Balder - State Opening of 19th Storting

[Farnhamia]

Good that you have something to laugh about. Frankly, I don't think the seriousness of the situation is something to laugh about however. I have been refraining to do this for now, but you leave me no other choice.
I would like to show the world of NationStates that Balder has not been supporting the occupation of Lazarus on behalf of any GCR government:

(Image)

Holy shit, you have to be trolling. Your smoking gun was just Rachel telling you what was going on, and literally the same exact thing as what is being said in this thread.

If you think someone's trolling, report them, don't just point fingers.

[Onderkelkia]

My removal of the GCRSA Governing Council and anything regarding it, was a great sentiment and sacrifice; I doubt that would have been something Balder would have been willing to do in return. Ultimately it's a choice the Pacific can only regret. Balder has not been proven to be a worthy partner in upholding GCR Sovereignty, nor proven to be able to drop a the silly R/D dichotomy that in the first place led to the forced demise of the Pacific's Consul by foreign powers.

Your removal was the only option you left your superiors after your appalling treatment of the other three members of the GCR Sovereignty Accords.

You have only yourself to blame.

Balder has been very controlling and discouraging throughout our relationship. I want to give you an example: In no way we have been informed of your plans to ally Lone Wolves United over their Lazarus incarnation. On the same hand you demanded that we consult you before aspiring alliances with other GCRs, you have been especially shocked about the treaty with TSP. Why shall we, above anything else consult you beforehand, if you don't do the same thing?

This is an outright falsehood. Balder has not "demanded" that The Pacific consult us about alliances in advance. In her conversation to register a complaint about your previous public attacks on Balder - comments which you acknowledged to be wrong, and for which you apologised - the Queen incidentally mentioned she was concerned about a lack of Balder-NPO communication in the context of Lazarus and the treaty between The Pacific and The South Pacific (while adding that she did not object to the treaty itself). Misrepresenting that as being "very controlling and discouraging" is absurd in the extreme.

In any case, Lazarus and The Pacific had a very different relationship to Balder and The South Pacific. Whichever side you think was in the right, Balder and The South Pacific had a very public confrontational dispute, whereas The Pacific only made its stance on Lazarus clear after Balder had taken a position.

The Pacific is not your pet on a leash and I will make sure you feel that. Especially now.

An empty threat. You have been manipulating The Pacific to promote Defenderism and create trouble for Balder since at least mid-2017.

I have heard all this bluster before from overmighty senators of The Pacific intent on pursuing their own self-aggrandisement coupled with a pro-defender agenda, rather than genuinely advancing The Pacific's interests. The NPO's Retort consisted of hot air and conspiracy theories about the so-called "Ondersphere" to justify a contorted and dishonest narrative around Lazarus. Fast forward 2 years and this is how it turned out: with The Pacific apologising to "the coordinating bodies within TNI, LKE, Europeia and Balder" for its conduct. Even today, the situation in Lazarus, and Balder's resulting position, are direct consequences of Feux's misjudgements back then. If you hate the present situation in Lazarus so much, think long and hard about how we got here.

I sincerely hope for the sake of The Pacific that this time they see through you quicker than they saw through Feux.

[Tim-Opolis]

...The Pacific to promote Defenderism and create trouble for Balder since at least mid-2017.

Damn, someone shoulda given Defenders that memo, given that NPO and Defenders cooperating is usually an ocassion restricting to AntiFash operations, with rare exceptions coming only when the NPO has their own political motivatioms for it. I'd sure love to have the NPO's updating force on a regular basis, just to see how salty you lot would be then, if you hit these levels just from being called out in GP.

Or, in other words Onder, your claim is as full of shit as your essays are with needless wordplay.

[Onderkelkia]

...The Pacific to promote Defenderism and create trouble for Balder since at least mid-2017.

Damn, someone shoulda given Defenders that memo, given that NPO and Defenders cooperating is usually an ocassion restricting to AntiFash operations, with rare exceptions coming only when the NPO has their own political motivatioms for it. I'd sure love to have the NPO's updating force on a regular basis, just to see how salty you lot would be then, if you hit these levels just from being called out in GP.

