Just got invaded by DEN

[Knot II]

We they speaking on behalf of your organization? Sure looked like it to me. You may want to have a chat with your people about your public relations policy, as no one can tell who actually speak in the official capacity of DEN any longer.

Offical DEN beliefs, view points, and opinions are the posts made by Gest, Kknight, Knot, or DEN News Agency. All other posts are usually opinions of the individual and not necessarily of the organization.

Thank you.

The deliberate foolishness has grown rather tiresome.

[Narintia]

Let me put to death two raider arguments.

''We do it to help you''
Bullshit. If you do it for help then you wouldn't be having such vivid and beautiful chats like
''DEN IS THE BEST''
''FUCK YOU GUYS''
''DEN DEN DEN DEN''

''You can opt out!''
No.
No you can't.
Passwords can be leaked. (Sapphire incident)
Liberations can be used to get into RP regions. (the whole Haven incident points to this)

[Aurum Rider]

And did you give Frak said help, so he could help Nephy develop Poseidon?

I wonder how I knew!

Edit: And before you go off saying 'I helped frak' all he ever got were links to the python documentation, and basic division math tutorials.

[3/25/2015 5:27:14 PM] General Halcones: to help you
[3/25/2015 5:27:29 PM] General Halcones: otherwise bad things will happen, things I want to stop
[3/25/2015 5:27:45 PM] Niadh: What will happen?
[3/25/2015 5:28:16 PM] General Halcones: Frak will go full on crazy against LWU, making scripts to help defenders defeat you

Notice the part I highlighted there? Frak will go crazy and make scripts.... Now how would you explain that? Hmm... Frak can't make scripts, yet Halcones is worried Frak will make scripts and give them to defenders. I'm sorry but two plus two does not equal five Aurum.

[/quote]

Note that Predator was written in Python, and literally everything that Frak has ever done was done in PHP. Frak can make scripts, yes, everyone knows that. But he Can't write tools that calculate update times. I asked for solid proof about Predator and you gave me some irrelevant quote about developing scripts for defenders, and that bob got recruitment scripts from Frak.

[We Are Not the NSA]

Let us put to rest, forever, the vile rumours that Predator, now revealed to be cheating behind the scenes, was written by the man was that DoSed for cheating and helped someone else cheat. It was written by the man that was DoSed for cheating while working with another guy was DoSed for cheating.

So is that how we do things around here now? Sweep them under the carpet when they become too embarrassing?

I think (correct me if I am wrong) that he was questioning whether it really matters which Delete on Sight player created the illegal script. Does it make a difference? (<-- serious question)

Let me put to death two raider arguments.

''We do it to help you''
Bullshit. If you do it for help then you wouldn't be having such vivid and beautiful chats like

That argument is usually sarcastic. No one actually believes we're helping.

''DEN IS THE BEST''
''FUCK YOU GUYS''
''DEN DEN DEN DEN''

Those aren't arguments, they are spam. That is why they get Reported.

''You can opt out!''
No.
No you can't.
Passwords can be leaked. (Sapphire incident)
Liberations can be used to get into RP regions. (the whole Haven incident points to this)

Incorrect. Nobody has ever claimed that passwords are the opt out tool. You opt out by making your WA Delegate non-executive, and that is the only way to opt out.

[Zemnaya Svoboda]

Liberations can be used to get into RP regions. (the whole Haven incident points to this)

As a matter of record, Liberations have been used to invade one, and only one, region: Nazi Europe.

No Liberation against any RP region has ever passed, nor is one likely to.

[Lady Isolde]

Liberations can be used to get into RP regions. (the whole Haven incident points to this)

If memory serves correctly, the proposal to Liberate Haven was not successful.

[Aurum Rider]

I think (correct me if I am wrong) that he was questioning whether it really matters which Delete on Sight player created the illegal script. Does it make a difference? (<-- serious question)

It really doesn't, honestly. Not at this point. I don't have anything to prove, I just want him to stop posting misleading information.

[Narintia]

Yes, but it still is dangerous. Liberations basically take away the one last line ''the opt out''
We need a opt out.
Why don't you want a opt out?

[Aurum Rider]

Yes, but it still is dangerous. Liberations basically take away the one last line ''the opt out''
We need a opt out.
Why don't you want a opt out?

What stops a raider region from opting out? The reason it hasn't happened is because it's abusable, and would require work from mods to process regions on a case-by-case basis.

