NATION

PASSWORD

Embassy of the South Pacific | Joint Proscription of TBH

Talk about regional management and politics, raider/defender gameplay, and other game-related matters.
Not a roleplaying forum.

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Comfed
Diplomat
 
Posts: 589
Founded: Apr 09, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Comfed » Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:16 am

Qvait wrote:It's great to see an update on the SPSF! It's also great to see us working with EPSA, arguably our closest non-defender military ally in the game right now.

Quietly adds you to the TNP enemies list.

Seriously, though, great to see the SPSF doing stuff! Quality RP as always. Congratulations to Prairie!
Mall:
Best part about being a mod was engaging in normal player behavior and getting accused of abuse
"You think this is abuse? I'll SHOW you abuse."
Ever-Wandering Souls wrote:
Unibot III wrote:in a liberal justice system


In the liberal justice system, raiding-based offenses are considered especially heinous. In The South Pacific, the dedicated defenders who investigate these vicious felonies are members of an elite squad known as the Council on Regional Security. These are their proscriptions. DUN DUN.

User avatar
Qvait
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 182
Founded: Mar 08, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Qvait » Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:57 am

Comfed wrote:
Qvait wrote:It's great to see an update on the SPSF! It's also great to see us working with EPSA, arguably our closest non-defender military ally in the game right now.

Quietly adds you to the TNP enemies list.


Ruh-roh. You can take solace in the fact that I believe that TNP is the South's closest non-defender cultural ally. I think I should shut up now before another region enters the fray. :p
Hey, I'm Jay and I am a legislator and roleplayer in the South Pacific.

Former Minister of Foreign Affairs /// Member of the Council on Regional Security /// Former Minister of Regional Affairs

My History

User avatar
Varanius
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 111
Founded: Sep 18, 2019
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Varanius » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:33 pm

Congrats Prarie! Well deserved I’m sure.
Adoring fan of Tim
A TWPer with a question

Yeah yeah, all opinions expressed by Varanius are not representative of any region or organization they are a member of unless explicitly stated otherwise.

User avatar
Daytime to Night
Envoy
 
Posts: 227
Founded: Dec 04, 2007
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Daytime to Night » Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:20 pm

The South Pacific Special Forces wrote:“I swear, plot armor is the only thing that kept me alive here.” Phoenix sighed as she felt revived by the sun’s rays, her skin returning to their normal color as she shook the rain off of her. She looked up at Prarie, then over the other side of the mountain, and gasped. “Oh my gosh you can really see everything from here.”

“Plot armor…?” Prarie asked, confused. “Is that something that can help us…?”


:D this is excellent

Congratulations to Prarie and Melix, you've both been awesome!
Former Minister of Security and Minister for Justice - the South Pacific

Potato General Numero Capatata

User avatar
North Prarie
Diplomat
 
Posts: 903
Founded: Nov 04, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby North Prarie » Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:41 pm

Thanks all! It's a pleasure to continue to work with Phoe and the rest of the SPSF :)

Congrats to Melix!! You've been an awesome and enthusiastic trainee and I am sure that will continue as soldier!
North Prarie. Prarie. Proud TSPer. SocDem.
Hosting Experience
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament
Copa South Pacifica 1
WPIC 5
Sporting Acheivments
Round of 16 at Handball World Cup 20
Women's Hockey Round of 16 at Prescott Winter Olympics 13
Prarie Classic Baseball Tournament Champions

Prariean Airlines-Pompeii Industries Luxury Cars-Phoenix Luxury Hotels (V2 Coming Soon)-Stonebridge Simbacat International Airport-Embassy Program
SBT BottomLine-President Valieant welcomes first child Pax, Social Democrats gain big wins in Parliament elections, Lions win NPBL, Cavaliers win Prarie Hockey Cup, NPFA announces slow move away from world affairs

User avatar
TSP Foreign Office
Secretary
 
Posts: 40
Founded: Jul 18, 2016
New York Times Democracy

Postby TSP Foreign Office » Fri Nov 20, 2020 5:46 pm

PRESS RELEASE


Image

STATEMENT ON THE BLACK HAWKS' VIOLATION OF SOVEREIGNTY

11 NOVEMBER 2020

Fellow South Pacificans and friends abroad,

This week, our Office of WA Legislation (OWL) noticed suspicious activity in its surveys on Security Council resolutions. In an effort to increase to participation and representation in the World Assembly, OWL holds regular RMB-based debates on World Assembly resolutions. The outcome of these debates strongly influences our Delegate’s vote on the resolutions.

