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NARIS: The Fly on the Wall Your Mother Warned You About

Talk about regional management and politics, raider/defender gameplay, and other game-related matters.
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Belmaria
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Founded: Jun 12, 2010
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Postby Belmaria » Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:27 pm

Gatito wrote:
Belmaria wrote:A couple of our members are using their primary nations for human intelligence, so we can't reveal their identities. The others may accidentally log into the wrong account, so we've decided that we'll only have one front account for the whole group. In fact, we're discussing the idea of creating a group account solely for the purpose of being the face of the group.

So why have you chosen to reveal your connection with the project?

I don't do any humanint work. I just organize things and do the programming on our heuristic project.
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Gatito
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Postby Gatito » Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:32 pm

Belmaria wrote:
Gatito wrote:So why have you chosen to reveal your connection with the project?

I don't do any humanint work. I just organize things and do the programming on our heuristic project.

Including you, how many people do you have working on this?
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:36 pm

Gatito wrote:
Belmaria wrote:I don't do any humanint work. I just organize things and do the programming on our heuristic project.

Including you, how many people do you have working on this?

We have six members at the moment, although a couple may be leaving now that we're no longer prioritizing work on our heuristic detection project.
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Atagait Denral
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Postby Atagait Denral » Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:13 pm

As someone who's programmed a widely used, and script-legal tool that nobody questions the legality of, here's some suggestions for you that I urge you to take heed of:
  1. Stop attacking the people you're marketing to
  2. Don't make grandiose claims until you have something to sell them
  3. Have actual test data and results to show them

I did not start marketing (which I assume is the purpose of this thread) 20XX until I had finished it, and had tested it.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:17 pm

Atagait Denral wrote:As someone who's programmed a widely used, and script-legal tool that nobody questions the legality of, here's some suggestions for you that I urge you to take heed of:
  1. Stop attacking the people you're marketing to
  2. Don't make grandiose claims until you have something to sell them
  3. Have actual test data and results to show them

I did not start marketing (which I assume is the purpose of this thread) 20XX until I had finished it, and had tested it.

Looks like someone didn't read the thread.
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Khronion Denral
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Postby Khronion Denral » Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:32 pm

Belmaria wrote:We haven't released anything because what we have at the moment isn't much. That's why the thread was posted in the first place. We don't have the resources to complete this project without help from people who are more knowledgeable in the fields of statistics, Ruby on Rails, PHP/SQL, and general heuristics (which we may never find, since heuristic detection is pretty much exclusive to antivirus software).


This quote, if anything gives me more pause than the rest of this thread. You made it sound like you had something that was very close to being ready, in its final stages of construction. Instead, what I now hear is "I think this is a great idea, but all we have are some sketches and ideas."
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:37 pm

Khronion Denral wrote:
Belmaria wrote:We haven't released anything because what we have at the moment isn't much. That's why the thread was posted in the first place. We don't have the resources to complete this project without help from people who are more knowledgeable in the fields of statistics, Ruby on Rails, PHP/SQL, and general heuristics (which we may never find, since heuristic detection is pretty much exclusive to antivirus software).


This quote, if anything gives me more pause than the rest of this thread. You made it sound like you had something that was very close to being ready, in its final stages of construction. Instead, what I now hear is "I think this is a great idea, but all we have are some sketches and ideas."

In the OP it's stated that the project was still in its early stages.
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Gatito
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Postby Gatito » Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:39 pm

Khronion Denral wrote:
Belmaria wrote:We haven't released anything because what we have at the moment isn't much. That's why the thread was posted in the first place. We don't have the resources to complete this project without help from people who are more knowledgeable in the fields of statistics, Ruby on Rails, PHP/SQL, and general heuristics (which we may never find, since heuristic detection is pretty much exclusive to antivirus software).


This quote, if anything gives me more pause than the rest of this thread. You made it sound like you had something that was very close to being ready, in its final stages of construction. Instead, what I now hear is "I think this is a great idea, but all we have are some sketches and ideas."

Such is the reason why I doubt this project even exists.
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Stalker Queen
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Postby Stalker Queen » Sat Jul 16, 2016 10:58 pm

General Knot wrote:
Belmaria wrote:Well, let me ask you this: How much effort does it require to manually spot raider activity and act on it at present?

Too little.

Then God bless your innocent mind, kiddo, because one only needs to look at the fields to see who often has the upper hand these days.
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General Knot
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Postby General Knot » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:31 pm

Stalker Queen wrote:
General Knot wrote:Too little.

Then God bless your innocent mind, kiddo, because one only needs to look at the fields to see who often has the upper hand these days.

The meaning of the conversation soared over your personal vendetta.