Or, in other words Onder, your claim is as full of shit as your essays are with needless wordplay.

On the contrary, the cooperation between Feux Mark II over there and the political arm of Defenderism is readily apparent to anyone familiar with modern gameplay. That is why you and Roavin are openly re-framing The South Pacific's foreign policy according to an alien Francoist ideology. Pergamon's reward.

Your takeover of The South Pacific is so complete that you feel confident enough to bargain TSP foreign policy away to Pergamon.

Equally, it must be acknowledged that you are ultimately promoting a distortion of Francoism for ulterior Defender purposes. That is why you are happy to adopt the trappings for the time being. As Cormac helpfully reminded us, in the traditional sense there is no requirement for a person to be involved in a UCR for them to be classed as a userite and that is how the term was applied in The Pacific's conflict with the ADN. From a traditional Francoist perspective, Warden Pergamon is nothing more than a userite who has entered into a Faustian pact against The Pacific's natural allies among the GCRs.

[Glen-Rhodes]

If you mean that we are not fans of the Religious Government and Ethnic Cleansing Center that Perg's rhetoric indicates TP has become, then we are guilty as charged.

“Ethnic cleansing”? Seriously? Step away from your keyboard and monitor and take a chill break.

[Frattastan II]

From a traditional Francoist perspective, Warden Pergamon is nothing more than a userite who has entered into a Faustian pact against The Pacific's natural allies among the GCRs.

'Natural' how? The Pacific has no natural allies (or enemies, perhaps).

[Escade]

What are you talking about? Balder has made no attempt to change The Pacific's stance on Lazarus. It has merely requested that senior officials - one individual, you - avoids engaging in public hostilities against Balder and treat us as an ally should expect to be treated. This is a request that The Pacific actually accepted in July 2017, contributing to your removal from the GCRSA Governing Council and your demotion from the office of Consul. You are more than capable of expressing views about the situation in Lazarus without engaging in unprovoked, kamikaze attacks on Balder. Furthermore, if you did have objections, the correct approach in the first instance would have been to have formally approached the Government of Balder to register your concerns - which you have not done, despite Balder's intervention starting in early September 2017. Your handling of the matter has been deeply unprofessional.

From any objective standpoint, it is you (either as an individual or on behalf of your region) who has attempted to pressure Balder, not the other way round.

It has been addressed in private. But we will come to this later in this post. My removal of the GCRSA Governing Council and anything regarding it, was a great sentiment and sacrifice; I doubt that would have been something Balder would have been willing to do in return. Ultimately it's a choice the Pacific can only regret. Balder has not been proven to be a worthy partner in upholding GCR Sovereignty, nor proven to be able to drop a the silly R/D dichotomy that in the first place led to the forced demise of the Pacific's Consul by foreign powers. An alliance is not a tool to mute the eternal Empire, an alliance is not a tool to control the eternal Empire. Balder has been very controlling and discouraging throughout our relationship. I want to give you an example: In no way we have been informed of your plans to ally Lone Wolves United over their Lazarus incarnation. On the same hand you demanded that we consult you before aspiring alliances with other GCRs, you have been especially shocked about the treaty with TSP. Why shall we, above anything else consult you beforehand, if you don't do the same thing? The Pacific is not your pet on a leash and I will make sure you feel that. Especially now.

Balder has made no attempt to change The Pacific's course or direction. We respect The Pacific's right to its own view of the situation in Lazarus. When The Pacific announced its position that it considered our ally Lazarus to be a "Warzone", Balder officials didn't start posting below lamenting the influence of Defenderism on The Pacific or suggesting that you have no respect for GCR sovereignty (i.e. statements equivalent to your comments about Balder, and with which The Pacific would have taken offence). You on the other hand seem to think it is fair to criticise Balder for not subscribing to your Francoist dogma.