Our allies in 10000 Islands also alerted the Cabinet and the Council on Regional Security on this suspicious activity and provided more information. We have strong evidence that members of The Black Hawks attempted to manipulate the outcome of Security Council votes related to their interests.
  • The nation “Rebbid” belongs to known player Martyn, who is a corporal in The Black Hawks, and was founded merely 2 days before immediately joining the World Assembly and casting a vote, without explanation, in favor of “Commend Twobagger.”
  • The nation “GlowGolden” was founded at the same time and also immediately joined the World Assembly and cast a vote, without explanation, in favor of “Commend Twobagger.” We believe this nation may belong to Steak Paul, a known member of The Black Hawks, due to Steak Paul resigning from the World Assembly a mere 30 seconds before GlowGolden was admitted.
  • Both Rebbid and GlowGolden nations had moved into newly-founded passworded regions before moving into The South Pacific. We believe this may have been part of an alternate plan to pad “Commend Twobagger” with approvals by creating small single-purposes Delegates, in case it could not reach the voting queue organically.
  • A similar pattern was spotted with the nation “Seltin.” This nation is older, founded in September 2020 but only days ago rejoined the World Assembly. Their only activity in The South Pacific has been to vote in OWL and their votes track with the interests of The Black Hawks. They voted in favor of “Condemn Ever-Wandering Souls”, which was widely considered to be a thinly-veiled congratulation for the well-known raider. They also voted in favor of “Commend Twobagger.”

The Cabinet of The South Pacific considers this a grave and gross violation of our regional sovereignty by The Black Hawks. We endeavor to create an open community and foster a representative government, and the OWL program has been a great vehicle to introduce the community to the World Assembly. To abuse and attempt to manipulate the outcome of these votes to serve a foreign enemy’s interest is an attack on the integrity of our democracy. The Cabinet retains the authority to override an OWL vote, exactly to prevent something like this from succeeding. We shall do so when necessary. Let it be known to all enemies of the Coalition, and those who would think we can be so easily manipulated, that The South Pacific and our allies are watching.

The Cabinet also takes this opportunity to address the Security Council resolution that has inspired The Black Hawks to again attempt to violate our sovereignty. “Commend Twobagger” is a product of the worst habits of the Security Council and the Gameplay community in general. Let’s be clear: Twobagger betrayed 10000 Islands and joined their enemies in The Black Hawks. Regardless of the motive or anybody’s opinion on that, they are not an active defender and 10000 Islands does not approve of being used in such a manipulative way to commend them. The commendation purposefully misleads the rest of the game into thinking that Twobagger is a current wonderous defender, when in all actuality they are a turncoat raider.

“Commend Twobagger” represents the epitome of bad faith, pettiness, dishonesty, and disrespect that we have sadly come to expect from The Black Hawks. This kind of abuse of the Security Council debases the institution. When a resolution can be pushed through using such dishonest and despicable bad faith, it devalues the whole purpose of Commendations and the Security Council itself. Too many regions underestimate the damage these stunts do. The Black Hawks, and those who aid and abet their remorseless bad faith, are sowing a momentary and fleeting feeling of joy in sticking it to defenders. But we will all reap the disillusionment and discontent that comes when we throw the principles of honestly, good faith, and honorable conduct out of the window.

The South Pacific has voted against this commendation, and we encourage all regions, and all of our allies and partners to join us in doing so. It’s time to stand up for what’s right and foster a game that no longer promotes and rewards manipulation, bad faith, and trolling.

Faithfully yours,
The Cabinet

Last edited by TSP Foreign Office on Fri Nov 20, 2020 5:58 pm, edited 4 times in total.

User avatar
Lord Dominator
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6394
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Corporate Police State

Postby Lord Dominator » Fri Nov 20, 2020 5:53 pm

Point of information, none of the actions involving voting in TSP's WA debates were ever condoned or discussed by the Council of Hawks prior to said actions occurring.

Once we were made aware by a third party, we found those involved and they were berated for said actions.
Dee Vytherov-Skollvaldr | Forest | TBH Major and Council Member | WA Vizier | Ambassador to the WA

User avatar
United Federated States of Omega
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 128
Founded: Sep 06, 2015
New York Times Democracy

Postby United Federated States of Omega » Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:16 pm

Anything TBH does now is cheapened by the fact they knew their members violated our sovereignty, sat on the information, and didn't even think to tell us, much less do anything of actual substance about it. This is a "we're sorry we got caught" and nothing more.
My statements are my own and do not represent the opinion of any organization unless otherwise noted.
TSP Minister of Foreign Affairs (October 2019- June 2020, October 2020- )

Author of GAR #401

"If you had less friends, you'd probably be running TSP by now"-Solorni
"I don't know who you are but I think I like you" -Consular
"You seem very much the chill mafiasio opposite of hippie lifestyle watching everything going on with a calculated expression and an ace up your sleeve, making sure everything goes according to plan" - Imaginary
"My god can you ever be informal XD" -Roavin
"Omega, your brand is Texas" -Roavin

What's next?