We're talking about the difficulties (or lack thereof) of spotting, not the success rates of either side.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:34 pm

General Knot wrote:
Stalker Queen wrote:
Then God bless your innocent mind, kiddo, because one only needs to look at the fields to see who often has the upper hand these days.

The meaning of the conversation soared over your personal vendetta.

We're talking about the difficulties (or lack thereof) of spotting, not the success rates of either side.

At least there's someone on this forum who cares about staying on topic.
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Atagait Denral
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Founded: Jun 02, 2015
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Postby Atagait Denral » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:46 am

Belmaria wrote:Looks like someone didn't read the thread.

I thought the thread was about your heuristic raider detection engine, but apparently you decided to put that on hold and tell everyone you're doing intelligence work now. Nice to know my genuine advice warranted nothing but a snarky response about staying on topic.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:07 am

Atagait Denral wrote:
Belmaria wrote:Looks like someone didn't read the thread.

I thought the thread was about your heuristic raider detection engine, but apparently you decided to put that on hold and tell everyone you're doing intelligence work now. Nice to know my genuine advice warranted nothing but a snarky response about staying on topic.

Once again, it looks like someone didn't read the thread.

The original purpose of the thread was to probe the forum for developers with the necessary skills who were interested in helping the project. It was not a sales page in the slightest.
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General Knot
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Postby General Knot » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:18 am

It's ironic that the majority of detractors come from those you attempt to assist.

Perhaps it's time to take your time, skill, and effort to the other side.
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History will record the DEN as the most notorious, well-organized, and well-disciplined raider army ever to grace the battlefield.

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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:31 am

General Knot wrote:It's ironic that the majority of detractors come from those you attempt to assist.

Perhaps it's time to take your time, skill, and effort to the other side.

:rofl:

What a poor attempt at social manipulation. I'll tell you what. You seem to be at least somewhat of a nice guy so I'll give you some advice. You should be more concerned about the spies we have within your leadership than with poaching us to join the dark side. Have fun.

*chuckles after generating fear within the enemy ranks*
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General Knot
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Postby General Knot » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:37 am

Belmaria wrote:*chuckles after generating fear within the enemy ranks*

I was more afraid when the (current) President of Spiritus "infiltrated" Albion to swear at me.
General of the DEN
History will record the DEN as the most notorious, well-organized, and well-disciplined raider army ever to grace the battlefield.

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Atagait Denral
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Founded: Jun 02, 2015
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Postby Atagait Denral » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:45 am

Belmaria wrote:
Atagait Denral wrote:I thought the thread was about your heuristic raider detection engine, but apparently you decided to put that on hold and tell everyone you're doing intelligence work now. Nice to know my genuine advice warranted nothing but a snarky response about staying on topic.

Once again, it looks like someone didn't read the thread.

The original purpose of the thread was to probe the forum for developers with the necessary skills who were interested in helping the project. It was not a sales page in the slightest.


Yes, and? You have to sell your idea to get people to work on it here. Unless you want to pay people, nobody is going to work on something they don't think will work, or don't want to work on. And you have a visible thread, and things said here will impact opinions of your project in the future.
You can deny it all you like, but what this thread is doing is marketing your project to get people to work on it, and hopefully to use it in the future.

And as a developer who could have helped you with this project, I wouldn't work on this if you paid me, thanks to your over-eagerness to snark or insult any and everyone who has questions or advice.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:01 am

Atagait Denral wrote:
Belmaria wrote:Once again, it looks like someone didn't read the thread.

The original purpose of the thread was to probe the forum for developers with the necessary skills who were interested in helping the project. It was not a sales page in the slightest.


Yes, and? You have to sell your idea to get people to work on it here. Unless you want to pay people, nobody is going to work on something they don't think will work, or don't want to work on. And you have a visible thread, and things said here will impact opinions of your project in the future.
You can deny it all you like, but what this thread is doing is marketing your project to get people to work on it, and hopefully to use it in the future.

And as a developer who could have helped you with this project, I wouldn't work on this if you paid me, thanks to your over-eagerness to snark or insult any and everyone who has questions or advice.

Snarky insults are my default mode of defense against overwhelming cynicism and closed-mindedness.
Last edited by Belmaria on Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Caelapes
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Postby Caelapes » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:07 am

Oh hey, it's Belmaria. The guy who founded The Hyatt Islands Intelligence Service to root out TRF/raider spies and promptly named the Fleet Admiral of The Red Fleet as its Director of Internal Affairs.

This project will no doubt go as splendidly as your last.
    
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Gatito
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Postby Gatito » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:19 am

Belmaria wrote:
Atagait Denral wrote:
Yes, and? You have to sell your idea to get people to work on it here. Unless you want to pay people, nobody is going to work on something they don't think will work, or don't want to work on. And you have a visible thread, and things said here will impact opinions of your project in the future.
You can deny it all you like, but what this thread is doing is marketing your project to get people to work on it, and hopefully to use it in the future.

