The region is literally named after St. Lazarus of Bethany.
Catholic Commonwealth of Auralia
"Amor sequitur cognitionem."

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RiderSyl
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6309
Founded: Jan 16, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby RiderSyl » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:11 pm

Polldger wrote:<snip>


Sure, let's do it!
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Ashmoria
Karpathos
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Vadia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1054
Founded: Nov 28, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Vadia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:09 pm

"
Polldger wrote:<snip>


This is an interesting idea, I'll think it over.
The fastest way to make absolutely sure that a point is bad, is to pretend to argue for it to people that are against it.

""Ten thousand people, maybe more
People talking without speaking
People hearing without listening""

This is also my NPC account.

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Aigania
Attaché
 
Posts: 71
Founded: Sep 17, 2009
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Aigania » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:14 pm

Er, why don't put it through a fair election once the region is made stable?

Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?
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Neop
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 111
Founded: Oct 02, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Neop » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:18 pm

Aigania wrote:Er, why don't put it through a fair election once the region is made stable?

Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?


That's the fairest idea. Unfortunately, we've still got the stabilization part to work out.
neop

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Vadia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1054
Founded: Nov 28, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Vadia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:26 pm

Aigania wrote:Er, why don't put it through a fair election once the region is made stable?

Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?


Seems pretty stable right now, only going to get more stable.
The fastest way to make absolutely sure that a point is bad, is to pretend to argue for it to people that are against it.

""Ten thousand people, maybe more
People talking without speaking
People hearing without listening""

This is also my NPC account.

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Pencil Sharpeners 2
Diplomat
 
Posts: 601
Founded: Aug 21, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Pencil Sharpeners 2 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:44 pm

Aigania wrote:Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?

Yes. You need to be subjugated by somebody. It's the law, I'm afraid.
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Lord Dominator
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8900
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Right-wing Utopia

Postby Lord Dominator » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:06 pm

Vadia wrote:
Aigania wrote:Er, why don't put it through a fair election once the region is made stable?

Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?


Seems pretty stable right now, only going to get more stable.

Stable is one word I suppose...

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Razzle Dazzle
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Posts: 69
Founded: Jan 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Razzle Dazzle » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:11 pm

Vadia wrote:
Aigania wrote:Er, why don't put it through a fair election once the region is made stable?

Is it too much to ask that the people of Lazarus will be able to decide in peace and freedom how they want to roleplay themselves sans impositions?


Seems pretty stable right now, only going to get more stable.

It's an anarchy with no government and no laws that has declared itself a warzone. How is that in any way stable?
I support Leviticus 19 : 27, do you?

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MALLORA AN RIV SHOULD RESIN

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Vadia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1054
Founded: Nov 28, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Vadia » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:34 pm

Razzle Dazzle wrote:
Vadia wrote:
Seems pretty stable right now, only going to get more stable.

It's an anarchy with no government and no laws that has declared itself a warzone. How is that in any way stable?


Well, no one's been killed for awhile, and everyone is really active and friendly. RP is florishing, the region has it's own inside jokes now, and so on.

It's like a peaceful camping ground, vs the previous gulags and crackdowns we had to live with.
The fastest way to make absolutely sure that a point is bad, is to pretend to argue for it to people that are against it.

""Ten thousand people, maybe more
People talking without speaking
People hearing without listening""

This is also my NPC account.

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Razzle Dazzle
Attaché
 
Posts: 69
Founded: Jan 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Razzle Dazzle » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:39 pm

Vadia wrote:
Razzle Dazzle wrote:It's an anarchy with no government and no laws that has declared itself a warzone. How is that in any way stable?


Well, no one's been killed for awhile, and everyone is really active and friendly. RP is florishing, the region has it's own inside jokes now, and so on.

It's like a peaceful camping ground, vs the previous gulags and crackdowns we had to live with.

Perhaps, but it's a peaceful camping ground on a volcano.
I support Leviticus 19 : 27, do you?

Eluvatar wrote:Back in my day, we endotarted up-hill both ways in the snow! #DiscordsAreLazy
MALLORA AN RIV SHOULD RESIN

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Lazarene Pilgrimage
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Apr 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Lazarene Pilgrimage » Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:40 pm

Christians have every right to assert a region of their own.

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Razzle Dazzle
Attaché
 
Posts: 69
Founded: Jan 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Razzle Dazzle » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:03 pm

Lazarene Pilgrimage wrote:Christians have every right to assert a region of their own.

No more than any other group would have a right to claim an entire GCR belonged to them.
I support Leviticus 19 : 27, do you?

