Military Gameplay and Game Mechanics - A Primer

[Ballotonia]

Or if delegates could only change the WFB, that would totally exclude the griefing.

It would certainly scale it back, but it would represent a major nerfing for all regions run partially or completely by the Delegate, which is most of them.

... and in return they'd get the guarantee they'll never get griefed into oblivion, ever, as it'll become impossible to do. IMHO that's overall not a nerfing, that's a huge benefit added.

Ballotonia

[[violet]]

I understand very well that you see it that way, Ballo, but it's not a universally supported view.

[Ballotonia]

I understand very well that you see it that way, Ballo, but it's not a universally supported view.

Hence the "IMHO".

Ballotonia

[TannerFrankLand]

I've seen "IMHO" so so so many times over the years, and as I've said I know nothing about computers, or the silly talk that people use on them so what is this IMHO???

[Goobergunchia]

I've seen "IMHO" so so so many times over the years, and as I've said I know nothing about computers, or the silly talk that people use on them so what is this IMHO???

In My Humble Opinion.

[TannerFrankLand]

I've seen "IMHO" so so so many times over the years, and as I've said I know nothing about computers, or the silly talk that people use on them so what is this IMHO???

In My Humble Opinion.

Thanks! As you were.

[Bears Armed]

Or if delegates could only change the WFB, that would totally exclude the griefing.

It would certainly scale it back, but it would represent a major nerfing for all regions run partially or completely by the Delegate, which is most of them.

... and in return they'd get the guarantee they'll never get griefed into oblivion, ever, as it'll become impossible to do. IMHO that's overall not a nerfing, that's a huge benefit added.

Ballotonia

It would be real a pain if the invader delegate kept taking the link to any offsite forum that the region has out of the WFE, at the same time that invaders were filling the RMB with their posts: How else are the natives supposed to advertise that site?

[Ballotonia]

It would be real a pain if the invader delegate kept taking the link to any offsite forum that the region has out of the WFE, at the same time that invaders were filling the RMB with their posts: How else are the natives supposed to advertise that site?

Having seen a number of battles like that in the feeders, I can see how such a fight would work. But basically: the natives would end up fighting for their region (which, lets face it, is what one has to do when one doesn't have a founder, one way or another... be it by sitting behind a password and elaborate acceptance procedures or creating allies etc...)

Note how in this case there at least CAN be a fight. And it won't be over until one side gives up (compare the situation in The Rejected Realms... showing that if a community wishes to stay in their region long-term under non-password non-banbutton condition then they can easily do it). Nowadays, there is no fight. When invaders are noticed it's too late. I don't see how minor changes could possibly fix that.

Ballotonia

[Biyah]

Influence, after all, replaces the old Native measurement.

Does anyone have a better criteria for determining nativity than Influence? Because I would implement that. I just haven't seen a viable alternative. We can't just say, "You're a native if we know you are." That way lies madness.

Give us a button in the regional page of each region that says 'I am a native of X region'. That way we -know- where every nations home ground lays.

Such clicky button can only be used once every 31 days by each nation, so that defenders/invaders can't move from region to region and claim to be a native at every battleground.

When a region is taken over, no invader may remove anyone who is tagged as a Native of said region. Or, alternatively, can only remove X percentage of natives. (that way an invader can remove a local defender lead, or vice versa)

And if you really want to have fun with the code, disable native tagging for 72 hours after a delegacy change, so that defenders can't make a pass through the region right after its taken and claim to be part of the home guard so that they're untouchable for later liberation attempts.

If you want to have even more fun with teh code, disable native tagging 2 hours before an update so invaders and defenders moving into the region can't claim native status during an active operation.

Native region at creation would be the feeder they were born in, though I would have the timer set to zero at this time so new nations can move and immediately claim native status else-where.

Edit: Clarified the thought some.

[Naivetry]

So raiders move in their puppets, click the "I'm a native" button, and then can never be removed by defenders... this is all being done through disposable puppets, remember - they don't have to move.