And as a developer who could have helped you with this project, I wouldn't work on this if you paid me, thanks to your over-eagerness to snark or insult any and everyone who has questions or advice.

Snarky insults are my default mode of defense against overwhelming cynicism and closed-mindedness.

1. Learn to take a hit.

2. Your behavior is what caused this cynicism.

3. Stop trying to boast about a project that doesn't even exist. Your contradictions in how you've described the project clearly allude to this entire venture being nothing but bollocks. I don't know if you're doing this for attention or because you think that R/D is some roleplaying game that allows you to use imaginary scripts, but it's got to stop.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:22 am

Caelapes wrote:Oh hey, it's Belmaria. The guy who founded The Hyatt Islands Intelligence Service to root out TRF/raider spies and promptly named the Fleet Admiral of The Red Fleet as its Director of Internal Affairs.

This project will no doubt go as splendidly as your last.

We've already detected multiple raids, and have spies in multiple raider organizations. As a friendly piece of advice, do not underestimate us.
Gatito wrote:
Belmaria wrote:Snarky insults are my default mode of defense against overwhelming cynicism and closed-mindedness.

1. Learn to take a hit.

2. Your behavior is what caused this cynicism.

3. Stop trying to boast about a project that doesn't even exist. Your contradictions in how you've described the project clearly allude to this entire venture being nothing but bollocks. I don't know if you're doing this for attention or because you think that R/D is some roleplaying game that allows you to use imaginary scripts, but it's got to stop.

1. When the entire thread is nothing but "This project is bullshit" how do you expect me to respond?

2. What behavior might that be?

3. I'm not boasting, the projects do exist, and I don't know what I've said that would lead you to believe this isn't a real project.

The overwhelming cynicism of the Gameplay forum strikes again.
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Gatito
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Postby Gatito » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:34 am

Belmaria wrote:
Caelapes wrote:Oh hey, it's Belmaria. The guy who founded The Hyatt Islands Intelligence Service to root out TRF/raider spies and promptly named the Fleet Admiral of The Red Fleet as its Director of Internal Affairs.

This project will no doubt go as splendidly as your last.

We've already detected multiple raids, and have spies in multiple raider organizations. As a friendly piece of advice, do not underestimate us.
Gatito wrote:1. Learn to take a hit.

2. Your behavior is what caused this cynicism.

3. Stop trying to boast about a project that doesn't even exist. Your contradictions in how you've described the project clearly allude to this entire venture being nothing but bollocks. I don't know if you're doing this for attention or because you think that R/D is some roleplaying game that allows you to use imaginary scripts, but it's got to stop.

1. When the entire thread is nothing but "This project is bullshit" how do you expect me to respond?

2. What behavior might that be?

3. I'm not boasting, the projects do exist, and I don't know what I've said that would lead you to believe this isn't a real project.

The overwhelming cynicism of the Gameplay forum strikes again.

Well, first of all, you haven't given any of us evidence that it exists other than telling us. You keep hiding behind this shroud of "it's still in development" or "it's a secret project", which leads me to believe that there is nothing more to NARDIS than this forum topic.

Also, you originally implied that it was close to being finished, but then switched to claiming it was in early alpha or whatever.

And finally, you haven't revealed the names of the people working on the project with you for "reasons". You keep mysteriously referring to yourself as "we", but with no evidence that anyone other than you is working on this, we can only assume that you're using first person plural to make you seem like you're a bigger deal than you actually are.

Look, I don't know why you're doing this, but it's time to stop. Based on what Caelapes said, you already seem to have a pretty rotten reputation around here, so I wouldn't recommend worsening it. Give me evidence or give up your claims.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:43 am

Gatito wrote:
Belmaria wrote:We've already detected multiple raids, and have spies in multiple raider organizations. As a friendly piece of advice, do not underestimate us.

1. When the entire thread is nothing but "This project is bullshit" how do you expect me to respond?

2. What behavior might that be?

3. I'm not boasting, the projects do exist, and I don't know what I've said that would lead you to believe this isn't a real project.

The overwhelming cynicism of the Gameplay forum strikes again.

Well, first of all, you haven't given any of us evidence that it exists other than telling us. You keep hiding behind this shroud of "it's still in development" or "it's a secret project", which leads me to believe that there is nothing more to NARDIS than this forum topic.

Also, you originally implied that it was close to being finished, but then switched to claiming it was in early alpha or whatever.

And finally, you haven't revealed the names of the people working on the project with you for "reasons". You keep mysteriously referring to yourself as "we", but with no evidence that anyone other than you is working on this, we can only assume that you're using first person plural to make you seem like you're a bigger deal than you actually are.