User avatar
Comfed
Diplomat
 
Posts: 589
Founded: Apr 09, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Comfed » Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:46 pm

I hope that regions don't switch their WA vote on this because some TBH people were doing stuff they shouldn't have done.
Mall:
Best part about being a mod was engaging in normal player behavior and getting accused of abuse
"You think this is abuse? I'll SHOW you abuse."
Ever-Wandering Souls wrote:
Unibot III wrote:in a liberal justice system


In the liberal justice system, raiding-based offenses are considered especially heinous. In The South Pacific, the dedicated defenders who investigate these vicious felonies are members of an elite squad known as the Council on Regional Security. These are their proscriptions. DUN DUN.

User avatar
Custadia
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 55
Founded: May 29, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Custadia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:49 pm

As Lazcorp's managing director, I'd like to express our disappointment in these three raiders' actions. In order to discourage violations of GCR sovereignty such as this, our delegate has agreed to vote against the proposal in question. Subterfuge of this kind ought to blow up in the perpetrators' faces.
AKA McChimp

User avatar
Tinhampton
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7595
Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Tinhampton » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:21 pm

TSP Foreign Office wrote:Our allies in 10000 Islands also alerted the Cabinet and the Council on Regional Security on this suspicious activity...

Why is it acceptable for "our allies in 10000 Islands" (who may or may not be eligible to cast a legal vote in TSP's OWL program, since we do not know who exactly supplied this information) to potentially influence the vote of TSP's Delegate in the form of identifying "suspicious" OWL voters, when those same "suspicious" voters - who, by some miraculous coincidence, are perfectly entitled to cast an OWL vote and have that vote counted - cannot do so? This is not on the level of a "Violation of Sovereignty" and this is not even on the level of an IRL state governor purging the voter rolls - more accurately, this is akin to a person presenting their ID at a polling station, casting an early in-person vote, and then learning two days before election day that their vote will be conveniently discarded because they moved into the state a few months ago and they voted for the candidate that's the opposite party to the Secretary of State anyway.

Let it be known that the next time a sincere Commendation of Twobagger comes up, I will very likely support it - and since it's fair game for Kuriko to send a tag:wa on Commend Texas because "the raiders influence on the GCRs and large independents would have seen it fail" otherwise, I will more than happily do the same the next time such a resolution comes to vote to prevent its being sunk by defender-oriented GCRs such as The South Pacific.
Last edited by Tinhampton on Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Self-Administrative City of TINHAMPTON (pop. 319,372): Saffron Howard, Mayor (UCP); Alexander Smith, WA Delegate-Ambassador

Authorships & co-authorships: SC#250, SC#251, Issue #1115, SC#267, GA#484, GA#491, #GA#533
Other achievements: Cup of Harmony 73 champions; -45 Darkspawn Kill Points; current WA Delegate of Auctor; "Tinhampton? the man's literally god"
Who am I, really? 45yo Tory woman; Cambridge graduate; possibly very controversial; currently reading Worth Dying For by Tim Marshall

User avatar
Aleister
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 25
Founded: Oct 26, 2016
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Aleister » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:30 pm

I feel like I'm in a fever dream.
Since when do raiders apologize to defenders for messing with defenders...
Also, this is about two puppets voting on a resolution? ~210 nations from TSP have voted on the resolution. Am I genuinely misinterpreting this post or is this really all about thinking two puppets (or let's say even if they had evidence of 10 puppets) could manipulate the voting in TSP in their favor? What? Is there something I'm missing about how the OWL system works maybe?
Hello?
Can anybody hear me?
Hellllooooo?
Last edited by Aleister on Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Big Bad Badger
Envoy
 
Posts: 227
Founded: Apr 25, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Big Bad Badger » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:30 pm

This is petty and this is lame. Y'all are going to make me want to like TBH again.

We (my spooky associates and I) have been doing things like this to TSP and others for years. If a handful of WA nations are going to swing your votes then your WA dept needs to get better.

