Curious Observations | Funkadelia sold Lazarus to... Adytus?

[DJ Raid]

I don't know Osiran history all that well, but I do know that the NPO has spent the last two years making reparations for 2015. Not only that, but it has essentially distanced itself from Lazarus as much as possible.

How the hell can you do those two things at once..

I don't know if those two things are true of Koth and Tim (Tim comments on Osiran affairs from time to time, not sure about Koth), but I suspect the circumstances are different.

Not sure what you're confused about. All three of them were involved in the Osiris coup last April and were made Persona non Grata in Lazarus. Yeah, the circumstances are way different because 1. they didn't coup Lazarus, and 2. the NPO couped Lazarus. I can spell it out if needed.

So banning the NPO from Lazarus makes about as much sense as kicking you out of Osiris because you're a raider and raiders are untrustworthy because they raid stuff (not my actual logic, just an example of how yours is flawed).

Okay I am going to spell it out now. NPO (the New Pacific Order) couped Lazarus, creating the NLO (New Lazarene Order). I, on the other hand, did not coup Osiris and have no intention to. It would make sense if Lazarus didn't allow anybody from the NPO in, because of those events. Alternatively, it would not make sense for Osiris to ban me because I am.. a raider?

You realize Osiris is currently raider aligned?

... rofl.png

Furthermore, all of the NPO members who orchestrated the coup were and are still PNG in Lazarus. I am not one of them, as I wasn't even playing the game in 2015.

The NPO is an organization known for their planning and execution of multiple coups of GCR's including Lazarus. They should be banned from Lazarus, at the least.

[United Arkadia]

Can someone get a fact-checkker for Sygian? He seems to have gotten confused halfway through reading my post.

[Altmoras]

Not sure what you're on about Syg. The perpetrators of the NLO and OFO coups both had measures taken against them by Lazarus in 2016, the NLOers when the "Gang of Five" Trial wrapped up. And the OFOers by a PNG vote in the assembly.

[Sygian II]

Can someone get a fact-checkker for Sygian? He seems to have gotten confused halfway through reading my post.

Please point me to what has you, or apparently I, so confused, and I will explain. Everything in my post is common knowledge. Tim, Koth, and Cormac are banned from Lazarus. The NPO couped Lazarus. I am a raider. Osiris is raider aligned. The NPO is known for bad stuff.

>>mfw I spell it out for you twice and you are still confused

[Pergamon]

The NPO is known for bad stuff.

And you and your fellow invaders are not known for bad stuff? It doesn't really suit pointing at the "bad guys" if you are one yourself - quite by different means and on a different scale.

And Lazarus, such a great center of interest for everyone but natives. <3

[Revolutionary Vanguardism]

snip

NLO was never directly orchestrated by the Emperor of the New Pacific Order. Rogue elements involved in Lazarus chose to overthrow the PRL and NPO made the decision to back them, considering that too many resources had been spent on making Lazarus a loyal vassal to be lost to defenders within days. That is entirely different from your vague claim that NPO as a whole orchestrated and organised a coup d etat in Lazarus.

At least, that was how things happened based on statements by then Regent and shortly afterwards Emperor, Pierconium as well as various factors following the end of the whole story.

[RiderSyl]

snip

NLO was never directly orchestrated by the Emperor of the New Pacific Order. Rogue elements involved in Lazarus chose to overthrow the PRL and NPO made the decision to back them

[Lamb Stone]

I haven't paid much attention to Lazarus since my return, hell a decent part of the reason I left is because I was tired of it.

How can someone be tired of a place they did absolutely nothing in?

I've never seen the Laz courts move that fast on anything ever, but when its a political opponent of both the one pressing the charges and the justice so eager to accept them, all of the sudden everything starts moving fast.

Probably because the court has individuals residing who are actually active in the region beyond coming around for court cases. The former bench was only around so long because no one really wanted to do the job and it seemed like they didn't want to either, until their residence was deemed invalid by law.

[Cormactopia Prime]

The only people I see expressing concern about this in this thread are defenders -- some of whom were actively supportive of the NPO takeover of Lazarus -- and prominent NPO members. I don't know why anyone should listen to defenders or the NPO about anything in regard to Lazarus. I especially have no idea why anyone would listen to their accusations against Funkadelia and Evil Wolf, both of whom spent enormous time and energy fighting to liberate Lazarus from the NLO coup, with Funkadelia never participating in a Feeder or Sinker coup as far as I know. Maybe Milograd's coup of the South Pacific in 2013, I can't remember. I'm no fan of Funkadelia, as most know, but it's clear there is a credibility gap here: Are you going to trust the word of an anonymous propagandist, the NPO, and defenders complicit in the NPO's prior takeover of Lazarus, or the people who fought the NLO coup? Whatever their faults, Funkadelia and even Evil Wolf have credibility in regard to upholding Lazarene sovereignty. The OP and other detractors in this thread sure don't.