Look, I don't know why you're doing this, but it's time to stop. Based on what Caelapes said, you already seem to have a pretty rotten reputation around here, so I wouldn't recommend worsening it. Give me evidence or give up your claims.

It looks like sub-par reading skills also plague the forum. Let's address a number of discrepancies in your post.

1. We're NARIS, not NARDIS. There is no "D".
2. I never said it was finished or close to being finished. The OP has always stated that this is an alpha project, and is in the early testing phase.
3. It's funny how you always find it safer to assume the worst in others rather than giving people the benefit of the doubt. Both are assumptions, and you choose the more cynical of the two. I have no intention of revealing the identities of any of our operatives, and quite frankly, I don't care how many people you think we are. Once again, that's not the purpose of this thread.
4. My "rotten reputation" was nothing more than an original project that failed for logistical reasons. That original project was an attempt to index all raider nations into a dossier file, and distribute said file to defenders and susceptible regions. That didn't work because it didn't take into account clean puppets, which is what motivated the creation of our engine.

I have provided technical specifications for the project to a certain degree, if you would only read the thread, but please continue to be a cynic.
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Gatito
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Postby Gatito » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:49 am

Belmaria wrote:
Gatito wrote:Well, first of all, you haven't given any of us evidence that it exists other than telling us. You keep hiding behind this shroud of "it's still in development" or "it's a secret project", which leads me to believe that there is nothing more to NARDIS than this forum topic.

Also, you originally implied that it was close to being finished, but then switched to claiming it was in early alpha or whatever.

And finally, you haven't revealed the names of the people working on the project with you for "reasons". You keep mysteriously referring to yourself as "we", but with no evidence that anyone other than you is working on this, we can only assume that you're using first person plural to make you seem like you're a bigger deal than you actually are.

Look, I don't know why you're doing this, but it's time to stop. Based on what Caelapes said, you already seem to have a pretty rotten reputation around here, so I wouldn't recommend worsening it. Give me evidence or give up your claims.

It looks like sub-par reading skills also plague the forum. Let's address a number of discrepancies in your post.

1. We're NARIS, nor NARDIS. There is no "D".
2. I never said it was finished or close to being finished. The OP has always stated that this is an alpha project, and is in the early testing phase.
3. It's funny how you always find it safer to assume the worst in others rather than giving people the benefit of the doubt. Both are assumptions, and you choose the more cynical of the two. I have no intention of revealing the identities of any of our operatives, and quite frankly, I don't care how many people you think we are. Once again, that's not the purpose of this thread.
4. My "rotten reputation" was nothing more than an original project that failed for logistical reasons. That original project was an attempt to index all raider nations into a dossier file, and distribute said file to defenders and susceptible regions. That didn't work because it didn't take into account clean puppets, which is what motivated the creation of our engine.

I have provided technical specifications for the project to a certain degree, if you would only read the thread, but please continue to be a cynic.

Although this has already been brought up, why on Earth would you make a topic advertising a project that's far from being done? Doing so is pointless.

Not only that, but you've butchered any credibility that you once held over the course of this topic. You say that your snark is justified, however in a scenario like this, looking professional is more important than lashing out against critics.
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Belmaria
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Postby Belmaria » Sun Jul 17, 2016 10:54 am

Gatito wrote:
Belmaria wrote:It looks like sub-par reading skills also plague the forum. Let's address a number of discrepancies in your post.

1. We're NARIS, nor NARDIS. There is no "D".
2. I never said it was finished or close to being finished. The OP has always stated that this is an alpha project, and is in the early testing phase.
3. It's funny how you always find it safer to assume the worst in others rather than giving people the benefit of the doubt. Both are assumptions, and you choose the more cynical of the two. I have no intention of revealing the identities of any of our operatives, and quite frankly, I don't care how many people you think we are. Once again, that's not the purpose of this thread.
4. My "rotten reputation" was nothing more than an original project that failed for logistical reasons. That original project was an attempt to index all raider nations into a dossier file, and distribute said file to defenders and susceptible regions. That didn't work because it didn't take into account clean puppets, which is what motivated the creation of our engine.

I have provided technical specifications for the project to a certain degree, if you would only read the thread, but please continue to be a cynic.

Although this has already been brought up, why on Earth would you make a topic advertising a project that's far from being done? Doing so is pointless.

Not only that, but you've butchered any credibility that you once held over the course of this topic. You say that your snark is justified, however in a scenario like this, looking professional is more important than lashing out against critics.

As stated previously, the original purpose of this thread was to put out feelers for development talent that could help us with the project. That's another line that has, once again, ALWAYS been in the OP. Regarding my propensity to attack my critics, it's what I do best. And I don't think it's unprofessional at all to fight back when challenged, especially when challenged by such a pessimistic, cynical, introverted, anti-outsider community like the Gameplay forum.
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