I doubt you would have a solid foundation to accuse the Pacific of "defenderist influence" or having no respect of GCR sovereignty. It's hard to argue that an entity has no respect for GCR sovereignty when it literally declared an UCR and all of its members Userites, enemies of the NPO and PNG, for occupying a GCR - in the name of a raiding UCR. Not that you wouldn't have done it, it's more the case that you have been lacking the proper base for any arguments for your cause. Your dearest userite ally, Lone Wolves United, which currently occupies Warzone Lazarus, has conducted crucial errors. Errors that have been more than convenient for the Pacific: They made us a great gift, they finally provided us with the base to tackle the raider UCR infestation of Lazarus.

The majority of our allies were never there for one side or the other in the first place. Three allies of Balder have been deployed in Lazarus at one point or the other - The West Pacific, Osiris and the LKE - since Balder started our deployment in September 2017 and since the Khanate began in mid-March. For the reasons expressed in each of their respective statements, TWP and Osiris withdrew their forces on 27th March. In the case of TWP, it was specified that they still recognised the changes as the actions of a legitimate delegate, but they were uncomfortable with the way it happened. Balder understands and respects that. The LKE Imperial Army meanwhile remains deployed in Lazarus. Balder's other allies - such as Europeia and The North Pacific - have remained uninvolved in the situation throughout and Balder continues to work productively with them on other matters, as indeed we do with TWP, Osiris and LKE.

What is this trying to explain? That Balder is the last GCR to support the raider UCR of Lone Wolves United in Lazarus by providing military assistance? We already knew that.

The only ally which seems to have pretensions to dictate Balder's position on Lazarus according to its own ideological dogma is The Pacific - assuming of course, that your comments represent The Pacific's considered position rather than representing another case of you going rogue with your own agenda.

So this is what NationStates degraded to: Someone that actually criticizes the support of an rogue UCR occupation of a GCR is considered to follow a rogue agenda. Times have changed, I guess.

Again, I repeat: what are you talking about?

There has been no "hotfix" or "re-amendment" to the Treaty of Regenesis. The treaty in force today is exactly the same one we announced had been ratified on 9th December 2017, which you can see has not been edited. The text of that treaty as originally written remains the basis of the Balder-Lazarus alliance.

The "hotfix" I am mentioning is the additional explanation to the treaty after the full annexation of Lazarus by Lone Wolves United. I want to point out further that Balder was violating said treaty:

"Article I: Mutual Recognition

1. The signatories recognize the constitutional governments in force at the time of ratification of this treaty and any legitimate successor governments as the sole and sovereign governments of their respective sinker regions." - can be found here.

The sudden transition to the Khanate was not legitimate. Let me explain to you why; I know this was highly unprofessional of Lone Wolves United, but even after that you decided to stick with them, for whatever unlogical reason. Now to the point:

"Section 7: Constitutional Amendments

Section 6 of this document may only be added to. Section 7 may not be edited or revised.

This document may only be repealed by unanimous vote of the citizens." - Constitution of the UDoL.

There has been no unanimous vote of the citizens: The Khanate was established in an unlawful manner. The change just happened suddenly; Even Balder seemed to be quite unprepared for this step, but acted quickly after. "The right of the Sitting Delegate" is a Feederite Privilege. A privilege that UCRs are not able to utilize. I want to remind you at this point:

Evil_Wolf is Killer_Kitty
Lamb_Stone is Aleister

They are Officers of Lone Wolves United, a raider UCR, they are Userite. Both of them have been delegates since an alternated flag of LWU flies over Warzone Lazarus, declaring it a Khanate, just like Lone Wolves United. Following the same ideology as Lone Wolves United, with the same Leadership as Lone Wolves United. Your attempts to tell me that Lazarus and LWU are different entities are invalid. Balder allied Lone Wolves United over their Lazarus incarnation. The Pacific will further refuse to address Lone Wolves United as Lazarus, and just keeps addressing the Userite Subversive by their actual name.

This is comical. You seem to think that there is something scandalous about the existence of a Discord conversation between regional leaderships.