/me wiggles spooky fingers in your general direction
Last edited by Big Bad Badger on Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Mr. Badger

I've been told that raiding requires booze and a lack of pants! --Neenee

User avatar
Office of WA Legislation
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 3
Founded: Mar 15, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Office of WA Legislation » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:41 pm

Aleister wrote:I feel like I'm in a fever dream.
Since when do raiders apologize to defenders for messing with defenders...
Also, this is about two puppets voting on a resolution? ~210 nations from TSP have voted on the resolution. Am I genuinely misinterpreting this post or is this really all about thinking two puppets (or let's say even if they had evidence of 10 puppets) could manipulate the voting in TSP in their favor? What? Is there something I'm missing about how the OWL system works maybe?
Hello?
Can anybody hear me?
Hellllooooo?

The Office of WA Legislation's voting system allows all WA member citizens of the South Pacific (i.e. those resident in good faith) to determine the vote of the delegate by posting their vote with an optional opinion on the RMB of the region The South Pacific WA Voting Center. We pride ourselves on the fact that we do not sequester the determination of the delegate's vote on a sub-sub-forum of our offsite, but rather make it widely available to our RMB-based community as well.
Last edited by Office of WA Legislation on Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
OWL

DISCLAIMER: TSP Office only. Does not represent the whole World Assembly.

User avatar
United States of Vietnam
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 100
Founded: Jun 10, 2016
Left-wing Utopia

Postby United States of Vietnam » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:42 pm

Big Bad Badger wrote:This is petty and this is lame. Y'all are going to make me want to like TBH again.

We (my spooky associates and I) have been doing things like this to TSP and others for years. If a handful of WA nations are going to swing your votes then your WA dept needs to get better.

/me wiggles spooky fingers in your general direction


I don't think there is really any way to stop this aside from detecting suspicious activities like this. I am not sure how you can make it better. The same can be done for any region with a WA voting program as most only need you to be in the WA to vote. Also, the Cabinet has the final authority on SC votes so this is not a problem for us on that front.

User avatar
Refuge Isle
Diplomat
 
Posts: 539
Founded: Dec 14, 2018
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:43 pm

Tinhampton wrote:Let it be known that the next time a sincere Commendation of Twobagger comes up, I will very likely support it

I am certain that TBH will appreciate your four votes.
Luca Vytherov (29, F, herbivore)
Refugi Arch-Administrator
Admin assistant: Siv Ember
A List of History
Founder of Refugia
3x WA Author, Deputy WAA Minister of TEP
Posts not OOC are assumed to be made under duress

User avatar
Aleister
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 25
Founded: Oct 26, 2016
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Aleister » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:49 pm

Office of WA Legislation wrote:The Office of WA Legislation's voting system allows all WA member citizens of the South Pacific (i.e. those resident in good faith) to determine the vote of the delegate by posting their vote with an optional opinion on the RMB of the region The South Pacific WA Voting Center. We pride ourselves on the fact that we do not sequester the determination of the delegate's vote on a sub-sub-forum of our offsite, but rather make it widely available to our RMB-based community as well.

What did their posts look like? And even then, two nations? I would understand making this a story if they were even campaigning within the region/on the RMB to vote their way, but did even that happen?

I once piled like 7 votes last minute on Roavin for the Prime Minister? election I think that was like a region-side poll. It was against Aumelodia? I think. Not sure if it was Prime Minister, but he would have won too if I had found out about it sooner! And we're talking about two puppets that just voted on a resolution and didn't do anything else to campaign?

User avatar
Tinhampton
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7595
Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Tinhampton » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:52 pm

Office of WA Legislation wrote:
Aleister wrote:I feel like I'm in a fever dream.
Since when do raiders apologize to defenders for messing with defenders...
Also, this is about two puppets voting on a resolution? ~210 nations from TSP have voted on the resolution. Am I genuinely misinterpreting this post or is this really all about thinking two puppets (or let's say even if they had evidence of 10 puppets) could manipulate the voting in TSP in their favor? What? Is there something I'm missing about how the OWL system works maybe?
Hello?
Can anybody hear me?
Hellllooooo?

The Office of WA Legislation's voting system allows all WA member citizens of the South Pacific (i.e. those resident in good faith) to determine the vote of the delegate by posting their vote with an optional opinion on the RMB of the region The South Pacific WA Voting Center. We pride ourselves on the fact that we do not sequester the determination of the delegate's vote on a sub-sub-forum of our offsite, but rather make it widely available to our RMB-based community as well.

