The North Pacific Wire

[McMasterdonia]

The fact that we released our documents prior to publication of this tabloid article or knowledge of its existence does lend credence to what we're saying, since the official documents released differ from that which is quoted in the article.

Or because the documents I released are at least a week old possibly two? I doubt that there has been no discussion since I received this information. There is no dispute that the documents released by you today, are different. I dispute the fact that this was a well executed plan, releasing false information. Given that yourself, Gaspo and others, have all agreed that this was the case.

I presume you all knew who was given the false information if you expected them to leak it? So obviously you were all able to discuss the real document in secret, away from the people on the committee? Or are you completely sure that none of them leaked it? Trusting of the individuals on the committee, but not of others? If you didn't trust them, why include them in the meeting to start with?

I look forward to seeing them put to task about the release then. Which is something that will have to be handled with great diplomatic care, given who has released it.

[Whamabama]

-snip-

In other words, you didn't read the actual charter, you didn't read our actual releases.

[McMasterdonia]

Just for the record, I don't have the exact date that I received this information, but upon realization that I only returned to Australia a week ago. I think I received this information about 3-5 days ago. Not the original 1-2weeks ago, as originally thought. Easy to lose track when jet-lagged and moving around a lot.

[Southern Bellz]

Lmao at TSP being called a UDL pet. Even as an exaggeration, is a fairly insulting accusation. How is TSP now not close enough to TP to be involved, when we were close enough to provide military aid to both TP and Osi?

I don't really understand the stance our long standing ally is taking, and overall its pretty sad to see how the Pacific really views the importance of its relationship with tsp.

[Former English Colony]

It still seems like a potentially backward policy to me, "This way, if we have a mole he/she will leak something truly damning, that makes us look really bad, rather than an actual depiction of our organization." Unless I'm misunderstanding the plan? Either way, if someone was going to leak you have equal chance of catching them, unless this "bait" was only presented to a few suspects? I'm not seeing the advantage of giving a mole completely false information to leak...

Actually, given the people involved, you should be surprised there wasn't like 3 layers of secrets to be revealed one by one. The people involved in this organization (that I know) lovvvvve being crafty.

[The Blaatschapen]

It still seems like a potentially backward policy to me, "This way, if we have a mole he/she will leak something truly damning, that makes us look really bad, rather than an actual depiction of our organization." Unless I'm misunderstanding the plan? Either way, if someone was going to leak you have equal chance of catching them, unless this "bait" was only presented to a few suspects? I'm not seeing the advantage of giving a mole completely false information to leak...

Actually, given the people involved, you should be surprised there wasn't like 3 layers of secrets to be revealed one by one. The people involved in this organization (that I know) lovvvvve being crafty.

Erastide

They really come out of the woodworks nowadays

[Unibot III]

The fact that we released our documents prior to publication of this tabloid article or knowledge of its existence does lend credence to what we're saying, since the official documents released differ from that which is quoted in the article. As stated, we anticipated the possibility of a leak. The benefit to allowing misinformation to be leaked is that it has people preparing to respond to deliberately inflammatory information that isn't in our official documents, geared up to attack things that don't reflect the actual situation, and grasping at straws when what they're planning to attack isn't in our official documents. It also enables us to find leaks more easily and plug them.

But if you still don't believe it, consider the reality compared to the inflammatory rhetoric used as bait. "The younger generations have failed to nurture what was given them." -- this is being taken as an attack on newer players and yet we have a blend of veteran and newer players, myself included among the latter. "They have failed to safeguard the world from the ravages of boredom and mediocrity." -- this is taken as advancing a destructive agenda of Feeder imperialism and coups, and yet we have Astarial, who has been a defender for eight years, is a Sepatarch in Osiris, and has served native communities honorably as one of the UDL's own Merrywomen and an FRA Ranger; Madjack, the Pharaoh and Delegate of Osiris, also a former UDL Merryman; Gaspo, a Senator in The Pacific and a Justice on the Court of The North Pacific; and myself, a former UDL Lieutenant whose commitment to native communities is commemorated in the UDL's Hall of Honour, actively involved in two Feeders and a Sinker. In a very real sense, by attacking this new organization as one advancing a destructive agenda Unibot is attacking several of the people who have served native communities, including GCR communities, alongside him.

If you ask yourself if reality matches the inflammatory rhetoric, it's easy to see that it doesn't; and that's the best evidence yet that the rhetoric was nothing more than mole bait, as we've said.

Or... Biyah is using a set of people that haven't couped regions to legitimize his organization, while the actual motives of the organization are presented in the original documents shown here -- which weren't meant to go public. Furthermore, I'm not the only one or even the first one to advance the idea of your organization just being a gang of old feeder coupers wanting to stir up trouble for kicks, I think anybody with a lick of sense would know that (I mean really, TP, Equilism and Gatesville working together?). Like, some of your supposed sovereigntists just couped a region as recent as four weeks ago.