Good that you have something to laugh about. Frankly, I don't think the seriousness of the situation is something to laugh about however. I have been refraining to do this for now, but you leave me no other choice.
I would like to show the world of NationStates that Balder has not been supporting the occupation of Lazarus on behalf of any GCR government:

Funkadelia was the leader of the Undead Dominion/Dominion and Aleister was the leader of its successor, Khanate. Who else were we meant to be talking with, if not Funkadelia and Aleister? There is no more scandal than if Balder talked to you and Aleisyr in a group conversation to contact The Pacific.

The transition to the Khanate was not legal. It's no legal successor state. Furthermore, subverting GCRs with high ups of a raiding UCR is fundamentally different from engaging in private conversation with government members of a Pacific, which are all GCR puritists. What you did, is criminal. Throughout your time in NationStates you have condemned the UDL and the FRA, but now you are doing the exact same things, just on the other side of the R/D spectrum. How are you better than the userite defender menace, Onderkelkia? How are you not Userite?

You will find that we are bound under the Treaty of Regenesis to support Lazarus following a request for aid in the event of an attack:
You primarily seem to be working with fantasies at the moment.

I am confused. Is Balder able to uphold any treaties? The transition to the Khanate was not lawful and is basically an occupation by LWU. Balder technically, by treaty, would have been obliged to provide assistance to restore the Undead Dominion of Lazarus.

Balder's intervention with Lazarus has nothing to do securing a foothold for Lone Wolves United. As Solorni stated, we do not even have forum embassies with them. Other gameplay powers have had far closer relationships with LWU in the past. Indeed, anyone remotely familiar with the history will be aware of several long-standing disagreements between LWU and myself, arising from multiple distinct events in 2006, 2011 and 2016. Lamb Stone was even banned from TNI in 2008. There is no particular warmth in that relationship. Our reasons for being in Lazarus have nothing to do with LWU or raiders more generally. Our intervention is entirely rooted in our opposition to 2013-2017 Lazarus and shaping a better, more stable and secure future for Lazarus going forward.

Your current relationship with LWU is spendid. You are the main supporter of their upper Echelon. The current founder of LWU is now Delegate of Warzone Lazarus, openly occupied by Lone Wolves United. Your alliance with LWU Lazarus, is an alliance with LWU. But please try to explain again, how this isn't Lone Wolves United. They also have the same people in their Leadership.

Balder is not doing this to help Lone Wolves United. Balder does not recognise Lazarus as being under LWU control.

I want to ask you yet again how this is an applicable logic to you? All I am asking for is reasoning and logic finally.
Again, Hypothetically:

1. I coup Balder, I set up the Flag of Polaris.

2. I slightly alternate Proper Francoist Thought and pin it as dispatch to Balder.

3. I purge you and the rest of the original Balder.

4. My entire cabinet consists of Feux, Shnailand, Svezjacael, Jar Wattinree, Japanese Schoolgirls and Glealian. All officers of the NPO.

Now to the point: By your logic, this wouldn't be connected to the NPO then, since it's only a change of aesthetics, am I correct? You can agree now. If you disagree there however, you have no longer any solid point to support the LWU occupation of Lazarus.

Independence doesn't mean equidistance between Raider and Defender positions. It means intervening in world events to maximise your region's interests.

To me it appears less independent, rather than quite raiderist in terms of strong anti-defenderist policies. With such policies, which are directed against one particular side of the R/D metagame, how are independents not taking a side in the R/D game: which would be raider side? If they pick raider side, how are they independent? Yet again, it doesn't seem to follow any logic, other than justifying R/D polities in a slightly more political way.

A Raider region is one that has raiding for fun as its central purpose, viewing R/D as a mini-game and seeing raiding as part of that. Balder's opposition to the defender political establishment - and their threat to Independent regions - has nothing to do with the Raider tradition. It is our own tradition.

A Raider region seems to have greater ambitions than just a "hobby", which is politicking in GCRs, gathering support for their pointless fights over UCRs, gathering support for the R/D SC battles and also trying to spread their ideology and influence, with the main goal to see the other side of the R/D spectrum to go extinct. It is a war that wouldn't concern the Pacific at all. This war over pointless UCRs is no war of ours. However, this war has been brought to GCRs and hence it became our war. We are no friend of Defenders, we are no friend of Raiders. Ever since, the Francoists aspired to stand up against the aspirations of UCRs that desire to rule over GCRs. If UCR R/D orgs think that GCR aspirations are what they desire, it is our natural stance to seek their destruction in GCRs. GCR for GCR.