The official OWL document on how to vote is clear that "if you want to vote, your nation needs to be in the South Pacific and a member of the WA first," without any "resident in good faith" qualifications attached. (Seltin, GlowGolden, and Rebbid all had their votes left mysteriously uncounted in the final Commend Twobagger tally.) Do we want every legal vote or just every moral vote counted next time?
Last edited by Tinhampton on Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Self-Administrative City of TINHAMPTON (pop. 319,372): Saffron Howard, Mayor (UCP); Alexander Smith, WA Delegate-Ambassador

Authorships & co-authorships: SC#250, SC#251, Issue #1115, SC#267, GA#484, GA#491, #GA#533
Other achievements: Cup of Harmony 73 champions; -45 Darkspawn Kill Points; current WA Delegate of Auctor; "Tinhampton? the man's literally god"
Who am I, really? 45yo Tory woman; Cambridge graduate; possibly very controversial; currently reading Worth Dying For by Tim Marshall

User avatar
Jakker City
Envoy
 
Posts: 211
Founded: Dec 10, 2011
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Jakker City » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:54 pm

It is unfortunate that this takes focus away from the commendation itself. I get that there has been a lot of talk about my intentions writing it, but ultimately I have worked as hard as I have on this proposal because Twobagger truly deserves it and yet he has gotten so much hate. Hate that I would say goes beyond the typical reactions in this game. As well as a dismissal of their achievements that I know would be different if they were still a defender. 

I get that this will be used to push the proposal towards failing. It was great that so many people came forward in favor of the proposal and of Twobagger. I will see if someone else will want to take it on for a future attempt. Hopefully that will then allow the focus to be on and remain on Twobagger's contributions to the game.

User avatar
Qvait
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 182
Founded: Mar 08, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Qvait » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:02 pm

I very much appreciate the Cabinet of the South Pacific taking forceful action on this egregious violation of regional sovereignty.
Hey, I'm Jay and I am a legislator and roleplayer in the South Pacific.

Former Minister of Foreign Affairs /// Member of the Council on Regional Security /// Former Minister of Regional Affairs

My History

User avatar
Aumeltopia
Attaché
 
Posts: 67
Founded: Apr 02, 2017
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Aumeltopia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:11 pm

Rebbid wrote:Out of curiosity, can a legal rep for TSP point out what was wrong with moving into the region, endorsing all of their Guardians (not a legal requirement) and then following the letter of their law to vote for something that was receiving support from within that region already?

Further, if I choose to move into a GCR, am I forbidden from partaking in the democratic process within that region? And if yes, is that purely because I'm a raider? I've left because I clearly wasn't welcome and if that's going to be my experience of GCRs, I'll be quite happy to steer clear, but this seems very unfair, especially repremanding someone who had literally nothing to do with it.

I am no legal representative, but those resident in the South Pacific in bad faith -- for example, someone attempting to hide the fact that they are a puppet while moving to the South Pacific purely to influence our WA vote -- are specifically excluded from the definition of citizenship. Casting OWL votes has always been a privilege open only to citizens of the Coalition. However, all nations of the world are invited to voice their opinions on every proposal by posting an opinion to the OWL message board. OWL appreciates those opinions and I was a bit saddened that the TBH stackers didn't even see fit to explain their opinions -- something we strongly encourage of TSP voters.

EDIT: I see the post I was quoting has now been deleted. But I've preserved it for posterity, I suppose.
Last edited by Aumeltopia on Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Former Delegate of the South Pacific
aka Somyrion

Auphelia wrote:Raccoons are bandits! First they steal your food . . . and then your heart/identity!

User avatar
Nova Vandalia
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 168
Founded: Jan 19, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Nova Vandalia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:20 pm

Aumeltopia wrote:
Rebbid wrote:Out of curiosity, can a legal rep for TSP point out what was wrong with moving into the region, endorsing all of their Guardians (not a legal requirement) and then following the letter of their law to vote for something that was receiving support from within that region already?

Further, if I choose to move into a GCR, am I forbidden from partaking in the democratic process within that region? And if yes, is that purely because I'm a raider? I've left because I clearly wasn't welcome and if that's going to be my experience of GCRs, I'll be quite happy to steer clear, but this seems very unfair, especially repremanding someone who had literally nothing to do with it.

I am no legal representative, but those resident in the South Pacific in bad faith -- for example, someone attempting to hide the fact that they are a puppet while moving to the South Pacific purely to influence our WA vote -- are specifically excluded from the definition of citizenship. Casting OWL votes has always been a privilege open only to citizens of the Coalition. However, all nations of the world are invited to voice their opinions on every proposal by posting an opinion to the OWL message board. OWL appreciates those opinions and I was a bit saddened that the TBH stackers didn't even see fit to explain their opinions -- something we strongly encourage of TSP voters.