Furthermore, I'd appreciate if you didn't use your status in the Hall of Honour as a way to legitimize the organization.

[Cromarty]

Madjack, the Pharaoh and Delegate of Osiris, also a former UDL Merryman;

Former UDL Lieutenant actually.

[Hileville]

6) Regarding TSP and Balder, their exclusion was primarily a function of a lack of close relationships with any of the drafting committee, and the fact that their current status as UDL/TNI pets, respectively, represented an inherent contradiction with the plainly stated goals and values of the organization.

Lack of close relationships? That is a shocking statement coming from a TNP Senator. TSP has always been close to The Pacific and has seen Osiris as one of our closest allies. Let me remind you of TSP's overwhelming support of the legitimate government of Osiris when Biyah and crew took the Delegate seat. How about our most recent support of Krull when a possible threat was detected. TSP deployed the SPA to aid in both in situations. To go even further TSP and TNP held a cultural event just over a month ago with Osiris. I find this view on our relationships very disheartening.

[Unibot III]

In other words, you didn't read the actual charter, you didn't read our actual releases.

You didn't quote what I said, you only quoted the snarky emoticon. >_< Which obscures the fact that you haven't responded to my argument attached to the emoticon. Oh well.

Lack of close relationships? That is a shocking statement coming from a TNP Senator. TSP has always been close to The Pacific and has seen Osiris as one of our closest allies. Let me remind you of TSP's overwhelming support of the legitimate government of Osiris when Biyah and crew took the Delegate seat. How about our most recent support of Krull when a possible threat was detected. TSP deployed the SPA to aid in both in situations. To go even further TSP and TNP held a cultural event just over a month ago with Osiris. I find this view on our relationships very disheartening.

Hear hear.

[Biyah]

6) Regarding TSP and Balder, their exclusion was primarily a function of a lack of close relationships with any of the drafting committee, and the fact that their current status as UDL/TNI pets, respectively, represented an inherent contradiction with the plainly stated goals and values of the organization.

Lack of close relationships? That is a shocking statement coming from a TNP Senator. TSP has always been close to The Pacific and has seen Osiris as one of our closest allies. Let me remind you of TSP's overwhelming support of the legitimate government of Osiris when Biyah and crew took the Delegate seat. How about our most recent support of Krull when a possible threat was detected. TSP deployed the SPA to aid in both in situations. To go even further TSP and TNP held a cultural event just over a month ago with Osiris. I find this view on our relationships very disheartening.

Bolding mine. So, Hile, do you have any close relationships with those listed?

This had nothing to do with relationships between feeder regions. That statement was clearly aimed at relationships between the drafters themselves. As any project, this started as a think-tank between trusted people - in this case, organized by Wham and Asta.

Of course the Feeders have great international relations, as evidenced by the past, which you so kindly pointed out. This is why all the GCRs are invited to join SovCon once it has been formally established with ratified members. Lazarus is interested, we are or will be approaching the rest shortly.

~B

[Cromarty]

The fact that we released our documents prior to publication of this tabloid article or knowledge of its existence does lend credence to what we're saying, since the official documents released differ from that which is quoted in the article. As stated, we anticipated the possibility of a leak. The benefit to allowing misinformation to be leaked is that it has people preparing to respond to deliberately inflammatory information that isn't in our official documents, geared up to attack things that don't reflect the actual situation, and grasping at straws when what they're planning to attack isn't in our official documents. It also enables us to find leaks more easily and plug them.

But if you still don't believe it, consider the reality compared to the inflammatory rhetoric used as bait. "The younger generations have failed to nurture what was given them." -- this is being taken as an attack on newer players and yet we have a blend of veteran and newer players, myself included among the latter. "They have failed to safeguard the world from the ravages of boredom and mediocrity." -- this is taken as advancing a destructive agenda of Feeder imperialism and coups, and yet we have Astarial, who has been a defender for eight years, is a Sepatarch in Osiris, and has served native communities honorably as one of the UDL's own Merrywomen and an FRA Ranger; Madjack, the Pharaoh and Delegate of Osiris, also a former UDL Merryman; Gaspo, a Senator in The Pacific and a Justice on the Court of The North Pacific; and myself, a former UDL Lieutenant whose commitment to native communities is commemorated in the UDL's Hall of Honour, actively involved in two Feeders and a Sinker. In a very real sense, by attacking this new organization as one advancing a destructive agenda Unibot is attacking several of the people who have served native communities, including GCR communities, alongside him.

If you ask yourself if reality matches the inflammatory rhetoric, it's easy to see that it doesn't; and that's the best evidence yet that the rhetoric was nothing more than mole bait, as we've said.