Agree with it or not, Balder has provided a coherent explanation for our intervention in Lazarus. We did so on 4th September 2017, when our deployment began. Since that September 2017 announcement, The Pacific has been well aware of our stance that "all Lazarus regimes since [Feux's] coup" lacked legitimacy until the formation of Undead Dominion. Balder likewise confirmed our support for Khanate on 14th March, over a month ago. Pergamon, in the intervening period, you have done nothing to register any concerns with me when I was Statsminister or my successor. Instead of approaching Balder on a multilateral or bilateral basis, you have apparently fumed in silence before choosing now to engage in a bizarre public outburst that degrades your office.

If Balder has proven anything today, then it is that the Userite Menace in the GCRs is still alive and well, this time just calling from the other side of the worthless R/D spectrum. What has been displayed here, alongside your posts and Balder's attacks against the Sovereignty of GCRs, in support of UCRs that desire to rule over GCRs reminds me of what I have been taught about the ADN.

The most rationale, readable, and evidence based long post that I have ever read on NSGP. ^



Of course Balder supports coups rather than lives up to its treaties and it thinks it has the right to lord over its allies as it see's fit. Balder supported the attempted coup of TSP in 2016, the LWU coup of Lazarus 2017, and hey other treatied allies if you make the mistake of not being pro invader\raider\ userite menace then you too will see Balder support a coup of your region - treaty or no treaty. It's appalling that anyone would still treaty with Balder. It's simple, disagree with Balder's policies and you'll feel them threaten you using various malicious tactics or support a coup of your region. Or I guess the craven can continue to live in that false glow of "friendship" that only lasts as long as you obey Big Balder. Hilarious, that Onder tries to "no u" that TSP foreign policy is anything but our own see we don't manipulate, bully, or otherwise pressure our allies into bending to their knees. You know we treat them like allies, partners rather than our lackeys. You could learn from us but I guess the dictatorial schtick is all that keeps Balder relevant these days.

It's funny to see TWPers chime in here to either blatantly ignore facts as presented or cry "ethnic cleansing" when a TWPer, just the other day, stated that they would support any coup of Lazarus AS LONG AS IT WASN"T DEFENDERS. So much for sovereignty or whatever other ideology they allegedly support.

It's pretty clear that Cormac is correct, NSGP has become an anemic mess of herd mentality with one side, the imperialist\raider\invader side dominating to the extent where there is no game since a real game requires at least two sides both of which may actually have a chance. You'd think one of the regions that bend over backwards for Balder would grow a pair and create their own ideology or side, maybe even a triangle but I guess we have to wait for the cowardly actors of the game to get bored with their own cravenness.

[Lord Dominator]

I know it looks cooler and longer and stuff, but can we please not quote long posts without snipping or spoiler tags please?

[Jar Wattinree]

I know it looks cooler and longer and stuff, but can we please not quote long posts without snipping or spoiler tags please?

^I heartily am in favor of this, unless you're responding to a textwall to refute its arguments point by point.

[Solorni]

I am fascinated how people who say that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but also say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I should state that I do not think that TSP is inferior to Balder or that Independents et al are dominating this game, so I disagree with the premise entirely. But I do think that the logic presented is clearly illogical.

[Consular]

I am fascinated how people who that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but that say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I've tried reading this a few times but am a bit lost tbh.

[Gibraltarica]

I am fascinated how people who that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but that say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I've tried reading this a few times but am a bit lost tbh.

Oh please. I bet you have not even went to be as like so much as Balder could have been more seen.

[Solorni]

I am fascinated how people who that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but that say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I've tried reading this a few times but am a bit lost tbh.

Yeah, I think I'm too tired to be making posts atm.

[Consular]

I've tried reading this a few times but am a bit lost tbh.