[The Silver Sentinel]

Note that Predator was written in Python, and literally everything that Frak has ever done was done in PHP. Frak can make scripts, yes, everyone knows that. But he Can't write tools that calculate update times. I asked for solid proof about Predator and you gave me some irrelevant quote about developing scripts for defenders, and that bob got recruitment scripts from Frak.

Yet he developed Poseidon for Nephy which does exactly that. Are you insinuating Nephy lied, and was puppetswept, and put on the edge of DOS for no reason? If s0, then there has been a monstrous injustice.

I think (correct me if I am wrong) that he was questioning whether it really matters which Delete on Sight player created the illegal script. Does it make a difference? (<-- serious question)

Yes.. It makes a huge difference. Because if Frak developed Predator, the people that were using it before Halc was DOS'd should know they were colluding with a DOS player even then.

[Narintia]

Simple.

''Fuck off button''

(not a working name)
What it does is takes out every person that has joined the region since the last update.
''Well whats to stop a raider from using this?''
well first it kicks out only the people since the last update
second you must be delegate for 24 hours to use the ''fuck off button''
It also requires high influence to use.

[Aurum Rider]

Yet he developed Poseidon for Nephy which does exactly that. Are you insinuating Nephy lied, and was puppetswept, and put on the edge of DOS for no reason? If s0, then there has been a monstrous injustice.

I can't speak for the times that they came out exactly, but unless you feel like going and finding the time that Posiden came out, Predator was released in Late 2013-Early 2014 IIRC, so it probably came out first by a good few months. And I should have phrased it better, so here.

While Predator was being developed, Frak was not able to create scripts that programically calculated accurate update times.

[Marselesk]

Simple.

''Fuck off button''

(not a working name)
What it does is takes out every person that has joined the region since the last update.
''Well whats to stop a raider from using this?''
well first it kicks out only the people since the last update
second you must be delegate for 24 hours to use the ''fuck off button''
It also requires high influence to use.

I believe this is not the correct forum to discuss potential changes to NationStates mechanics. If you have something to propose in that regard, i would suggest posting in the Technical forum where your topic may be added upon and discussed properly. Otherwise you are merely making noise in an already overbooked thread.

[We Are Not the NSA]

Note that Predator was written in Python, and literally everything that Frak has ever done was done in PHP. Frak can make scripts, yes, everyone knows that. But he Can't write tools that calculate update times. I asked for solid proof about Predator and you gave me some irrelevant quote about developing scripts for defenders, and that bob got recruitment scripts from Frak.

Yet he developed Poseidon for Nephy which does exactly that. Are you insinuating Nephy lied, and was puppetswept, and put on the edge of DOS for no reason? If s0, then there has been a monstrous injustice.

I think (correct me if I am wrong) that he was questioning whether it really matters which Delete on Sight player created the illegal script. Does it make a difference? (<-- serious question)

Yes.. It makes a huge difference. Because if Frak developed Predator, the people that were using it before Halc was DOS'd should know they were colluding with a DOS player even then.

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Simple.

''Fuck off button''

(not a working name)
What it does is takes out every person that has joined the region since the last update.
''Well whats to stop a raider from using this?''
well first it kicks out only the people since the last update
second you must be delegate for 24 hours to use the ''fuck off button''
It also requires high influence to use.

Sigh. If it takes so much influence, wouldn't it make more sense to just have the founder eject all the new nations? And if this "button" is available to the delegate, wouldn't the fact that a raider is now the delegate make it so that this "button" could not be used for at least 1 update? And what would be the point of the button after that update? Wouldn't the raiders have left already if it was just a tag raid? And if it is an occupation, wouldn't the raiders just hold the delegacy for 24 hours? Then couldn't said tool become a weapon for the raiders to use against liberators?

[Aurum Rider]

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Because there is literally no reason why Frak would have been unable to build simple parts of predator if he had made it. It also makes no sense for someone who only knows how to program in PHP to deviate from using the language they are comfortable with to make something in Python.

Edit: If anything, someone who programmed in PHP would go for a language that is syntactically similar like C# or C++. No matter how you look at it, there is little to no reason that Frak would have written Predator in Python. Halc, on the other hand, was very comfortable with Python, having used it to develop games like a GUI version of Monopoly, or the game of life.

[The Silver Sentinel]

Liberations can be used to get into RP regions. (the whole Haven incident points to this)

As a matter of record, Liberations have been used to invade one, and only one, region: Nazi Europe.

No Liberation against any RP region has ever passed, nor is one likely to.

