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by Pacific Sopo » Sun Jan 31, 2016 5:16 am
by Pacific Sopo » Sun Jan 31, 2016 5:21 am
by Lord Ravenclaw » Sun Jan 31, 2016 5:38 am
by Lord Ravenclaw » Sun Jan 31, 2016 5:44 am
by Lord Ravenclaw » Sun Jan 31, 2016 6:17 am
SIPJENKINS wrote:Lord Ravenclaw wrote:
You look like a concerned resident who is rightfully upset and angry at something that has happened in your home. It's okay to be angry, I've been through it before and a lot of people who will comment in this thread will have as well.
But you need to stay calm. If you don't, and you do get too personal with your comments you risk being warned by the Moderators for flaming or otherwise. Let's avoid that, as there is no reason why we can't be civil and mature in how we approach this.
With all due respect sir and/or madam, I don't think I have been even remotely disrespectful, but I will keep your advice in mind.
Thank you.
by Pacific Sopo » Sun Jan 31, 2016 6:29 am
by Consular » Sun Jan 31, 2016 7:41 am
Cormac Stark wrote:Why are you so hostile to TEP? What have they done that has prompted this latest asinine behavior from you? And most importantly, why does Albion keep putting you in high positions so when you antagonize people and regions for something that has nothing to do with you or Albion, it negatively reflects not only on you, but on Albion?
Xoriet wrote:Oh, I'm sorry, I must not have phrased that clearly enough. TEP's government kindly requests that you mind your own business on issues involving TEP that have absolutely nothing to do with you or any region you are in. As much as we couldn't care less about your conspiracy-theorist level factual inaccuracies ourselves, there is no shortage of people who actually believe that sort of rhetoric and we'd prefer that they don't believe anything you say on issues you have nothing to do with and know nothing about, really.
by Glen-Rhodes » Sun Jan 31, 2016 8:32 am
by Ever-Wandering Souls » Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:31 am
Zadiner wrote:But when it's done in the way your government has done it, it is very wrong.
I might have supported a change in TSP if it wasn't secretive and was handled in a different way, by different people.
The Alicorns (Equestria) wrote:Let them stay, no need to badmouth them...From our view a bunch of nations just came in, seized the delegate position, and changed a few superficial things...we play NationStates differently...there's really no reason for us to be butthurt.
http://www.nationstates.net/page=rmb/postid=8944227
http://www.nationstates.net/page=rmb/postid=8951258
Reploid Productions wrote:Raiders are endlessly creative
by Icecream Princess » Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:44 am
Kazmr wrote:We want all our friends to join us in propping up our new dictatorship!
by Todd McCloud » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:00 am
Consular wrote:-snip-
by SouthMac » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:02 am
Kazmr wrote:So is this still "not a coup"? Because holy shit, removing your political opponents with no democratic basis, and expelling your justice system because you disagree with their ruling is, well, exactly that... Hopefully any of the other regions still supporting Hile (if there are any) get out of there fast and realize that the coup we could all see coming was just made official.
Glen-Rhodes wrote:Also lol @ at saying Kris or I were unwilling to work with the Cabinet. Tsu literally talked to Hileville yesterday, reaching a compromise on moving back. Hileville said he'd go back to the Cabinet with it. I'm guessing he had already made his decision to coup. The only people who have been unwilling to work with anybody else are Hileville and the Cabinet (Imki, Scylla, Sam, Siberian, and Sopo). They didn't want to work with the Assembly. The refused to acknowledge the court. And all along the way, they've had foreigners supporting their cause.
Glen-Rhodes wrote:Turns out when you have a group of players willing to break the laws of your region to get what they want, you can't compromise with them. It's been pretty clear from the start that Hileville coup'd the forums as was going to have to coup the region, because he knew the actual community would not support his power hungry attitude.
Glen-Rhodes wrote:I wonder if TNP is still in there, you know, "preventing escalation." I don't envy Raven right now.
by Kazmr » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:18 am
by The Church of Satan » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:24 am
by Onderkelkia » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:28 am
Kazmr wrote:NES and others in the PRL are a lot more like The situation in Osiris, where the individuals ultimately removed were more interested in simply keeping the region inactive or subservient.
by Icecream Princess » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:45 am
Kazmr wrote:to Icecream: Every GCR has a history of coups. By extension every GCR resident is in the same position as me.
Kazmr wrote: NES and others in the PRL are a lot more like The situation in Osiris, where the individuals ultimately removed were more interested in simply keeping the region inactive or subservient.
by SouthMac » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:47 am
Kazmr wrote:To my best frenemy Cormac: NES and others in the PRL are a lot more like The situation in Osiris, where the individuals ultimately removed were more interested in simply keeping the region inactive or subservient.
Kazmr wrote:In this case, Glen and Kris in TSP, on the otger hand, actually worked to build up the region, but had a different vision than the cabal currently in power.
Kazmr wrote:Stuff like the treaty between Laz and TSP was not at all an attempt to manipulate TSP in some malicious way, as it has been so often characterized. Glen's view was simply that the future of TSP would be more positive with defender regions. He was elected as foreign minister multiple times and never hid that view. For people like you (at the moment) and others who are against defenderdom, he is wrong, and any such views are so commonly portrayed as "against the regions interests" by you lot. This coup is all about politics, its a power play pure and simple.