I was talking about something like this with Eras a few months ago... in order for it to work, it would have to be a one-per-player thing, just like the WA (but independent of WA membership). IIRC, Eras's objection was that she considered herself to be a native of several regions, and that this would be unfair to other people with dual-citizenships.

In light of the other changes we've been discussing recently, though, that hardly seems like a significant objection. The vast majority of NS players, I would imagine, consider themselves to have a primary regional home. The people who are dual citizens tend to be so for the sake of participating in forum government; exceptions can be worked out on the off-sites on a case by case basis.

(Also, how about every 28 days - that's a good NS number. )

[Biyah]

In that case, one per player is fine. but I have also claimed status to several regions, if not nativity.

How about this then, how about you may click native status only if you have a nation size of 600 million - 1 billion?

That way, at least, the invaders (and defenders) can't just use fresh puppets to claim native status, they have to put some real time and effort into the operation.

[Minineenee]

You people are posting faster than I am thinking tonight, and I am not thinking *that* much >_<

anyways...

I like the idea, and I rather like basing it on population.

[Naivetry]

In that case, one per player is fine. but I have also claimed status to several regions, if not nativity.

How about this then, how about you may click native status only if you have a nation size of 600 million - 1 billion?

That way, at least, the invaders (and defenders) can't just use fresh puppets to claim native status, they have to put some real time and effort into the operation.

But that just leaves all the newbies - the players we need to reach out to and protect the most - without any protection.

One per player is more fair.

(Yes, I know that makes it harder to come up with a cover story while couping feeders. )

[Biyah]

I'm good for either, but I like population size better. And there's even a good role-play reason for it.... behold. Newbies are small regions, and smaller nations are always being pushed around by the bigger ones.

Once they get bigger and exert more influence, they can claim said status and have a better fighting chance. The older you are, the longer you're here, the more rights and protections you get.

Of course, one per IP could work as well. For those players who do control multiple nations, they'll have to think closely about which region they want to be a native of. My only problem with this is the Intel side. Intel operatives wouldn't be able to be a a native of any region (or only of their target region) with this restriction... though that is something I could work around, if necessary.

Like I said, I'm good for either.

[Naivetry]

I'm good for either, but I like population size better. And there's even a good role-play reason for it.... behold. Newbies are small regions, and smaller nations are always being pushed around by the bigger ones.

Once they get bigger and exert more influence, they can claim said status and have a better fighting chance. The older you are, the longer you're here, the more rights and protections you get.

Whether or not it makes sense as RP is not as important as what effect it will have on the game. I'm not a fan of anything that prejudices the game by code towards older players. That just reinforces the status quo, which already has a rather intimidating edifice of experience to protect itself. Doing it by population would just repeat the secondary problem of Influence, which is that it prejudices the game against newer players (I'm thinking of feeder politics, here) so much that it becomes a lot harder for anyone new to get involved. One of the biggest problems in the political game is a lack of novelty, and we're not going to encourage novelty by giving older players another in-game advantage over new people to match their out of game networking and accumulated know-how.

Of course, one per IP could work as well. For those players who do control multiple nations, they'll have to think closely about which region they want to be a native of. My only problem with this is the Intel side. Intel operatives wouldn't be able to be a a native of any region (or only of their target region) with this restriction... though that is something I could work around, if necessary.

Like I said, I'm good for either.

Yeah, I figure it's no more complicated than the current situation with the WA.

[Biyah]

600 Million inst much of anything, it doesn't take long to get there. Since most of our game-play is off-site anyway, then the coding bias will have no impact. It'll be something for them to work for and hope for, in fact, and the UCR's and feeders both can use that magic number of maturity for inclusion into their government, if they so choose (an age or size limit has usually been the deciding factor in most big governments, at least Feeder side).