In regard to the OP article, there are numerous factual inaccuracies. Izon is no more nor less an "old" native than Caldariat or Constie, neither of whom are identified as such. The identification of Wrektopia as "raider" is also inaccurate, as he has never, to my recollection, been involved with military gameplay. If he ever was, it would have been very briefly as a member of the Sekhmet Legion of Osiris when it was barely active, and he probably didn't adopt a firm ideology. Moreover, until the OP identifies themselves, there is no reason to trust anything they're saying. This is quite likely to just be another Unibot propaganda piece hiding behind a puppet. If it isn't Unibot, it's clearly someone from or affiliated with the South Pacific who has bought into this notion that if there are more than one or two Rahls in a region, that means an Empire conspiracy is at work. Nevermind the obvious and more plausible explanation, which is that these new citizens have friends in Lazarus and are getting involved there for that reason, which happens all the time in all of the Feeders and Sinkers as well as many user-created regions. To be honest, Lazarus could use the increase in numbers and activity.

TL;DR: This is a fake news nothingburger. The fact that defenders and particularly the NPO are pushing this narrative should raise alarm bells, because it's much more likely that they are the ones trying to undermine Lazarus' sovereignty. Just look at their track record.

[Metal Mekhet]

Hey I just joined, put me under: 'Native but still thinking about it'. Please and thnx.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Hey I just joined, put me under: 'Native but still thinking about it'. Please and thnx.

Nah, I'm sure you'll be grouped in with the Empire/Rahl/Osiris portion of this conspiracy theory. I probably will be too, at some point, which is hilarious given my recent history with both Empire and Funkadelia. Unfortunately, outlandish conspiracy theories are neither factual nor reasonable.

[Metal Mekhet]

Hey I just joined, put me under: 'Native but still thinking about it'. Please and thnx.

Nah, I'm sure you'll be grouped in with the Empire/Rahl/Osiris portion of this conspiracy theory. I probably will be too, at some point, which is hilarious given my recent history with both Empire and Funkadelia. Unfortunately, outlandish conspiracy theories are neither factual nor reasonable.

But I was a Lazerene since Grffyn was delegate like back in 2008-9 or whatever and during the PRL. Sure, NK sent me here this time, so that's where the thinking about it part comes in.

[Fratatstan]

Are you going to trust the word of an anonymous propagandist, the NPO, and defenders complicit in the NPO's prior takeover of Lazarus, or the people who fought the NLO coup?

Defenders fought the NLO coup too, as Funkadelia could confirm.
And Funk himself was a NPO member at the time the PRL was estabilished (or perhaps shortly before), so whatever narrative you imagine doesn't match with reality. I would stick to the factual inaccuracies if I were you.

[Shizensky]

Are you going to trust the word of an anonymous propagandist, the NPO, and defenders complicit in the NPO's prior takeover of Lazarus, or the people who fought the NLO coup?

Defenders fought the NLO coup too

Defender who fought the NLO coup, can confirm.

[Cormactopia Prime]

Defenders fought the NLO coup too, as Funkadelia could confirm.
And Funk himself was a NPO member at the time the PRL was estabilished (or perhaps shortly before), so whatever narrative you imagine doesn't match with reality. I would stick to the factual inaccuracies if I were you.

Defenders who fought the NLO coup are largely not the ones lending support to this conspiracy theory in this thread, along with their former NPO allies. Glen-Rhodes never does any actual defending, I don't recall Unibot being at all involved, and I can't remember if Altmoras was even playing NationStates at the time but, if so, I don't remember seeing him at all involved in the liberation of Lazarus.

Funkadelia spent enormous time and energy in the liberation of Lazarus. He didn't just log in at update and do what he was told. He had to rally the native community, set up the government-in-exile, ensure that recall of Stujenske and elections quickly proceeded, actually organize liberation efforts, and coordinate with Kazmr in his infiltration of the NLO. He has earned trust in regard to Lazarus, and the only reason defenders are now suggesting that he cannot be trusted is because he is no longer a defender. Meanwhile, the anonymous propagandist in the OP, the prominent NPO members backing the OP's narrative, and defender detractors in this thread have no credibility at all in regard to Lazarus.

Anyone who chooses to trust the anonymous OP, the NPO, Glen-Rhodes, Unibot, and Altmoras over Funkadelia and Evil Wolf has an agenda and that agenda has nothing to do with Lazarene sovereignty. It's frankly absurd to see defenders working with the NPO again after the NLO coup, and in light of the growing collaboration between the NPO, the Grey Wardens, and the South Pacific, it is not a surprise to me to see the NPO and defenders once again collaborating to undermine Lazarus' sovereignty. There is nothing new under the sun.