Actually Nazi Europe was raided after the liberation was repealed. While it was under liberation, not one attempt was made against it. For the record.

Yet he developed Poseidon for Nephy which does exactly that. Are you insinuating Nephy lied, and was puppetswept, and put on the edge of DOS for no reason? If s0, then there has been a monstrous injustice.

I can't speak for the times that they came out exactly, but unless you feel like going and finding the time that Posiden came out, Predator was released in Late 2013-Early 2014 IIRC, so it probably came out first by a good few months. And I should have phrased it better, so here.

While Predator was being developed, Frak was not able to create scripts that programically calculated accurate update times.

So just for the record then, you are standing by the good word of a proven sociopath (and yes, Frak in every sense of the word fits the defined definition of that classification) that he could not have coded this?

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Of course Halc took credit for it, or he ran the risk of everyone he gave access to it being DOS'd for knowingly colluding with a DOS player.

[Zaolat]

As a matter of record, Liberations have been used to invade one, and only one, region: Nazi Europe.

No Liberation against any RP region has ever passed, nor is one likely to.

Actually Nazi Europe was raided after the liberation was repealed. While it was under liberation, not one attempt was made against it. For the record.

I can't speak for the times that they came out exactly, but unless you feel like going and finding the time that Posiden came out, Predator was released in Late 2013-Early 2014 IIRC, so it probably came out first by a good few months. And I should have phrased it better, so here.

While Predator was being developed, Frak was not able to create scripts that programically calculated accurate update times.

So just for the record then, you are standing by the good word of a proven sociopath (and yes, Frak in every sense of the word fits the defined definition of that classification) that he could not have coded this?

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Of course Halc took credit for it, or he ran the risk of everyone he gave access to it being DOS'd for knowingly colluding with a DOS player.

Let me stop you right here. You're going in circles with this argument. Aurum has divulged everything he knew yet you still stick with your points while admittedly not giving up your "source" that is supposed to be reinforcing said points. That's just bad debate. Reveal your source or give up because your argument is faulty.

[Aurum Rider]

So just for the record then, you are standing by the good word of a proven sociopath (and yes, Frak in every sense of the word fits the defined definition of that classification) that he could not have coded this?

Because there is literally no reason why Frak would have been unable to build simple parts of predator if he had made it. It also makes no sense for someone who only knows how to program in PHP to deviate from using the language they are comfortable with to make something in Python.

Edit: If anything, someone who programmed in PHP would go for a language that is syntactically similar like C# or C++. No matter how you look at it, there is little to no reason that Frak would have written Predator in Python. Halc, on the other hand, was very comfortable with Python, having used it to develop games like a GUI version of Monopoly, or the game of life.

No, I don't care about the word of Frak or Halc, just like I don't care about the word of your 'source.' I care about the fact that Frak has not once written a script in anything but PHP, and you cannot compile PHP into a 32 bit or 64 bit binary executable with a GUI.

[Souseiseki]

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Because there is literally no reason why Frak would have been unable to build simple parts of predator if he had made it. It also makes no sense for someone who only knows how to program in PHP to deviate from using the language they are comfortable with to make something in Python.

Edit: If anything, someone who programmed in PHP would go for a language that is syntactically similar like C# or C++. No matter how you look at it, there is little to no reason that Frak would have written Predator in Python. Halc, on the other hand, was very comfortable with Python, having used it to develop games like a GUI version of Monopoly, or the game of life.

They're all C derived languages and the gap between PHP and C++ is much much wider than the gap between PHP and Python. Yeah, you claim the guy can't handle an if statement, he's gonna go to C++ of all things because he likes the curly braces.

[The Silver Sentinel]

Let me stop you right here. You're going in circles with this argument. Aurum has divulged everything he knew yet you still stick with your points while admittedly not giving up your "source" that is supposed to be reinforcing said points. That's just bad debate. Reveal your source or give up because your argument is faulty.

Yeah nice try. I have zero intentions of giving up my source for them to be absolutely torn to shred by their peers. I am not one to knife someone in the back for my own gain thanks. I am also not debating anything. I am sticking by what I know. The fact that Aurum is on some crusade to prove that Frak did not indeed develop Predator, make me believe even more than ever that he knows far more than he is letting on.

[Ambroscus Koth]

Let me stop you right here. You're going in circles with this argument. Aurum has divulged everything he knew yet you still stick with your points while admittedly not giving up your "source" that is supposed to be reinforcing said points. That's just bad debate. Reveal your source or give up because your argument is faulty.