As long as we're agreed to the basic concept, this particular point can be fine-tuned. heh

[TannerFrankLand]

I switch nations too much, I guess I could start playing as some of my old nations again if we did it by population...

I'm confused if we made another organization that only one per player can be in what will stop raiders from just applying to join in the region they are raiding??

[Biyah]

Nothing would stop them, per say, except those who do the same in reply. Also that would tie up each raider who applied to that region.

After the first rush of regions that fall after the inception of this idea, it would balance out. You could only switch your nationality once a month (be it 28 days or 31), so that tactic would only work once a month en-masse. And don't forget, the Defenders would be watching. If a whole list of nations suddenly became natives of X region, the Defenders could follow suit and become natives as well, which would nullify the point.

^ With that in mind, I would make the application/acceptance of a new nation as a Native of X region into a Regional/National Happenings on the regional page, just like a nation leaving/joining the region is now.

[Naivetry]

600 Million inst much of anything, it doesn't take long to get there. Since most of our game-play is off-site anyway, then the coding bias will have no impact. It'll be something for them to work for and hope for, in fact, and the UCR's and feeders both can use that magic number of maturity for inclusion into their government, if they so choose (an age or size limit has usually been the deciding factor in most big governments, at least Feeder side).

It's over 3 months, which is a critical time for new players to get involved. Again - I have 30 puppets that can be declared native right now, anywhere I choose. That's nonsense, and opens this up to extreme abuse. Instead of creating clean puppets and using them immediately, raiders can just create swaths of them and let them sit around... put some in future target regions, leave others free to declare native status on the fly, and use those to raid with.

Age or size has only ever been a factor in feeders, you elitists, you... UCRs take what we can get.

As long as we're agreed to the basic concept, this particular point can be fine-tuned. heh

One-per-player, or nothing. There is no good reason for someone to have more than one "native" nation at a time. Off-site governments can work with you on what that means for your dual-citizenship status; the game code should not be opened to abuse for the convenience of so few.

[Biyah]

Fine, fine- as long as we don't have to verify citizenship with an email, like WA status.

[Bears Armed]

One-per-player, or nothing. There is no good reason for someone to have more than one "native" nation at a time. Off-site governments can work with you on what that means for your dual-citizenship status; the game code should not be opened to abuse for the convenience of so few.

As 'Godwinnia', 'St Edmund' & some associated puppets, I have been a native of Conservative Paradise since July 2005.
As 'Bears Armed' & its associated puppets I have been a native of the International Democratic Union since June 2006.
These two sets of nations are RPed as completely separate from each other, and both of those 'home' regions are important to me.

Hr'rmm, maybe one per IP per RL year of involvement in NS?

[Biyah]

That would become problematic, I think.

There is no way to cater to everyone, we've proved that in five years of changes and innovations. At this point, we'll just have to pick the lessor of evils and move on.

[Bears Armed]

That would become problematic, I think.

There is no way to cater to everyone, we've proved that in five years of changes and innovations. At this point, we'll just have to pick the lessor of evils and move on.

Well, from my viewpoint, the "lesser of two evils" would be finding a way to end the 'invasion' side of NS altogether...

[Biyah]

Not going to happen. As long as NS is in operation, there will be some sort of invasion gameplay.

[Romanar]

One-per-player, or nothing. There is no good reason for someone to have more than one "native" nation at a time. Off-site governments can work with you on what that means for your dual-citizenship status; the game code should not be opened to abuse for the convenience of so few.

As 'Godwinnia', 'St Edmund' & some associated puppets, I have been a native of Conservative Paradise since July 2005.
As 'Bears Armed' & its associated puppets I have been a native of the International Democratic Union since June 2006.
These two sets of nations are RPed as completely separate from each other, and both of those 'home' regions are important to me.

I'm not thrilled with this idea for the same reason. I'm active in 2 regions and semi-active in 2 more, and I consider myself a citizen in 3 of those regions. It might be "the lesser evil", but I wonder how many people are attached to multiple regions.