Eluvatar wrote:Back in my day, we endotarted up-hill both ways in the snow! #DiscordsAreLazy
MALLORA AN RIV SHOULD RESIN

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Lazarene Pilgrimage
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Apr 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Lazarene Pilgrimage » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:10 pm

Razzle Dazzle wrote:
Lazarene Pilgrimage wrote:Christians have every right to assert a region of their own.

No more than any other group would have a right to claim an entire GCR belonged to them.

We have long been ostracised from NationStates communities. Surely we have the right to claim for our own a region named after one of our saints?

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Ikania
Senator
 
Posts: 3692
Founded: Jun 28, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Ikania » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:11 pm

Eh. Laïcité c'est magnifique. I think it wouldn't be bad to have a Lazarus themed a little around the Bible, with corresponding names (Bethany, Nazareth, Galilee, etc) as well as positions (Bishops, Patriarchs, a Pope maybe). But I think it would be best to distance it from any actual theological disputes or 'real' Christianity, because naturally that might turn off non-Christians. Or Protestants.
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Executive Advisor in The League.
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Three-time Defendervision winner. NSG Senate veteran.
Knuckle-dragging fuckstick from a backwater GCR. #SPRDNZ
Land Value Tax would fix this
СЛАВА УКРАЇНІ

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Razzle Dazzle
Attaché
 
Posts: 69
Founded: Jan 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Razzle Dazzle » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:13 pm

Lazarene Pilgrimage wrote:
Razzle Dazzle wrote:No more than any other group would have a right to claim an entire GCR belonged to them.

We have long been ostracised from NationStates communities. Surely we have the right to claim for our own a region named after one of our saints?

Indeed, just as soon as Osiris is seized by ancient Egyptian gods and Balder is taken over by the Rogaine Republic.
I support Leviticus 19 : 27, do you?

Eluvatar wrote:Back in my day, we endotarted up-hill both ways in the snow! #DiscordsAreLazy
MALLORA AN RIV SHOULD RESIN

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Lazarene Pilgrimage
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Apr 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Lazarene Pilgrimage » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:14 pm

Ikania wrote:Eh. Laïcité c'est magnifique. I think it wouldn't be bad to have a Lazarus themed a little around the Bible, with corresponding names (Bethany, Nazareth, Galilee, etc) as well as positions (Bishops, Patriarchs, a Pope maybe). But I think it would be best to distance it from any actual theological disputes or 'real' Christianity, because naturally that might turn off non-Christians. Or Protestants.

We would be a catch-all region, a refuge of sort for Christians of all stripes. We would, however, embrace religious tolerance and democratic governance of a hybrid between a secular and religious state.

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Ikania
Senator
 
Posts: 3692
Founded: Jun 28, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Ikania » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:29 pm

Lazarene Pilgrimage wrote:
Ikania wrote:Eh. Laïcité c'est magnifique. I think it wouldn't be bad to have a Lazarus themed a little around the Bible, with corresponding names (Bethany, Nazareth, Galilee, etc) as well as positions (Bishops, Patriarchs, a Pope maybe). But I think it would be best to distance it from any actual theological disputes or 'real' Christianity, because naturally that might turn off non-Christians. Or Protestants.

We would be a catch-all region, a refuge of sort for Christians of all stripes. We would, however, embrace religious tolerance and democratic governance of a hybrid between a secular and religious state.

I don't want to end up a dhimmi in my own region.
Ike Speardane
Executive Advisor in The League.
Proud soldier in the service of The Grey Wardens.
Three-time Defendervision winner. NSG Senate veteran.
Knuckle-dragging fuckstick from a backwater GCR. #SPRDNZ
Land Value Tax would fix this
СЛАВА УКРАЇНІ

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Jar Wattinree
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1700
Founded: Dec 14, 2016
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Jar Wattinree » Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:14 pm

Razzle Dazzle wrote:
Lazarene Pilgrimage wrote:Christians have every right to assert a region of their own.

No more than any other group would have a right to claim an entire GCR belonged to them.

The Pacific region has been themed around the New Pacific Order for over fourteen years. I'd say that qualifies, unless you meant an IRL group claiming a GCR?
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I will quest forever onwards, so far;
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Razzle Dazzle
Attaché
 
Posts: 69
Founded: Jan 23, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Razzle Dazzle » Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:16 pm

Jar Wattinree wrote:
Razzle Dazzle wrote:No more than any other group would have a right to claim an entire GCR belonged to them.

The Pacific region has been themed around the New Pacific Order for over fourteen years. I'd say that qualifies, unless you meant an IRL group claiming a GCR?

I was thinking more a group entering a region to take it over, all the while claiming they had an inherent right to do so.
I support Leviticus 19 : 27, do you?

Eluvatar wrote:Back in my day, we endotarted up-hill both ways in the snow! #DiscordsAreLazy
MALLORA AN RIV SHOULD RESIN

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