Kazmr wrote:I personally find it interesting to see you telling people on the RMB who are against this move to work at the convention for change. When those who initiated the convention have already demonstrated that they are willing to ban people to peotect their vision for the region, making such a move naive at best.
by Icecream Princess » Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:56 am
by RiderSyl » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:18 am
by Glen-Rhodes » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:23 am
by RiderSyl » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:30 am
Glen-Rhodes wrote:Lol what Cormac??
Tsu was talking to Hileville because there was no way Hileville was going to talk to me or Kris. Have you never heard of a negotiation?
by Glen-Rhodes » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:46 am
by SouthMac » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:59 am
Glen-Rhodes wrote:Also, the idea that I got rid of the diplomatic corps because I wanted full control over everything is just dumb propaganda. I got rid of it because nobody wanted to do it. Not even Hileville, who was elected pretty much on just getting it back up and running, dissolved the diplomatic corps at the end of his term because he couldn't fine anybody who actually wanted to do the job.
The diplomatic corps are glorified newsletter writers anyways. They never had any role in foreign policy under any MoFA.
by Kazmr » Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:34 pm
Icecream Princess wrote:Kazmr wrote:to Icecream: Every GCR has a history of coups. By extension every GCR resident is in the same position as me.
Not really. When one looks at Balder for example, it has only had one coup early on its history before it reverted back. Last year it underwent a Lawful reformation. I haven't decided on the exact title.Kazmr wrote: NES and others in the PRL are a lot more like The situation in Osiris, where the individuals ultimately removed were more interested in simply keeping the region inactive or subservient.
This is absurd, the success rate of independents and imperialists when it comes to region building continues to be far superior to that of defenders. Let us not forget that TRR and Lazarus are by far the most inactive of the sinkers and widely considered to be the "sick men" of the sinkers. Also, let us not forget the fact that Lazarus has had issues with manipulators but these were defenders similar to Glen-Rhodes who cared and continue to care more about controlling regions rather than building them up.
Lazarus to my knowledge still has not apologized for it's gross misconduct although it has paid the price of its poor policies. This can be seen via the NLO coup, delegates accidentally resigning & the continual inactivity.
SouthMac wrote:Kazmr wrote:To my best frenemy Cormac: NES and others in the PRL are a lot more like The situation in Osiris, where the individuals ultimately removed were more interested in simply keeping the region inactive or subservient.
This demonstrates what I will charitably call an, umm, imperfect understanding of the situation that led to dissolution of the Kemetic Republic of Osiris and establishment of the Osiris Fraternal Order -- two separate events, the former with much broader support than the latter.
You can accuse Biyah of many things in relation to Osiris, but you can't accuse him of being inactive or keeping Osiris inactive. That was not the nature of the problem the community had with him, it was more that he was using his positions of power -- specifically, in the days before the OFO, his admin position -- to maintain unelected power, to pursue his own agenda over the community's needs, and to hinder the government every step of the way as it pursued change. Sound familiar? It should, because the exact same sentence could accurately be written about Glen-Rhodes and Kringalia in TSP.
Kazmr wrote:In this case, Glen and Kris in TSP, on the otger hand, actually worked to build up the region, but had a different vision than the cabal currently in power.
You have a curious definition of building up TSP. In his time as Minister of Foreign Affairs, Glen-Rhodes dismantled the diplomatic corps and deprived the "Ministry" of Foreign Affairs -- if you can even call a ministry of one an actual ministry -- of any activity that wasn't undertaken exclusively by him and for his own ends. When he got his hands on SPINN, TSP's newspaper, it stopped producing anything. Much more importantly, Glen-Rhodes and Kringalia have driven many citizens away from TSP, including longtime citizen Brutland and Norden, who acted as lead against Milograd's coup in 2013.
Admittedly, Kringalia's participation in TSP was more substantive, but his vitriol was often even more effective than Glen's in driving people from the region. Neither he nor Glen-Rhodes simply "worked to build up the region." It is far more complicated than that, and in the case of Glen-Rhodes I would argue that he did nothing to build up TSP's community, only to further his interests.
Kazmr wrote:Stuff like the treaty between Laz and TSP was not at all an attempt to manipulate TSP in some malicious way, as it has been so often characterized. Glen's view was simply that the future of TSP would be more positive with defender regions. He was elected as foreign minister multiple times and never hid that view. For people like you (at the moment) and others who are against defenderdom, he is wrong, and any such views are so commonly portrayed as "against the regions interests" by you lot. This coup is all about politics, its a power play pure and simple.
This has nothing to do with "defenderdom" among the people supporting the Transitional Government in TSP, but it's telling that the perpetual R/D conflict is immediately where your mind went. The issue is not that Glen-Rhodes was a defender in TSP, the issue is that he was willing to tear down, drive out, divide and conquer, in order to accomplish his ends -- and that would be an issue whether he had been a defender, a raider, or something in between. Ripping the community apart to pursue the interests of a foreign ideology, and power for one's self, should always be frowned upon.
Ridersyl wrote:I'll admit, when I saw that it was freakin' Kazmr voicing opposition to this coup, I went 'Hey, wait a minute, that's not right.'
It's like seeing Tony the Tiger voicing opposition to cereal. Just.. what.
by SouthMac » Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:38 pm
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