[Ikania]

The only people I see expressing concern about this in this thread are defenders -- some of whom were actively supportive of the NPO takeover of Lazarus -- and prominent NPO members. I don't know why anyone should listen to defenders or the NPO about anything in regard to Lazarus. I especially have no idea why anyone would listen to their accusations against Funkadelia and Evil Wolf, both of whom spent enormous time and energy fighting to liberate Lazarus from the NLO coup, with Funkadelia never participating in a Feeder or Sinker coup as far as I know. Maybe Milograd's coup of the South Pacific in 2013, I can't remember. I'm no fan of Funkadelia, as most know, but it's clear there is a credibility gap here: Are you going to trust the word of an anonymous propagandist, the NPO, and defenders complicit in the NPO's prior takeover of Lazarus, or the people who fought the NLO coup? Whatever their faults, Funkadelia and even Evil Wolf have credibility in regard to upholding Lazarene sovereignty. The OP and other detractors in this thread sure don't.

In regard to the OP article, there are numerous factual inaccuracies. Izon is no more nor less an "old" native than Caldariat or Constie, neither of whom are identified as such. The identification of Wrektopia as "raider" is also inaccurate, as he has never, to my recollection, been involved with military gameplay. If he ever was, it would have been very briefly as a member of the Sekhmet Legion of Osiris when it was barely active, and he probably didn't adopt a firm ideology. Moreover, until the OP identifies themselves, there is no reason to trust anything they're saying. This is quite likely to just be another Unibot propaganda piece hiding behind a puppet. If it isn't Unibot, it's clearly someone from or affiliated with the South Pacific who has bought into this notion that if there are more than one or two Rahls in a region, that means an Empire conspiracy is at work. Nevermind the obvious and more plausible explanation, which is that these new citizens have friends in Lazarus and are getting involved there for that reason, which happens all the time in all of the Feeders and Sinkers as well as many user-created regions. To be honest, Lazarus could use the increase in numbers and activity.

TL;DR: This is a fake news nothingburger. The fact that defenders and particularly the NPO are pushing this narrative should raise alarm bells, because it's much more likely that they are the ones trying to undermine Lazarus' sovereignty. Just look at their track record.

So to you, clear implications that an influx of new citizens out of nowhere, some of whom have said outright that they were told to come to Lazarus, all voting in a certain pattern to benefit a regime, plus the gaming of the region's political system, including the illegal admission of new voting citizens during a voting process that would solidify a raider bloc's grip on power in the region, should be completely disregarded because most of the natives resisting this happen to be defenders? There is a clear and concerted effort here to subvert our democracy, and it's on a scale much more blatant and obvious than all your shouting about what went down in TSP years ago behind the curtains.

Defenders who fought the NLO coup are largely not the ones lending support to this conspiracy theory in this thread, along with their former NPO allies. Glen-Rhodes never does any actual defending, I don't recall Unibot being at all involved, and I can't remember if Altmoras was even playing NationStates at the time but, if so, I don't remember seeing him at all involved in the liberation of Lazarus.

Funkadelia spent enormous time and energy in the liberation of Lazarus. He didn't just log in at update and do what he was told. He had to rally the native community, set up the government-in-exile, ensure that recall of Stujenske and elections quickly proceeded, actually organize liberation efforts, and coordinate with Kazmr in his infiltration of the NLO. He has earned trust in regard to Lazarus,

It's been two years since then. Y'know, the same year you helped induct Gest to the hall of fame for his contributions to raiding. Nothing is permanent.

and the only reason defenders are now suggesting that he cannot be trusted is because he is no longer a defender.

Do you think, just for a moment, that maybe some of it is because he is actively working with a fellow LWU member to import raider votes and change the law to solidify his grip on power in the most Erdogan-like fashion imaginable? Do you think maybe some of us are taking issue with his attempt to puppet our region for his invader pals?

Meanwhile, the anonymous propagandist in the OP, the prominent NPO members backing the OP's narrative, and defender detractors in this thread have no credibility at all in regard to Lazarus.

I think you'll find that several members of the Lazarene government, including our most esteemed Defender of the Realm, the Celestial Being, and Harmoneia herself (who has dedicated far more to Lazarus over the course of its history than Funk ever could), are taking issue with this blatant power grab. It's not just some defender conspiracy. We are concerned citizens united across gameplay spectrums to stand in defense of our democracy.

Anyone who chooses to trust the anonymous OP, the NPO, Glen-Rhodes, Unibot, and Altmoras over Funkadelia and Evil Wolf has an agenda and that agenda has nothing to do with Lazarene sovereignty. It's frankly absurd to see defenders working with the NPO again after the NLO coup, and in light of the growing collaboration between the NPO and the Grey Wardens, it is not a surprise to me to see the NPO and defenders once again collaborating to undermine Lazarus' sovereignty. There is nothing new under the sun.