Yeah nice try. I have zero intentions of giving up my source for them to be absolutely torn to shred by their peers. I am not one to knife someone in the back for my own gain thanks. I am also not debating anything. I am sticking by what I know. The fact that Aurum is on some crusade to prove that Frak did not indeed develop Predator, make me believe even more than ever that he knows far more than he is letting on.

Other than the fact that this post admits that you're literally only trying to bait Aurum, is it really farfetched to believe that he's making his points purely from the info that he's stated here? His arguments are completely sound based upon what he's stated in this thread.

[Aurum Rider]

They're all C derived languages and the gap between PHP and C++ is much much wider than the gap between PHP and Python. Yeah, you claim the guy can't handle an if statement, he's gonna go to C++ of all things because he likes the curly braces.

He was specifically asking about Pythonic if statements, because they work with or without brackets.

Code: Select all

if X == 5:
    #Do stuff


in python is equivalent to

Code: Select all

if (X == 5)
{
    //Do stuff
}


in C++. And he'd go for C# because not only is it more syntactically similar to PHP than Python, it also has the high level libraries that C++ lacks, such as WebClient, which makes getting web pages trivial.

Edit: Ontop of that, it's even more trivial to compile it into 32bit and 64bit binary executables than Python. The only reason Halcones used python is because it was the only language he is familiar with.

Edit: For reference, here is getting a Page in C#

Code: Select all

int main()
{
    WebClient client = new WebClient();
    string downloadString = client.DownloadString("http://www.gooogle.com");
{


[We Are Not the NSA]

But how is that so? How can you be 100% sure that Halcones didn't take credit for Predator from the beginning? (To be clear, I'm not arguing against you, I legitimately want to know)

Of course Halc took credit for it, or he ran the risk of everyone he gave access to it being DOS'd for knowingly colluding with a DOS player.

But if Halc took credit for it, as you said he did, why would "the people that were using it before Halc was DOS'd... know they were colluding with a DOS player"? They would think they were colluding with Halcones, who at the time of Predator's creation was not DOS.

Let me stop you right here. You're going in circles with this argument. Aurum has divulged everything he knew yet you still stick with your points while admittedly not giving up your "source" that is supposed to be reinforcing said points. That's just bad debate. Reveal your source or give up because your argument is faulty.

Yeah nice try. I have zero intentions of giving up my source for them to be absolutely torn to shred by their peers. I am not one to knife someone in the back for my own gain thanks. I am also not debating anything. I am sticking by what I know. The fact that Aurum is on some crusade to prove that Frak did not indeed develop Predator, make me believe even more than ever that he knows far more than he is letting on.

SS, you are aware that it looks like you're just throwing out random claims around, right? It is pretty clear that no one else "knows" that Frak made Predator like you do (or at the very least no one has come out in agreement with you), yet you have refused to divulge any actual evidence or sources to support the claim. Without valid evidence or anyone else agreeing with you, it looks like you're grasping at straws. If you have proof give it, I'm all ears, but right now you just keep saying the same thing over and over again without convincing me of your point.

[The Silver Sentinel]

Other than the fact that this post admits that you're literally only trying to bait Aurum

Not at all. I am simply trying to get to the truth of the matter.

is it really farfetched to believe that he's making his points purely from the info that he's stated here? His arguments are completely sound based upon what he's stated in this thread.

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. The thing is the two people that can prove I'm wrong have zero way of proving I'm wrong now do they?

[Aurum Rider]

Not at all. I am simply trying to get to the truth of the matter.

No, you are not at all interested in the truth. Okay, I know more than I'm letting on. I know that Frak went to Halcones asking for help, and Halcones told him no. Frak came to me asking for help, and I snarkily linked him to the Python 3.5.1 documentation for URLLIB and the mathisfun division tutorials page. I know that Halcones and I are both enthusiastic about game development, so we'd talk about Python, and he'd send me screenshots of the games he was working on, and I'd send him screenshots of games I am working on. At one point we even talked about developing a game together, but it fell through the cracks. I know Frak is enthusiastic about Web Development, and only knows how to program in PHP. I consider both of them my friends, even despite all that's happened, but I respect my other friends on this website enough that when I do talk to them, I only ever talk to them about things completely unrelated to nationstates like vegan chocolate cake, and video games.

There, you know everything I know about this entire situation. If you're done trying to make me look like I deserve a DOS, I'd appreciate it if you'd start respecting me as more than some random raider with something to prove.