Yeah, I think I'm too tired to be making posts atm.

Fair. Less browser games, more sleeping!

[Escade]

I am fascinated how people who say that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but also say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I should state that I do not think that TSP is inferior to Balder or that Independents et al are dominating this game, so I disagree with the premise entirely. But I do think that the logic presented is clearly illogical.

What next, are you going to write "SAD."


I do believe that NSGP has become a hotbed of parrots repeating each other and pretend that there is a difference between faux independent and imperialists. Of course this thread is a great show of alignment as well and how utterly boring its gotten

Will we ever have anything but a one-legged bar stool functioning in NSGP? Only time will tell...

[Solorni]

I am fascinated how people who say that Independents, Imperialists & Raiders are dominating this game but also say that we should learn from regions whose own players believe are inferior...

I should state that I do not think that TSP is inferior to Balder or that Independents et al are dominating this game, so I disagree with the premise entirely. But I do think that the logic presented is clearly illogical.

What next, are you going to write "SAD."


I do believe that NSGP has become a hotbed of parrots repeating each other and pretend that there is a difference between faux independent and imperialists. Of course this thread is a great show of alignment as well and how utterly boring its gotten

Will we ever have anything but a one-legged bar stool functioning in NSGP? Only time will tell...

I have no idea what you're saying, and won't even pretend to try to understand. But many bar stools are one-legged:

[Onder Kelkia]

The Realm of Balder

Announcement of Statsminister's Awards

The Government of Balder has established a programme of Statsminister's Awards in order to recognise the meritorious contributions of our citizens as ministers, legislators, vikings and ordinary participants in our community. I have today granted awards to three citizens for service in each category:

Statsminister's Award for Executive Service

Fuzzy
Linkin Talleyrand
Zander Cerebella

Statsminister's Award for Legislative Service

Akillian Talleyrand
Griffindor13
Theoden Sebastian

Statsminister's Award for Military Service

Bran Triune
Cinder
Zander Cerebella

Statsminister's Award for Regional Service

Cinder
Griffindor13
Paren

Please join me in congratulating the recipients.

[Tim-Opolis]

The only thing I'll congratulate anyone here on, Onder, is your accomplishment when you learn how to resize your images.

[Consular]

Rachel should just purge you already.

[Onderkelkia]

The only thing I'll congratulate anyone here on, Onder, is your accomplishment when you learn how to resize your images.

Balder likes our big banner.

If, however, I did want it editing, I would delegate the task.

Rachel should just purge you already.

It is mildly intriguing, albeit unsurprising, to learn what those declared persona non grata in Balder choose to fantasise about. I have to say I'm flattered.

[Roavin]

Rachel should just purge you already.

It is mildly intriguing, albeit unsurprising, to learn what those declared persona non grata in Balder choose to fantasise about. I have to say I'm flattered.

Pls don't retire before 2021. For ... reasons.

[Onderkelkia]

It is mildly intriguing, albeit unsurprising, to learn what those declared persona non grata in Balder choose to fantasise about. I have to say I'm flattered.

Pls don't retire before 2021. For ... reasons.

I take it that this would be the scheduled timing for that coup you keep promising to inflict on us.

With all the internal troubles of The South Pacific and the utter degradation of Albion, it is genuinely sad to see that Roavin and Cassius have nothing better to do than think about destroying another region as well as their own homes. Happily, our community is much stronger and more resilient than you think.

[Queen Yuno]

lol@all the above comments


Good job on the awards ^_^
From that list, I know Bran, Cinder, Griffindor, Zander, Theodon. Fuzzy sounds fun.

Anyway, here’s a positive comment:

(I can’t load gifs right now so this may be the wrong gif)


EDIT: it was the wrong gif!

[Onderkelkia]

Good job on the awards ^_^
From that list, I know Bran, Cinder, Griffindor, Zander, Theodon. Fuzzy sounds fun.

Thank you Yuno for your appreciation of their efforts. I shall make sure to pass your congratulations on to the recipients.

[Flemingovia]

COngratulations to all the award recipients. Good to see Balder in good heart.