Or... Biyah is using a set of people that haven't couped regions to legitimize his organization, while the actual motives of the organization are presented in the original documents shown here -- which weren't meant to go public. Furthermore, I'm not the only one or even the first one to advance the idea of your organization just being a gang of old feeder coupers wanting to stir up trouble for kicks, I think anybody with a lick of sense would know that (I mean really, TP, Equilism and Gatesville working together?). Like, some of your supposed sovereigntists just couped a region as recent as four weeks ago.

Furthermore, I'd appreciate if you didn't use your status in the Hall of Honour as a way to legitimize the organization.

That's twice you've mentioned Biyah as the titular head or spiritual driving force behind this. You seem to have a serious hangup on him, Uni. He is not the head of this project, it's a group effort organized by Wham and Asta.

There are five regions that were in negotiations. Ignore that all you like, as I'm sure it doesn't suit your propaganda, but there are a lot of intelligent people on this project, and myself . It's pretty hard to take over NS when the structure is so open, and the regions involved have a say.

Edit: typo.

[Unibot III]

That's twice you've mentioned Biyah as the titular head or spiritual driving force behind this. You seem to have a serious hangup on him, Uni. He is not the head of this project, it's a group effort organized by Wham and Asta.

Odd, the player who leaked the information said Biyah was the driving force. Interesting to see what facts are being contradicted here. "OH, these documents that make us look really bad aren't real, they just... fake documents.. that we passed onto someone.. to make us look bad! OH, the guy who just couped a sinker isn't our leader... it's the two people in the organization who haven't been involved in coups yet as far as we know!"

[Biyah]

Oh, alrighty then. We're wrong.

Unibot, tell us how our own organization is organized. Please, you're the knowledgeable one here

[Cerian Quilor]

I have to say that the very idea of an interregional organization devoted to regiona sovreignty hits me right in the 'you're kidding me' bone. Not because I think this is a scam or a joke or conspiracy but just because its about as counter-intuitive as all-get out.

That said, if it can be made to actually work (I have my doubts), I applaud the measure.

Some of the rhetoric in the leaked version is...bothersome, to say the least, from its romaticism of the 'good old days' to the misunderstanding of modern geopolitics, but I can accept that that isn't the formal version.

Still, if your intent was to have the fake versio be leaked, I can't imagine what the hell you were thinking it would accomplish...

Also, as much as parts of this (even the official version) and the tone of some of its supporters in this thread are troubling to me, I think Unibot and some of its other detractors are overreacting, to say the least.

[The Blaatschapen]

Still, if your intent was to have the fake versio be leaked, I can't imagine what the hell you were thinking it would accomplish...

Lulz, hilarity, lots of unnecessary chaos.

We're talking here about Cromarty and Biyah after all, seeing other people going chaotic and overreacting is fun

[Cromarty]

Still, if your intent was to have the fake versio be leaked, I can't imagine what the hell you were thinking it would accomplish...

Lulz, hilarity, lots of unnecessary chaos.

We're talking here about Cromarty and Biyah after all, seeing other people going chaotic and overreacting is fun

I resent that. I am an upstanding and well respected member of the community.

[The Blaatschapen]

Lulz, hilarity, lots of unnecessary chaos.

We're talking here about Cromarty and Biyah after all, seeing other people going chaotic and overreacting is fun

I resent that. I am an upstanding and well respected member of the community.

I never claimed that you weren't. I just imply that you like to ruffle other people's jimmies just for fun.

[Cromarty]

I resent that. I am an upstanding and well respected member of the community.

I never claimed that you weren't. I just imply that you like to ruffle other people's jimmies just for fun.

Lies and slander, says I.

Balderdash and piffle.

[Biyah]

The reason is simple, some parts were just too juicy not to leak... And we know who got the leaks now. And, free publicity.

Besides, I am amused by this thread. And I'm surprised that it is been behaved this long... great fun, i love the discussion that a tabloid can bring. And the terrible theories, and scandal.... ahhh. *chuckles

Edit. On the phone... spelling correction

[The Blaatschapen]

I never claimed that you weren't. I just imply that you like to ruffle other people's jimmies just for fun.

Lies and slander, says I.

Balderdash and piffle.

Please stop citing from a 19th century dictionary.

[Biyah]

Lies and slander, says I.

Balderdash and piffle.

Please stop citing from a 19th century dictionary.

Sir, i bite my thumb at thee!

[Cerian Quilor]

The reason is simple, some parts were just too juicy not to leak... And we know who got the leaks now. And, free publicity.

Besides, I am amused by this thread. And I'm surprised that it is been behaved this long... great fun, i love the discussion that a tabloid can bring. And the terrible theories, and scandal.... ahhh. *chuckles

Edit. On the phone... spelling correction

Except that now the message has been muddled.

[Sovreignry]

Thin modor werith lether gewaed

[Unibot III]

Unibot, tell us how our own organization is organized. Please, you're the knowledgeable one here

No, just the honest one here.