If it's all about the NPO and defenders supposedly undermining our sovereignty, why is it that they're taking the side of the concerned natives trying to protect their region from foreign infiltration? We have a clear cut case of power grabbing on the part of people who want to consolidate an iron-fist rule on Lazarus, and you're instead trying to gaslight the democratic opposition of the region that doesn't want to be ruled by a cabal of oligarchs from the LWU.

[Cormactopia Prime]

It's hilarious to see Ikania wringing his hands about supposed voter importation.

On another note, was Ark speaking in his official capacity as Archbishop for the Exterior (Foreign Minister) when he was suggesting that the Sovereign of Lazarus who appointed him is up to no good and that "Lazarus is in danger of becoming a raider puppet state"? Because that's awkward. But I guess it's what you get when you allow an NPO member into your government.

[Ikania]

It's hilarious to see Ikania wringing his hands about supposed voter importation.

You getting me mixed up with someone here? My cosmopolitan career is much different to simply serving as a vote bot.

On another note, was Ark speaking in his official capacity as Archbishop for the Exterior (Foreign Minister) when he was suggesting that the Sovereign of Lazarus who appointed him is up to no good and that "Lazarus is in danger of becoming a raider puppet state"? Because that's awkward. But I guess it's what you get when you allow an NPO member into your government.

I cannot speak for Ark, but maybe you've got a problem on your hands when even members of your government are speaking out against your plans to solidify power.

[Cormactopia Prime]

It's hilarious to see Ikania wringing his hands about supposed voter importation.

You getting me mixed up with someone here? My cosmopolitan career is much different to simply serving as a vote bot.

Yeah, I remember your "cosmopolitan career" quite well from your time in Osiris.

On another note, was Ark speaking in his official capacity as Archbishop for the Exterior (Foreign Minister) when he was suggesting that the Sovereign of Lazarus who appointed him is up to no good and that "Lazarus is in danger of becoming a raider puppet state"? Because that's awkward. But I guess it's what you get when you allow an NPO member into your government.

I cannot speak for Ark, but maybe you've got a problem on your hands when even members of your government are speaking out against your plans to solidify power.

Yes, Lazarus has a problem. It is, as usual, the NPO and its opportunistic partners. Lazarus should eliminate the problem, by whatever means necessary.

[Metal Mekhet]

FYI, I'm inviting players to become a True Native status in Lazarus. Please send me a DM via Discord of your interest. Note: this doesn't mean Glen or Unibot or actually having a cit application approved because citizenship doesn't actually mean Nativity.

[Ikania]

You getting me mixed up with someone here? My cosmopolitan career is much different to simply serving as a vote bot.

Yeah, I remember your "cosmopolitan career" quite well from your time in Osiris.

I bear no shame in being a newcomer to Osiris at the time. My commitment was just as strong as it would've been had I been a citizen for a year prior.

Yes, Lazarus has a problem. It is, as usual, the NPO and its opportunistic partners. Lazarus should eliminate the problem, by whatever means necessary.

Go on, tell me about the NPO's plan to undermine our sovereignty. Isn't it a damn shame that a lot of Lazarene natives happen to be defender-oriented after years of being an officially defender region? What if defenders were importing votes to drown out a native raider population and kick them all out? What regard have you for our sovereignty when those harming it align with your ideology? Then again, it's not like you're known for paying too much regard for what the people in a region want.

[Tim-Opolis]

But I guess it's what you get when you allow an NPO member into your government.

Better than having Wolves within the flock. At least one party has an actual regard for GCR sovereignty.

[Canton Empire]

I think I qualify as a native (old)

And I think what really stands out is comparing Activity from Lazarus to other regions. Lazarene activity is at an all time high, while the rest of NS seems to be slowing down in activity.

[The Church of Satan]

You're forgetting me Cormac. I fought the coup in 2015 too and I was one of Lazarus' loudest soldiers. Oh sure I'm an (armchair) defender but that doesn't make me any less credible than Funk or Evil Wolf. Hell fighting the coup was the last military op I ever took part in. And if you think this whole thing is about R/D alignment then you are sorely mistaken.

When Lazarus went independent and needed to renegotiate the terms of the XYZ treaty I was literally the only other one supporting Lazarus' right to raid and still be part of the treaty. Funk himself can confirm that. It was never about military alignment, especially for me. I would standby Lazarus even if it went completely raider. This is about Funk trying to get rid of the most trustworthy members of Lazarus in favor of goons from LWU who have no issue with betrayal when it suits their needs. I'very never couped or betrayed any region and my fierce, unwavering loyalty is one thing that few in Lazarus can honestly claim to have.

[Solorni]

Thank you Lazarus for giving us our Game of Thrones fix between episodes xD