EDIT: I see the post I was quoting has now been deleted. But I've preserved it for posterity, I suppose.


And what is the definition of bad faith here? Voting for a proposal you all openly didn't want to approve. Honestly this feels like y'all circumnavigating your own system to push a very specific agenda, and to play the victim on the global stage, and It's just so happens that the one region more dedicated to seeing this fail than you all, is the one that happened to know that there was "Bad" actors in your midst. This honestly smells of convenience rather than genuine outrage.
Last edited by Nova Vandalia on Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All rants and grunts are soley the opinion of Nova Vandalia and the not the opinion of those they're affiliated with.
^-^

User avatar
Tinhampton
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7595
Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Anarchy

Postby Tinhampton » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:26 pm

Qvait wrote:I very much appreciate the Cabinet of the South Pacific taking forceful action on this egregious violation of regional sovereignty.

Even if the votes of Rebbid, GlowGolden and Seltin had been counted, the OWL vote on this resolution would still have gone 6-3 AGAINST. The Cabinet statement does not represent a change in TSP's mind and has no effect other than to "encourage all regions... to join us in" voting against Commend Twobagger (emphasis added by yours truly). How is this any less a "violation of sovereignty" to any non-TSP region than a failed attempt to convince a single GCR delegate to vote in favour of Commending Twobagger? If the Cabinet statement is forceful, it is only in terms of describing Commend Twobagger or the Black Hawks as having acted in "bad faith" or not in "good faith" five times in the space of less than 180 words.

Aumeltopia wrote:
Rebbid wrote:snip

I am no legal representative, but those resident in the South Pacific in bad faith -- for example, someone attempting to hide the fact that they are a puppet while moving to the South Pacific purely to influence our WA vote -- are specifically excluded from the definition of citizenship. Casting OWL votes has always been a privilege open only to citizens of the Coalition. However, all nations of the world are invited to voice their opinions on every proposal by posting an opinion to the OWL message board. OWL appreciates those opinions and we were a bit saddened that the TBH stackers didn't even see fit to explain their opinions -- something we strongly encourage of TSP voters.

After the Great Council of 2016, it was determined that all citizens of TSP before that point would become Legislators; TSP's Charter (and indeed the rest of its constitutional law) further makes no reference to citizenship other than to task the Minister of Engagement with "providing graphics to the government and citizens of the Coalition." I do not see anywhere in the OWL how-to-vote document or anywhere other than Page 90 of this thread that declares or even implies that only "citizens of the Coalition" or Legislators may cast an OWL vote; the ability to do so is quite clearly reserved to any person with a WA nation in The South Pacific, without regards to their intention.
Last edited by Tinhampton on Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Self-Administrative City of TINHAMPTON (pop. 319,372): Saffron Howard, Mayor (UCP); Alexander Smith, WA Delegate-Ambassador

Authorships & co-authorships: SC#250, SC#251, Issue #1115, SC#267, GA#484, GA#491, #GA#533
Other achievements: Cup of Harmony 73 champions; -45 Darkspawn Kill Points; current WA Delegate of Auctor; "Tinhampton? the man's literally god"
Who am I, really? 45yo Tory woman; Cambridge graduate; possibly very controversial; currently reading Worth Dying For by Tim Marshall

User avatar
Qvait
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 182
Founded: Mar 08, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Qvait » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:35 pm

There is an unquestionable fact in this scandal: TSP's sovereignty was violated by suspicious actors, and I know that the Cabinet would have never put out this statement if it wasn't, because it was. I'm speaking on this as a former MoFA and current CRS member. If any other region had been the subject of such an egregious violation, they would have as much right as any other region to protest this transgression.
Hey, I'm Jay and I am a legislator and roleplayer in the South Pacific.

Former Minister of Foreign Affairs /// Member of the Council on Regional Security /// Former Minister of Regional Affairs

My History

User avatar
Virgolia
Secretary
 
Posts: 39
Founded: Apr 19, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Virgolia » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:35 pm

Nova Vandalia wrote:And what is the definition of bad faith here? Voting for a proposal you all openly didn't want to approve.

I'd say joining the region specifically to affect the outcome of a vote is a good example of bad faith.
Last edited by Virgolia on Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to Gameplay

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot]

Advertisement

Remove ads